krsna Posted December 11, 2005 Report Share Posted December 11, 2005 Proponents of contraception claim it solves many social problems. Are they right? Thirteen-year-old Jenny broke the silence. “Rhoda, I was a birth-control baby.” “Birth-control baby? I never heard of that.” “The birth control my mother and father used didn’t work, and the result was me.” “You mean you weren’t wanted.” Jenny didn’t answer. She hunched the covers over her shoulders. Rhoda leaned across the beds to touch Jenny’s shoulder. “I’m sorry. I don’t know why I said such a stupid thing.” Jenny lay still for a long time. Her thoughts drifted to her family.… “Rhoda,” she said softly after a while. “Rhoda, you were right, anyway. I’m the family accident.” Rhoda was sleeping already. Surprised at what [Rhoda] had said, and yet, feeling as if she’d always known it, [Jenny] understood now the plea that was always in her mother’s eyes when her mother looked at her.… [Jenny] closed her own eyes and went to sleep, too. —A Figure of Speech, by Norma Fox Mazer, p. 44 ABUSED, UNLOVED, unwanted, neglected children are an image of pain that tugs at the heart of any caring person. And what is modern technology’s answer? Birth control. Politicians, scientists, educators, and even religious leaders advise contraception—and its commander in reserve, abortion—as the answer to many social and economic woes. Yet when we examine the problems that contraception and abortion aim to solve and the benefits they are supposed to give, we may be surprised to see how they fall short. In ancient history, the saint Prahlada taught that a materialistic solution is worse than the original problem. Birth control exemplifies this principle. Let’s consider the reputed benefits of birth control and abortion: no more births of unwanted children, all children raised in a stable home and nurtured with affection, more freedom and respect for women, better health for women, fewer financial burdens for families, and less of a population burden on the planet. No more unwanted children? The prime objective of birth control and abortion is to eliminate unwanted children. Despite the increase of birth control and abortion worldwide, however, evidence shows that the problem of unwanted children has worsened the more the “solution” has been applied. In the essay Right Reason, William F. Buckley, Jr., writes, “The general availability of birth control information has caused a rise in illegitimacy.” In Sweden, for example, the percentage of children born out of wedlock has risen steadily and today stands at 52%. In the United States, from 1950 to 1980 the annual rate of illegitimate births increased by 450%. One might imagine that with birth control and abortion easily available, all children, or nearly all, would be born to a married couple who want a child. But that’s not the case. The number of unwanted children is on the rise. A major cause is teenage promiscuity, and 81% of physicians surveyed agree that the availability of contraceptives has led to increased promiscuity among teens. (A. Pietropinto, “A Survey on Contraceptive Analysis,” Medical Aspects of Human Sexuality, May 1987, p. 147) Teenagers who have had birth control education have a 50% higher sexual activity rate than teens who have not. (Louis Harris and Associates, “American Teens Speak: Sex, Myths, TV and Birth Control,” Harris and Associates for Planned Parenthood of America, Inc., 1986, p. 53) Coleen Mast, author of the Sex Respect curriculum, compares teaching about contraceptives to teaching how to light fires “safely” in garbage cans. Such an education would no doubt increase the number of house fires. By offering some limited protection against the consequence of pregnancy, contraceptives encourage illicit sex. But contraceptives don’t solve problems of poverty, illiteracy, drug use, and uncontrolled sexual desire—all of which contribute to illegitimate births. In fact, people may feel that simply by using some pill or device, they can avoid becoming responsible adults capable of moral choice. All Children Raised With Stability and Love? The growing acceptance and use of birth control and abortion has also led to an increase in divorce, abandonment, child neglect, and child abuse. Half of all children in America will grow up without one parent, usually the father, because of illegitimacy or divorce. More than one million children a year live through divorce. Again in America, from 1986 to 1993 the number of abused and neglected children nearly doubled, and the numbers of children seriously injured or endangered from abuse both quadrupled. Having the right to “plan” one’s children through unnatural means may lead to family instability and child abuse; it certainly has not solved these problems. If we ask, “Why are so many children today not raised with love in a stable home?” and “Why do people use birth control?” the answers will be practically the same: the parents think sex is for pleasure only, not for reproduction. Why, then, take much care with children who come accidentally? And “accidental” children will come. Women who use contraceptives with a high rate of compliance still have a 10–13% pregnancy rate. (Family Planning Perspective, Sept./Oct. 1980, p. 236) Contraceptive use reveals a selfish attitude: one wants enjoyment without any responsibility other than giving pleasure in return. Some may argue that a married couple may be “responsible” in their contraceptive use and still care for the children they plan for. But isn’t that like a company employee who regularly steals from the business yet claims to be honest with the other employees? Perhaps some people can practice “selective love,” but they remind us of an unusual creature—the scorpion mouse, which kills and eats scorpions, being immune to the poison. It also eats other mice, even other scorpion mice. But scorpion mice are some of the most caring parents in the animal kingdom, mourning long if one of their babies becomes a meal for an owl. Such “love” is a kind of extended selfishness, rather than selfless giving for the welfare of others. If the motive for our “love” is selfish, we will act without concern for our formerly lovable person if our desires appear to be better fulfilled by not loving. Those who try to prevent pregnancy—through surgery, devices, chemicals, or unnatural sexual practices—develop a mentality of seeing their body as meant for their own purposes, rather than seeing both their body and the bodies of their children as gifts from God to be engaged in His service. The contraceptive users so much despise Krishna's plan for the human body that they alter its natural function. They come to hate the responsibilities integral to their own bodies. When those responsibilities take the form of children, they may resent the children as well. Contraceptive use means trying to outwit Krishna, to take what one wants while short-circuiting and sabotaging the system. That is the mentality of a thief. Srila Prabhupada often said that Krishna can be the greatest cheater. We may try to cheat Him, but in the end we will find ourselves cheated of genuine spiritual life and happiness, as the cheating employee will find that his friends don’t trust him and his boss fires him. One may further argue that abuse, neglect, divorce, instability, and so on, exist, if to a lesser extent, among those who do not artificially avoid having children. Clearly, simply having children as nature intended is not enough to insure genuine love for them. Yes, without spiritual realization, our loving relationships will be more or less selfish. But the mentality of the contraceptive user is so opposed to the Lord’s plan that spiritual life, with its true love and selflessness, has no chance to develop. And a life that fully respects the link between sex and reproduction is part of a foundation upon which one can exhibit real love. More Freedom and Respect for Women? Because of widespread contraceptive use, women have increasingly become exploited slaves of irresponsible men. Formerly, a woman who conceived a child outside marriage had choices. She could marry the child’s father, raise the child alone, or give the child to an adoptive couple. If she wanted to marry the child’s father, her parents and community would put moral and social pressure on him. Now boyfriends, parents, and even husbands often pressure women to avoid or kill their own children. The thinking is, “This woman entered the relationship with a stated or implied agreement that children weren’t included. Why should the man be obligated now that a child has come by accident?” Mary Pride, a leading advocate of the return to family values, writes, “Our society has been separating sex from the responsibilities and joys of having children for over thirty years.… Wives, who used to be regarded primarily as mothers and therefore sacred, are now seen as fancy vessels for men to relieve their sexual frustrations. Look at the ads in magazines, stores, TV, and billboards. Is this a noble picture of women, for their bodies to be used to sell everything from jeans to toothpaste?” (The Way Home, p. 30) Women who rely on contraception and abortion may feel unfettered to pursue their own desires and careers, but is that real freedom? Real freedom comes in loving and serving God. Having children, even many children, doesn’t interfere with that. Besides, a woman who rejects contraception is expressing her freedom to control her sexual urges. By using contraception and abortion, others show they are hopeless slaves of lust and selfish bodily urges. Better Health for Women? We’re told it’s dangerous for women to have “too many” children, or to have children later in their childbearing years. Actually, having and nursing children prevents many of the health problems of modern women. For example, a woman who breast feeds for a total of at least seven years has nearly a zero percent chance of breast cancer at any time in her life. Most women who get various cancers of the reproductive system have had no or few babies. Conversely, many medical problems come directly from contraception. And abortion is not only very risky physically, but often brings the mother lifelong psychological problems. Of course, as with anything in this world, pregnancy and childbirth include risks. The risks, however, need not deter us from doing what is best for us and most pleasing to God. Those devoted to illicit sexual life are willing to sacrifice their money, health, and reputation to maintain their way of life. Even the fear of AIDS doesn’t discourage them. Can we not be at least as willing to sacrifice for the right cause? Fewer Financial Burdens for Families? It is common in modern society to think of children as a problem rather than a blessing. And today, children may indeed be financial burdens, especially if they’re extravagant consumers. On the other hand, many parents find that their children are a blessing and enrich their lives in many ways, even economically. Despite their freedom from the financial burden of children, childless couples face financial burdens nonetheless, because their desires induce them to work hard for money. Instead of spending money on educating and training their children, they spend for an extra car, a vacation home, a large-screen TV, and so on. Do these acquisitions bring more joy and fewer burdens than children would? Which life inspires one to be a better person? Certainly having children costs money, time, and effort. But, again, life is full of sacrifice and responsibility. A man who works hard so he can raise children dedicated to Lord Krishna is blessed with spiritual growth and satisfaction. Less of a Population Burden on the Planet? Many people will argue that without birth control, families will have a dozen or more children. Yet in societies where birth control isn’t practiced, the average number of children per family is six. Six children per family may seem too many for the earth, but the entire present world population could fit in France or in the state of Texas, with 1,500 square feet per person. We could feed ten times the present population on an American-style diet, and thirty times the population on a Japanese-style diet. (Colin Clark, Oxford University) All the world’s scriptures urge us to have many children, and describe children as a blessing. The only burden on the earth mentioned in the Vedic scriptures is that of a large population of sinful people who live lives of crime and deceit. The Lord, Sri Krishna, is unlimitedly wealthy and can easily provide adequately for all His obedient children. Harmful Side Effects Not only does birth control not solve the problems for which it claims to be the solution, but it has harmful side effects as well. Homosexuality: Contraception leads to increased homosexuality and other perversions. If the purpose of sex doesn’t include children, then why not relations between two women or two men? Why not any type of unnatural relations? Abortion: Acceptance of birth control leads to acceptance of abortion. Fifty percent of women who have had abortions say they were using birth control and it failed. Abortion is simply a more extreme way of saying that one’s personal needs, desires, status, and so on, are more desirable than the birth of a child. And being a form of child abuse (torturing and killing an unborn child), abortion leads to abuse of children in general. Why not hurt or kill a child who interferes with my life? People may claim that an unborn child is not yet human, but is an acorn seedling not simply an immature oak? The fetus is growing because the soul is present from conception. In any case, all life is sacred, not just life outside the womb, and not just human life. Illicit sex: Immoral sexual relationships increase when contraception and abortion are available. People feel that with control over pregnancy, they need not consider commitment or the criticism of society. And because birth control promotes a mentality of separating sexual pleasure from procreation, people begin to feel that relationships based only on physical pleasure are not only morally acceptable, but natural. Loss of respect and love for God: The spiritual harm of birth control is its most damaging—to individuals and society. The contraceptive user doesn’t respect Krishna's design and plan. How can I love God if I don’t even respect Him? Rather, I think I would be a better God and am ready to redesign the world according to my vision. The mentality of envying Kåñëa's supremacy and control is the root of material consciousness. The Spiritual Solution All the arguments for the benefits of contraception presume that people cannot control their sexual appetites. We expect adults to control their appetites for food, so why not for sex? Of course, modern society doesn’t expect much self-control in eating, either. The artificial sex created when using contraceptives has its parallel in the artificial foods that have taste but no calories or nutrition. Sterilization has its parallel in stomach stapling. Krishna's devotees know that mastery over our bodies, senses, and minds is both desirable and possible. Those who dedicate their lives to worshiping and pleasing Lord Krishna know that real pleasure comes from serving His plan, including His plan for the human body. They don’t try to separate physical pleasure from the whole of the reproductive function. In fact, those completely serious about spiritual perfection in this lifetime either live as unmarried celibates or, in marriage, restrict sexual union to the time when the wife is most likely to conceive. Before conception, the husband and wife meditate on the Lord and chant His holy names to purify themselves of selfish desire so as to offer the procreative act as a sacrifice to Him. Krishna says that He is present in such a union, and the couple therefore feels not only bodily pleasure but also spiritual bliss. They don’t feel a burden in raising their children to love Krishna; rather they take it as great happiness. For people in general, a return to a life where children can assist their parents with running the household and earning the livelihood would greatly contribute toward the vision of children as a blessing rather than a burden. Spiritually, when children are raised to grow in love of God they are a great blessing to their families and society in all respects. The unlimitedly wealthy Lord will surely provide for those who wish to raise such children. Society must also return to the vision that this entire creation, including one’s own body, operates according to the plan of an unlimitedly intelligent and caring Supreme Being. We only hurt ourselves when we try to circumvent or obstruct that plan, even when dealing with our body, which we can’t truly claim to be our own. [Originally published in Back To Godhead, 34/1, 2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2005 Report Share Posted December 15, 2005 There is dangerous thinking in this article... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2005 Report Share Posted December 16, 2005 whats the dangerous parts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2005 Report Share Posted December 16, 2005 the dangerous thinking is when you kill your baby in the womb, they stick a machine up the uterus cut, chop and slice the baby into little pieces and then suck it out with a another machine. the reason is because of illicit sex thus producing unwanted children with no other intelligent option but to terminate life. demons, lowest of the mankind, totally abominable, horrible, hellish, disgusting, terrible, demoniac, any women who kills there own child will never be same thus destroying there moral, dignity and spirit to live happy thus will always be haunted by the abominable act. society, on one hand we pride ourselves on saving lives and on the other hand we kill life, so very strange!!!!! J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 What if it's rape or incest? Should she be made to keep the baby? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 ok if in an unfortunate non self indulged tragedy accures such as the above then adoption is an option that is not abominable, if you are raped it still does not give you the right to kill your child. it is my opinion that abortion is much more a severe act then rape although abortion is legal and rape is not, but both are punishable by the laws of nature, meaning you will recieve bad karma for that act. the problem is we do not see abortion as murder and somehow justify it by science. J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 How can can you say abortion is worse than rape! That is truly outrageous! Have you spoken to a rape victim? Have you ever been raped? You seriously need to revise your thing on this topic, if you want to be seen as a decent human being! Abortion is a personal choice and it should stay that way! If a woman doesn't want to carry a child, for whatever reason that is her choice! Who are you to judge? Rape is undebatable worse than abortion! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 I agree! What a horribly embarassing article for this devotee to have written. I recommend she get off her high horse, her Christian-like moral crusade, and instead concentrate on chanting and reading Krsna's pastimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 An ideal thing to follow but for demoniac person like me it is always impossible .. Hare Krishna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 ok guest a question? is abortion murder, that is the question? if yes than is murder a worse crime than rape? if no then why not, why isn't abortion murder? secondly i never said what was worse my exact words are "severe act" meaning murder is more "severe" than rape and in court it is also seen like that, ie. can you get the death sentence for rape? no but you can for murder, point proven. anyway the post was not to discuss wether or not your opinion can justify the act of murder based on your own misfortunate circumstance, the point is by the laws of nature both acts are punishable, karma. who made me the judge? hahahahaahah!!!!! very funny guest, try and justify killing your baby by saying who made you the judge, no i am not "the judge" as you put it, but somebody is and depending on your faith i chose krishna. the fact that there is a law of nature proves there must be a judge to that law. krishna says you will be punished for killing not based on religious principles and in the right circumstances. Srila Prabhupada said that one will have to birth and be killed in the same fashion as the killer, meaning you kill your baby and you will become in your next life a baby and be killed in the same fashion, thus the "law" of nature prevails and is equally disposed with no prejudice. J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 Just because rapist don't get the same punishments as murders doesn't mean their crime is any less severe. Alot of people think rapist and child molesters are worse than murders. No I do not think abortion is murder! Beause it's not! It all depends on were you think life begins! I personallly don't think a fetus that's 2 months old in a mothers' womb is equal to a 2 yr. old chid! If you're like most Christians, who think birth begins at conception, answer this! If you're in the waiting room of a fertility clinic with your three year old child and a fire broke out! Would you rescue you child or thousands of petri dishes of fertilized eggs? Abortion is a hard chose for a women to make! It's still an option women need! For health reasons abortion are also needed! What are the consequences for these abortions? Instead of trying to inject your own Christian-like sense of morality, maybe you should learn a more evolved way of practicing Krishna Consciousness! Being judgemental is a trait better fit for Christians! So what are you, really? /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Question: Do you think the morning after pill is equal to abortion and still murder? If so, here's a good link! You'll definately mesh well with these people! Christianity for Beginners /images/graemlins/tongue.gif http://www.thefellowship.info/Church%20Life/Congregational%20Life/Resources/christianityforbeginners.icm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 trying to justify your actions with frivolous useless talk and what would you know about k.c. srila prabhupada the archrya for k.c has said abortion is murder so is he a christian. the law of nature doesn't care about your bs talk only your actions in killing your child. devotees are opposed to abortion as are some christians doesnt mean we are the same so quit the bs, face the truth and stop hiding behind your false ego, i am guessing your a women with your womens right bs. your opinion my opinion who gives a stuff, the law of nature still stands wether you like it or not. J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 What's the matter, nothing else to say? /images/graemlins/blush.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 your ignorance has made me want to sign up for this site! I'll be back later, peace! /images/graemlins/grin.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parvati19 Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 It's me the former guest, still waiting for J.S Das to come with legit answers to questions! /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 my ignorance of what, the fact that you justify killing your baby although unecessary and who are you anyway mother teresa? were i must answer your stupid questions about spliting hairs over morality, grow up!!!!!! J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parvati19 Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 You can't call it murder! If I were to go kill a 30 year teacher out of the blue, that's murder! The idea of abortion being murder is debatable! Like I said, if it was an abortion for health reasons, how is that murder? And what about the fertility clinic scenario? Don't speak about subjects you can only give one liners to! /images/graemlins/smirk.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSdas Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 no you are wrong my friend its not only my opinion but the opinion of vedic culture who was represented by srila prabhupada, "parvati 19". Being a human and having intelligence means we have the ability to discriminate, so killing unecessarily and killing for a reason are two different matters. example, arjuna on the battlefield of kuruksetra as described in the bhagavad gita was faced with the dilenma of killing his family relatives, but krishna asured him of his actions as it was according to religious duties of a ksatrya (warrior class) and would not incure sinful reactions, but if not under religious principles he would definitely go to a hellish region and be punished by the laws of nature and take a lower birth. terminating the baby because of health reasons is a totally different issue altogether, abortion is not about a health issue it is about not wanting the responsibilty that is associated with sex life......... so you cannot say it is ok to kill something unless it is approved by learned persons who know the religious principles governing the material nature, that is why we seek out a spiritual master to teach us, if not then speculate yourself about what is right or wrong and at the end of your life you will know wether or not you did the right thing. srila prabhupada has condenmed abortion and has assured us of sinful reactions of pursuing abortion as an alternative to giving birth and he is the most recent and foremost scholar in the vedic literatures, so parvati if you want to speculate about abortion being acceptable then that is your choice and i am sure there are many women who will support you in this and men too for that matter as it means they can have illicit sex then leave the women with the problem and have an abortion. i guess it comes down to who you chose as your authority!!!!! the spiritual knowledge of abortion as punishable by the laws of nature or the scientist who protest that abortion is ok by rationalizing that the baby has not yet become a living being. we must chose an authority, i chose the supreme personality of godhead sri krishna who do you chose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parvati19 Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 I admit that I'm new and can't exactly quote scripture off the top of my head. Still I don't necessarily thing that me being religious means I have to be conservative on every issue. I still can think for myself and deside what I believe. I know different Gurus have different opinions. I plan to learn scripture and vedic culture properly from the right authority. If that means I have to change my beliefs on issues like these, so be it! Still, that's not something that's going to happen over night! I do believe I can be a liberal and still properly espouse vedic culture! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 "I still can think for myself and deside what I believe. I know different Gurus have different opinions. I plan to learn scripture and vedic culture properly from the right authority. If that means I have to change my beliefs on issues like these, so be it! Still, that's not something that's going to happen over night! I do believe I can be a liberal and still properly espouse vedic culture!" There's the incident of Hiranyakashipu's wife being pregnant and the demigods wanting to kill the baby because of the demoniac father. So, yes, we all have the right to think for ourselves, liberally or conservatively. Yet, along came Narada Muni and enlightened everyone and was able to care for and instruct one of the most celebrated devotees in history by his spiritual discourses. So we should always check our own "beliefs" with guru sadhu and shastra. Many people may rationalize that abortion is not murder because a 19.9 week fetus is not equal to a 2 year old child, or for that matter, if we live in a sick society, that a girl will be economically disadvantageous because you have to pay a dowry, and then kill the child but that doesn't mean that it will be approved by saintly persons. Basing our beliefs on what many people think or even what we think is not a wise practice. As kali-yuga progresses, one has to become even more careful because genuinely saintly persons will become even more rare. And so, so-called gurus differing on some issues may actually mean that some of them are not gurus (by definition, a good person) but only so-called guru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSdas Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 yes parvati we are all learning and it is good to debate with people that can be objective and use common sense in discussions without becoming overly subjective. if you can see your wrong or not wrong but maybe not completely right then it is healthy to ourselves to admit it and learn, thats the meaning of having a guru and giving up speculative pre-concieved idea's about the world we live in. also there is a difference with being liberal because it suits your cause and believing it. if your conservative in your principles or strictly believe in the scripture's but still break the rules we must be honest with ourselves about whats going on. if your being liberal and easy go lucky because it suits you but deep down you know it doesn't feel right then it is best to be honest with yourself. anyway it seems that you are making some spiritual progress as am i (hopefully) and may we keep learning from the all supreme sri krishna. do you chant the hare krishna mantra at all? or maybe your iniated i dont know just asking, good luck......haribol J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSdas Posted December 17, 2005 Report Share Posted December 17, 2005 yes i agree with the guest, good point about being careful which guru you chose as we are in kali yuga and decieving guru's are not uncommon, knowingly or unknowingly, they are definitely everywhere. Thats why i am 100 percent sure to stick with srila prabhupada as a safe bet, but that does not mean you have to agree with everyone within iskcon either just use common sense and discrimination and chose a guru wisely but on the other hand i have also seen people take forever to chose which one that is also not really necessary, we could leave our body's at any time, food for thought... haribol J.S das /images/graemlins/smile.gif Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parvati19 Posted December 18, 2005 Report Share Posted December 18, 2005 I do chant religiously everyday! I've been reading the Bhagavad Gita As It Is from gitamrta.com. I'm still learning and looking for a Guru. I definately strive to be a more spiritual person and devout myself to Krishna. I still have a long ways to go. Thanks for your advise. Haribol! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2006 Report Share Posted January 4, 2006 I agree with Parvati. Just as there is a big difference between killing a small insect and a cow, there is also a big difference between killing an undeveloped embryo and an adult human being. Of course all killing is sinful and should be refrained from by all religious persons, but making something a legally punishable crime is an entirely different affair. What I find interesting is that there are no punishments mentioned in the Manu-samhita for abortion, with the one exception being if the unborn child is of brahminical parentage. Other than this, abortion was not a punishable crime in Vedic times. In other words, abortion should be discouraged and preached against, but not made illegal. That seems to be the best compromise on this issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2006 Report Share Posted January 5, 2006 the reason there was no punishment for abortion in vedic times was because it didn't exist, illicit sex was not practiced generally by the masses so there was no unwanted children to abort. obviously exceptions are made under guidance from saintly personalities but was uncommon. no illicit sex means no need for abortion, the reason for abortion is because of the urge to enjoy the genatils without taking responsibility for the reaction. in vedic culture there is no illicit sex so there is no abortion, so why would they need a law to govern something that doesn't exist. guest your points don't seem valid and i am sceptical in your understanding of vedic culture. Why NOT made illegal? to benefit the people from sinful reactions the heads of state should make laws which guide them towards an auspicious outcome and to elevate them in conciousness to the laws of karma so as to recieve purification and good karma to live happy and progressively make spiritual advancement. that is the real job of the heads of state, not to be whimiscal and give the public whatever they want in order to be re-elected as president etc to earn a big pay check. J.S das Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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