ISKCON and Varnasrama-Dharma: A Mission Unfulfilled

krsna · March 28, 2005

Ravindra Svarupa Dasa

Nevertheless, in the world today we have democracy because the power monarchy was abused, we have socialism because the power of capital was abused, we have feminism because the power of masculinity was abused. I understand why women want independence in the same way that I recognize why ordinary citizens want to control the government. Both positions are, however, against our philosophy.

I know from my own experience how sankirtana in America tended to become less and less of a brahminical preaching activity and more and more of a vaisya commercial activity, with books eventually being replaced by secular paraphernalia. This shift from preaching

to fund-raising after Srila Prabhupada’s demise has been well documented by E. Burke Rochford in Hare Krishna in America (New Brunswick: Rutgers University Press, 1986). While the movement prospered financially, it declined spiritually. Prabhupada’s misgivings proved sound.

In 1987, ISKCON in America fortunately changed course. The North American leaders resolved to stop all sales of secular items by the temples and to return them to what was, in effect, a brahminical mode of maintenance, depending mainly upon donations from the congregation and working residents. All the temples in North America quickly went broke. However, there has been since then a slow but steady recovery, both spiritual and financial. Both depend, in my view, on turning the temples into exemplary brahminical institutions. The brief history I have recounted illustrates the truth — and the prescience — of Prabhupada’s perception.

Let me note another important indication of ISKCON’s failure to organize brahminical training. In 1976, Prabhupada ordered a gradated system of examinations to be instituted in ISKCON. To this day, this order is unfulfilled.

From a letter Prabhupada had his secretary send out to the GBC to convey his directions:

Re: Examinations for awarding titles of Bhakti-sastri, Bhakti-vaibhava, Bhakti-vedanta and Bhakti-sarvabhauma.

... Srila Prabhupada has requested me to write you in regard to the above examinations which he wishes to institute. Here in India many persons often criticize our sannyasis and brahmanas as being unqualified due to insufficient knowledge of the scriptures. Factually, there are numerous instances when our sannyasis and brahmanas have fallen down often due to insufficient understanding of the philosophy. This should not be a point of criticism nor a reason for falldown, since Srila Prabhupada has mercifully made the most essential scriptures available to us in his books. The problem is that not all the devotees are carefully studying the books, the result being a fall down or at least unsteadiness.

His Divine Grace therefore wishes to institute examinations to be given to all prospective candidates for sannyasa and brahmana initiation. In addition he wishes that all present sannyasis and brahmanas also pass the examination. Awarding of these titles will be based upon the following books:

Bhakti-sastri — Bhagavad-gita, Nectar of Devotion, Nectar of Instruction, Isopanisad, Easy Journey To Other Planets, and all other small paperbacks, as well as Arcana-paddhati (a book to be compiled by Nitai Prabhu based on Hari-bhakti-vilasa on Deity worship)

Bhakti-vaibhava — All of the above plus the first six cantos of Srimad-Bhagavatam.

Bhakti-vedanta — All of the above plus cantos seven through twelve of Srimad-Bhagavatam.

Bhakti-sarvabhauma — All the above plus the entire Caitanya-caritamrta.

Anyone wishing to be initiated as a brahmana will have to pass the Bhakti-sastri exam and anyone wishing to take sannyasa will have to pass the Bhakti-vaibhava examination as well. This will prevent our Society from degrading to the level of so many other institutions where, in order to maintain the Temple, they accept all third class men as brahmanas. Any sannyasis or brahmanas already initiated who fail to pass the exams will be considered low class or less qualified. Anyone wishing to be second initiated will sit for examination once a year at Mayapura. Answers will be in essay form and authoritative quotations will be given a bigger score. During the exams books may not be consulted.

Finally, let me briefly note a second major reason ISKCON has had difficulty understanding and instituting varnasrama-dharma. This is the fact that the system can neither be understood nor practiced within the material and conceptual framework of an industrial society. Prabhupada taught that the modern industrial economy was artificial, unnatural, and harmful to the human and non-human world. In one way or another it would one day have to be sized-down and scaled back. Humanity would have to develop a new economy, in which the family would be restored as a unit of production and in which local self-sufficiency — most importantly in the matter of food supply — would become a major value. Therefore, from the very beginning Prabhupada wanted ISKCON to establish self-sufficient, rural communities, not only to construct the material basis necessary for varnasrama-dharma, but also to provide working examples of an alternative when the inevitable transition to a neo-agrarian economy began to impose itself upon the industrialized world.

ISKCON has established a number of these rural communities in advanced industrial countries. Many devotees have moved to them to ‘learn to live off the land’ and practice ‘plain living and high thinking.’ Yet over the course of time these projects have evolved largely into suburban-style Hare Krsna communities. We still await the self-sufficient agrarian community in practice. Although there are social and economic reasons why this ideal has failed in practice, I suspect a necessary condition for its future success will be the contribution of genuine brahmanas, whose creation is still ISKCON’s unfulfilled mission.

My proposal, therefore, for establishing varnasrama-dharma in ISKCON, and even in the society at large, is first of all to take the first step and do everything needed to form a proper community of brahmanas. According to Bhagavad-gita (18.42), two of the traits evinced by brahmanas are jnana and vijnana, that is, they have genuine knowledge of the Absolute Truth and they posses the wisdom to apply that knowledge appropriately. If this first step is taken, and ISKCON is thus given a brain, then I am sure we shall be in a better position to know where to go further.

I am happy to report that a movement is gaining strength among the leaders to make ISKCON an organization primarily dedicated to education and training. If we continue in this way, I am sure we will become eligible to receive Prabhupada’s legacy and empowered to convey it to the rest of humankind.

Kulapavana · March 28, 2005

finally some Iskcon "bigshot" decides it is time to openly talk about the missing 50% of Srila Prabhupada's mission...

"let me briefly note a second major reason ISKCON has had difficulty understanding and instituting varnasrama-dharma. This is the fact that the system can neither be understood nor practiced within the material and conceptual framework of an industrial society"

Iskcon has failed to even IDENTIFY the varna of it's own members, let alone implementing the varnasrama system in society at large.

btw: what is your varna, my dear Ravindra Svarupa Dasa?

and btw: the actual IMPLEMENTATION of the varnasrama system is NOT in the hands of the brahmanas, but in the hands of the kshatriyas... thus, you also need to have trained kshatriyas as well.

Kulapavana · March 28, 2005

Prabhu, where is this article from?

This subject matter is very dear to me. I hope there is indeed sincere interest among Iskcon leaders to complete the missing part of SP's mission. However this line has me worried:

"I am happy to report that a movement is gaining strength among the leaders to make ISKCON an organization primarily dedicated to education and training. If we continue in this way, I am sure we will become eligible to receive Prabhupada’s legacy and empowered to convey it to the rest of humankind."

translation(?): WE WILL ONLY THEORIZE...

March 29, 2005

there's not to build sanatana dharma

there's simply to destroy the catholic idea that priests are more close to god than other people and that temples are better than houses

for people is natural to learn hare krsna philosophy and remain at home to practice it.. they have a job, a place in the society (varna), they devote their mind to krsna and the job (and the whole life) turns in devotional service (ashram)

so there's no separate effort to do.. anything artificial is against varnashrama system

krsna · March 29, 2005

Good stuff but like you said we heard it all before...

Gauracandra · March 30, 2005

The first question we need to ask is what is it we mean by Varnashram? That is what is the goal we are trying to hit. I tend to view it as largely economic, though others will see it as social. The best you can do is have a general outline, and then let the organism grow in its myriad ways, and see what comes of it. A society can't be organized, it is a social organism and has to grow and mature. I do see it happening in Iskcon, its growing in all sorts of ways, some slowly, but here and there.

Here is how I see it. Srila Prabhupada set up a great bridge between East and West. Today Indians can come to western countries all over the world and immediately tap into a network of temple communities. Westerners can also tap into this network and it is a great benefit. I know many devotees who work in the U.S. and then live in India. It gives them a flexibility that most Americans never will have. Thats a great strength. Partly this is because if you are a member of a large religion, there really isn't a network you tap into (its so large, that it is somewhat meaningless). So we might call this a sort of horizontal bridge - east<->west.

The next step as I see it is a vertical bridge within various countries (America, Europe, India, South America etc...). Can we create a flexibility for our members to be able to move freely east and west (already pretty much established), as well as move freely from city life to country life (up and down, north and south). If we do this we have a full range of mobility and flexibility.

To some degree this has already been established. Again, unlike most religions which are so big, Iskcon has the advantage of being small enough that there is in fact a general cultural consensus that we want farming communities etc.... Thats a good start (having the idea, even as an ideal).

If we did establish strong rural communities it would be a major benefit for devotees to be able to move in between those worlds (city life & country life). The main obstacle I see is in the past Iskcon purchased land, and devotees moved out of the city. But this was basically a commune, and like communism, no one did anything.

Alachua seems to have done some of it right. There is a large temple community, with private ownership of their land. The main problem with rural communities is the lack of jobs. Most devotees would want to live out in the country if they could get a decent and steady job.

In this respect something like a Vaisnava Small Business Administration might be useful. Can we work towards creating home based businesses. I don't know what these necessarily will be, but in the U.S. there are millions of people who earn a living from home. I would think we could find a few thousand jobs that would be feasible.

Let me give one example I've thought of. This is a possibility of leveraging city life and country life. Its not perfect but its a general idea. Suppose (its always easier to imagine I know) you had a set of devotees who had a real skill. For a simple example, lets say you have 4 devotees who were great at stained glass. You could in fact do all of your stained glass work in the garage of your home out in the country. But how do you sell it? Well, if you had a cooperative, you could have 4 devotees, each rotates one week per month to the city. There you have a permanent office/showcase and an apartment. During the week you take orders, and work on your projects. The projects are shared with the others living in the country who create the work. Each week one person rotates out and another rotates in.

There are a couple of advantages here. First, you only have to live in the city one week per month. Commute wouldn't be that bad, after all every 3 weeks you might drive 8 hours. The second advantage is competitive. I'd be willing to bet with a skill like this, you could in fact have cheaper rates than competitors who don't have that network and all live in the city. All you have to do is earn enough to maintain a life in the country, they have to earn enough to maintain a life in the city.

So I've been trying to brainstorm what sorts of jobs these are. What jobs could be done at home and at the same time with a devotee rural community would give a slight competitive edge.

March 30, 2005

Ravindra Swarupa is completely wrong.

He says that ISKCON should be all about the Brahminical dependence on donations, that Varnashrama cannot work in an industrial society, that ISKCON's version of varnashrama needs to be all about self sufficient agrarian communities, that ISKCON needs to enforce sastric testing standards because:

Quote:

This will prevent our Society from degrading to the level of so many other institutions where, in order to maintain the Temple, they accept all third class men as brahmanas. Any sannyasis or brahmanas already initiated who fail to pass the exams will be considered low class or less qualified.

And he says that the real problem that is keeping Varnashrama from succeeding in ISKCON is:

Quote:

I suspect a necessary condition for its future success will be the contribution of genuine brahmanas, whose creation is still ISKCON’s unfulfilled mission.

My proposal, therefore, for establishing varnasrama-dharma in ISKCON, and even in the society at large, is first of all to take the first step and do everything needed to form a proper community of brahmanas.

It's amazing to me that a person with a top leadership position in ISKCON is advocating sastric tests as a qualifier for Sannyasa and Brahmana status, and yet at the same time shows such a dismal understanding of what Prabhupada actually said he wanted in regards to Varnashrama in ISKCON.

First off the idea that a Sannyasi or Brahmana is or is not qualified based upon a written test is ludicrous. Any non Brahmana can study the sastra and be able to pass any sastric test if that person is so inclined. There is no shortage of people who have the ability to study and memorize philosophy without having the nature of a Brahmana or having the nature of a Sannyasi.

What are those tests comprised of? They will be nothing more then looking to see if the person taking the test has done his or her homework. Imagine being in College and taking a class on German philosophers of the 19th century, if you passed your course, you were then awarded status as the spiritual leader of society. You could have no qualities of a Brahmana, you may be a total hedonist, but since you had good study habits, or were good at cheating, you passed the course and now you were accepted by everyone in society as some kind of superior human. Meanwhile the people who were actually qualified based on those persons inherent nature, if they were not good students, did not have time to study or were not very good at memorizing data from books, or were not inclined to cheat, and then failed the course, they should then be seen as:

Quote:

This will prevent our Society from degrading to the level of so many other institutions where, in order to maintain the Temple, they accept all third class men as brahmanas. Any sannyasis or brahmanas already initiated who fail to pass the exams will be considered low class or less qualified.

That is a supposed quote from Srila Prabhupada sent out in a letter from Prabhupadas secretary, there is no way to tell if those are Prabhupadas words or not. The context of the above quote from the letter was:

Quote:

Srila Prabhupada has requested me to write you in regard to the above examinations which he wishes to institute. Here in India many persons often criticise our sannyasis and brahmanas as being unqualified due to insufficient knowledge of the scriptures.

So it's not that Prabhupada was supposedly asking for these tests in order to determine if someone was a qualified Brahmana or Sannyasi, rather he was supposedly concerned about bad publicity due to his disciples being uneducated in the sastra. That was because at that time most of his disciples had been devotees for less then 5 years, and very few had been devotees for at most 10 years. He seemed to have been concerned with the reputation of ISKCON in India among other religious organizations because of the lack of experience of his disciples. He was creating an ad hoc solution to what he perceived as a problem of public ridicule. Nothing more.

The irony here is that a so called Brahmana, a so called leader among Brahmanas, a so called leader of Brahmanas proposing a standard of knowledge which should be enforced on ISKCON'S membership, is in fact completely in ignorance of what he is attempting to show that he is an authority about. ISKCON Sannyasis are no longer twenty year olds with only a few years of sadhana bhakti under their belts. ISKCON is no longer in the position of having to fear public ridicule because of the sastric ignorance of it's Sannyasis and Brahmanas. Those days are long past. So the tests that Prabhupada supposedly wanted, are no longer a necessity because the cause for their need, is no longer applicable.

But it doesn't stop there.

He goes on to make a litany of errors in his calling for "reform". He says that ISKCON should be a Brahmana society. He says that ISKCON should be dependent on donations like a Brahmana is supposed to be doing. He says that the Varnashrama Prabhupada proposed is all about agrarian lifestyles, and that therefore Varnashrama has not worked in ISKCON because the farm communities become "suburban" communities, instead of agrarian luddite communes.

All of that is wrong. His idea of what Prabhupada wanted for ISKCON vis-a-vis Varnashrama is not what Prabhupada himself has said. If Prabhupada said he wanted to implement Varnashrama in ISKCON then how can Ravindra Swarupa say that ISKCON should be Brahminically based and sustain itself off of donations in what he considers to be the Brahminical fashion?

Varnashrama means 4 varnas. Brahmana, Ksatriya, Vaisya, Sudra. If Ravindra were to take that test he suggests "Brahmanas" take, then I'm afraid we would all have to shun him as being some kind of spiritual leper, as he himself advises, for missing the obvious meaning of the concept of Varnashrama. On the one hand he speaks about the need to implement Varnashrama in ISKCON, yet at the same time he says that ISKCON should live by strictly Braminical standards.

You can't have it both ways. It's like saying society needs to be ruled by democratic standards, but there will be not be any voting allowed. We need to go on a diet to lose weight, and we should therefore eat ice cream and donuts all day long.

Varnashrama does not equal Brahminical. Varnashrama is not all about agrarian luddite communes. Varnashrama is about people living life and working according to their own nature, it's about doing what comes naturally, and doing it for God. In the case of ISKCON the implications are that ISKCON should not be a strictly Brahminical society, it should not be dependent soley on donations like a begger Brahmana of old, it should not be something which is restricted to agrarian luddite communes.

What it should be is a normalized social order with a common purpose, rather then a dysfunctional social order with an unsustainable purpose. ISKCON has always been a dysfunctional social order exactly because of the type of thinking that Ravindra has displayed. His way of thinking is quite common among many vaisnavas. It shows in many ways the truth of the fact that most people are not Brahminical by nature. When non-Brahmanas act in the capacity of Brahmanas, they simply make of mess of everything. Up becomes down, right becomes wrong.

Here are some words from Prabhupada from his last days with us.

Quote:

Room conversation in Mayapura, February 14, 1977

Satsvarupa: When Ramananda Raya brought Varnasrama up, Lord Caitanya said it was not possible in this age to introduce this.

Prabhupada: He did not say not possible. Iha bahya. Caitanya Mahaprabhu was interested only on the spiritual platform. He had no idea of material side. He rejected material side.

Satsvarupa: But don't we do that also?

Prabhupada: No. Our position is different. We are trying to implement Krsna consciousness in everything. Caitanya Mahaprabhu personally took sannyasa. He rejected completely material. Niskincana. But we are not going to be niskincana. We are trying to cement the troubled position of the world.

That is also in the prescription of Bhagavad-gita. We are not rejecting the whole society. Our duty is that we shall arrange the external affairs also so nicely that one day they will come to the spiritual platform very easily, paving the way. We are preaching. Therefore we must pave the situation in such a way that gradually they will be promoted to the spiritual plane.

Hari-Sauri: But in Caitanya Mahaprabhu's practical preaching He only induced them to chant.

Prabhupada: Chanting will go on. That is not stopped. But at the same time the varnasrama-dharma must be established to make the way easy.

Satsvarupa: We tell them go on with your job but chant also.

Prabhupada: Yes. Caitanya Mahaprabhu recommended, sthane sthitah. Therefore varnasrama-dharma is required. Simply show-bottle will not do. So the varnasrama-dharma should be introduced all over the world, and...

Satsvarupa: Introduced starting with ISKCON community?

Prabhupada: Yes. Yes. Brahmana, ksatriyas. There must be regular education. So we are stressing on the point of education. You educate certain section as brahmana, certain section as ksatriya, certain section as vaisya. In that education we don't discriminate because he's coming of a sudra family. Take education. Be qualified.

Hari-Sauri: But in our community as it is, we are training up as Vaisnavas...

Prabhupada: Vaisnava is not so easy. The varnasrama-dharma should be established to become a Vaisnava. It is not so easy to become Vaisnava.

Hari-Sauri: No, it's not a cheap thing.

Prabhupada: Yes. Vaisnava, to become Vaisnava, is not so easy. If to become Vaisnava is so easy, why so many fall down? It is not easy.

Hari-Sauri: Varnasrama system is beneficial. Where will we introduce the varnasrama system, then?

Prabhupada: In our society, amongst our members.

Hari-Sauri: But then if everybody's being raised to the brahminical platform...

Prabhupada: Not everybody. Why you are misunderstanding? Varnasrama, not everybody should become brahmana.

Hari-Sauri: No, but in our society practically everyone is being raised to that platform. So then one might ask what is...

Prabhupada: Everybody is being raised, but they're falling down.

Hari-Sauri: So then we should make it more difficult to get brahminical initiation. After four or five years.

Prabhupada: Not necessary. You remain as a ksatriya. You'll be happy.

Hari-Sauri: No need for even any brahmana initiation, then...

Prabhupada: No, no.

Hari-Sauri: Unless one is particularly inclined.

Prabhupada: Not that a Sudra man is by force become a brahmana. You cannot improve. That is not possible. But even if he remains a sudra and does accordingly, he will get the same position as devotee. Sva-karmana tam abhyarcya sam... He'll get the perfection. At the present moment the idea is: if one remains a sudra, then he cannot get perfection. No. Even a sudra can get perfection provided he does the work of a sudra perfectly.

Hari-Sauri: For Krsna.

Prabhupada: Therefore why a sudra artificially should be a brahmana? Let him remain a sudra, and if he follows strictly the rules and regulation of sudra, he'll also be as good as a brahmana. The same example: Just like head is as important as my leg. It is not that because it is leg, it is less important than my head. And if you ask the head, "Do the work of a leg," it is impossible. And if you ask the leg to work as a brain, that is impossible. Let him remain brain, let him remain leg, and do your duty and you become perfect.

Satsvarupa: Today you've been saying that the Vaisnava is the highest, above the brahmana. But then we've also understood that everyone in ISKCON is a Vaisnava.

Prabhupada: Yes. Vaisnava everyone, even if he's not brahmana. Jivera svarupa haya nitya-krsna-dasa. But you have to gradually bring him to that pure consciousness that "I am servant of Krsna." Here the bodily conception is going on, "I am American,I am Indian,I am this,I am that."

Satsvarupa: If in our society we say, "Srila Prabhupada wants some to be sudra..."

Prabhupada: No, no, no. I don't want. I want everyone to become Vaisnava. But because he's a sudra, it is not possible to bring him immediately to the platform of brahmana, or Vaisnava. Therefore falling down. Therefore the system must be present. But even if he remains a sudra, he's a Vaisnava.

Hari-Sauri: So we'd have to completely revise the whole system that we have now.

Prabhupada: No. Whatever we have, that is all right. But we see by experience that they're falling down. Why falling down? Because he was not fit for the position, therefore he has fallen. Better remain in his position and become perfect. Why artificially bring them? There is no need. Krsna says. Bring that Bhagavad-gita. Sve sve karmany abhiratah?

Hari-Sauri: sve sve karmany ab hiratah samsiddhim labhate narah sva-karma-niratah siddhim yatha vindati tac chrnu By following his qualities of work, every man can become perfect. Now please hear from Me how this can be done."

Prabhupada: Yes. He is sudra, clerk. As a sudra, he can get the perfection. Why he should artificially become a brahmana and sannyasi and fall down? This has to be checked.

Hari-Sauri: So in Mayapura here now we have that situation, that so many...

Prabhupada: Everywhere, wherever, Mayapura or anywhere. Question is that here it is clearly said, sve sve karmany abhiratah. Brahmana has his duty, ksatriya has his duty, vaisya has his duty, sudra has his duty. And if he performs his duty nicely, then he also becomes perfect.

So why artificially he should be called a brahmana?

Let them do, according to sastra, the work of sudra, or vaisya. He'll become perfect. Perfection is not checked.

But why artificially he should be made a brahmana or he should be made a sannyasi and fall down and become ludicrous?

That is the point. Better let him live in his position and become perfect. That's good. That looks very nice. And that is possible. That is possible. Lord Visnu can be worshiped if you perfectly follow the rules and regulation of four varnas and four asramas.

Here it is also said, sve sve karmani. You work as a perfect brahmana or a perfect ksatriya, perfect sudra; you get perfection. The perfection is available in your natural life.

Why should artificially you become unnatural and fall down and become ludicrous?

Hari-Sauri: At this time should we try to introduce it in our centers or not?

Prabhupada: Always we shall try. Human society will be always there. We have to serve them, para-upakara. We have to keep them in the right position.

Hari-Sauri: I just remember two or three years ago there was a thing... A pamphlet came out about introducing the varnasrama system in the society, but actually nothing came of it.

Prabhupada: Yes. That time was not right. Now you can do something. Every business is important. Brahmana business is important, ksatriya... Just like the body. Head is important; the arm is important; the belly is important. They must be kept in order.

Just like I am in trouble because my belly is not working. Digesting power is not good. So in spite of brain, hand, and leg, I am diseased. If any part of the society remains diseased, the whole society will suffer.

Therefore they must be maintained in correct order. You cannot say if there is some trouble in the leg, "Neglect the leg. Take care of the brain." No. Brain will be taxed due to the pain in the leg. This is nature. Therefore everyone should be kept in order. Then things will go on. That is varnasrama.

Hari-Sauri: So at least if we successfully introduce the varnasrama system in our own society, then when all the demons finish themselves...

Prabhupada: At least... At least... At least they will see, "This is the ideal." Ideal. We are giving the ideal. We are not going to be a sudra. But to show ... Just like you play in a drama. You are playing the part of a king. You are not a king.

Hari-Sauri: No.

Prabhupada: So similarly, just to give them idea, we have to play like that.

Hari-Sauri: Well, again, that's...

Prabhupada: Not necessarily that we are going to be sudra. So that is it. That is the thing. We are servant of Krsna. That's all. And as servant of Krsna, we have to execute the order of Krsna.

Satsvarupa: So we can ideally organize ourselves and then for the rest of the people all we can do is hope that they'll follow it.

Prabhupada: Yes. In order to serve the mass of people, to bring them to the ideal position, we should try to introduce this varnasrama, not that we are going to be candidates of varnasrama. It is not our business. But to teach them how the world will be in peaceful position we have to introduce.

March 30, 2005