Prabhupada's last official declaration

[Guruvani 0]

What was Prabhupada's last personally signed declaration regarding the system of initiation in ISCKON? Was the "disciple of my disciple" conversation an officially signed and decreed document? (no)

If the "disciple of my disciple" conversation was not Prabhupada's final directives for the future of ISKCON then what was?

 

The last signed declaration by Srila Prabhupada was:

 

ISKCON

 

INTERNATIONAL SOCIETY FOR KRISHNA CONSCIOUSNESS

 

Founder-Acharya: His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada

 

July 9th, 1977

 

 

 

To All G.B.C., and Temple Presidents

 

Dear Maharajas and Prabhus,

 

Please accept my humble obeisances at your feet. Recently when all of the GBC members were with His Divine Grace in Vrndavana, Srila Prabhupada indicated that soon He would appoint some of His senior disciples to act as "rittik"-representative of the acarya, for the purpose of performing initiations, both first initiation and second initiation. His Divine Grace has so far given a list of eleven disciples who will act in that capacity:

 

• His Holiness Kirtanananda Swami

 

• His Holiness Satsvarupa dasa Gosvami

 

• His Holiness Jayapataka Swami

 

• His Holiness Tamala Krsna Gosvami

 

• His Holiness Hrdayananda Gosvami

 

• His Holiness Bhavananda Gosvami

 

• His Holiness Hamsaduta Swami

 

• His Holiness Ramesvara Swami

 

• His Holiness Harikesa Swami

 

• His Grace Bhagavan dasa Adhikari

 

• His Grace Jayatirtha dasa Adhikari

 

In the past Temple Presidents have written to Srila Prabhupada recommending a particular devotee's initiation. Now that Srila Prabhupada has named these representatives, Temple Presidents may henceforward send recommendation for first and second initiation to whichever of these eleven representatives are nearest their temple. After considering the recommendation, these representatives may accept the devotee as an initiated disciple of Srila Prabhupada by giving a spiritual name, or in the case of second initiation, by chanting on the Gayatri thread, just as Srila Prabhupada has done. The newly initiated devotees are disciples of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupad, the above eleven senior devotees acting as His representative. After the Temple President receives a letter from these representatives giving the spiritual name or the thread, he can perform the fire yajna in the temple as was being done before. The name of a newly initiated disciple should be sent by the representative who has accepted him or her to Srila Prabhupada, to be included in His Divine Grace's "Initiated Disciples" book.

 

Hoping this finds you all well.

 

Your servant,

 

Tamala Krsna Gosvami

 

Secretary to Srila Prabhupada

 

Approved: A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami

 

[srila Prabhupada's signature appears on the original]

 

 

[Guest guest]

this is not demonstrating that this system had to be continued after srila prabhupada's disappearance

[Guruvani 0]

Prabhupada signed this decree and the wording of it said "henceforward". Let's look at the dictionary meaning of "henceforward":

hence[forth 7hens fCrth$, hens4fCr0#8

adv.

5ME hennesforth: see prec. & FORTH6

1 from this time on: also hence#for$ward 73fCr4w!rd8

 

 

"FROM THIS TIME ON" is what the dictionary says. Prabhupada singed the document with it's implications that "FROM THIS TIME ON" this system will be in place.

 

If it was meant to last only until Prabhupada's disappearance, Prabhupada would have made them correct the wording to "until Prabhupada is gone".

 

All we can really do is accept this final decree of Srila Prabhupada face value with it's wording of "henceforeward" (from this time on). To interpret it as meaning anything else is a deviation from the actual implied meaning of the words as given in the English language.

[Govindaram 1]

HK

 

Does that mean, that all Iskcon people are disobying the orders of the spititual master (Srila Prabhupada), and so they will fall down, if not today then soon? Is that what you saying prabhuji?

[I_love_krishna_ 0]

Why do we emphasize on how the organization of ISKCON is run, our main goal is to go to krishna, isn't that enough

 

who cares if people follow the ritvik system or some other system , as long as we all get to one goal that is reaching krishna.

[Guest guest]

.. and world jugglery...

 

srila prabhupad is not ever going on morning walks ... and he has not given an OFFICIAL stop..

 

when the guru goes to krsna stops to give diksa.... very simple

[Guest guest]

Here's a brief article I wrote for Krishna.org about a year and a half ago:

 

http://guru.krishna.org/Articles/2001/01/00233.html

 

The GBC argue that the ritvik system was a temporary measure Prabhupada put in place until he left his body. If this is the case then why didn't Srila Prabhupada issue any other instructions on this point? Surely His Divine Grace would have had the foresight to clarify the most important issue facing the devotees following his departure. Srila Prabhupada would certainly have put something in writing to the effect of "After I leave my body my disciples can become diksa gurus." But no such quote or reference can be found in ANY of Srila Prabhupada's teachings.

 

Actually when he refers to becoming a guru it is almost always in the sense of becoming a 'siksa' or instructing guru. See the purport to the 'amara ajnaya guru haya tara ei desa' verse in CC. Prabhupada actually says it is best NOT TO ACCEPT ANY DISCIPLES but rather to simply repeat the words of Sri Krishna in Bhagavad Gita and Srimad Bhagavatam. On the few occasions when Srila Prabhupada speaks of his disciples becoming diksha gurus it is coupled with the phrase "on my order . . . "

 

From what i have seen most new devotees are happy to accept the party line - whatever the leaders tell them they accept. They quickly label 'ritviks' as demons and believe that Prabhupada intended for his disciples to become diksha gurus following his departure.

 

It is unfortunate that most have not read Srila Prabhupada's actual instructions on this matter. He says that all his leading disciples should become 'ritvik acharyas' and initiate devotees on his behalf. There is no time factor mentioned in this letter - in other words it is not described as a temporary measure to be instituted until Prabhupada's departure.

 

Hare Krishna

 

Sudama dasa

[Guruvani 0]

I am not saying that. Maybe we could say that the GBC and the 11 original rtviks disobeyed Srila Prabhupada.

There are some ISKCON gurus who cannot be blamed for the initial deviation by the GBC.

There are some really wonderful devotees in ISKCON and some of them have accepted disciples. Lokanatha Maharaja, Svarupa Damodara Maharaja and many others had nothing to do with the inititial deviations by the GBC and they cannot be faulted for trying to make the best of a bad situation and going ahead to accept their own disciples.

My main grievance is with the 11 original gurus who pressured the GBC into accepting them as diksha gurus after the disappearance of Srila Prabhupada.

It was actually, Bhagavan das, Kirtanananda Swami and Tamal Krishna Maharaja who spearheaded the move to change the status of the original 11 rtviks to diksha gurus. Some of the other 11 just went along to get along. What happened after that is simply an effort to make the new system work.

Narayana Maharaja was a major influence on these 11 and the GBC to abandon the rtvik system with his opposition to it.

 

I don't condemn ISKCON gurus wholesale. We can trace the original deviation back to the orignal 11 who aggreed with these three main instigators to abandon the rtvik system for the diksha guru system.

 

I personally have the highet admiration for some of the ISKCON gurus, though I have some grievance with the orignal 11 who conducted the conspiracy and pressured the GBC to endorse their intentions.

[Govindaram 1]

HK

 

I think I get it now, heres what I think you are saying in

simplified terms prabhuji....

 

Srila Prabhupada (Acaraya in the line of disiplic succession form Lord Sri Krishna Chaitanya Mahaprabhu)

 

His 11 initiated disciples, have the authority to initiate

disciples all over the world on the behalf of Srila Prabhupada

 

Srila Prabhupada always remaining the original diksha guru

 

The 11 disciples (ritvik) or some of them want to have,

the same authority as Srila Prabhupda (and sit on big seats), and become diksha gurus like Srila Prabhupada.

 

Thereby thinking themselves on a par with Srila Prabhupda,

(the ego and maya are unbelievable)

 

The rest you have you have already mentioned

Hope this right prabhuji, I am still learning...Haribol

 

Ps.So what is the story right now with the original 11

 

[Sudama 0]

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