Hello

[Hedied4us2live]

I am a Christian... and I was just wondering about your faith.. what do you guys believe in?

if you want you may ask me some questions about my faith.. I am looking forward talking with you guys.. night..

 

sincerely,

Me

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Could you be a little more specific about your question,its hard to answer questions grossly.There is so much to say and it cant just be described if there is no specific question for that.We would all be glad to answer your questions as much as we can

Thanks

[Guest guest]

Christ was the coolest Guru ever. too bad ppl took his teachings and misunderstood them and distorted them to what they have become today...

 

if u wanna talk w/ some other open-minded Christian ppl on this site their user names are: SarahK and Vayu.

[Guest guest]

Was he a million times cooler than your

Shankaracharya? IS and WAS

[Guest guest]

nd I was just wondering about your faith.. what do you guys believe in?

 

We believe not in a sky-god like yours who sits on the clouds and is jealous, wicked and always angry cum egoistic.

We have our true scriptures pointing to the lord of the whole universe.You will be wondered by the reference of galaxies and planets and all those cosmic details in our hindu scriptures.

while your bable is confined to the planet earth, and bable considers sky as a firmament on which stars are attached. In revelation there is a verse that stars were thrown to the earth. the mythographer who composed revelation thought stars were much smaller than earth.

STUPID RELIGION.

[Guest guest]

wonderful response. he came here to ask about hinduism and you just made him a martyr. people like you are the reason they want to 'convert', thinking we are apes without insight or reason. by telling him what you think of christianity you are basically showing how little you know about hinduism as well.

 

hedied4us2live, hinduism is incredibly expansive. there is alot of theory, religion, culture, philosophy, metaphysics, spirituality all rolled into one. you need an open mind and a proper teacher to interpret things for you, and unfortunately due to the very nature of christianity, hinduism is often misunderstood and misapplied when you try to understand it. in a brief and general sense, think of christianity as the practical application of hindu philosophy. we do believe in one God, whereas while christians know God to be a material embodiment through christ, hindu's know that enlightenment can be obtained by purification and dharma. christians say christ is the way, but hindu's know christ was a product of the hindu way as well.

 

there is no need to confess you are a sinner, if you are purged of the ability to sin. it's the next step up from being a common, worldly minded person, even one who has strict beliefs, or who has been baptised. buddhism is an aetheistic interpretation of the christian method, but with focus on different aspects of an individuals virtues. hinduism is not a paganistic, ritualistic, hokey religion. it is a universal law.

[Guest guest]

Why do you believe Christ will save you?

He couldn't save himself. On the cross

he said: My god, my god, why have you

forsaken me? And his god turned a deaf

ear to him. According to the story, Christ

died on the cross and was not saved by

his god.

[Guest guest]

Was he a million times cooler than your

Shankaracharya? IS and WAS

[Guest guest]

he was def not a million times cooler! omg what was i thinking?

 

maybe i used hyperbole or something... but i am not exxagerating about Sankara!

[Guest guest]

Kwaka, you say that Buddhism an atheistic

interpretation of the Christian method.

Buddhism is 800 years older than 2nd century

Christianity. How can it be an interpretation

of anything in Christianity when Christianity

did not even exist then? Also what is this Christian

method you are talking about?

[Sephiroth]

too bad ppl took his teachings and misunderstood them and distorted them to what they have become today...

 

If you know that people distorted his teachings, then WHY are you still holding onto a distorted teachings?

 

What is the logic of following a road which you KNOW leads nowhere?

 

And what is the logic is knowing that the road you have taken leads to nowhere YET you preach to others to follow? Isn't that like the blind leading the blind?

[Guest guest]

I saw a programme that talked about the possibility that the tomb in Kashmir may or may not have been Christ's. That is irrelevant but what was interesting is when they showed that many verses from the gospels, looked like they were taken from Buddhist scriptures. The idea was that due to the Buddhist ideas all over the east in that period Jesus must have been familiar with these teachings and incorporated them in his religion. Or even if he didn't exist the founders of the early christian community could have taken Buddhas teachings and pass it off as Jesus' words.

[Guest guest]

"Why do you believe Christ will save you?

He couldn't save himself. On the cross

he said: My god, my god, why have you

forsaken me? And his god turned a deaf

ear to him. According to the story, Christ

died on the cross and was not saved by

his god."

 

where did i say it was the case that christ could save you? what is misunderstood by christians themselves is the whole process of 'enlightenment'. christians say by believing in christ you are saved. they are ignorant of the process one goes through, which is acceptance of God over all other material desires. this is explained in the gita, as well as the idea that a demigod or lesser god although worshipped not in accordance with rules, leads to the eventual discovery of the supreme. who christ was or what people believe is not important. it is the mechanics underneath the mental process of acceptance that is important. what christians refer to as faith for hindu's is pure bhakti. im not arguing one religion over another, im explaining in a way the christian will understand.

[Guest guest]

"Kwaka, you say that Buddhism an atheistic

interpretation of the Christian method.

Buddhism is 800 years older than 2nd century

Christianity. How can it be an interpretation

of anything in Christianity when Christianity

did not even exist then? Also what is this Christian

method you are talking about? "

 

yes, i dont mean from a historial perspective, im explaining for someone from a christian point of view to understand what buddhism is, as they may not know. im aware buddah was born much earlier. basically the practices in buddhism are more or less are evident in christianity. some have different emphasis than others. christianity without doctrine and without jesus becomes very similar to buddhism in a sense. im not referring to 'churchianity' here, im talking about real christianity in practice. the christian method i referred to is that where they practice abstaining from materialism, purity of thought, forgiveness, detachment from bonds, loving kindness, etc, that sort of practice. these exist in the correct church based environment, so in effect they echo what is there in buddhism. their 'saviour' is a model to follow, one which acts as a very strong medium of propaganda. this 'character' jesus was an enforcement of ideals by the vatican.

[Sephiroth]

Why don't you people read this first and know the Origin of Act of Renunciation of the World?

 

Source :http://forum.cari.com.my/forumdisplay.php?fid=185

 

 

[Note : the following statements are my own deduction on various religions existed. ]

 

 

Vamana Avatar and Practitioners of Renouncing the World.

 

 

One of the smaller branch of Hindusm are Sannyasi - a group of men who choose to renounce the World and live in state of Celibacy. They will concentrate themselves toward God and Religion and leave behind Family life and such. Buddhism is considered one of this practise as well, especially among Buddhist Monks.

 

Now, for a long time now, I was wondering about some questions about them. Questions are :

 

1. Where did this practise came from?

- Some puranas did mentioned methods of Renouncing the World but not in detail so there is no exact purana from which it was based on. Bhavagad Gita itself is addressed to Laymen who wish to indulge in the Worldly Affairs (as practised by most Humans nowadays).

 

2. What is the starting point of Sannyasi practise?

- Like I said before, some puranas state about the practise but none can be said to be the source of them.

 

3. Where did the clothing and methods of Sannyasi used came from also?

4. Where did the Spiritual Aspects comes from?

5. And most importantly, what are the proper Spiritual aspect a Sannyasi should follow?

 

Unknowingly, while I was researching Vamana Avatar, I think I finally found this answer.

 

 

Answer to Question 1 : Vamana Purana is source for the Practise of Sannyasi.

 

- In Vamana Avatar, Lord Vishnu took the form of a Drawf, left His parents (after receiving their blessing) and went into the World. In same manner, Sannyasi and Buddhist Monks are required to (voluntarily) leave the Family them know behind and go to the world.

 

In some Sannyasi groups, family men who left their families without their consent (like leaving behind young wife and little children) will be asked to return back because such practise will only burden the Seeker of truth and prevent him from reaching the highest level of renounching.

 

Even Gautama Buddha who left behind His wife and children, did so because His father and Family wouldn't had let Him go. In the end, He came back to them, and teach them about Truth (not because He wanted His family back, but because He wanted to liberate His family as well ... a Responsible Action).

 

 

Answer to Question 2 and 3 : Unfortunately, I cannot answer this because Hindusm is a timeless religion which started when the First Man is born on this Planet. So who knows who are the First Sannyasi because, as puranas stated, many Asharams had couples living together and worshipping God. ( We could use such Ashrams nowadays in Malaysia. )

 

However, according to the 10 Avatars, Vamana Avatar is considered the FIRST Birth Lord Vishnu had as a Human (all others are different organisms), so in the way, Vamana Avatar Himself can be consider the First Human Sannyasi (and probably the First Buddha as well).

 

Also, Vamana Avatar fits perfectly as a Human. Humans born the same way Vamana Avatar did, grows up and matures fast (of compared to Asuras and Dewas) in relatively short period of time - 15 years or so (where they become sexually matured). Humans are weak physically - have no natural defense against Nature and its other occupants which is what Vamana Avatar's drawfy form supposed to indicate, also the required for Vamana Avatar to seek blessing and alms from others to survive.

 

Humans are naturally (born) peaceful and happy (unlike some religion stating that they burdened with Original Sins), which is what the easy-going attitude of Vamana Avatar supposed to present. By renouncing the World, Sannyasi can retain that Child-like attitude and be happy and peaceful till the end of his time.

 

So, all this shows that Vamana Avatar is the starting point of Sannyasi Practise (and probably Buddhism as well).

 

 

Answer to Question 4 : Spiritual Aspects of Sannyasi Practise. For me, this is the deepest and the one which everyone should think about.

 

Many people and groups in the World today renounce the World by stating that the World is full of suffering and corrupted and they wanted to reach God by obtaining Moksha. Is this a proper way of Sannyasi? By discarding the World and seeking God for his own selfish need to be saved? Is this what Gautama Buddha taught as Buddhism? Is this what Vamana Avatar showed?

 

Answer - I could say No.

 

What people and some groups are practising today is different from what the Spiritual Aspects of Renouncing the World supposed to be. It is heavily influenced by Islam and Christianity (no offense attended) which views the World as a dirty and disgusting place and the goal of Living was to escape from this Prison.

 

First of all, Renouncing the World means you seeks to deattach yourself from the World emotionally and seeks to find God (in Buddhism - Sense of Enlightnment). You don't renounce the world by stating it is dirty and disgusting and you want to avoid living in it. That is not the method of Renouncing.

 

When Vamana Avatar took His Drawf form, everyone was surprised and asked why Lord Vishnu took this small form which hardly suits a battle which required to take back what Pali had taken from the Dewas. And what did Lord Vishnu answered - He came not to fight but to BEG. He Himself didn't follow what the Dewas expected of Him to do and made His own actions and Rules. Same way, just because the World is ugly, you don't have to make it even uglier by acting Selfishly. Actions of Seeking God while your fellow Men suffering is Action of a Selfish person. This is NOT what Vamana Avatar showed and this is NOT Sannyasi practise or Buddhism for that matter.

 

In His "battle" with Pali, what Vamana Avatar asked was very little - but what He gave was a lot. He reestablished Kingdom of Heaven back to the Dewas and made the World His. He send Pali (who become His devotee) to the Underworld where Pali ruled in His name while awaits His return (which He did in Ramayana). In the whole "battle" - no violence is used and everyone had received what they required.

 

What does this have to do with Sannyasi and Buddhism? In the similar way, this two groups have the strongest "weapon" and many of this groups doesn't know about it.

 

While I studied Magic and its concept, I have came to conclude that Basic of ALL Magic is FAITH (Keter - highest level in Tree Of Life). It is Faith which brought together and combine all the other elements in. Same way, Faith generates Merits (Punya - Pahala) as result of their actions and beliefs.

 

Compared to most Humans who struggle through Life and have no Faith, Sannyasi and Buddhist Monks have more Faith than them. WHY? Because they believe so much that they willing to renounce the World to follow what they believe in and if that is not Faith, I don't know what is. It's similar to a Warrior - he must believe in his skills, knowledge and physical abilities in facing the enemy if he was to survive and win. Which is why I considered Buddha's Approach of Renouncing the World as Warrior's Way.

 

A Sannyasi who lives for sake of the World will pray for the World, and give his Merits (Pahala - Punya) to the World so it will promote Goodness and Prosperity to all. He will become like a Tree which gives shade to others, fruits to eat, air to breath and sweet sight to behold. In the end, Faith in Spiritualism will bring him closer to God and in the end, lead him to Enlightnment.

 

But Sannyasis nowadays mostly don't do this. They seek Enlightnment and Spiritual Advance but they themselves offers NOTHING to the World. It's like asking for something expensive when you have no money to pay for it. In the end, you ask and ask and ask, but receive nothing and make stupid statements that God don't exist because He never gave you what you seek.

 

Buddhists also have fallen to trap of Atheism. They follow the same method as above, thinking that renouncing the World which they believe to be an illusion as proper methods of Buddhism; they meditate, discuss Sutras, debate and talk about peace when they do nothing for peace in higher level (of Spiritualism) and wonder forever why they never reached Enlightnment (reminds me of Ariya though. ).

 

Lastly ... To ALL who wants to progress in Spiritualism :-

Live FOR the World and Its people and you will find yourself closer to God. Be a tree which gives shade to others, Don't be weeds which nice to look at but gives nothing to the World.

 

Muslims should work for thier community and their own people (instead of asking others to support them).

 

Christians must take care their own problems before coming to other nations and try to convert others as if they themselves are saved.

 

Hindus should stop trying to run from the World and start living for the World.

 

And Buddhist should do the same things (since their goal is similar to Hindus as well).

[Guest guest]

Kwaka, you have been interpreting Christianity for us. What do you think

of these passages from the New Testament which more or less sum

up the violent history of Christianity.

 

 

SOWING SEEDS OF DIVISION, DESTROYING FAMILIES AND PROMOTING WAR

 

Luke 22:36

 

... he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

 

Luke 12:49

 

I am come to send fire on the earth.

 

Matthew 12:30

 

He that is not with me is against me; and he that gathereth not with me scattereth abroad.

Luke 12:51

 

Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but

rather division.

 

Matthew 10:36

 

...a man's foes shall they be of his own household.

 

Luke 12:52

 

...from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against

two, and two against three.

 

Matthew 10:35

 

For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter

against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

 

Matthew 10:21

 

And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the

child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them

to be put to death.

 

 

INTOLERANCE FOR OTHERS' POINTS OF VIEW

 

Matthew 23:33

 

Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye

escape the damnation of hell?

 

Matthew 24:27

 

Woe to you, scribes and ... hypocrites!

 

Luke 10:13-15

 

Woe unto thee ... it shall be more tolerable for

Tyre and Sidon at the judgment, than for you.

 

And thou ... shalt be thrust down to hell.

 

Revelation 2:12

 

These things saith he which hath the sharp sword

with two edges.

 

Revelation 2:16

 

I will come ..., and will fight against

them with the sword of my mouth.

 

 

PUNISHMENT FOR CONSENSUAL SEX BETWEEN ADULTS

 

Revelation 2:20-23

 

... I have a few things against thee, because

thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which

calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to

seduce my servants to commit fornication, and

to eat things sacrificed unto idols.

 

And I gave her space to repent of her

fornication; and she repented not.

 

Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them

that commit adultery with her into great

tribulation, ...

 

And I will kill her children with death ...

 

CURSING THE FIG TREE

 

Christ was hungry and looked around for something to eat.

He saw a fig tree some distance away. But it was not the

season of figs yet. Being out of season, the tree bore only

leaves but no fruit. Here's what happened.

 

Matthew 21:19-20

 

And when he saw a fig tree in the way, he came to it,

and found nothing thereon, but leaves only, and said

unto it, Let no fruit grow on thee henceforward for

ever. And presently the fig tree withered away.

 

And when the disciples saw it, they marvelled,

saying, How soon is the fig tree withered away!

 

Mark 11:13-14 , 11:20-21

 

And seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came,

if haply he might find any thing thereon: and when he

came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of

figs was not yet.

 

And Jesus answered and said unto it, No man eat fruit

of thee hereafter for ever. And his disciples heard it.

 

And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig

tree dried up from the roots.

 

And Peter calling to remembrance saith unto him, Master,

behold, the fig tree which thou cursedst is withered

away.

 

 

APOCALYPSE, ONLY BELIEVERS WILL BE SAVED

 

... ye shall hear of wars ...

 

For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against

kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences,

and earthquakes, in divers places.

 

Then shall be two in the field; the one shall be taken,

and the other left.

 

Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall

be taken, and the other left.

 

And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that

give suck, in those days!

 

... for there shall be great distress in the land, and

wrath upon this people.

 

And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall

be led away captive into all nations ...

 

there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

For in those days shall be affliction ...

 

then ... great tribulation ...

 

no flesh should be saved ...

 

And except those days should be shortened, there

should no flesh be saved ...

 

but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he

hath shortened the days.

 

... after that tribulation ... shall he send his

angels, and shall gather together his elect from

the four winds, from the uttermost part of the

earth to the uttermost part of heaven.

 

 

GENOCIDE, WORLD CONQUEST AND DOMINATION

 

Revelation 2:26-28

 

And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end,

to him will I give power over the nations:

 

And he shall rule them with a rod of iron; as the vessels

of a potter shall they be broken to shivers ...

 

And I will give him the morning star.

 

Luke 19:27

 

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should

reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.

[Guest guest]

{Hindus should stop trying to run from the World and start living for the World.}

 

But there are Hindu sects who do this. There are groups that concentrate on Karma-yoga rather than raja-yoga. These sanyassis are mainly followers for sects that prescribe raja-yoga or tantric methods. The groups that follow karma-yoga believe working selflessly for society will lead to Moksha. Vivekananda emphasied this for his followers and so have many other groups. There are also sects that combine bhakti-yoga with karma-yoga.

 

[Guest guest]

Yo Sephiroth man.... u gotta chill out a lil ok? that ego of urs... tell it to heeeel.

 

i do not follow that teaching which u commented on, so ya.. calm down.

[Guest guest]

there are good seeds everywhere, bad seeds everywhere, every religion. times change, thought progresses. you have to be prepared to be unbiased, when battling evangelicals. they will sell their good points to you, so you in turn need to know their good points and bad points, just like they know ours. the discussion is about hinduism, and therefore im providing an interpretation for the christian who wrote the thread.

[Sephiroth]

But there are Hindu sects who do this.

 

Yes, this sects are influenced by Abrahamic religions (Christianity and Islam).

 

They have forgotten a few things like :

 

1. Reincarnation IS real (even Jews believe in Reincarnation).

 

Which means that IF you do not obtain Spiritual Perfection in this lifetime, you WILL come back (either to this world or to other worlds) and be born again.

 

 

2. IF people leave problems in this lifetime, they will find themselves in the same problem in the next.

 

No one actually escape from their karma. You throw thrash onto the World and die, you will be born into the trash you thrown earlier. So in the end, you have to clean your own mess.

 

 

3. NO ONE can become perfect in ONE lifetime. This is stupidity of Christianity and Islam, thinking one lifetime is all it takes.

 

 

4. Heaven IS NOT your ultimate Goal - God is. Many people work for achieving Heavenly existences and not working for God.

 

 

 

To Ravi - What's your problem?

[Guest guest]

prem namaste

 

you u should so desire the truth then go onto

www.jesusneverexisted.com

take it which ever way you want.

 

jai hind

narottam das

[Guest guest]

just thought u thought i was a christian and that u were talking to me about already knowing its false but still following it. thats all. no offense meant or anything