Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 Who is Ravana? What place he hold in Hindu religion? Is he a Brahmana? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 After creation, Lord Brahma created Sanath kumaras. Four Sanath kumaras are symbol of knowledge & they were supreme Bhagavathas. they are external youths in form of 5 yr old kids. Once they went to Vaikunda to have a darshan of Supreme Lord - Narayana. But two dvarapalakas (gatekeepers) of vaikunda seeing 4 kids approaching vaikunda, they misunderstood sanath kumaras greatness & refused them to allow to enter in Vaikunda. Sanath kumaras on hearing this got angry & cursed them to become demons for 3 births. In all the 3 births they will be insulting Vishnu & harassing Vishnu's devotees. So as per the curse, two gatekeepers (Jaya & Vijaya) born as Hiryankasha & Hiranyakashipu in first birth. They were killed by Lord Varaha & Lord Narashima. Note : Hiryankasha & Hiranyakashipu were Shaivatees. In next birth, they again born as "Ravana & Kumbakarna". Also Ravana & Kumbakarna also shaivatees. Since they worshipped Shiva, Shaivatees regarded them as Brahmin. But their nasty acts are not worthy of the title, because brahmins should be pure at heart & deed. But they werent, as they were evil. As we all know "Lord Rama" killed Ravana & Kumbakarna. Ravana is regarded as "Symbol of evil" & taken as example of how a man "should not" behave. So in Ramlila, Ravanas image are made & burnt. Philosophically : Every human has Rama (ie., God) & Ravana (ie., Evil energy) in him. As long as we dont burn (or chast) away the evil within ourself, we cant feel the bliss of God (Lord Rama) residing within us. In order to burn down the evil forces within us, we defintely need help of some divine forces. Divine forces are none other than forces that govern our sareera (body). All the divine forces the govern our body is controlled by "Vayu" (ie., Life giving air). So we have to worship Vayu so that he will burn down the evil forces within us & help us to realise God (lord Rama) residing within us. In Ramayana, Vayu incarantes as Hanuman. Hanuman serves Lord Rama by killing namy demons of Ravana. So this is main theme of Rama, Hanuman & Ravana. Above philosophy is heavily supported By Dwaita Philosophy. Lord Vayu incarnated as "Sri Sri Madhvacharya" & expounded the philosophy. Also "Sri Sri Guru Raghavendraswamy" also came & preached the Dwaita Philosophy. In order to know more about dwaitam visit www.dvaita.org In order to know about "Sri Sri Raghavendraswamy" visit www.srsmutt.org /images/graemlins/smile.gif JAI SHRI RAM /images/graemlins/smile.gif JAI SHRI HANUMAN /images/graemlins/smile.gif JAI SHRI KRISHNA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 Thanks for the reply. Is ravana really a brahmana? And I have another question. As per the puranas, is lanka a part of India? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 A Brahmana is the one who realises/realised God. Since Ravana is symbol of evil how can be a brahmana ? So Ravana is not a brahmana. He was just a Demon (Asura/Raktchasa) There were many evidences found that a bridge existed between India & Srilanka and also the bridge was so ancient. So it defintely points to the bridge built By Hanuman. Moreover, Famous kothanda Rama temple is built near Dakshinakodi and temple is sooo ancient. Sthala purana of the temple is "Rama sat there" when Hanuman & others were building the bridge. So according to puranas, it seems "lanka" of ramayana is "srilanka" itself. Philosophically : Our Sareera (body) has two sections. One is driven be negative powers & other by divine powers. So if a person is bad, negative powers make control of him & vice versa. Here one section is "ram bhoomi" (divine powers) & other section is "lanka" (negative powers). So with the help of governing divine forces (Vayu - life giving air) in our sareera (body) we should overcome the negative powers by allowing the divine powers to dominate our body. So Vayu acts as a bridge to allow divine powers to dominate our body. In Ramayana "Vayu" is hanuman, Divine power is "Rama" & Negative power is "Ravana". The above philosophy is heavily supported by Dvaitha philosophy. It is lord vayu incarnated as "Sri Madhvathirtha" and expounded the Dwaitha philosophy. Also Lord Narayana (Rama) sent his topmost devotee "Prahlada" in form of "Sri Sri Guru Raghavendra" and Guruji preached the Dwaita Philosophy. In order to get more info on Dwaita philosophy visit www.dvaita.org In order to get more info on Guru Raghavendraswamy visit www.srsmutt.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2004 Report Share Posted March 3, 2004 Ravana was a kshatriya, a royal king. Most of his power came from his great austerities and the boon he received from Lord Shiva. Thus, he was a powerful king, well-established in tapas, but not enlightened. Brahmins are not automatically enlightened souls. Brahmans are priests who dedicate themselves to a religious life as the storehouse of Vedic knowledge and as performers of Hindu ceremonies. Some who choose not to take the life of an active priest still observe certain rules, like vegetarianism, abstinence from intoxicants and daily prayer. They may or may not marry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 Rama Killed Vali hiding behind a tree. It was infact a family fight between the brothers and Rama had no right to interfere. It was a biased fight. And how do you think Arjuna killed Karna? You think it was fair? It was Krishna who twisted the rules of war to kill a helpless warrior without his weapons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 Rama is parabrahma . he has right to do anything. only idiots like you wont understand Rama. Also krishna is parabrahma. dumpheads like you wont understand krishna. Your words show hatred towards Rama & krishna. That means you are a asura. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 Power Corrupts, and absolute power tends to corrupt absolutely right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brinthan Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 Ravana kinapped Sita not because he wanted to make her his. Because Sita was Ravana's daughter, and Ravana knew that. He didn't want Sita to suffer in the jungle. In the real Ramayana Vaalmiki wrote, it's said that Sita was the daughter of Ravana. Ravana couldn't tell anyone that Sita was her daughter, because of some promises or something. This is what I heard. In Kamba Ramayana, Kamban changed the story, and said that Ravana was in love with Sita because according the Tamil Culture, non other than the husband of the girl is allowed to touch her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brinthan Posted March 4, 2004 Report Share Posted March 4, 2004 <<..Rama is parabrahma . he has right to do anything. only idiots like you wont understand Rama..>> Rama's arrow is said that it breaks the mountains and hard roccks and everything. But when Rama hit Vali, his arrow didn't even come through the chest of Vali. It stuck in the middle because of the way Rama hit Vali. Because he didn't hit him face to face. Even the people who have studied literatures and everything argues whether it was Killing of Vali is right or wrong. <<..Also krishna is parabrahma. dumpheads like you wont understand krishna..>> Krishna did a lot of tricks to make the war happen. And did everything to make Pandavas win. Saha Devan (the fourth one in Pandavas) ate the ashes of Paandu because Paandu had asked their sons to eat his ashes and that it would bring them great knowledge. Krishna stopped Paandavas when they were about the eat the ashes, he said that what kind of idiot would eat ashes and get knowldege, but Saha Devan didn't listen to him, he went and ate the ashes. Because of that he was the one with the great knowldege. Once they were arguing about how to stop Mahabharat War, Saha Devan was so quite that made Krishna uncomfortable, and he asked him "How come you are so quite? Why don't you say how you think we can stop the way?" And Saha Devan asked him back "Do you really want me to say?" And then Krishna, knowing what he will say asked him to say to him privately, and Saha Devan said to him "To stop the Mahabharat war, first we should shave the head of Throwpathi, kill Veeman, and Arjuna" something like that. And to kill Karna Krishna sent Indra to get the Kavasa Kundala from Karna because until Karna has his Kavasa Kundala on, no one can do anything to him. But still Krishna knew that Karna will kill Arjuna, so he sent Kunthi to ask Karna that he wouldn't shoot Naga asthirya more than once to Arjuna. But still, when Karna was hit by the arrow of Arjuna he didn't die right away. His dharmas were keeping him alive, then Krishna took the form of an old brahmin, and asked Karna to give him all the dharma he did. And Karna did and died. Krishna did a lot of tricks to make dharma wins. Thuroonar was killed because Krishna made Tharuma (1st of the Paandavas) to lie about the death of Thoroonar's son. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 Gokul - "Just because he worshipped shiva & kali he doesnt deserve any respect." So does that mean anyone who worships Shiva & Kali doesn't deserve any respect. Well what should they worship then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 <---So does that mean anyone who worships Shiva & Kali doesn't deserve any respect. Well what should they worship then? ---> You didnt understood my words. even though he worshipped shiva & kali, idiot ravana was evil. so theres no point in supporting him just because he worshipped shiva & forgetting that hes evil. Evil persons should not be supported in any way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2004 Report Share Posted March 5, 2004 i have already told u ignorant people like you cant understand ram lila & krsna lila. people like you always make negative comments on God rama & god krsna. yes there are many sinners like you who argue on lilas of Rama & krishna. they are none other than asuras. so u too are one of em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brinthan Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 <<..i have already told u ignorant people like you cant understand ram lila & krsna lila. people like you always make negative comments on God rama & god krsna. yes there are many sinners like you who argue on lilas of Rama & krishna. they are none other than asuras. so u too are one of em..> I didn't say that I don't believe in Krishna. I want to know why would Rama and Krishna do such things? I don't want to have a blind faith in god because I'm scared that of him. I want to have full faith in him not out of fear, with no fear at all. What you have is a blind faith. I can show you a lot of examples of persons who had blind faiths and lost their lifes because of it. In 63 Nayanmaarkals, some of them had very blind faiths such as the one who gave the wife to someone who took a disguise as a devotee of Siva, and told him that Siva told him that he should give his wife for this guy for one day. So, that guy give it to him, because he had a blind faith and really thought that god will ask such a thing. And a king who was fighting with his enemy, enemy took out his shield and showed that he was wearing thirunooru. King saw that thirunooru and freeze right there and said "God forgive him from killing me when I'm not holding the weapons" and throw the weapons and get killed. So, I'm just trying to understand God. I didn't say that I suspect whether he exists or not. If you have understand all the lilas of Rama & Krishna, please teach the other followers and show them the path. Stop saying to everyone who questions god to understand god that they are asuras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Dear Brinthanji, Raghavendra Swamyji has told to not to have blind faith. i know that. your tone of words proved that you have to argue. Just for arguement sake we should not comment on Gods. If you really want to know about lilas of Rama & krishna completely, then apprach a good vaishnava & take him as your guru & get clarified doubts. i am not a scholar. of course, according to my dumb knowledge, i will explain something about rama & krishna. Vaaali was incarnation of Indra. Indra many times committed many sins that he invoked bad karma. in order to cleanify the bad karmas he want to born as a evil vanara & get killed by his holy arrow. anyway, indira after incarnating as vaaali forgot his realself (indira) by maya. soo he thought of himself as a ordinary vanara and did penance to brahma to acquire huge powers. From Brahma, he got a boon that none can kill him by facing him directly.Of course, even though Rama is god, lord rama want to act as a human being since Rama was a human incarnation. so lord rama knew that if he faced vaali directly, brahma's boon will not work on Rama (as raama is parabrahma) & thus will make brahmas boon false. Lord rama didnt want to make Brahmas boon false ,so rama choose to kill him by shootinh him in a back position. anyway, vaaali was evil & god rama punished him in a appropriate way. Karna killed abhimanyu in a way of adharma. so lord krishna want to punish him by killing him in a similar manner. anyway you still apprach a good vaishnava guru & get your doubts clarified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 9, 2004 Report Share Posted March 9, 2004 Intolerance is one of the greatest sins of any religion.............and you Mr Gokul are the epitome of intolerance.........so go take a good look in the mirror I am sure the folks here are as much offended by your insensible words as I am! ananth ananthshanmuagm@hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gokulkr Posted March 10, 2004 Report Share Posted March 10, 2004 i dont think telling ravana as evil is intolerance. ofcourse, i love lord vishnu soo much that if someone offends him i cant tolerate. you may take as it as you like. of course people like you may take offence of your gods as cool in name of tolerance. i know how much tolerancy u guys of other sect are ? dont try to hide urself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 30, 2006 Report Share Posted August 30, 2006 Firstly Vali was a monkey and Rama could have killed him as if HUNTING any other animal. Secondly Vali had forcefully kept the wife of Sugriva whom he should have treated like a daughter, hence his killing was justified. Read Ramayan again carefully. Rama Killed Vali hiding behind a tree.It was infact a family fight between the brothers and Rama had no right to interfere. It was a biased fight. And how do you think Arjuna killed Karna? You think it was fair? It was Krishna who twisted the rules of war to kill a helpless warrior without his weapons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 31, 2006 Report Share Posted August 31, 2006 Ravana was an ancient sri lankan king who held sway over a powerful lankan kingdom. He kidnapped the wife of a powerful north indian king (rama) and Sri Rama went to retreieve her, leading to a war/battle between the two groups. Eventually, the followers of Rama and the Vaishnavite people of North India deified a historical king and respected Rama so much to the point of connecting him with an absolute incarnation of their great god Vishnu. Ravana naturally became the antagonist in the story. Even religious men and men of god must understand that the ramayana and mahabharat are representations of ancient indian history much like the old testament is a representation of ancient jewish history. Both groups deified their ancient great kings who impacted the respective societies to a graeter level than any other leaders did.....which is a natural thing for huiman beings to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harekrishna.vkc Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 <<..i have already told u ignorant people like you cant understand ram lila & krsna lila. people like you always make negative comments on God rama & god krsna. yes there are many sinners like you who argue on lilas of Rama & krishna. they are none other than asuras. so u too are one of em..> I didn't say that I don't believe in Krishna. I want to know why would Rama and Krishna do such things? I don't want to have a blind faith in god because I'm scared that of him. I want to have full faith in him not out of fear, with no fear at all. What you have is a blind faith. I can show you a lot of examples of persons who had blind faiths and lost their lifes because of it. In 63 Nayanmaarkals, some of them had very blind faiths such as the one who gave the wife to someone who took a disguise as a devotee of Siva, and told him that Siva told him that he should give his wife for this guy for one day. So, that guy give it to him, because he had a blind faith and really thought that god will ask such a thing. And a king who was fighting with his enemy, enemy took out his shield and showed that he was wearing thirunooru. King saw that thirunooru and freeze right there and said "God forgive him from killing me when I'm not holding the weapons" and throw the weapons and get killed. So, I'm just trying to understand God. I didn't say that I suspect whether he exists or not. If you have understand all the lilas of Rama & Krishna, please teach the other followers and show them the path. Stop saying to everyone who questions god to understand god that they are asuras. iskon =International Society for Krishna Consciousness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 Krshna's shenanigans or his lila's acceptable as the very purpose of avatar is not limited by what a ordinary human being limited too. but rama avatar was supposed to lead a life of ordinary human being and follow the principles. but that never happened while he was taking vali's life. I can accept the grudge towards the Nayanmars in this form who unlike the earlier shaivites like hiranya brothers or ravana bros didn't do anything adharmic. They showed the utmost bhakthi towards god. Hope the jealous is there vishnu never had such devotees. Ramanuja running for life & sending his cousin, when saint appar was taking enemy by his horns (jains) standing just saying the panchaksharam. Every body wearing ash should be considered as Shiva himself. Somebody pointed here Shiva went asked some nayanmar's life or wife. But @ the same time each shaivite should not even enter a home when a husband is not there. refer - Siruthonda nayanar puranam. Its convenient to take the wrong thing and interpret to once fancies as blind faith or something like that. I feel sorry for vishnu not getting a chance to slay any shaivites after the puranas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 4, 2007 Report Share Posted February 4, 2007 It took just 6 days and stern bhakthi towards Shiva, when he spent 75% of life with krsna and listening to Bhagavat Gita in person, (live [the only person to do so]) to attain the ultimate salvation. Hail Kannappa, Hail your love towards shiva. Although u were not able to make it as arjuna in previous birth. The jealousy is acceptable from Vaishnavites!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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