Is the creator and his creation the same entity?

[subroto 0]

One of my chrisitan friends asked me this question about hinduism...any suggestions?

[Guest guest]

acynthia beda abeda tattva..

 

god is the same in quality and different in quantity with us and his other "creatures".. like an ocean is at the same time different and non different from a drop of water (no one of these aspect of difference and non difference prevails)

 

god is three aspects:

 

bhagavan:...

person (name, form, face, hands, eyes, voice, legs, companions, subordinates, friends, charachter, personality, activities..

 

all sat(eternal) cit (conscious) ananda (blissful))

 

(this is like the bible's god's concept .. a person who walks, speaks, likes, dislikes.. all in the spiritual realm, there's no material gunas (sattva, rajas, tamas) for god, he's not subjected to any influence)

--

 

paramatma:..... (supreme soul)

a form of god is within any living being at the side of the individual jivatma..

 

he is silent when we are conditionated,

then he speaks through the spiritual master when we begin a spiritual path to attain moksa and spiritual realization,

then we became able to listen directly to god from our heart..

 

(in christianism there's the concept of the "guardian angel" that's somewhat similar.. paramatma is an avatar, a manifestation of bhagavan, a messenger.. and angel means "messenger")

--

 

brahman:....

the light emanating from sri bhagavan.

 

God has to be surely the whole, the everything, omnipervasive, all is surely him and within him.

 

God is complete (purna), if a square centimeter of universe is out of god, god is has boundaries, limits, and he's not god. but it is not possible

 

so everything is into god, but at the same time god is separated and not subordinated to the everything, because the whole is deriving his existence by him and not the opposite

 

another thing to say is that we speak more precisely of EMANATION, not creation.. creation is to introduce in the spiritual realm the concept of birth, start and mundane, material time.

 

But it is not possible, all is eternal, after and before, because god, being eternal and being the whole cannot have parts, sections, cells, atoms that are not eternal, that are not existing until a certain time (because god is the source of time, not subjected to the time)

 

so we, as spiritual souls are eternal (and when we are in this material world, we experience samsara, because this is the way to be eternal here), god is eternal, spiritual world is eternal and material world too is eternal.. the only thing is that maya, to give the illusion that we have to pass through birth and death, destroys and recreate periodically (and eternally) the material world

 

and the average christians see and know only of one of these creations/distructions, and they believe for this reason that there's a creation.. i.e. an emanation with a start and an end

 

but as we already said there's not anything like a start and an end, a birth and a death inside god

 

[Guest guest]

I believe the word you're looking for is 'manifestation'.

God in it's impersonal aspect (Brahman) manifests as the universe, or as some poeple put it created or projected this universe out of itself.

[Guest guest]

yes.. manifestation is good because it adds a new concept.. that the material world is eternal, but sometimes unmanifested.. and i agree completely

 

but i do not agree (and it is a discussion who is to going on forever) that impersonal brahman is the direct source of emanation/manifestation/projection(this term is also good, because after the distruction the matter, in an unmanifest state, goes back in the mahavishnu's body waiting for the new manifestation)

 

i vote for sri bhagavan as the source of all the absolutes, and this is revealed also by your "projecting" conception.. if the absolute has not variety in itself he cannot manifest, emanate, project a world full of variety

[Guest guest]

But why can't god be different from his control ie. have dominion over them yet not be a part of them?

[Guest guest]

god is not part of the "creation" he's the whole who contains "creation" inside him.. and he has dominion because all is his part and parcel and it is not possible to exist indipendently by his existence.

 

So god is not subordinate to his control over nature and he has absolute dominion not being at all a part of his domination.. he is the supreme controller and the supreme "dominator", he is never subjected to the shaktis that have him at the source of their existence (so he does not die, he does not forget, he's never wrong, he's never defeated by anyone, he never gets sick and so on)

 

when we see the personal aspect of god we do not have to make confusion with the "mundane" concept of personality

 

everything is inside god even when he's manifested as a person, individual

 

when the little krsna in vrindaban eats the sand (like many children do), yasodamata opens his mouth to clean it, and she remains astonished seeing inside the mouth of bhagavan sri krishna, all the universe, all the planets, vrindaban, and her opening the mouth of krishna to wipe away the sand

 

if i have not understood or you are not satisfacted i will be happy to try to say more