Guest guest Report post Posted October 7, 2005 Despite chanting 4 rounds a day and chanting to one's self from time to time within the day, If one cannot adhere to the 4 regulative principles (I have trouble with cigarettes and alcohol which I drink like twice a week but not to the point of getting blind drunk) would you say that I will still go to hell? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 7, 2005 depends if u remeber the Lord at the time of death? with a lifestyle like that - i might be an unfortunate situation for u. but then again ur chanting so its cool. well hang in there buddy eventually im sure u will get over. jus a matter of time. Hare Krishna Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 7, 2005 Is it possible to realise that the soul is leaving the body (at the time of death)? Take for example a person who is in a coma and not conscious? I appreciate your reply Hare Krishna Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 7, 2005 Can a senior devotee provide their thoughts and views? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 7, 2005 Good you are chanting 4 rounds. Dont be too hard on yourself on the drinking and smoking part. Just dont think it is ok to do all that. Slowly reduce your bad habits. But, no, you will not go to hell If you do smoking and drinking- you will get karma accordingly but it is not that you will go to hell Suffering and enjoyment is based on your actions and has nothing to go to hell or heaven. Dont worry about hell and heaven Chanting is beyond all that Just...chant and ask Krishna's mercy and you will surely quit your habits. But, you should be willing to quit. You cannot chant and drink. But, everybody makes mistakes, Krishna knows, what counts is your sincerity to quit smoking and drinking. But, keep chanting! Haribol! anand Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mark 0 Report post Posted October 7, 2005 Haribol, Who knows where these things will lead you? (apart from Lord Yamaraja and Lord Krishna that is). They could lead you into trouble before you die. Why assume that you will not be able to change your habits before you die? When I first started chanting a couple of years ago I had not completely stopped all of my vices, as I was still having a glass of wine with a meal a couple of times a week, and also playing the lottery. I felt bad about these transgressions, but at first could not see myself giving them up completely (and also perhaps felt that they were not that serious). As time went on I started to increase the number of rounds I was chanting, reading more and generally became more and more interested in (and serious about) Krishna Consciousness, and decided to start cutting down on the amount of lottery tickets and alcohol, and eventually cut them out altogether, although it took a while. Basically as my chanting increased it seemed to replace my bad habits, and I obtained the realisation that although these transgressions seemed small, that they could have a very negative and big effect on ones life, for example : You probably don't need to be told that something as small and silly as cigarettes can terminate your life early by causing you to die a horrible death from lung cancer. It took me 10 years before I could give up smoking - I only managed it by replacing it with something better (in my case love of a new girlfriend/wife to be). Sorry to go on about 'me' but if someone as weak-willed as I am can change then anyone can, but you first have to want to change! One drink makes you feel like having another drink, which could lead to gradually losing control, and who knows what that could lead to ? A fight ? (If you're in a bar a drunk could pick on you even if you are relatively sober). A car crash ? (this is more likely to happen to you even if you only have the legal amount of alcohol in your blood stream). I heard about a local woman where I live who won a substantial amount on the lottery. She bought her teenage son a sports car that he desired, and within a couple of weeks he died when he crashed it at high speed. A sad but true story. A thing as small and innocuos as a lottery ticket has placed this poor woman in a living hell. We always think these sorts of things happen to others and not us. Who knows what these little seeds of 'sin' will grow in to ? I would recommend even more chanting if and when you can, although 4 rounds is good. Also try and develop the mindset/intention that you eventually intend to stop these habits, as they are no good for you, although they may seem fairly harmless. Cut down to one drink a week, or if going out with friends offer to drive and have a reason to decline alcohol and stick to soft drinks. Eventually drink only non-alcoholic drinks, and perhaps change your lifestyle to avoid going to places where Kali hangs out. I used to find that beer and cigarettes seemed to go well together, but when I stopped smoking by using nicotine patches to help me through the withdrawal symptoms, I then found that I did not like going to pubs (bars if you're in the US) for drinks anymore as the cigarette smoke used to get to me. With a little determination, good intention, and help from Lord Krishna you will free yourself from these small but annoyingly difficult-to-get-rid-of demons. Increase your chanting and reading if you can! Haribol and Hare Krishna! Best wishes, Mark Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 8, 2005 Omshanti. What Shri Mark has written about the experiences of hell in this world is correct. Hell and heaven are not somewhere in the paataal-lok (below the earth) or in the sky respectively. Hell and heaven are experienced by human beings here on this earth itself and that too in our minds. Even if a person is surrounded by all luxuries he/she may feel like living in a hell if his/her mind is sorrowful or unhappy. But even if a poor man does not have any means of prosperity, but if his mind is happy and contended, then it is like a heaven for him. The pleasures of this Iron-aged world are like the excreta of crows (kaag-vishta-samaan-sukh). God is teaching us this art of remaining happy and peaceful (i.e. to experience ateendriya sukh or supersensuous pleasures) even while living in a hell-like world like a lotus and not by running away from it like sanyasis. This is possible through Rajyoga, i.e. realizing oneself as a soul and remembering God as a Supreme Soul, who has come in an ordinary human body to make us deities. With regards, On Godly service, Roohani sevadhari, Prajapita Brahmakumar Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 8, 2005 Yes, this is hell. Many use alcahol, drugs, sex, food etc. to mask this but it is all temporary. I would really look into why you need the alchaol or cigarettes and see what kind of emotions are tied to them. Ask for Shiva's help and he will. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 8, 2005 raja yoga doesn't work. Love is the only way, love of Krishna. Unless his grace acts and removes our impurities, nothing will. Our efforts are futile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 8, 2005 Raja YOga doesn't work? If this person whom seems to follow Hare Krishans' still smokes and drinks then obvisously Krishna is not helping him. I give thie soul alot of courage and respect for posting this concern of his on this board. Your giving him a solution that does not work. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 11, 2005 Thanks for providing feedback. However one of my questions still remains unanswered... What if a person is in a coma at the time of death?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 11, 2005 If a person in a coma at death. Lord krishna does have common sense and thus will deliver him if he was a devotee even though he cannot think of Krishna at the time of death. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 11, 2005 It is important to know that in general very sinful or very attached people are in coma before death. The srimad Bhagavatam states that just as a caterpillar captures another leaf before giving up the current leaf. We see our next body before giving up the current one. If the next body is lower then some will refuse to accept it and thus remain in coma. But eventually he will be forced to accept it. This explains why some people remain in coma for some time then die. It is said that some politicians and leaders remain in coma before death, as they see their next body is that of an animal and don't want to accept it. Another reason for being in coma is that the person is very attached to his current life and does not want to give it up. So he remains in coma for some time. But will eventually be forced to give up the attachments. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Fair enough I understand where you are coming from...But how would you explain those that are able to come out of a coma then? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest guest Report post Posted October 12, 2005 Omshanti. Learned Dvaitin wrote: -------------------------- raja yoga doesn't work. Love is the only way, love of Krishna. Unless his grace acts and removes our impurities, nothing will. Our efforts are futile. -------------------------- Rajyoga means considering ourselves to be a living soul and not this non-living body. Rajyoga teaches how to control this non-living body by the realization of self and God. Love for God is essential. But it is not correct to say that all our efforts are futile. There is a famous shloka - karmanyevaadhikarastey ma faleshu kadachinah.... -which says that without making efforts one cannot get the fruits. Similarly if one wants to get rid of any bad habit or vices, one has to make sincere efforts and Rajyoga helps in making a successful effort. Just as a man controls various parts of a machine, a soul controls the various organs of the body. If one uses the body in a detached and balanced way for the benefit of self and society then one will get rid of the vices. Remembrance of God helps us in getting the self confidence to gain victory over bad habits/vices. God helps those who help themselves. God says, you take one step and I will take you 100 steps forward. Sudama gave hanful of rice to Krishna and got a palace in return. Although it is only a story, the moral is very important. With regards, ON Godly service, Roohani sevadhari, Prajapita Brahmakumar Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
