Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, I assume that you are reading this, even used the expression, " force our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make ourselves feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. My question… What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving into, processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel what ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel them and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have learned something and become more mature in the process. There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms of therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It must be evaluated on a case by case basis. I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " should only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion…when there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of my fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, lol. Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. Rich BTW I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 Many good questions being posted today. The way I see it, the daily practice of inner joy and the other safties helps in not having such deep highs and lows of emotions. These need to be practice daily, not wait until one is in the middle of depression and anger and force yourself to feel the opposite. The daily practice helps keep the emotions from getting so out of control...makes it easier to be an observer rather than get caught up in those strong emotions. @@@ I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! @@@ Interesting symbology in your dream. What did the white snake, pole, vines and roses mean to you and was it those symbols that caused your feeling of frustrated, angry and depressed the next day? If it's too personal that's ok, you don't have to answer of course.. just wondering if/the meanning/how they are tied in together...if that is what you are saying. The color white has always been synonymous with purity, virtue, innocence. Linda , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, I > assume that you are reading this, even used the expression, " force > our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make ourselves > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. > > My question… > > What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving into, > processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? > > I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel what > ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel them > and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have > learned something and become more mature in the process. > > There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms of > therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. > > When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? > > My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It must > be evaluated on a case by case basis. > > I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " > ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " should > only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion…when > there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very > difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking > longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of my > fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to > learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, lol. > Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. > > Rich > > BTW > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 In kundalini yoga, it is said that " your emotions are not there to take you for a ride " . Emotions are looked at as guidance that give you info about your thoughts and actions. When your emotions are negative, it's that by whatever you are doing/thinking about, etc. is offering a resistance to Love/God/Source/Shakti/etc. So you would want to stop resisting and that would mean changing behaviour and dealing with negative emotions. I would say that it's perfectly okay to feel whatever you are feeling, but I would say that you need to improve your emotional state to stop resisting. You can't really do that except baby steps in a lot of cases. Think of something that makes you feel a little better. Then think of something after that that makes you feel a little better again until you are back. Trying to feel better all in one step is like trying to jump onto a speeding train. It doesn't work. I've tried it and crashed and burned, so I can definitely verify that. To give a perspective on Chrism's words about feeling positively in the face of negativity around us: What did the mirror say to the other mirror? It's all done with people. Are we going to let someone else decide how we feel, or are we going to decide to feel love and connectedness? I struggle with this all the time. I'm doing a lot of trying and learning with this stuff. Sarah , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, I > assume that you are reading this, even used the expression, " force > our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make ourselves > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. > > My question… > > What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving into, > processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? > > I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel what > ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel them > and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have > learned something and become more mature in the process. > > There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms of > therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. > > When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? > > My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It must > be evaluated on a case by case basis. > > I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " > ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " should > only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion…when > there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very > difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking > longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of my > fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to > learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, lol. > Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. > > Rich > > BTW > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 I say this in the spirit of the Internal Joy that is mentioned in the safeties. It is far better to come into a Kundalini awareness or expression or change that awareness inside an already occurring Kundalini to a place of joy rather than continuing or approaching it from a place of depression or fear. Sometimes we can be so caught up in depression that we must " force " that to occur. Yes we can continue to experience the darkness of despair and sadness and fear and loss and pain and difficulty and trauma. Absolutely this is a choice and the options are there to partake of. And if this is the way an individual feels drawn to express within the Kundalini nobody is stopping them. I feel you may be getting stuck on the issue of " force " Richard. The Shadow will always be there to learn from. The darkness within. That teacher within of the forces of pain and mistrust and fear and resurrection will still be there. You will be deprived of nothing by changing the focus to love and joy. Hardship can still be taken advantage of as so much of the experience is unknown. Fear can still be learned from if you have that focus. I am suggesting that almost everyone will benefit by a behavior modification towards the aquisition of a joyful mindset inside of the early expression of the Kundalini process on the body. This has been a successful format for many. But Richard you do not have to do it this way. You have your way of approaching difficulties. And if you feel this will work for you then yes please follow the path you are drawn to. I have no intention of interfering with you in this way. Sorry if it seemed that way for you. People who do not have experience with the Kundalini Awakening process will sometimes make the choice of trying to experience it and process it within the accepted societal five sense paradigm of problem resolution. They do not understand the dynamics of what occurs with the Kundalini. I was like this. I learned how it was for me after about eight years of intense pain and fear and suffering. Not saying this will happen for you Richard. Perhaps your abilities extend far beyond mine and your mind set will bring you much comfort inside of the early awakening process. That would be my hope. So yes Richard feel free to chart your course as you see fit. I offer you many blessings to you on your path Richard. - chrism , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 This is something that recently came up on another group I belong to. My view on the subject is that we need to deal with the issues that come up, that it is helpful to review our past mistakes in order to learn from them and move forward. It is when we are getting stuck or hung up on it that it becomes unhealthy imo. Sarita , "Richard Eisenberg" <Pyaar333 wrote:>> Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > to "let go of" our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, I > assume that you are reading this, even used the expression, "force > our selves" to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make ourselves > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > Rich > > BTW > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > Rich, White roses is a symbolic gesture from whom you can trust to confide your secrets. John .M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 For me, from what I've learned and from what I've learned here from Chrism and others, there is much to learn from pain, suffering, fear, etc... But we learn these lessons as well as we can, then we don't have to dwell on them, or hopefully repeat them! But from time to time I think life or the universe throws 'review' lessons at us to see if we really got the lessons. So as we awaken the Kundalini will expand everything we are thinking and feeling. So it's a great idea to be thinking and feeling love, gratitude, joy, peace, etc, etc as much as possible since these are the things that are expanded and multiplied in our awakening. Knowing everything will be expanded and the intensity of it all will increase and we will radiate this outwards, it also seems like our responsibility to do this for others too in a way!!! be well, bradly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Perhaps I am thinking of things I learned a long time ago. I learned, and still believe, that we go through an organic process of mental emotional growth by letting our feeling be and by being willing to feel them. When we do this, when we are open to feeling what ever is there for us in the moment, we very natural move through the emotion to the next emotion. This process goes on and on until we resolve and transcend our issues. I also believe that this process is guided by a higher force…the higher self, guides, angels, god, kundalini etc. The higher forces see to it that we are given what we need for our higher good. This is how we, on the emotional level, grow, mature, burn karma and develop to higher levels of being. This process leads to enlightenment…at least in the emotional realms. However, The other side (one of my strengths and weaknesses is seeing both sides) Yes do need to cultivate joy and the ability to overcome sadness, fear, anger etc. We do need to " look on the bright side " and not let ourselves just slide into and get stuck in the above mentioned so called negative emotions. It can be easy to fall into depression, fear and hate. I like to say that…to quote myself… " anyone can hate and be angry, try unconditional love and forgiveness " . Love, forgiveness and peace of mind in the face of upheaval is the path, the higher way. This is what must be cultivated. We should not just let oursleves feel pain, hate, sadness etc. all of the time just because it is there. MY MAIN CONCERN My only real concern is not going into denial and trying as hard as possible to only be happy all of the time. Liberation, freedom will not come from pushing our pain and other issues back down into the unconscious. Depression, fear, hate etc. do emerge from time to time and they should be allowed to be felt so that they can be processed and transcended. Then again (the other side) We do need to know when to move into and process and when to just get out of an emotional state. NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) does not " process " and " deal with " emotions. They just work on changing them as rapidly as possible. As I see it each approach, processing and just changing it, has its place. The art is to know what to which approach to take and to then be able to take is successfully. If we could do that…wow what a world we would live in. Chrisim, I look forward to your thoughts on this rich , " chrism " <> wrote: > > I say this in the spirit of the Internal Joy that is mentioned in the > safeties. It is far better to come into a Kundalini awareness or > expression or change that awareness inside an already occurring > Kundalini to a place of joy rather than continuing or approaching it > from a place of depression or fear. > > Sometimes we can be so caught up in depression that we must " force " > that to occur. Yes we can continue to experience the darkness of > despair and sadness and fear and loss and pain and difficulty and > trauma. Absolutely this is a choice and the options are there to > partake of. And if this is the way an individual feels drawn to > express within the Kundalini nobody is stopping them. > > I feel you may be getting stuck on the issue of " force " Richard. The > Shadow will always be there to learn from. The darkness within. That > teacher within of the forces of pain and mistrust and fear and > resurrection will still be there. You will be deprived of nothing by > changing the focus to love and joy. Hardship can still be taken > advantage of as so much of the experience is unknown. Fear can still > be learned from if you have that focus. > > I am suggesting that almost everyone will benefit by a behavior > modification towards the aquisition of a joyful mindset inside of the > early expression of the Kundalini process on the body. > > This has been a successful format for many. But Richard you do not > have to do it this way. You have your way of approaching difficulties. > And if you feel this will work for you then yes please follow the path > you are drawn to. I have no intention of interfering with you in this > way. Sorry if it seemed that way for you. > > People who do not have experience with the Kundalini Awakening process > will sometimes make the choice of trying to experience it and process > it within the accepted societal five sense paradigm of problem > resolution. They do not understand the dynamics of what occurs with > the Kundalini. I was like this. I learned how it was for me after > about eight years of intense pain and fear and suffering. Not saying > this will happen for you Richard. Perhaps your abilities extend far > beyond mine and your mind set will bring you much comfort inside of > the early awakening process. That would be my hope. > > So yes Richard feel free to chart your course as you see fit. I offer > you many blessings to you on your path Richard. - chrism > > > , " Richard > Eisenberg " <Pyaar333@> wrote: > > > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 I am not exactly sure what it meant. As far as I can recall… The snake – Kundalini The pole – the caduceus, the spine/shushumna The vines and roses- reminded me of a fancy flower arrangement I saw recently at a table set for a wedding. Rose has always been one of my fav. flowers. The sent is intoxicating to me, very sensual and etherieal/spiritual White – spiritual, high pure spiritual energy I was surprised when I saw it that even the snake was white. As if it had been spray painted. rich , " Linda " <crazycats711 wrote: > > Many good questions being posted today. The way I see it, the daily > practice of inner joy and the other safties helps in not having such > deep highs and lows of emotions. These need to be practice daily, not > wait until one is in the middle of depression and anger and force > yourself to feel the opposite. The daily practice helps keep the > emotions from getting so out of control...makes it easier to be an > observer rather than get caught up in those strong emotions. > > @@@ I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that > had white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! @@@ > > Interesting symbology in your dream. What did the white snake, pole, > vines and roses mean to you and was it those symbols that caused your > feeling of frustrated, angry and depressed the next day? If it's too > personal that's ok, you don't have to answer of course.. just > wondering if/the meanning/how they are tied in together...if that is > what you are saying. > > The color white has always been synonymous with purity, virtue, > innocence. > > Linda > > , " Richard > Eisenberg " <Pyaar333@> wrote: > > > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should try > > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you chrisim, > I > > assume that you are reading this, even used the expression, " force > > our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make > ourselves > > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. > > > > My question… > > > > What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving into, > > processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? > > > > I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel what > > ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel > them > > and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have > > learned something and become more mature in the process. > > > > There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms of > > therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. > > > > When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? > > > > My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It > must > > be evaluated on a case by case basis. > > > > I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " > > ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " > should > > only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion… when > > there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very > > difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking > > longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of my > > fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to > > learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, > lol. > > Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. > > > > Rich > > > > BTW > > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that had > > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 The pole is ancient symology and is of the male aspect, sivalingum. Ancient civilizations evolved from worship regarding the poles. Totum poles ect. The snake is even older it represents the kundalini though even older than that as it also represents the ocean of the universe. So what are the secrets of the universe are you not able to tell because of such secracy that pi$$es you off. :-) John , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > > I am not exactly sure what it meant. As far as I can recall… > > The snake – Kundalini > > The pole – the caduceus, the spine/shushumna > > The vines and roses- reminded me of a fancy flower arrangement I saw > recently at a table set for a wedding. Rose has always been one of > my fav. flowers. The sent is intoxicating to me, very sensual and > etherieal/spiritual > > White – spiritual, high pure spiritual energy > > I was surprised when I saw it that even the snake was white. As if > it had been spray painted. > > rich , " Linda " > <crazycats711@> wrote: > > > > Many good questions being posted today. The way I see it, the daily > > practice of inner joy and the other safties helps in not having > such > > deep highs and lows of emotions. These need to be practice daily, > not > > wait until one is in the middle of depression and anger and force > > yourself to feel the opposite. The daily practice helps keep the > > emotions from getting so out of control...makes it easier to be an > > observer rather than get caught up in those strong emotions. > > > > @@@ I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that > > had white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was > unusually > > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! @@@ > > > > Interesting symbology in your dream. What did the white snake, > pole, > > vines and roses mean to you and was it those symbols that caused > your > > feeling of frustrated, angry and depressed the next day? If it's > too > > personal that's ok, you don't have to answer of course.. just > > wondering if/the meanning/how they are tied in together...if that > is > > what you are saying. > > > > The color white has always been synonymous with purity, virtue, > > innocence. > > > > Linda > > > > , " Richard > > Eisenberg " <Pyaar333@> wrote: > > > > > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should > try > > > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you > chrisim, > > I > > > assume that you are reading this, even used the > expression, " force > > > our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > > > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make > > ourselves > > > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. > > > > > > My question… > > > > > > What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving > into, > > > processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? > > > > > > I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel > what > > > ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel > > them > > > and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have > > > learned something and become more mature in the process. > > > > > > There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms > of > > > therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. > > > > > > When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? > > > > > > My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It > > must > > > be evaluated on a case by case basis. > > > > > > I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " > > > ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " > > should > > > only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion… > when > > > there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very > > > difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking > > > longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of > my > > > fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to > > > learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, > > lol. > > > Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. > > > > > > Rich > > > > > > BTW > > > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that > had > > > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > > > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Thanks Rich for replying. Funny I was kind of stuck on your post and went to bed thinking about it last night. You didn't say if it was the dream that caused you to feel frustrated, angry and depressed the next day, but I woke up from a dream this morning feeling the same thing from my dream. In my dream, I was in my backyard with my daughter. She saw a white cat over my the fence and went over to pet it, check it out. I was with my cat on the patio and he was not liking another cat in his yard. I looked over and my daughter was just standing there frozen in fear before even getting to the cat. She was looking toward the side of the house. I ask her what was wrong, but she didn't answer. I quickly turned and put my cat inside and turned back to go over to my daughter but she was gone in just that instance. I called out to her but she didn't reply. I just knew/sensed at that moment that there was a large snake there even though I could not see it physically and that it had devoured my daughter and maybe the cat too. The cat was no longer there either. I was too afraid to go over there then and instead went inside and called 911 for help. LOL! I think I woke up feeling frustrated and a little on the depressed side, because I became angry at my self for becoming afraid and not going to my daughter aid. Looks like I have more fear to work through. Linda , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > > I am not exactly sure what it meant. As far as I can recall… > > The snake – Kundalini > > The pole – the caduceus, the spine/shushumna > > The vines and roses- reminded me of a fancy flower arrangement I saw > recently at a table set for a wedding. Rose has always been one of > my fav. flowers. The sent is intoxicating to me, very sensual and > etherieal/spiritual > > White – spiritual, high pure spiritual energy > > I was surprised when I saw it that even the snake was white. As if > it had been spray painted. > > rich , " Linda " > <crazycats711@> wrote: > > > > Many good questions being posted today. The way I see it, the daily > > practice of inner joy and the other safties helps in not having > such > > deep highs and lows of emotions. These need to be practice daily, > not > > wait until one is in the middle of depression and anger and force > > yourself to feel the opposite. The daily practice helps keep the > > emotions from getting so out of control...makes it easier to be an > > observer rather than get caught up in those strong emotions. > > > > @@@ I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that > > had white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was > unusually > > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! @@@ > > > > Interesting symbology in your dream. What did the white snake, > pole, > > vines and roses mean to you and was it those symbols that caused > your > > feeling of frustrated, angry and depressed the next day? If it's > too > > personal that's ok, you don't have to answer of course.. just > > wondering if/the meanning/how they are tied in together...if that > is > > what you are saying. > > > > The color white has always been synonymous with purity, virtue, > > innocence. > > > > Linda > > > > , " Richard > > Eisenberg " <Pyaar333@> wrote: > > > > > > Lets see now…Chrism has mentioned several times that we should > try > > > to " let go of " our painful emotions…I believe that he, you > chrisim, > > I > > > assume that you are reading this, even used the > expression, " force > > > our selves " to feel good in the face of depression, fear, anger, > > > etc. That we MUST overcome these emotions/states and make > > ourselves > > > feel joy, excitement and other such emotions. > > > > > > My question… > > > > > > What about the learning and growth that comes only by moving > into, > > > processing and eventually moving through the anger, sadness etc.? > > > > > > I have always told myself that it is Ok, in fact good, to feel > what > > > ever I am feeling. My emotions, if I just let them be and feel > > them > > > and be mindful will lead back to happiness again and I will have > > > learned something and become more mature in the process. > > > > > > There is value in the natural evolution of emotions. Many forms > of > > > therapy are based on this or some kind of similar idea. > > > > > > When does forcing myself to feel good become denial? > > > > > > My feeling is that there is no one answer to this question. It > > must > > > be evaluated on a case by case basis. > > > > > > I do recognize that there are times when we do need to " force " > > > ourselves out of an emotional state. But I think that " force " > > should > > > only be used when we are just stuck and drowning in an emotion… > when > > > there is no growth or learning happening. But it can be very > > > difficult to determine when we stuck and when it is just taking > > > longer to process then we want. Personally I would like all of > my > > > fear, anger etc. to last only minuets before I learn what need to > > > learn, process what I need to process and transcend the emotion, > > lol. > > > Unfortunately hours, days or sometimes week or months are needed. > > > > > > Rich > > > > > > BTW > > > I had a dream of a white snake wrapped around a white pole that > had > > > white vines and white roses on it. The next day I was unusually > > > frustrated, angry and alternately depressed… how fascinating! > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 hey Rich, I was going through the same exact thing. I had been waking up depressed almost every single morning since my activation last summer. I tried forgiving, I tried being present and letting go of the story, I tried to allow the emotion to be there. None of this was working for me, every single morning I was still depressed and in a negative mood. I tried gratitude but just couldn't feel the feelings. I knew that this big cloud was hanging over me and I knew that somehow it was because of my story, my beliefs. then a couple weeks ago, I was lead to Byron Katie's book called Loving What Is. She teaches a process called The Work and it's 4 questions that one asks when a stressful thought arises. This has been truly liberating to me. After 7 to 8 months of waking up depressed and anxious, this past week I'm actually waking up light and joyful. With the examining of my thoughts, forgiveness is a natural byproduct as well as joy and gratitude. Before this I had had glimpses of love and gratitude, real highs, but always short lived and I was always brought back down. Now it feels like I'm actually moving through the shadow, not trying to rise above it, not denying, but walking steadily through it. In 2 weeks I feel like I've already transformed, or better to say, I'm moving through the alchemical process more efficiently and effortlessly. So maybe check out that book? It definately resolved that issue for me, how does one overcome suffering without going into denial. As Byron Katie says " I don't let of of my concepts- I meet them with understanding. then they let go of me. " I find that this is also happening to me. peace and blessings on you journey through the shadow craig , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > Perhaps I am thinking of things I learned a long time ago. > > I learned, and still believe, that we go through an organic process > of mental emotional growth by letting our feeling be and by being > willing to feel them. When we do this, when we are open to feeling > what ever is there for us in the moment, we very natural move through > the emotion to the next emotion. This process goes on and on until > we resolve and transcend our issues. > > I also believe that this process is guided by a higher force…the > higher self, guides, angels, god, kundalini etc. The higher forces > see to it that we are given what we need for our higher good. This > is how we, on the emotional level, grow, mature, burn karma and > develop to higher levels of being. This process leads to > enlightenment…at least in the emotional realms. > > However, > The other side (one of my strengths and weaknesses is seeing both > sides) > > Yes do need to cultivate joy and the ability to overcome sadness, > fear, anger etc. We do need to " look on the bright side " and not let > ourselves just slide into and get stuck in the above mentioned so > called negative emotions. It can be easy to fall into depression, > fear and hate. I like to say that…to quote myself… " anyone can hate > and be angry, try unconditional love and forgiveness " . Love, > forgiveness and peace of mind in the face of upheaval is the path, > the higher way. This is what must be cultivated. We should not just > let oursleves feel pain, hate, sadness etc. all of the time just > because it is there. > > MY MAIN CONCERN > My only real concern is not going into denial and trying as hard as > possible to only be happy all of the time. Liberation, freedom will > not come from pushing our pain and other issues back down into the > unconscious. > > Depression, fear, hate etc. do emerge from time to time and they > should be allowed to be felt so that they can be processed and > transcended. > > Then again (the other side) > We do need to know when to move into and process and when to just get > out of an emotional state. NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) does > not " process " and " deal with " emotions. They just work on changing > them as rapidly as possible. > > As I see it each approach, processing and just changing it, has its > place. The art is to know what to which approach to take and to then > be able to take is successfully. If we could do that…wow what a > world we would live in. > > Chrisim, I look forward to your thoughts on this > > rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 >Posted by: "johndplumber," jaganatha: >The snake is even older it represents the kundalini though even older than that as it also represents the ocean of the universe. I had a dream quite a few years ago that I dropped something by the side of the road, and when I bent down to pick it up, a snake slithered away. Carolyn 'Beliefs are those things we hold to be true, and which are instrumental in creating our actions and our experience of life.' Posted by: "johndplumber" jaganatha johndplumber Mon Jan 5, 2009 3:05 pm (PST) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I am looking into Byron kates (spelling?) work. I got hold of the 4 questions from her site but have not read much about them. I believe that I know where she is coming from and what she is doing. Ok, but not as good as it could be…that is my impression so far. However if it worked for you then it worked…what more can be said. Have you heard of Core Tranformations? Very good stuff. It is an NLP thing. Very worth looking into. It can lead you into profound states of consciousness as you give yourself what you need to go beyond your issues. I am thinking that some combination of the two, the Work and Core Transformantions might be possible and really good. I always look that things that way…how can I improve it, what is missing, what can be added or taken away to make it better? All my love, rich , " kundaflame " <kundaflame wrote: > > hey Rich, I was going through the same exact thing. I had been waking > up depressed almost every single morning since my activation last > summer. I tried forgiving, I tried being present and letting go of the > story, I tried to allow the emotion to be there. None of this was > working for me, every single morning I was still depressed and in a > negative mood. I tried gratitude but just couldn't feel the feelings. > I knew that this big cloud was hanging over me and I knew that somehow > it was because of my story, my beliefs. then a couple weeks ago, I was > lead to Byron Katie's book called Loving What Is. She teaches a > process called The Work and it's 4 questions that one asks when a > stressful thought arises. This has been truly liberating to me. After > 7 to 8 months of waking up depressed and anxious, this past week I'm > actually waking up light and joyful. With the examining of my > thoughts, forgiveness is a natural byproduct as well as joy and > gratitude. Before this I had had glimpses of love and gratitude, real > highs, but always short lived and I was always brought back down. Now > it feels like I'm actually moving through the shadow, not trying to > rise above it, not denying, but walking steadily through it. In 2 > weeks I feel like I've already transformed, or better to say, I'm > moving through the alchemical process more efficiently and > effortlessly. So maybe check out that book? It definately resolved > that issue for me, how does one overcome suffering without going into > denial. As Byron Katie says " I don't let of of my concepts- I meet > them with understanding. then they let go of me. " I find that this is > also happening to me. > peace and blessings on you journey through the shadow > craig > > > , " Richard > Eisenberg " <Pyaar333@> wrote: > > > > Perhaps I am thinking of things I learned a long time ago. > > > > I learned, and still believe, that we go through an organic process > > of mental emotional growth by letting our feeling be and by being > > willing to feel them. When we do this, when we are open to feeling > > what ever is there for us in the moment, we very natural move through > > the emotion to the next emotion. This process goes on and on until > > we resolve and transcend our issues. > > > > I also believe that this process is guided by a higher force…the > > higher self, guides, angels, god, kundalini etc. The higher forces > > see to it that we are given what we need for our higher good. This > > is how we, on the emotional level, grow, mature, burn karma and > > develop to higher levels of being. This process leads to > > enlightenment…at least in the emotional realms. > > > > However, > > The other side (one of my strengths and weaknesses is seeing both > > sides) > > > > Yes do need to cultivate joy and the ability to overcome sadness, > > fear, anger etc. We do need to " look on the bright side " and not let > > ourselves just slide into and get stuck in the above mentioned so > > called negative emotions. It can be easy to fall into depression, > > fear and hate. I like to say that…to quote myself… " anyone can hate > > and be angry, try unconditional love and forgiveness " . Love, > > forgiveness and peace of mind in the face of upheaval is the path, > > the higher way. This is what must be cultivated. We should not just > > let oursleves feel pain, hate, sadness etc. all of the time just > > because it is there. > > > > MY MAIN CONCERN > > My only real concern is not going into denial and trying as hard as > > possible to only be happy all of the time. Liberation, freedom will > > not come from pushing our pain and other issues back down into the > > unconscious. > > > > Depression, fear, hate etc. do emerge from time to time and they > > should be allowed to be felt so that they can be processed and > > transcended. > > > > Then again (the other side) > > We do need to know when to move into and process and when to just get > > out of an emotional state. NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) does > > not " process " and " deal with " emotions. They just work on changing > > them as rapidly as possible. > > > > As I see it each approach, processing and just changing it, has its > > place. The art is to know what to which approach to take and to then > > be able to take is successfully. If we could do that…wow what a > > world we would live in. > > > > Chrisim, I look forward to your thoughts on this > > > > rich > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 hey Rich, I haven't heard of Core Transformations, I'll have to check it out when it feels right. Right now I'm going by what a wise man once told me: If it aint broke, don't fix it. But I know what you mean with mixing and finding what works and what doesn't. I feel that's part of our individual expression and is what gives life it's different flavors! I use Katie's work with Tolle's. I use mixture of digging up past grievances and bringing them to understanding with becoming present and realizing that time is the illusion, that there is only Now. hope you find a way that works! namaste to you Rich craig , " Richard Eisenberg " <Pyaar333 wrote: > > I am looking into Byron kates (spelling?) work. I got hold of the 4 > questions from her site but have not read much about them. I believe > that I know where she is coming from and what she is doing. Ok, but > not as good as it could be…that is my impression so far. However if > it worked for you then it worked…what more can be said. > > Have you heard of Core Tranformations? Very good stuff. It is an > NLP thing. Very worth looking into. It can lead you into profound > states of consciousness as you give yourself what you need to go > beyond your issues. > > I am thinking that some combination of the two, the Work and Core > Transformantions might be possible and really good. I always look > that things that way…how can I improve it, what is missing, what can > be added or taken away to make it better? > > > All my love, > rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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