Ornish and the fat-free discussion - responsse from Zandria72

[Guest guest]

Here's the response from zandria72 re my last post ;-) Sadly doesn't seem

to have

as yet caught up with the changes made to her membership, so she's still having

trouble

posting. Meanwhile, I'm pleased to pass on the rejected-by- message that

she

kindly forwarded to me. Dear dear , it can be sooooo temperamental, can't

it! (And

yes, it does sometimes take several days for their computers to catch up with

changes

made.)

 

Okay: Here's the message:

 

Pat wrote:

 

>Do I take it that since you have mentioned him in two separate emails regarding

this 'fat'

study, that you don't think much of Dr Ornish's theories and diet? Is that

because you

think that it is too hard to follow, or is it because you think it is

ineffective, or is it because

you don't think a low-fat or fat-free diet is a good thing in general? Just

wondering - just

asking - not trying to put you on the spot ;-)

 

 

I'm ambivalent, I guess. I think it's hard to follow. Unless you really like

cooking (and have

time to do so), your diet is going to be very boring and repetitive. I was privy

to partake of

a meal with the Ornish group at a hospital in Des Moines (where I did an

internship in the

cardiac rehab dept), and it was fairly tasty - but lots of work. Many favorite

foods are likely

to get eliminated - not reduced, but completely eliminated. That's hard for most

people to

do. There are also many stories out there from people who tried and tried with a

low-fat

vegetarian diet, and they were hungry all the time or couldn't lose weight.

Different people

seem to need different things. I think that the principle might be solid (and

advisable for

people with significant heart disease), but it just doesn't work for everyone.

 

I also met Dr. Ornish once, at a book signing. It was a long time ago, but I

still remember

it negatively. I think I asked him a pointed question (don't recall what), and

he wasn't

happy about it. I also brought an old copy of one of his books instead of buying

one of the

new ones there, and he didn't seem to pleased about that either.

[Guest guest]

Zandria72 (Suzanne) wrote, re Dr Ornish's plan:

 

> I think it's hard to follow. Unless you really like cooking (and have

> time to do so), your diet is going to be very boring and repetitive.

 

Well, I think that's true of most eating plans that are not dependent on fast

food and pre-

packaged meals from the supermarket.

 

>I was privy to partake of

> a meal with the Ornish group at a hospital in Des Moines (where I did an

internship in

the

> cardiac rehab dept)

 

You are a cardiologist? Or, no, I guess not - another kind of 'internship'?

 

> and it was fairly tasty - but lots of work.

 

Yeah, no pain no gain. And I could repeat what I said above ;-)

 

> Many favorite foods are likely

> to get eliminated - not reduced, but completely eliminated. That's hard for

most people

to do.

 

I guess for one's heart's sake one would have to learn to develop new

favourites, eh?

 

>There are also many stories out there from people who tried and tried with a

low-fat

> vegetarian diet, and they were hungry all the time or couldn't lose weight.

 

Oh you seem to have forgotten that this is a low-fat vegetarian group! LOL Many

of us eat

vegetarian - even vegan - as a regular thing and low- or no-fat and we don't

find it

difficult at all. If you do, as a vegetarian (are you now?), then you need nicer

recipes!!! ;-)

We can help. There's more to it all than simple boiling or steaming - herbs and

spices and

unusual combinations of vegetables, vegetables with grains, beans, etc., all can

help a lot

to make a vegan diet exciting!

 

> Different people

> seem to need different things. I think that the principle might be solid (and

advisable for

> people with significant heart disease), but it just doesn't work for everyone.

 

Can't speak to that - I haven't studied it. You seem to speak from experience

here.

 

> I also met Dr. Ornish once, at a book signing. It was a long time ago, but I

still

remember

> it negatively. I think I asked him a pointed question (don't recall what), and

he wasn't

> happy about it. I also brought an old copy of one of his books instead of

buying one of

the

> new ones there, and he didn't seem to pleased about that either.

 

LOL Personal prob with him, I see ;-) That can sour you if you can't get past it

I guess. I've

never met him of course, so again can't comment. Interesting anecdote - esp.

about the

old copy of his book!

 

Okay, Suzanne. Thanks very much for telling us all this - that helps to know

where you're

coming from. I'm neither defending nor advocating the Ornish plan, but I am not

happy

about something like that being swept aside without proper consideration. There

are

several groups on for those who follow the Ornish plan, I see. Now don't

all rush off

at once - and DON'T leave this group if you do!! <grins wickedly to think what

she'll do to

keep you all here!>

 

Best love, Pat