B12 (southladogs)

[Guest guest]

Gabriel Cousens is an MD and has been a raw foodist

for decades. I'm curious, what " qualifications " do

you have that would make us put our health in your

hands. For some reason I do not think you will give

us a streight answer to that one. You have not done

so in the past.

 

Rufus

 

--- southladogs <southladogs wrote:

 

> rawfood , " dubadee1952 "

> <dubadee1952>

> wrote:

> > -I have enjoyed your postings. I have been vegan

> for 2 years, and

> > try to eat raw much of the time. Some

> acquaintences have asked me

> if

> > I am vegan for my health; I like to reply that I

> consider myself a

> > holistic vegan, vegan for many reasons. My health

> is one of them,

> > but I know veganism is healthier for the animals

> we share this

> planet

> > with, and for the planet itself.

>

> Glad to see your post--I thought no one was going to

> respond at all

> to my post on B12. Veganism is the optimal choice

> all around--for

> health, for morality, for the planet.

>

> > That said, even though I eat vegan

> > 100% of the time, and would eventually like to eat

> all my meals

> > raw/vegan, I think I will probably continue to

> take vegan vitamin

> > supplements. Please read the following, which is

> from Gabriel

> Cousens

> > Tree of Life Website

>

> Unfortunately, most of the raw gurus have given in

> to the hysteria

> over " B12 deficiency " . There is nothing enlightening

> about any of it.

>

> > Data in a 1982 study showed that of the infants

> who were breastfed

> > for three months, and then were given diluted

> homemade soymilk for

> > three months to one year, 25 of them (a

> significant percentage)

> had

> > protein deficiency, iron and B-12 anemia, as well

> as zinc

> deficiency.

> > In the 1982 study, three of the infants were dead

> on arrival, five

> > more died within a few hours of hospital

> admission, despite

> > treatment. Serum levels were low in 9 of 15 cases

> and undetectable

> in

> > three of them. I don't feel this is a very good

> example of what we

> > want to show to the world in the way we want to

> treat our

> children.

> > We can make those choices. We have a theory of

> natural, and we

> also

> > have a theory of what it means to be healthy.

>

> This is a perfect example of the bait-and-switch

> aspect to the

> hysteria over " B12 deficiency " . Nowhere in this

> tract is there any

> reference to these infants being fed a raw vegan

> diet. They were

> given diluted soymilk, and probably starved to death

> on it. They did

> not die of " B12 deficiency " , they died of

> starvation. Soymilk is not

> raw, and is processed and largely devoid of

> nutrition, yet it is

> what most people feed infants these days, and most

> of those people

> are not even vegetarian. What does the above example

> have to do with

> raw veganism? Absolutely NOTHING! Yet this is used

> to make a case

> for purported " B12 deficiency " among raw vegans.

> That's the power of

> hysteria.

>

> > Contrary to what a few people wanted to interpret

> from my article,

> > there was more than one study that showed live

> food people were

> B12

> > deficient. There were at least three studies on

> adults and two on

> > children. All five of these published live food

> studies showed the

> > participants had serious deficiencies. These are

> no studies that

> show

> > live food vegans do not get B12 deficient

> overtime. There are at

> > least fifteen vegan studies on adults that have

> shown identical

> > results. Cooked food and live food vegans show the

> same results…

> > approximately 80% of those who do not use B12

> supplements or B12

> > fortified foods sooner or later develop symptoms

> of B12

> deficiency.

>

> The above is simply a measurement of levels of B12

> that are

> considered " normal " . Then, immediately below, a

> smorgasbord of

> symptoms are presented, with typically the mistaken

> assignation of

> symptoms to B12 levels.

>

> > These may include physical symptoms such as the

> inability to walk,

> > tremors, weakness, fatigue, diarrhea, fever, upper

> respiratory

> > infections, impotence, infertility, anemia as well

> as neurological

> > symptoms such as depression, anxiety, panic

> attacks, hyperactive

> > reflexes, numbness and tingling in the hands and

> feet, impaired

> > memory, and paranoid delusions. These appear in

> children as well,

> but

> > in children if they are not caught in time, they

> often result in

> > death. Sickness and death due to B12 deficiency do

> not support the

> > expansion of the vegan live food movement. These

> symptoms are not

> > just " a misunderstood healing crises or poorly

> functioning colon

> or a

> > poor live food diet. "

>

> The implication here is that the purported " B12

> deficiency " , if

> found in children, " often result in death " . This is

> another tactic

> of hysteria. In fact, I've not read of ONE single

> case of ANYONE

> dying on a vegan diet from ANY " deficiencies " , let

> alone tons of

> children. Dr. John McDougall has stated that in his

> extensive

> practice with vegans, he has MAYBE seen ONE possible

> example of a

> vegan with a bit of a " B12 deficiency " .

>

> The catalogue of symptoms listed above clearly

> indicate only one

> thing--that the body is trying to force these people

> to FAST, to lie

> down and completely rest. In fact, the more dramatic

> the symptoms,

> the more it shows the vitality of the body, the

> ever-increasing

> INSISTENCE on the part of the body to force the

> person to lie down

> and rest. NOT to take pills or get injections of

> toxins!

>

> > Although bacteria in the colon do produce B12, it

> is not

> reabsorbed

> > into the system.

>

> This is an old wives' tale that has been disproved.

> In any case, B12

> is produced in the mouth, and in the upper intestine

> as well, so we

> are not dependent on the bacteria in our colon

> supplying B12.

>

> > Published research has shown that if people eat an

>

> > extract of their feces they will not get a B12

> deficiency.

> Although

> > this may be considered natural, it is not

> something that I

> recommend.

>

> It is not " natural " for humans to eat their feces. I

> don't know of

> anyone in the raw vegan movement suggesting that

> people should eat

> feces, lol. Where does he come up with this stuff?

>

> > A published report cites a man in his eighties who

> had been in

> > excellent health as a vegan for 38 years, when

> suddenly he began

>

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