Guest guest Posted April 27, 2004 Report Share Posted April 27, 2004 Ian, I assume you are a vegan or at least a vegetarian. so the comment you made.. >>>>(Medical training is about diagnosis and treatment: itdoesn't necessarily mean someone can form and test a hypothesis, or critically read a scientific paper.)It's also suspicious that they published a book rather than a peer--reviewed paper. ...Should not reference a science or medicine that does not reflect vegan attitudes I also asked you for a couple weeks to look up the info and references I am a bit busy at the moment with home renovations (making my home more enviro friendly) but I assure you for every disproof there is proof it will all depend on the Science you believe I choose not to believe that main stream medicine understands what is happening they try to cure everything rather than prevent that in itself is very troubling as for publishing a book well I think I have covered that if you would like to continue this debate I am all for it if you would like to mud sling get a fan all the best Craig Ian McDonald [ian]Tuesday, April 27, 2004 3:48 PM Subject: Re: Re: [100% veg*n ] Alzheimer's=CJD???> Craig Dearth wrote:> > Ian this message was posted prior to Catherine's comment> > CraigThanks.I don't think we should believe something just because it's on the blurbfor a book written by a medic and a journalist. I think I rememberliterary references to dementia before the 20th century, so I don'tbelievethat claim. (Medical training is about diagnosis and treatment: itdoesn'tnecessarily mean someone can form and test a hypothesis, or criticallyread a scientific paper.)It's also suspicious that they published a book rather than a peer--reviewed paper.The blurb doesn't speak to Craig's claim that "the onset of Dementia onalarge scale didn't start happening until after world war II".> > DYING FOR A HAMBURGER HOW MODERN MEAT-PACKING LED TO AN EPIDEMIC OF> ALZHEIMER'S DISEASE: "Dr. Murray Waldman, in collaboration with writer> Marjorie Lamb, sets out to show that Alzheimer's is, indeed, a deadly> modern plague. They present startling evidence that Alzheimer's is one> of a> family of diseases caused by a malformed protein - or prion - that> also> causes mad cow disease and its human variant, Cruetzfeld-Jakob disease> (CJD). Could Alzheimer's, like CJD, be caused by tainted beef? In this> compelling exposition, the authors come to a frightening conclusion> about> our seemingly insatiable hunger for hamburger.> > "Before about 1900 Alzheimer's disease did not exist, or if it did,> was so> rare as not to be noticed. But just over a hundred years ago,> Alzheimer's> disease was unknown, and most people did not know anyone who exhibited> the> symptoms of dementia that are now all too familiar to the families and> friends of victims. Alzheimer's disease (AD) now afflicts 15 million> people> around the world, including 250,000 Canadians and 4.5 million> Americans.> One in 10 persons over 65 and nearly half of those over 85 have the> disease. More significantly, the number of people with dementia is> expected to increase steadily over the next 25 years: in Canada,> 10,000 new> cases of AD are diagnosed each year - 27 cases per day."> > [Edited from the book summaries and the excerpt below:> http://www.mcclelland.com/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=0771087659> http://www.thebukowskiagency.com/DyingForAHamburger.htm> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2004 Report Share Posted April 27, 2004 > Craig Dearth wrote: > > Ian, > I assume you are a vegan or at least a vegetarian. > so the comment you made.. > I'm a vegan. > >>>>(Medical training is about diagnosis and treatment: it > doesn't necessarily mean someone can form and test a hypothesis, or > critically read a scientific paper.) > It's also suspicious that they published a book rather than a peer- > -reviewed paper. > ..Should not reference a science or medicine that does not reflect > vegan attitudes I'm also > I also asked you for a couple weeks to look up the info and references > I am a bit busy at the moment with home renovations (making my home > more enviro friendly) > but I assure you for every disproof there is proof > it will all depend on the Science you believe > I choose not to believe that main stream medicine understands what is > happening > they try to cure everything rather than prevent > that in itself is very troubling > as for publishing a book well I think I have covered that > if you would like to continue this debate I am all for it > if you would like to mud sling get a fan > all the best > Craig > > Ian McDonald [ian] > Tuesday, April 27, 2004 3:48 PM > > Re: Re: [100% veg*n ] Alzheimer's=CJD??? > > > Craig Dearth wrote: > > > > Ian this message was posted prior to Catherine's comment > > > > Craig > > Thanks. > > I don't think we should believe something just because it's on the > blurb > for a book written by a medic and a journalist. I think I remember > literary references to dementia before the 20th century, so I don't > believe > that claim. (Medical training is about diagnosis and treatment: it > doesn't > necessarily mean someone can form and test a hypothesis, or critically > read a scientific paper.) > > It's also suspicious that they published a book rather than a peer- > -reviewed paper. > > The blurb doesn't speak to Craig's claim that " the onset of Dementia > on > a > large scale didn't start happening until after world war II " . > > > > > DYING FOR A HAMBURGER HOW MODERN MEAT-PACKING LED TO AN EPIDEMIC OF > > ALZHEIMER'S DISEASE: " Dr. Murray Waldman, in collaboration with > writer > > Marjorie Lamb, sets out to show that Alzheimer's is, indeed, a > deadly > > modern plague. They present startling evidence that Alzheimer's is > one > > of a > > family of diseases caused by a malformed protein - or prion - that > > also > > causes mad cow disease and its human variant, Cruetzfeld-Jakob > disease > > (CJD). Could Alzheimer's, like CJD, be caused by tainted beef? In > this > > compelling exposition, the authors come to a frightening conclusion > > about > > our seemingly insatiable hunger for hamburger. > > > > " Before about 1900 Alzheimer's disease did not exist, or if it did, > > was so > > rare as not to be noticed. But just over a hundred years ago, > > Alzheimer's > > disease was unknown, and most people did not know anyone who > exhibited > > the > > symptoms of dementia that are now all too familiar to the families > and > > friends of victims. Alzheimer's disease (AD) now afflicts 15 million > > people > > around the world, including 250,000 Canadians and 4.5 million > > Americans. > > One in 10 persons over 65 and nearly half of those over 85 have the > > disease. More significantly, the number of people with dementia is > > expected to increase steadily over the next 25 years: in Canada, > > 10,000 new > > cases of AD are diagnosed each year - 27 cases per day. " > > > > [Edited from the book summaries and the excerpt below: > > http://www.mcclelland.com/catalog/display.pperl?isbn=0771087659 > > http://www.thebukowskiagency.com/DyingForAHamburger.htm > > > > To send an email to - > > ------------------------------ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 27, 2004 Report Share Posted April 27, 2004 > Craig Dearth wrote: > > Ian, > I assume you are a vegan or at least a vegetarian. > so the comment you made.. > I'm a vegan. > >>>>(Medical training is about diagnosis and treatment: it > doesn't necessarily mean someone can form and test a hypothesis, or > critically read a scientific paper.) > It's also suspicious that they published a book rather than a peer- > -reviewed paper. > ..Should not reference a science or medicine that does not reflect > vegan attitudes Last time I checked, being a vegan meant not eating animal products and - with the wider definition - avoiding any other animal products as far as is practical. Craig thinks that you also have to avoid any approach to solving a problem which " does not reflect vegan attitudes " . This is a new one on me. As it happens, I'm a scientist. There are quite a few vegan scientists - Stephen Walsh* is probably the best known amongst vegans. I happen to think that science amounts to a rigorous, open, tested, and testable (because you can check someone's results by repeating their experiment). (* In real life. Spock from Star Trek is probably better known overall ) > I also asked you for a couple weeks to look up the info and references Oh, right. I thought that the blurb was your answer to my question. > but I assure you for every disproof there is proof > it will all depend on the Science you believe Science does not prove anything: scientists work my making up theories which explain what happens, and then conducting experiments which might disprove their theories to test them. > I choose not to believe that main stream medicine understands what is > happening > they try to cure everything rather than prevent > that in itself is very troubling > as for publishing a book well I think I have covered that > if you would like to continue this debate I am all for it > if you would like to mud sling get a fan You post stuff which, sadly, doesn't make much sense. (I don't hold this against you. Goodness knows that I have days where I may no sense at all.) I point this out, point by point, a bit curtly perhaps but not making it personal either. And then you imply I'm mud slinging? You claim I shouldn't be using science because it " does not reflect vegan attitudes " ? I'm not particularly interested in discussing this for the sake of it, but I wouldn't want anyone to be taken in by you. So ... does anyone think the evidence thus far presented supports the hypothesis that Alzheimers is a prion disease (apart from Craig)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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