CA bill... LONG

[Guest guest]

Hi Todd and all,

 

My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the standards of our

profession. My understanding... as I am in receipt of an email stating that

Jack Miller and Christine from the NCCAOM are meeting with Assemblywomen Chu

on March the 5th, to try and persuade her to drop the Bill all together...

if any of you are interested in supporting the bill... I believe it

imperative to let her know, immediately. The opposition is putting forth a

compromise of 2800... which I think is total backsliding, as I graduated

with 3200 hours. I am disappointed that my school... did not contact any

alumni, that I am aware of... to see what our take is on the matter. I was

told that if this bill passes then it will be simular to when Certified

Acupuncturist... had a name change to Licensed Acupuncturist... so this bill

would change our title to Doctor of Oriental Medicine... it is not an

automatic award of a PhD Degree... PhD's need to be earned. In the state of

California we are Primary Health care Providers... and most people think of

us as " Doctor " .

 

It is my further understanding that The California State Board is in support

of the Bill, whereas the NCCAOM is in opposition... some schools are for and

some are against. I believe the AMA is in support of higher education.

 

In Health,

Teresa

 

If you have received an early version of this message please disregard and

forward this message to anyone that you forwarded the previous version.

 

Urgent Message Regarding the State of our Profession

 

HAPPY NEW YEAR! It is an exciting beginning to 2002 for those of us in the

Oriental Medical Profession. It is the year of the yang water horse, and the

horses are charging out of the gate. We have four bills up for legislative

vote this year, the most in one year ever. Please take a few minutes to TAKE

ACTION NOW, now is not the time to hold your horses. Passing the bills is

going to take all of our efforts in concert. The bills are crucial for the

future of our profession for many reasons. They will increase our ability to

help our patients by upgrading our training, provide access to more patients

by putting us on equal ground with the other members of the health care

system, and mandate that all insurance carriers operating in CA cover

Oriental Medicine. They also provide more funding for research, clarify the

scope of our practice, ensure the quality of the medicinals we use, and. as

the I Ching put it, " pay heed to the providing of nourishment (for all). "

 

The four bills on the table at the moment are:

1. Assembly Bill No. 1943(Acupuncture Education Bill)

2. Senate Bill No. 1705 (Workers Compensation: " Disability Evaluation "

Rights for Acupuncturists)

3. Assembly Bill No. 2314 (The establishment of a Traditional Asian

Medicine Certification Program for Herbs and Supplements)

4. Senate Bill No. 573 (Health Plan Coverage for Acupuncture)

 

For more information on each bill, read each one below, or go directly to

the " Step by step instructions on where to mail your support letters " page.

 

Assembly Bill No. 1943 (Acupuncture Education Bill)

Authored by Assembly Member Judy Chu

For the full text of this bill go to:

 

http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/bill/asm/ab_1901-1950/ab_1943_bill_20020214_intro

duced.html

 

There are four main points of interest:

 

1) Raises the hours of education for entry-level acupuncturists in the state

of California.

This bill would raise the educational standard from its current designation

to around 3200 hours effective for students entering school after January 1,

2003 and to around 4000 hours for students entering school after January 1,

2007. This level of training is akin to the amount of training other primary

care physicians (MD's, DC's, DO's, etc.) need to become licensed in CA. This

bill would require faculty of TCM/TOM schools to have at least 5 years of

clinical experience. This bill would also specify the areas of study and

clinical experience that additional hours would be spent, thus paving the

way for a clinical doctorate as opposed to an academic doctorate, to be

offered at some point in the future.

 

2) Authorizes acupuncturists to make a diagnosis within our scope of

practice.

Currently in California, LAc's, like other primary care providers, use ICD-9

codes on insurance claim forms to be reimbursed for services rendered. This

provision authorizes an acupuncturist to diagnose within the scope of

practice of acupuncture and Oriental Medicine.

 

3) Makes a change in the language of the law pertaining to Acupuncture to

include Oriental Medicine and Chinese Herbal Medicine thus reflecting our

current scope of practice.

 

4) Addresses the language and " title designation " of Doctor of Oriental

Medicine.

We cannot assume from the language of this bill that those who currently

possess LAc's in California will be automatically grandfathered in as

Doctors of Oriental Medicine (DOM) at some point in the future. At minimum,

by legislating an entry level program [of around 4000 hours] of study for

the clinician, schools would be able to work with the State Board and other

accrediting agencies to come up with a framework for those wishing to pursue

a clinical doctorate in Oriental Medicine and possibly have some of their

clinical hours as LAc's count towards the hours needed to reach [around]

4000 hour mark. In short, there are no short cuts to a doctorate degree

that requires [around] 4000 hours. Further clinical and academic work will

be needed to make up the difference in hours.

 

Nowhere in the current laws and regulations does it use the words Masters of

TOM/TCM, it mearly outlines the minimum totoal hours required and areas of

study a student must fullfill. Therefore, it seams that should this bill

become law, and the schools institute the [around] 4000 hour program, the

schools would then be free to work with the accrediting bodies to get

financial aid/Stafford loans to cover the cost of the additional hours and

also change name of the degree from, " Masters of TCM/TOM " to " Doctor of

Oriental Medicine (DOM) " . As the current laws and regulations are written

(in article 1399.456. Use of the Title " Doctor " ) graduates may begin to use

the title Dr. your name DOM once they " possess an earned doctorate degree

from an accredited, approved or authorized educational institution.which is

in acupuncture, Oriental Medicine, a biological science, or is otherwise

related to the authorized practice of an acupuncturist. "

 

By getting this bill passed into law, our profession would be raising the

standard of education. Including, more education in clinical sciences,

diagnostics, assessment, charting, reporting, herbology in its relation to

western treatment and possible interactions, and safety issues. Thus

allowing us to communicate and share in patient care and more effectively

co-mange patient care with other primary care medical practitioners. It

will enable our profession to gain more respect from other health care

professionals (MD's, DO's, Chiropractors, Dentist), all of whom have higher

standards than our profession right now.

 

A lot has changed since 1984, the last time our education standards were

determined, and with the level and proficiency that our profession is at

now. We could potentially lose our Primary Care status unless we step up

our level of training. It is essential to have a solid foundation in western

medical principles, pathology and diagnosis so that we can continue to share

the knowledge of TCM/TOM with our patients and other health care

professionals.

 

There is strong opposition to this bill from national groups such as the

National Certification Commission for Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine

(NCCAOM) and the Council of Colleges of Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine

(CCAOM) and schools not yet meeting California's current standard.

 

To pass this bill, we must not only write letters but also have our friends,

families, and patients write letters as well.

 

Senate Bill No. 1705 (Workers Compensation: " Disability Evaluation " Rights

for Acupuncturists)

 

Authored by Senator Burton

For the full text of this bill go to:

 

http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/bill/sen/sb_1701-1750/sb_1705_bill_20020221_intro

duced.html

Currently under article 3209.3 of Labor Code, L.Ac.'s cannot do disability

evaluations. Once this bill is passed, L.Ac.'s will have full rights for

work compensations, including disability evaluations. Once this bill passes

you must sit for additional class hours and the new Qualified Medical

Examiners (QME) Exam. Current QME's will have do the same additional class

hours and take the new QME Exam.

 

Assembly Bill No. 2314 (To establish a Traditional Asian Medicine

Certification Program for Herbs and Supplements)

 

Authored by Assembly Member Chu

For the full text of this bill go to:

http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/bill/asm/ab_2301-2350/ab_2314_bill_20020221_intro

duced.html

 

This bill would establish the Traditional Asian Medicine Certification

Program to be administered by the State Department of Health Services. The

bill would require the Department of Health Service to establish a list of

products, to be published annually, used in the making of traditional Asian

medicine. This bill would require that the department monitor the list and

labels of traditional Asian medicine and the ingredients used in the

production to prevent the use of endangered species of flora and fauna....

(and) to protect the health and welfare of the people of the state from

exposure to harmful levels of metals and other contaminants in traditional

Asian medicines and herbal health products. ...to test, every traditional

Asian medicine that is to be produced, sold, or imported into this state, to

determine if certification is warranted. A traditional Asian medicine or

herbal health product shall not be certified until the certification fee

required pursuant to this section has been paid. The department shall

establish the amount of the certification fee due under this section. The

amount of the fee shall not exceed a reasonable amount as necessary for

administration of this part. (From the Legislative Counsel's Digest) "

 

With this said, this bill would certify ( " Green Label " ) those herbs and

products tested, meaning that it met the standards adopted by the State

Department of Health Services (DHS). The State would say that the

ingredients that went into the processing and formulation of the product

have been tested and are approved. This bill would also allocate funds for

such testing needed to be performed to create certification labels. From

this testing a database of information will be assembled that may be used to

show that the compounds found in the products requiring Prop 65 label come

from natural occurring sources - thus exempting that product from the

proposition 65 labeling at some point in the future.

 

Senate Bill No. 573 (Health Plan Coverage for Acupuncture)

Authored by Senator Burton

For the full text of this bill go to:

http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/bill/sen/sb_0551-0600/sb_573_bill_20010712_amende

d_asm.html

 

In a nutshell, this bill mandates that all health plan, including HMO's,

provide coverage for acupuncture. This bill would require every health care

service plan and every disability insurer issuing policies on a group wide

basis, to provide acupuncture coverage under those terms and conditions as

may be agreed upon by the parties, with specific exemption. This bill would

delete the current requirement conditioning the payment and reimbursement of

a certified or licensed acupuncturist, for his or her services, on the

express inclusion of acupuncture as a benefit and in a disability insurance

policy or contract.

 

Step by step Instructions on where to mail your support letters

 

General ideas to keep in mind when composing a letter to a legislator:

· It is preferable that you send one letter per bill to the author of

the bill. For your local legislators, you may write one letter regarding all

four bills or simply send a CC (carbon copy) to your local legislators the

letter you have written and are sending to the author of each bill.

 

· Keep your comments general, do not get specific on one point of the

bill; for example if your letter on the education bill is based only/all

about becoming a Dr. and this time around that part of the bill is edited

out by the process of legislation, then your letter becomes void. To recap,

be general and supportive of the bill. Make sure to address the legislators

by the title of Honorable followed by Their Name, Title, and district. Make

sure you tell them you are a registered voter, and a constituent of their

district. Also, if you are a business owner (i.e. Self-employed

practitioner) make sure to mention that as well.

 

· Keep a copy of your letters for your records (we may be called upon

to send CC of those original letters to committees or the governor at a

later date.

 

1) Send a letter to the author of each bill

 

Assembly Bill No. 1943 (Acupuncture Education Bill)

Honorable Assembly Member Judy Chu

49th Assembly District

 

State Capitol

Room 5126

Sacramento CA 95814

assemblymember.chu

Fax: (916) 319-2149

Phone: (916) 319-2049

 

Request from Assembly Member Chu's Office: They do except emails (do not

send file attachments) as letters of support. If you fax your letter to her

office, do not mail it too.

Senate Bill No. 1705 (Workers Compensation: " Disability Evaluation " Rights

for Acupuncturists)

 

Honorable Senator John Burton, President pro Tempore

State Capitol

Room 205

Sacramento, CA 95814

Fax: (916) 445-4722

Phone: (916) 445-1412

 

Request from Senator Burton's Office: If you fax your letter to his office

do not mail it too. They do not except emails as letters of support. You can

go to his website and fill out a feedback form that will be electronically

sent to his office:

http://democrats.sen.ca.gov/servlet/gov.ca.senate.democrats.pub.members.memD

isplayHome?district=sd03

 

Assembly Bill No. 2314 (To establish a Traditional Asian Medicine

Certification Program for Herbs and Supplements)

 

Honorable Assembly Member Judy Chu

Same Contact info as above

Senate Bill No. 573 (Health Plan Coverage for Acupuncture)

Honorable Senator John Burton, President pro Tempore

 

 

Same Contact info as above

 

2) Local Legislators

 

You may send one letter regarding all four of the above bills to your local

representatives or you may simply CC the letters that you wrote to the

authors of each bill.

 

To find your local legislator:

 

Go the web site: http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/yourleg.html and type in your

address where you are registered to vote and it will give you the name and

contact information for your local state senator and assembly member.

 

OR

 

Look in the government pages at the front of your local phone book.

 

3) Send a CC (carbon copy) of the letter to the authors of the bills or the

letter you wrote to you local legislators to the following organizations:

 

CSOMA: In order to keep our lobbyist, Steve English, informed of the support

we have gathered for the respective bills, CSOMA will keep a file of the CC'

s of our letters. This is of utmost importance once the bills go to the

committees that they become assigned to so that Steve English will be able

to present to them all our letters. Even if you have not become a member of

CSOMA yet, please email, fax, or mail a CC to them. To support the efforts

of Steve English (our professions lobbyist) and our entire profession, if

you have not done so already, join a professional organization that is

contributing to our cause.

 

CSOMA

RE: 2002 Bills

 

2710 X Street, Suite 2A

Sacramento, CA 95818

office

Fax: (916) 455-0347

Phone: 800) 477-4564

 

-

" " <

Sunday, March 03, 2002 10:40 AM

CA bill

 

 

> Does anyone know what's up with a bill in the CA assembly to change the

> acupuncture law? I know they are trying to increase educational

> standards to 3800 hours. There is also language about the use of the

> title OMD or DOM. It does not seem this way to my reading, but some

> people have told me that the law will make the entry level degree a

> doctorate and grandfather current L.Ac.'s to allow them to use the title

> doctor.

>

 

>

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,

including board approved online continuing education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

, " Teresa Hall " <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

wrote:

> Hi Todd and all,

>

> My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the

standards of our

> profession.

 

Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this issue,

but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make their

positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard

on this matter.

 

[Guest guest]

All,

 

While all this stuff is highly debatable, the reality is that if we do not

get it together... the State schools will pick up Oriental Medicine. I

heard yesterday that USC, I believe is offering a PhD degree in Oriental

Medicine. If this is the case, as I have not called them yet... then I am

sure other schools will follow.

 

As a recent PCOM graduate with 3200 hours... I do not believe it was nearly

enough. Not one class was offered in Herbal and Drug interactions. The

reality is almost every patient I see is on some sort of Western Drug. In

California we are Primary care Providers... there just was not enough

information about when we should refer and who we should refer to. I also

believe at our entry level we need more classes in regards to setting up

practice... the business aspect of it.

 

In retrospect... it seemed many classes were strictly geered to passing the

State Licensing exam. I know I will be a student for the rest of my life...

amd my 4.5 years at PCOM was only a slight introduction to all that is out

there... however, once we are licensed we literally have our patients

healthcare in our hands.

 

Teresa

 

> , " Teresa Hall " <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> wrote:

> > Hi Todd and all,

> >

> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the

> standards of our

> > profession.

>

> Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this issue,

> but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make their

> positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard

> on this matter.

>

 

>

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,

including board approved online continuing education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

You are right, Teresa, a glaring omission, although I have been

championing the issue for years, and have taught 3 three hour classes

per semester in one course for at least five years.

 

We have rectified that (at PCOM). As of next semester, each herb course

will have the equivalent of 4-5 hours of discussion on herb toxicity,

drug/herb interactions, herb pharmacology, etc.

 

 

On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 01:31 PM, Teresa Hall wrote:

 

> As a recent PCOM graduate with 3200 hours... I do not believe it was

> nearly

> enough.  Not one class was offered in Herbal and Drug interactions.  The

> reality is almost every patient I see is on some sort of Western Drug. 

> In

> California we are Primary care Providers... there just was not enough

> information about when we should refer and who we should refer to.  I

> also

> believe at our entry level we need more classes in regards to setting up

> practice... the business aspect of it.

[Guest guest]

BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting on March

3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ... I believe we can only take a

position when we have as many of the facts, as possible. One of their

points of interest is that we should only be learning OM... well, hell does

that mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western Med classes we sat

through. For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught for 2

semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic. Now that I am in

practice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's Comp... we'll, I can say

these classes are VERY important!

 

It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved, in regards toAB 1943,

has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what California

does or does not do? I guess, I should write them to find out *S*

 

 

Teresa

 

 

 

 

-

" 1 " <

 

Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM

Re: CA bill... LONG

 

 

> , " Teresa Hall " <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> wrote:

> > Hi Todd and all,

> >

> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the

> standards of our

> > profession.

>

> Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this issue,

> but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make their

> positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard

> on this matter.

>

 

>

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,

including board approved online continuing education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Teresa,

 

I'd like to see it.

 

Ken

 

, " Teresa Hall "

<Teresa.bodywork4u@w...> wrote:

> BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting

on March

> 3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ... I believe we can only

take a

> position when we have as many of the facts, as possible. One of

their

> points of interest is that we should only be learning OM... well,

hell does

> that mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western Med classes we

sat

> through. For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught

for 2

> semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic. Now that I

am in

> practice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's Comp... we'll, I

can say

> these classes are VERY important!

>

> It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved, in regards

toAB 1943,

> has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what

California

> does or does not do? I guess, I should write them to find out *S*

>

>

> Teresa

>

>

>

>

> -

> " 1 " <@i...>

>

> Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM

> Re: CA bill... LONG

>

>

> > , " Teresa Hall "

<Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> > wrote:

> > > Hi Todd and all,

> > >

> > > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the

> > standards of our

> > > profession.

> >

> > Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this

issue,

> > but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make

their

> > positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are

heard

> > on this matter.

> >

>

> >

> >

> >

> > Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

healthcare

> practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics

specializing

> in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional

services,

> including board approved online continuing education.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Perhaps a specialty clinic in ortho-neuro, like the one PCOM does with

Japanese acupuncture would be the way to go. There is simply not enough

time in clinic to do everything, and we are still struggling to get

students to do pulse diagnosis, intake, choose an acupuncture protocol

and herbal prescription in a limited amount of time.

 

 

On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 02:34 PM, Teresa Hall wrote:

 

> BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting on

> March

> 3.  Let me know, I will forward it to you ... I believe we can only

> take a

> position when we have as many of the facts, as possible.  One of their

> points of interest is that we should only be learning OM... well, hell

> does

> that mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western Med classes we sat

> through.  For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught

> for 2

> semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic.  Now that I am in

> practice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's Comp... we'll, I can

> say

> these classes are VERY important!

>

> It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved, in regards toAB

> 1943,

> has their own agenda.  Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what

> California

> does or does not do?  I guess, I should write them to find out *S*

>

>

> Teresa

>

>

>

>

> -

> " 1 " <

>

> Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM

> Re: CA bill... LONG

>

>

> > , " Teresa Hall " <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> > wrote:

> > > Hi Todd and all,

> > >

> > > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the

> > standards of our

> > > profession.

> >

> > Thanks, Teresa.  very informative.  feel free to debate this issue,

> > but I doubt we will reach a consensus.  So everyone should make their

> > positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard

> > on this matter.

> >

>

> >

> >

> >

> > Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

> healthcare

> practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics

> specializing

> in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,

> including board approved online continuing education.

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

We have rectified that (at PCOM). As of next semester, each herb course will have the equivalent of 4-5 hours of discussion on herb toxicity, drug/herb interactions, herb pharmacology, etc.>>>Unfortunately so little real clinical information is known.

Alon

[Guest guest]

Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what Californiadoes or does not do? I guess, I should write them to find out *S*>>>Talk to AAOM they have been dealing with this dumbdown from NCCAOM of many years

Alon

[Guest guest]

Teresa,

Would you please also email me a copy of NCCAOM's agenda for the March

meeting? Thanks.

Frances

Teresa Hall wrote:

BTW... if anyone is interested

in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting on March

3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ...

I believe we can only take a

position when we have as many of the facts, as possible.

One of their

points of interest is that we should only be learning

OM... well, hell does

that mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western

Med classes we sat

through. For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation...

which we were taught for 2

semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic.

Now that I am in

practice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's

Comp... we'll, I can say

these classes are VERY important!

It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved,

in regards toAB 1943,

has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so

concerned about what California

does or does not do? I guess, I should write

them to find out *S*

 

Teresa

 

 

 

-

"1" <

 

Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM

Re: CA bill... LONG

 

> , "Teresa Hall" <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> wrote:

> > Hi Todd and all,

> >

> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about

raising the

> standards of our

> > profession.

>

> Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel

free to debate this issue,

> but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So

everyone should make their

> positions known to the legislature so that the

rank and file are heard

> on this matter.

>

>

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization

of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate

academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of

professional services,

including board approved online continuing education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Good point. . . but the discussion, work and compiling of information

must begin.

 

 

On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 06:03 PM, Alon Marcus wrote:

 

> We have rectified that (at PCOM). As of next semester, each herb course

> will have the equivalent of 4-5 hours of discussion on herb toxicity,

> drug/herb interactions, herb pharmacology, etc.

> >>>Unfortunately so little real clinical information is known.

> Alon

>

 

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed

> healthcare practitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate

> academics specializing in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety

> of professional services, including board approved online continuing

> education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Good point. . . but the discussion, work and compiling of information must begin.>>>I am definitely for that. The ground must be fertilized the basic science learned.

Alon

[Guest guest]

wrote:

 

> We have rectified that (at PCOM). As of next semester, each herb course will

have the equivalent of 4-5 hours of discussion on herb toxicity, drug/herb

interactions, herb pharmacology, etc.

 

I'd like to see the schools allow graduates to audit classes at a

reduced fee (or at least the audit cost). ECTOM actually allows their

faculty to sit in on classes as we wish and given more time, I would

certainly do more of this. One of the key classes I would take is

(biomedical) pharmacology. It was a good class when I took it, but have

long since forgotten the classes of drugs and their mechanisms.

 

For me, understanding the mechanism of a drug can help to avoid

potentiating its effect or negating it with the herbs. It may not

provide the necessary understanding of known drug/herb interactions such

as Chai Hu and Interferon, but at least we'll go into intergrated care

with both eyes open.

 

--

Al Stone L.Ac.

<AlStone

http://www.BeyondWellBeing.com

 

Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional.

[Guest guest]

Teresa,

 

Let us not forget that PCOM does offer an

externship that utilizes ortho-neuro evaluations / muscular skeletal treatments

almost exclusively with Matt Calison. AS for you not using what you

learned in class (ONE) in the clinic… one can only blame one’s

self. There is plenty of opportunity within the normal clinic to apply

this knowledge, and as mentioned above outside in the externships.

 

-Jason

 

 

 

 

[zrosenbe]

Sunday, March 03, 2002 3:00

PM

 

Re:

Re: CA bill... LONG

 

Perhaps a specialty

clinic in ortho-neuro, like the one PCOM does with Japanese acupuncture would

be the way to go. There is simply not enough time in clinic to do everything,

and we are still struggling to get students to do pulse diagnosis, intake, choose

an acupuncture protocol and herbal prescription in a limited amount of time.

 

 

On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 02:34 PM, Teresa Hall wrote:

BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for

the meeting on March

3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ...

I believe we can only take a

position when we have as many of the facts, as

possible. One of their

points of interest is that we should only be

learning OM... well, hell does

that mean we will be re-imbursed for all the

Western Med classes we sat

through. For example,

OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught for 2

semesters, and it was never implemented in the

clinic. Now that I am in

practice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's

Comp... we'll, I can say

these classes are VERY important!

 

It is becoming very apparent that everyone

involved, in regards toAB 1943,

has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so

concerned about what California

does or does not do? I guess, I should write

them to find out *S*

 

 

Teresa

 

 

 

 

-

" 1 "

<

 

Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM

Re: CA bill... LONG

 

 

> , " Teresa Hall "

<Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>

> wrote:

> > Hi Todd and all,

> >

> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu)

is about raising the

> standards of our

> > profession.

>

> Thanks, Teresa. very informative.

feel free to debate this issue,

> but I doubt we will reach a consensus.

So everyone should make their

> positions known to the legislature so that

the rank and file are heard

> on this matter.

>

 

>

>

>

> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary

organization of licensed healthcare

practitioners, matriculated students and

postgraduate academics specializing

in Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of

professional services,

including board approved online continuing

education.

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the insight Jason, however I think you are missing my point and further more I find it interesting that you would say that I am placing blame, as that is not my intention.

 

Teresa

 

 

 

Teresa,

 

Let us not forget that PCOM does offer an externship that utilizes ortho-neuro evaluations / muscular skeletal treatments almost exclusively with Matt Calison. AS for you not using what you learned in class (ONE) in the clinic… one can only blame one’s self. There is plenty of opportunity within the normal clinic to apply this knowledge, and as mentioned above outside in the externships.

 

-Jason

 

 

[zrosenbe] Sunday, March 03, 2002 3:00 PM Subject: Re: Re: CA bill... LONG

 

Perhaps a specialty clinic in ortho-neuro, like the one PCOM does with Japanese acupuncture would be the way to go. There is simply not enough time in clinic to do everything, and we are still struggling to get students to do pulse diagnosis, intake, choose an acupuncture protocol and herbal prescription in a limited amount of time.On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 02:34 PM, Teresa Hall wrote:

BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting on March3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ... I believe we can only take aposition when we have as many of the facts, as possible. One of theirpoints of interest is that we should only be learning OM... well, hell doesthat mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western Med classes we satthrough. For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught for 2semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic. Now that I am inpractice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's Comp... we'll, I can saythese classes are VERY important!It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved, in regards toAB 1943,has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what Californiadoes or does not do? I guess, I should write them to find out *S*Teresa-"1" <Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM Re: CA bill... LONG> , "Teresa Hall" <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>> wrote:> > Hi Todd and all,> >> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the> standards of our> > profession.>> Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this issue,> but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make their> positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard> on this matter.>>>>> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcarepractitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializingin Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,including board approved online continuing education.>> http://www..org>>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the insight Jason, however I think you are missing my point and further more I find it interesting that you would say that I am placing blame, as that is not my intention.

 

Teresa

 

 

 

-

 

 

Monday, March 04, 2002 4:59 PM

RE: Re: CA bill... LONG

 

 

Teresa,

 

Let us not forget that PCOM does offer an externship that utilizes ortho-neuro evaluations / muscular skeletal treatments almost exclusively with Matt Calison. AS for you not using what you learned in class (ONE) in the clinic… one can only blame one’s self. There is plenty of opportunity within the normal clinic to apply this knowledge, and as mentioned above outside in the externships.

 

-Jason

 

 

[zrosenbe] Sunday, March 03, 2002 3:00 PM Subject: Re: Re: CA bill... LONG

 

Perhaps a specialty clinic in ortho-neuro, like the one PCOM does with Japanese acupuncture would be the way to go. There is simply not enough time in clinic to do everything, and we are still struggling to get students to do pulse diagnosis, intake, choose an acupuncture protocol and herbal prescription in a limited amount of time.On Sunday, March 3, 2002, at 02:34 PM, Teresa Hall wrote:

BTW... if anyone is interested in NCCAOM's agenda, for the meeting on March3. Let me know, I will forward it to you ... I believe we can only take aposition when we have as many of the facts, as possible. One of theirpoints of interest is that we should only be learning OM... well, hell doesthat mean we will be re-imbursed for all the Western Med classes we satthrough. For example, OrthoNeuroEvaluation... which we were taught for 2semesters, and it was never implemented in the clinic. Now that I am inpractice and many of the cases I see are Workmen's Comp... we'll, I can saythese classes are VERY important!It is becoming very apparent that everyone involved, in regards toAB 1943,has their own agenda. Why is the NCCAOM so concerned about what Californiadoes or does not do? I guess, I should write them to find out *S*Teresa-"1" <Sunday, March 03, 2002 12:46 PM Re: CA bill... LONG> , "Teresa Hall" <Teresa.bodywork4u@w...>> wrote:> > Hi Todd and all,> >> > My understanding is that AB 1943 (Chu) is about raising the> standards of our> > profession.>> Thanks, Teresa. very informative. feel free to debate this issue,> but I doubt we will reach a consensus. So everyone should make their> positions known to the legislature so that the rank and file are heard> on this matter.>>>>> Chinese Herbal Medicine, a voluntary organization of licensed healthcarepractitioners, matriculated students and postgraduate academics specializingin Chinese Herbal Medicine, provides a variety of professional services,including board approved online continuing education.>> http://www..org>>