Gui Zhi Tang chicken soup ;) ~ modified

[Guest guest]

Kokko, I really like your idea to use GZT as a model for soup... I've been doing

it for my chicken soup this season and it had a very nice 'resolve the exterior'

effect

This is what i did: first boil the chicken ( i use 2 whole legs) in clean water,

with some salt to soften and control fire (just a little); after about 30

minutes add a couple handfuls of brown rice (like having the rice gruel with the

formula ), 3g Gui Zhi, 5 Da Zao pieces, and at first only 1 slice of ginger

so pernetrate though the chicken (i add more later so it doesn't cook too long);

when the chicken falls apart, add in some sliced, very fresh carrots (sweet,

parallel idea to Da Zao to nourish Earth/Ying); also add between 6 to 8 slices

of fresh ginger, depending on how much exterior resolution you want. Keep in

mind in dosing the ginger, that there is no Bai Shao (taste problem ;( ) so the

sweating will be more pronounced than GZT.Though, i take the chicken to have

some 'stabilizing' virtue because it is flesh. Boil until carrots are soft.

Last but not least: through in a coulpe handfuls of spinach or mustard greens,

and a very generous amount of chopped geen onions (almost one bunch). That adds

a nice Wei level touch

I guarantee you'll be sweating by the end of your first cup, with a very nice

taste (you've got to like ginger though).

Food and healing all in one!

 

 

 

 

 

________________________________

<johnkokko

Chinese Medicine

Sat, November 14, 2009 4:04:28 AM

Re: Prevention Protocol of swine flu-H1N1-Mrs Walkers's Chicken

Soup

 

Hugo,

 

Here is my quote..

" I always feel better after eating chicken soup with garlic for a

wind-cold. "

 

I agree that the saving grace in the chicken soup formula is the garlic.  As

Koreans love to point out, there was not a single case of SARS in Korea, due

to the pounds of kim-chi eaten every year.    Garlic is a pungent and hot

herb, which is suitable for wind-cold, but not wind-heat.  Even if you eat

chicken or congee soup, the garlic will " keep the door open " for pathogens

to leave.  Koreans and Jews and other cultures traditionally use garlic to

ward off the " bad spirits " .  In Korea, the founding myth includes the story

of the bear coming out of the cave with both artemesia and garlic in her

hands.  Garlic might have staved off certain epidemics, hence the story of

keeping garlic to ward off vampires.

 

Without the pungent garlic or ginger or red peppers or onions in chicken

soup, yes... it would be deterious for the patient's health to eat a

marrow-rich, protein stew... but as far as I know, every recipe for chicken

soup I've ever seen has a pungent ingredient in it.

 

Gui zhi tang includes 2 pungent herbs, 1 sour astringent herb and 2 sweet

and sticky herbs.  Without the cinnamon and ginger, would we have a leg to

stand on?  Do the other 3 ying tonifying herbs damage the patient?  Why did

Zhang Zhong Jing add the sticky herbs to this, the most famous wind-cold

formula?  There must be a purpose.

 

If we're going to stick to Chinese medicine, the wind-cold is not about a

virus, but our bodies relation to the outside world... regulating the ying

and the wei.  Is our purpose to fight the virus or to strengthen our body in

relation the the myriad viruses, molds, bacteria and parasites that are

everywhere at all times.  We can't live in a sterile bubble, nor would we

want to fight mother nature, which we are in-extricably linked with.  That's

why I think that the whole chicken mixed with pungent herbs can be extremely

useful for this type of condition.

 

By analyzing Gui zhi tang, can we figure out the best food remedy for

wind-colds?

Would it look like chicken soup with garlic?  or  jook with cong-bai?

 

Maybe it's just an issue of resonance and refinement, but I would have to

think again about traditional dietary practices that have worked for

centuries cross-culturally, especially if it tastes good.

 

K

 

 

 

 

 

 

On Fri, Nov 13, 2009 at 10:12 PM, Hugo Ramiro <subincor wrote:

 

>

>

> Hi John!

>

> I have to disagree here. It's not an issue about simply supplementing

> (which is erroneous *if there is no deficiency*). It is also an issue of

> trophism. Our categories in Chinese herbal medicine are created around the

> movement and trophism of herbs. Herbs that sink or move towards the centre

> (astringent / sour action) cannot expel EPF but in fact will draw them

> inwards to deeper layers - a clear error in treatment according to the

> experiential observation in our medicine.

> Do we have even *one* single formula which uses sinking medicinals for

> acute external wind-cold invasion in a patient with no other pathology? My

> herbal formula memory is not great, but I will bet a whole evening for two

> getaway that there is not even one.

>

> I am taking the trouble to argue this point because I feel this is an

> important issue since it impacts our patients negatively and also because

> this is one of the areas where we are being eroded as a profession. At my

> last staff meeting I did a presentation on astragalus and its proper use and

> contraindications because the MDs, naturopaths and others are using this

> herb completely incorrectly. There are parts of our theories which are

> easier to substantiate and others which seem " less real " to us like this 4

> levels theory, or meridian circulation, or the five elements ( " only some

> parts of the cycle are useful " ) or the triple burner ORGAN. It is my opinion

> that parts of our theory are not taken seriously because we compromise their

> proper use and training via excessive education in western (often unproven

> and speculative and always partial) theories.

>

> The theories about the movement of qi (sinking, rising, etc) are either

> correct descriptions of a real phenomena, OR they are flights of fancy. If

> they are flights of fancy then WE MUST DISCARD THEM. If they are NOT flights

> of fancy but are representative of real phenomena, then we must abide by

> them. One or the other - THIS is how we will maintain the integrity of our

> medicine. Now this doesn't mean we behave perfectly and always in accordance

> with these principles - it simply means we know what we are doing.

>

> This section is titled " natural history " .

> When you state, John, that you feel better after eating chicken soup with

> garlic when you have a cold, that is unfortunately *not enough*. Not only do

> we have actual and explicit standards of practice for the treatment of

> external pathogenic factors (which we must ethically conform to), but

> " getting better " CANNOT BE the only measure of efficacy. We get better for

> many reasons - the " natural course or history " of an illness, placebo effect

> (healing reaction to a non-specific stimulus or in accord with a

> subconscious directive), proper treatment OR internal strength. We must

> raise our standards so that people get better *surprisingly* rapidly - way

> beyond any accusation of " natural history " , placebo or internal strength.

> More toward " oh my gawd it was a MIRACLE! " haha.

>

> This section is titled " internal strength " .

> An important point in my view: If we have good internal strength, then our

> body will be able to pick up the pieces with just a little bit of partially

> correct help (or no help at all). Recovering from an illness, in this case,

> cannot be credited to the partially-correct treatment, but rather must be

> credited to the body's internal reserves and abilities. When we are

> young(ish) we can get over the common cold *even if* we apply an

> internalising force against the natural intent of the body to externalise

> the pathogenic factor. But I imagine that this mixed process will generate a

> problem: latent pathogens in the cracks and crevices of our internal

> landscape, suppressed for the moment, but certainly not expelled and

> actually ready to rise in rebellion at the first opportunity.

>

> With behaviour like this, might we not be adding to the warp and woof of a

> tapestry called chronic fatigue and fibromyalgia (qi, blood, yin and yang

> deficiency and cold damp in the muscle layer)? Certainly we are agreed that

> we create this tapestry if we use Huang Qi in this way...so what excuses

> other herbs and foodstuffs from this rule?

> The creation of latent, internalised pathogens is a subtle problem with no

> proof on any incoming horizon since noooobody! (people in Toronto will get

> that joke) will ever take the time and money to do that kind of study.

>

> So, again, John, would you seriously have chicken when you have a cold if

> you didn't include the strong dose of garlic, which is strongly acrid, and

> has a (partial) trophism for the lung and large intestine? Might the garlic

> be the saving grace in that formula?

>

> For what its worth.

>

> And thanks if any of you made it this far,

>

> Hugo

>

> ________________________________

> Hugo Ramiro

> http://middlemedicine.wordpress.com

> http://www.middlemedicine.org

>

> ________________________________

> <johnkokko <johnkokko%40gmail.com>>

>

> To:

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>

> Tue, 10 November, 2009 22:18:44

>

> Re: Prevention Protocol of swine flu-H1N1-Mrs Walkers's

> Chicken Soup

>

> Yuk,

> we always think about the wei qi protecting the outside of the body,

> but zheng qi includes ying qi and jing as well.

>

> Chicken bones, marrow, fat and all

> also nourishes the ying qi, blood and jing.

> When you cook a whole chicken down for a few hours,

> you're getting a lot of zheng qi in a pot.

>

> I always feel better after eating chicken soup with garlic for a wind-cold.

>

> For wind-heat, I feel better when I just drink fluids...

>

> the old quote... " starve a fever, feed a cold " .

>

> K

>

>

[Guest guest]

Genevieve,

I like your recipe.. sounds delicious, nutritious and addictive.

 

Many of the original herbs from the Han dynasty were cooking spice herbs,

especially the warming ones like sheng jiang, gui zhi, ba dou, cong bai

etc...

so, a nutritive soup to warm up the soul makes a lot of sense.

 

The Chinese were the first ones to domesticate chickens

(source: Guns, Germs and Steel), so I'm sure they know how to make Chicken

soup!

 

K

 

 

On Sat, Nov 14, 2009 at 9:47 AM, Genevieve Le Goff <

mellowmoonherbs wrote:

 

>

>

> Kokko, I really like your idea to use GZT as a model for soup...

>

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Genevieve & All,

 

Paraphrasing Genevieve's recipe:

 

Guizhi Tang Jiajian (Cinnamon Twig Dec modified as Chicken + Veg Soup

w great Release Exterior action (sweating after first cup): boil 2 chicken legs

in clean water w some salt to soften and control Fire; after circa 30 minutes,

add brown rice 2 handfuls, Guizhi 3g, Dazao 5pcs, Shengjiang (Xian) 1 slice;

when chicken falls apart, add carrots (very fresh, sliced; sweet; parallel idea

to Dazao to Nourish Earth/Ying), Shengjiang (Xian) 6-8 slices [depending on

how much Release Exterior action you want]; boil until carrots are soft; add

spinach / mustard greens 2 handfuls + Green Onions (chopped) circa 1

bunch; that boosts action of soup at Weifen; NOTE: there is no Baishao

(taste problem) so Make Sweat action is more pronounced than w GZT;

 

That sounds like a marvelous soup for the cold, wet days of the Irish winter!

 

I am looking forward to trying it!

 

Best regards,

 

[Guest guest]

what about popping some lemon juice in there in place of the Bai Shao? Adds some

astringency.

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " "

< wrote:

>

> Hi Genevieve & All,

>

> Paraphrasing Genevieve's recipe:

>

> Guizhi Tang Jiajian (Cinnamon Twig Dec modified as Chicken + Veg Soup

> w great Release Exterior action (sweating after first cup): boil 2 chicken

legs

> in clean water w some salt to soften and control Fire; after circa 30 minutes,

> add brown rice 2 handfuls, Guizhi 3g, Dazao 5pcs, Shengjiang (Xian) 1 slice;

> when chicken falls apart, add carrots (very fresh, sliced; sweet; parallel

idea

> to Dazao to Nourish Earth/Ying), Shengjiang (Xian) 6-8 slices [depending on

> how much Release Exterior action you want]; boil until carrots are soft; add

> spinach / mustard greens 2 handfuls + Green Onions (chopped) circa 1

> bunch; that boosts action of soup at Weifen; NOTE: there is no Baishao

> (taste problem) so Make Sweat action is more pronounced than w GZT;

>

> That sounds like a marvelous soup for the cold, wet days of the Irish winter!

>

> I am looking forward to trying it!

>

> Best regards,

>

>