Need Expert Advice/Info

[Guest guest]

I have a quick question - our company had a call yesterday from a customer

looking for Dead Sea Black Mud Soap. The lady asked what types of oils we

used in our handcrafted facial bars. I proceeded to tell her Virgin Coconut,

Virgin Red Palm, Virgin Palm Kernel, Emu, etc., etc., etc. She proceeded to

tell me that these oils clogged pores.

 

In my research I have found the opposite. I'm by no means a know-it-all and

am at the mercy of the people writing the literature - can anyone confirm my

research or point me in the direction of literature that contradicts my

findings?

I greatly appreciate any input anyone may have!

God Bless,

Tammy D.

The Mud QueenTM

[Guest guest]

NOT AN EXPERT but I have had oily/combo skin for 35 years and some limited

experience making soap (but still can't spell or pronounce comodogenic and

it's variants correctly!)

 

here's a couple links i've bookmarked ... tropical oils are notorius for

being comodogenic and have a bad rap in the mainstream (and should still be

avoided in lotions and creams), so some re-education is usually necessary

when selling natural, handmade soap to those with oily skin issues (I was

one of them!)

 

http://www.dermadoctor.com/pages/newsletter158.asp?WID=%7BE24A416A-6909-4D51-B3A\

7-06096291079F%7D

this article is a little too blase' about the comodogenicity test being done

on rabbits for my taste, but at least talks about how " oil free " does not

necessarily mean better for oily skin. after years of using " oil free "

products, i've come to find that using a natural lotion made with low

comodogenic oils is much more *healing*

 

http://www.soapnuts.com/noncomo.html

just a table of comodogenicity

 

 

BUT the one thing I don't have any documentation for is that a saponified

bar of soap will cleanse the skin and not clog the poors. As the oils react

with the lye and i'm pretty sure that makes the comodogenic factors go away,

in very very basic terms ... once the reaction is complete, there is no

lye or even coconut oil left, just soap and glycerin. my favorite soap is

a basic Olive/coconut/palm recipe and it just gently cleans my face. I

remember when I first saw " coconut and palm oils " on the label I nearly

jumped through the roof, so it is possible to re-educate even the staunchest

of the " oil free " or " avoid all tropical oils " believers. Not to mention

that these oils ARE MOST LIKELY in commercial soap in addition to artificial

detergents and dangerous chemicals, but my understanding is that they don't

have to list them b/c the finsihed soap that handsoap makers sell is but a

single ingredient in commercial soap. In fact, SLS " from coconuts " is all

over the place in commercial soaps and it is ranked as being even more

irritating and comodogenic than coconut oil itself in the articles above,

but very few of the " no tropical oils " disciples even know what the heck

Sodium Laurel Sulfate is or why it's bad for your skin. they're just

looking for the misleading " oil free " labeling. So they show up at your

shop going crazy over the fact that you use Palm Oil in your soap and

proudly label it as such. ok, i'm veering a little off to the side here ...

 

this article might help explain why those oils in a saponified soap/facial

bar will not be comodogenic but gently cleansing and moisturizing (even oily

skin needs proper moisturization).

http://www.herbsofgrace.com/natural-soap-benefits.php

 

the only other resources I have for how specific oils behave in a soap are,

gasp, books. So if you have any soap making books on hand you can also refer

to them.

 

Hope that helps!

 

~Bonnie

 

 

 

 

 

-

" Tammy Doering " <MudQueen

 

Wednesday, October 12, 2005 3:03 PM

Need Expert Advice/Info

 

 

I have a quick question - our company had a call yesterday from a customer

looking for Dead Sea Black Mud Soap. The lady asked what types of oils we

used in our handcrafted facial bars. I proceeded to tell her Virgin Coconut,

Virgin Red Palm, Virgin Palm Kernel, Emu, etc., etc., etc. She proceeded to

tell me that these oils clogged pores.

 

In my research I have found the opposite. I'm by no means a know-it-all and

am at the mercy of the people writing the literature - can anyone confirm my

research or point me in the direction of literature that contradicts my

findings?

I greatly appreciate any input anyone may have!

God Bless,

Tammy D.

The Mud QueenTM

 

 

 

 

 

 

The information contained in these e-mails is not a substitute

for diagnosis and treatment by a qualified, licensed professional.

 

 

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[Guest guest]

I haven't found that the CLOG the pores... the only thing that I've found

that does a job like that in the oil department is Mineral oil... YUCK! But,

again, I'm only " hearsay "

K

 

On 10/12/05, Tammy Doering <MudQueen wrote:

>

> I have a quick question - our company had a call yesterday from a customer

> looking for Dead Sea Black Mud Soap. The lady asked what types of oils we

> used in our handcrafted facial bars. I proceeded to tell her Virgin

> Coconut,

> Virgin Red Palm, Virgin Palm Kernel, Emu, etc., etc., etc. She proceeded

> to

> tell me that these oils clogged pores.

>

> In my research I have found the opposite. I'm by no means a know-it-all

> and

> am at the mercy of the people writing the literature - can anyone confirm

> my

> research or point me in the direction of literature that contradicts my

> findings?

> I greatly appreciate any input anyone may have!

> God Bless,

> Tammy D.

> The Mud QueenTM

>

> --

> Cheers!

> Kathleen Petrides

> The Woobey Queen

> Http://www.woobeyworld.com

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Tammy

 

Here are a couple of links you can read pertaining to chemicals and

Comedogenicity

 

This may or may not help I had them book marked

 

http://www.beautymagonline.com/pages/comedogenic_effects_of_cosmetic_.htm

 

 

 

http://www.zerozits.com/Articles/article6.htm#inglist

 

 

 

Hope this helps

 

Vickie

 

Gladys (Vickie) Swaim

 

Tierra De Cabros Goat Milk Bath Products

 

http://tierradecabros.bizhosting.com

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Woobey,

 

I am so quiet on this list BUT just this morning I had a

customer request that I carry cosmetic grade mineral oil

and I thought " hmmmm " what is the difference between

mineral oils? So, through some looking here is a recent

document stating that cosmetic grade mineral oil is

" non-comodogenic " . Some people have luck with this oil

and their skin types but it is very controversial!

 

Found it interesting my self! . . .

 

Opinions please :-)

 

" Blackwell Website Materials

The Journal of Cosmetic Dermatology

Zoe Diana Draelos, MD

 

Mineral Oil, Cosmetics, and Comedogenicity

 

Is mineral oil comedogenic? This is an age old question of concern to

consumers, the cosmetics industry, and dermatology that has finally

been answered in this issue of the Journal by Joe DiNardo.

Comedogenicity is a term used to describe cosmetics that cause

comedones, more commonly known as blackheads and whiteheads. The

cosmetics industry aims to develop skin care products and colored

cosmetics that do not cause " breakouts " on the face. This means that

they must use ingredients that do not cause comedo formation.

 

Mineral oil is one of the most common ingredients in skin care

products and colored cosmetics. It is a light weight inexpensive oil

that is odorless and tasteless, however, it is traditionally placed on

the list of comedogenic substances. These comedogenic substance lists

were developed many years ago, yet remain frequently quoted in the

dermatologic literature. There are several important points to

consider. First, there are different grades of mineral oil. There is

industrial grade mineral oil, which is used as a machine lubricant

that is not of the purity required for skin application. Cosmetic

grade mineral oil is the purist form without contaminants. Industrial

grade mineral oil may be comedogenic, but cosmetic grade mineral oil

is not. Quality manufacturers only purchase quality products from

quality suppliers who guarantee the quality of the materials they provide.

 

Mr. DiNardo's article provides additional perspective to this concept.

He elegantly demonstrates that mineral oil can be safely used in

cosmetics. He notes that it is not comedogenic and should be removed

from outdated lists that indicate it is problematic ingredient. This

was demonstrated by testing final formulations that contain mineral

oil in standard human comedogenic assays. These are performed by

placing the final mineral oil containing cosmetic formulation on the

upper back of healthy volunteers for several weeks that demonstrate

the ability to develop comedones. Cyanoacrylate glue is then applied

on a microscope slide to the treatment site to remove any

microcomedones that have formed during the study period. Analysis of

the slides then yields the answer as to whether comedones have formed.

This relatively new human testing has replaced the rabbit ear assay

that was the standard of the past.

 

Is mineral oil comedogenic? The answer is no. Better raw materials,

superior formulations, and new testing methodologies have resulted in

mineral oil-containing cosmetics and skin care products that are

noncomedogenic. Mineral can be safely removed from the list of

comedogens, at last. "

 

Markey :-)

www.gardenofwisdom.com

 

*snippet*

, Woobey Queen <WoobeyQueen@g...>

wrote:

>

> I haven't found that the CLOG the pores... the only thing that I've

found

> that does a job like that in the oil department is Mineral oil... YUCK!