Guest guest Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Lisa, What you are describing is, most probably, an extremely depleted patient (most probably Liver Blood and Kidney Yin Vacuous).  Such a condition will often damage the Shen as well.  In such a patient your main treatment should be with herbs, using acupuncture to gently support the Yin and Blood, and calm the Shen.  Women tend to be more vulnerable to depletion to begin with because of menstrual loss of blood, but Western infertility treatments tend to exacerbate things, sort of like kicking a workhorse that is exhausted, it may go a few more steps, but will soon collapse.  Even if she was blessed with a healthy child, the price that she has paid with her health is significant.  I have treated a number of women with symptoms and conditions such as you describe, and many have described themselves as being very sensitive, or as raw.  The electric sensation that she describes is consistant with this rawness.  However, you do need to be careful with needling such patients.  Since, as I'm sure her pulses and tongue will indicate, she is so severely blood Xu, you must be careful to supplement and only gently move the blood, as you have done, with superficial insertion for a very short time.  Also, I would work with an experienced CranioSacral therapist, to further promote this process.  You didn't do anything wrong, but she must receive herbal medicine and dietary guidance to rebuild herself. Reassure her that you are a medical practitioner with advanced training in Chinese medicine and acupuncture, you know what you are doing, and that what the MD said to her as absolutely incorrect.  Acupuncture is completely safe and absolutely promotes healing when administered by a trained practitioner, which you are.  Ask her to challenge the MD to contact you directly, and tell her that you are going to ask him to produce studies demonstrating his contention.  It's an slanderous lie and he's just being a bully.  If he's challenged, I'm sure he'll back down.  Good luck, , candidate, DAOMÂ\  --- On Tue, 8/18/09, Lisa Smith <fudge_lisa wrote: Lisa Smith <fudge_lisa Nerve damage " TCM " <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 7:03 PM I have a case I would like some feedback on - I am a relatively new practitioner and have never had this experience Last week a 43 y/o woman called in " crisis " because she said she had not slept in one month. About a year ago she went through infertility treatments (using both western and eastern medicine) and was able to get pregnant and carry to term and then the baby was still born. She was very traumatized and quickly developed insomnia, depression and anxiety. She was taking Ambien for almost a year and then it stopped working - she switched her to a different sleep medication (I don't have the name with me right now) and she had what seemed to be a toxic response to the meds (her veins enlarged and were distended and more visible, she had night sweats, headaches, nausea, red rash under her skin) She only took 2 doses. She then developed IBS and has lost 10 lbs in one month because she has diarrhea right after she eats anything. She has dull headaches all the time. She is very thin and I took this into account (I am a shallow needler and use 16 or 18 gauge needles) I called to follow up the day after the treatment (Thurs) and she said she slept 6 hours - but the evening of the treatment had severe cramping in her abdomen. She was going to come in Sat for a treatment but cancelled because she was having shortness of breath and was having more difficultly catching her breath when she was lying down. She was also feeling dizzy. She recently had lab work and everything was normal. I just spoke with her and since Sat she has seen her primary care doc who has referred her to see a neurologist. The MD told her that acupuncture can cause nerve damage and that is probably what happened. She says it feels like electricity is coursing through her body. She feels like there is no connection to her bladder. She is sleeping better but feels like there is nerve pain/sensation all over her body. I have never experienced this before and am curious if anyone has seen this as a side effect - and if so, what has been the result? Thank you for your feedback. Lisa _______________ Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you’re up to on Facebook. http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:\ en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 19, 2009 Report Share Posted August 19, 2009 Very well said, Yehuda. I couldn't believe what I was reading about the MD's assertion that acupuncture causes nerve damage. Also, I agree there is lot of mental depletion over this. I have treated women who have gone through these types of losses. Sometimes just taking a deep breath and holding a space for her, just where she is, can bring her some calm. Of course, treat the physical depletions Yehuda is describing while you do this. Anne Anne C. Crowley, L.Ac., Dipl.Ac. www.LaPlataAcupuncture.com - " yehuda frischman " < " Traditional " <Chinese Medicine > Wednesday, August 19, 2009 2:23:16 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Re:  Nerve damage?  boloney!  Lisa, What you are describing is, most probably, an extremely depleted patient (most probably Liver Blood and Kidney Yin Vacuous).  Such a condition will often damage the Shen as well.  In such a patient your main treatment should be with herbs, using acupuncture to gently support the Yin and Blood, and calm the Shen.  Women tend to be more vulnerable to depletion to begin with because of menstrual loss of blood, but Western infertility treatments tend to exacerbate things, sort of like kicking a workhorse that is exhausted, it may go a few more steps, but will soon collapse.  Even if she was blessed with a healthy child, the price that she has paid with her health is significant.  I have treated a number of women with symptoms and conditions such as you describe, and many have described themselves as being very sensitive, or as raw.  The electric sensation that she describes is consistant with this rawness.  However, you do need to be careful with needling such patients.  Since, as I'm sure her pulses and tongue will indicate, she is so severely blood Xu, you must be careful to supplement and only gently move the blood, as you have done, with superficial insertion for a very short time.  Also, I would work with an experienced CranioSacral therapist, to further promote this process.  You didn't do anything wrong, but she must receive herbal medicine and dietary guidance to rebuild herself. Reassure her that you are a medical practitioner with advanced training in Chinese medicine and acupuncture, you know what you are doing, and that what the MD said to her as absolutely incorrect.  Acupuncture is completely safe and absolutely promotes healing when administered by a trained practitioner, which you are.  Ask her to challenge the MD to contact you directly, and tell her that you are going to ask him to produce studies demonstrating his contention.  It's an slanderous lie and he's just being a bully.  If he's challenged, I'm sure he'll back down.  Good luck, , candidate, DAOMÂ\  --- On Tue, 8/18/09, Lisa Smith < fudge_lisa > wrote: Lisa Smith < fudge_lisa > Nerve damage " TCM " < Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tuesday, August 18, 2009, 7:03 PM I have a case I would like some feedback on - I am a relatively new practitioner and have never had this experience Last week a 43 y/o woman called in " crisis " because she said she had not slept in one month. About a year ago she went through infertility treatments (using both western and eastern medicine) and was able to get pregnant and carry to term and then the baby was still born. She was very traumatized and quickly developed insomnia, depression and anxiety. She was taking Ambien for almost a year and then it stopped working - she switched her to a different sleep medication (I don't have the name with me right now) and she had what seemed to be a toxic response to the meds (her veins enlarged and were distended and more visible, she had night sweats, headaches, nausea, red rash under her skin) She only took 2 doses. She then developed IBS and has lost 10 lbs in one month because she has diarrhea right after she eats anything. She has dull headaches all the time. She is very thin and I took this into account (I am a shallow needler and use 16 or 18 gauge needles) I called to follow up the day after the treatment (Thurs) and she said she slept 6 hours - but the evening of the treatment had severe cramping in her abdomen. She was going to come in Sat for a treatment but cancelled because she was having shortness of breath and was having more difficultly catching her breath when she was lying down. She was also feeling dizzy. She recently had lab work and everything was normal. I just spoke with her and since Sat she has seen her primary care doc who has referred her to see a neurologist. The MD told her that acupuncture can cause nerve damage and that is probably what happened. She says it feels like electricity is coursing through her body. She feels like there is no connection to her bladder. She is sleeping better but feels like there is nerve pain/sensation all over her body. I have never experienced this before and am curious if anyone has seen this as a side effect - and if so, what has been the result? Thank you for your feedback. Lisa ________ Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you’re up to on Facebook. http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:\ en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.