Guest guest Posted July 25, 2009 Report Share Posted July 25, 2009 I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Hello Dr. Zare, This is usually a damp head condition and Iv'e used Long Dan Xie Gan Tang? with success in several dogs and cats. And as strange as this may seem - I've done ear candling on my dogs? - you must of course be very careful not to burn them - but they lay still so I assume it must have provided relief.? I did it twice in each ear - 2 times a week.? It cleared up in three weeks - but must stay on top of it - also cleaned out the ears with organic apple cider vinegar twice a day. You must also watch the diet - if the stool is very smelly? - it indicates too much heat and you need to change foods.? I feed my dogs? and cats an all natural diet - on the few times I didn't have time and gave them an? all natural dried food their stool smell was unbearable - you really notice it with cats because of the litter box . Any questions-? you can contact me off line. Mary Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 royam68 <royam68 Chinese Medicine Sat, Jul 25, 2009 10:22 am Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 My golden/setter gets this from time to time and i use yin care topically in addition to the long dan and seems to be the only thing to work. good luck! J. Bedrosian LMBT (NC#3259) Advanced Massage Therapy 704-578-6245 nrgcreator live long & love strong ________________________________ Mary Chamberlain <acumary Chinese Medicine Monday, July 27, 2009 12:06:19 PM Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hello Dr. Zare, This is usually a damp head condition and Iv'e used Long Dan Xie Gan Tang? with success in several dogs and cats. And as strange as this may seem - I've done ear candling on my dogs? - you must of course be very careful not to burn them - but they lay still so I assume it must have provided relief.? I did it twice in each ear - 2 times a week.? It cleared up in three weeks - but must stay on top of it - also cleaned out the ears with organic apple cider vinegar twice a day. You must also watch the diet - if the stool is very smelly? - it indicates too much heat and you need to change foods.? I feed my dogs? and cats an all natural diet - on the few times I didn't have time and gave them an? all natural dried food their stool smell was unbearable - you really notice it with cats because of the litter box . Any questions-? you can contact me off line. Mary Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 royam68 <royam68 > Sat, Jul 25, 2009 10:22 am Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 27, 2009 Report Share Posted July 27, 2009 Hello - I sent this post out earlier - but I do not understand who went through and put all the question marks in my email - The question marks do not make sense.??? Is this usual?? Does someone go through and change punctuation?? If you have an issue with what I wrote then just please say so. Thank you, Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Mary Chamberlain <acumary Chinese Medicine Mon, Jul 27, 2009 12:06 pm Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hello Dr. Zare, This is usually a damp head condition and Iv'e used Long Dan Xie Gan Tang? with success in several dogs and cats. And as strange as this may seem - I've done ear candling on my dogs? - you must of course be very careful not to burn them - but they lay still so I assume it must have provided relief.? I did it twice in each ear - 2 times a week.? It cleared up in three weeks - but must stay on top of it - also cleaned out the ears with organic apple cider vinegar twice a day. You must also watch the diet - if the stool is very smelly? - it indicates too much heat and you need to change foods.? I feed my dogs? and cats an all natural diet - on the few times I didn't have time and gave them an? all natural dried food their stool smell was unbearable - you really notice it with cats because of the litter box . Any questions-? you can contact me off line. Mary Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 royam68 <royam68 Chinese Medicine Sat, Jul 25, 2009 10:22 am Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 If you are suggesting giving the dog garlic I would not.? Although garlic has been used in the past, it is now consider toxic to dogs as it is in the onion family and onions are very toxic to pets.? Onions and garlic contain the toxic ingredient thiosulphate. ? At least four years ago holistic vets started? warning against feeding dogs garlic.? There may be some controversy on this but I would not take the chance.? Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Mercurius Trismegistus <magisterium_magnum Chinese Medicine Mon, Jul 27, 2009 9:35 pm Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Try colloidal silver. Would he eat garlic or coconut? - " royam68 " <royam68 <Chinese Medicine > Saturday, July 25, 2009 7:22 AM Dog with chronic otitis externa >I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. >First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and >puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. > I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen > dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of > other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. > One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! > > She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know > something about the treatment. > Thanks. > > Dr Zare > > > > --- > > Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times > http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com > > Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine > and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia > > > and adjust > accordingly. > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group > requires prior permission from the author. > > Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Try colloidal silver. Would he eat garlic or coconut? - " royam68 " <royam68 <Chinese Medicine > Saturday, July 25, 2009 7:22 AM Dog with chronic otitis externa >I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. >First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and >puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. > I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen > dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of > other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. > One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! > > She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know > something about the treatment. > Thanks. > > Dr Zare > > > > --- > > Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times > http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com > > Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine > and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia > > > and adjust > accordingly. > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group > requires prior permission from the author. > > Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Hi - this is Mary Chamberlain again - is the moderator adding question marks to my post? (this is my question mark) ?Perhaps there is a language problem here, but it is irritating? to have your punctuation changed so that it doesn't make sense. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Mary Chamberlain <acumary Chinese Medicine Mon, Jul 27, 2009 7:59 pm Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa If you are suggesting giving the dog garlic I would not.? Although garlic has been used in the past, it is now consider toxic to dogs as it is in the onion family and onions are very toxic to pets.? Onions and garlic contain the toxic ingredient thiosulphate. ? At least four years ago holistic vets started? warning against feeding dogs garlic.? There may be some controversy on this but I would not take the chance.? Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Mercurius Trismegistus <magisterium_magnum Chinese Medicine Mon, Jul 27, 2009 9:35 pm Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Try colloidal silver. Would he eat garlic or coconut? - " royam68 " <royam68 <Chinese Medicine > Saturday, July 25, 2009 7:22 AM Dog with chronic otitis externa >I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. >First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and >puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. > I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen > dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of > other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. > One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! > > She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know > something about the treatment. > Thanks. > > Dr Zare > > > > --- > > Subscribe to the free online journal for TCM at Times > http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com > > Help build the world's largest online encyclopedia for Chinese medicine > and acupuncture, click, http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/wiki/CMTpedia > > > and adjust > accordingly. > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group > requires prior permission from the author. > > Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn's website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 2009 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare _______________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 28, 2009 Report Share Posted July 28, 2009 Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before the vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 2009 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare _______________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > > > " Hello - I sent this post out earlier - but I do not understand who went through and put all the question marks in my email - The question marks do not make sense.??? Is this usual?? " Hi Mary all kinds of weird things sneak into posts here ... funny little hieroglyphs, question marks... I wouldn't worry about it... I'm sure it's some techno-thing. Someone who knows about stuff like this may know why. Dr Zare I once saw improvement in a human with chronic stinky-foul discharge from a painless ear using the following remedy - a bit fiddly, but worth a try, especially if nothing else is working. Ingredients: 1 large brown onion medicinal honey - such as Manuka - though any raw honey will do. Frankincense and Myrrh essential oils Method Slice the onion completely in two - across the fattest part - so you have a large surface area. Slice the opposite end off, very close to the tip or base. Score the larger cut surface with multiple deep cuts. Place the onion in a very clean cup or jar so it is suspended by the rim - you might like to rinse the jar or cup with boiled water, and dry it off in an oven first, to minimise risk of mould or other bugs growing in your 'brew'. Cover the scored area of onion with a generous smear of honey. Leave to rest. The honey will work its way through the onion, drawing juice with it as it goes, ultimately dripping through the smaller cut end into your receptacle. Repeat the honey process until no more juice is coming through the base of the onion. Depending on the volume of juice, you might like to decant the honey-onion solution into a small ultra-clean bottle. Add the Frankincense and Myrrh - 10 drops of each, and give it a good shake. Viola! You now have an ear drop solution with ingredients which are known to be anti-inflammatory, astringent, with some broad-spectrum activity against bacteria and fungi. If this combination isn't affecting change, you could add Tea Tree essential oil to the recipe. One must vigorously shake the ear drop mixture before use, to disperse the oils throughout, and obviously never place the dropper or pipette used in the ear, into the solution or bottle. We don't want to be contaminating the solution with whatever is in a patient's ears. ie no double dipping! Am also wondering if an ear wash solution made from decocted Lonicera [jin hua] & Forsythia [lain qiao] might help. I've previously used this to irrigate my cat's abcesses. Alternatively, an ear wash made from the ingredients in the patent formula - Coptis & Scute [Huang Lian Jie Du Wan] might also be useful. Veterinarians might have an opinion about this, as I'm guessing the ear canals need to be kept as dry as possible. I'd be thinking about using a warm ear wash once daily, and the 'onion' ear drops 3 times / day. Hope this helps. Margi http://margihealing.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Hi Margi, Thanks for the info about aol? - it was annoying - Anyway - I have a question - Since onions are very? toxic to dogs wouldn't this wash be dangerous?? I would think that some of the onion juice would be absorbed through the skin - I just don't think that I'd want to take a chance when there are other things that work. I've seen dogs have a violent reaction to meat that was cooked in onion powder and this would be much stronger. Any Vets who can weigh in on this? And while on the subject of toxic reactions - I almost lost my cat to a drug called Metacam - it's a NSAID similar to Viox that was taken off the market for people.? My cat had a bladder infection and was given Metacam for pain -? after 2 doses of Metacam he went into Kidney Failure - Over a Thousand Dollars? and more, he pulled through - the Vet says it's safe for cats but there are many websites with horrific stories about this drug which is not FDA approved for Cats - anyway - just a warning. Mary Chamberlain,MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Dr Zare I once saw improvement in a human with chronic stinky-foul discharge from a painless ear using the following remedy - a bit fiddly, but worth a try, especially if nothing else is working. Ingredients: 1 large brown onion medicinal honey - such as Manuka - though any raw honey will do. Frankincense and Myrrh essential oils Method Slice the onion completely in two - across the fattest part - so you have a large surface area. Slice the opposite end off, very close to the tip or base. Score the larger cut surface with multiple deep cuts. Place the onion in a very clean cup or jar so it is suspended by the rim - you might like to rinse the jar or cup with boiled water, and dry it off in an oven first, to minimise risk of mould or other bugs growing in your 'brew'. Cover the scored area of onion with a generous smear of honey. Leave to rest. The honey will work its way through the onion, drawing juice with it as it goes, ultimately dripping through the smaller cut end into your receptacle. Repeat the honey process until no more juice is coming through the base of the onion. Depending on the volume of juice, you might like to decant the honey-onion solution into a small ultra-clean bottle. Add the Frankincense and Myrrh - 10 drops of each, and give it a good shake. Viola! You now have an ear drop solution with ingredients which are known to be anti-inflammatory, astringent, with some broad-spectrum activity against bacteria and fungi. If this combination isn't affecting change, you could add Tea Tree essential oil to the recipe. One must vigorously shake the ear drop mixture before use, to disperse the oils throughout, and obviously never place the dropper or pipette used in the ear, into the solution or bottle. We don't want to be contaminating the solution with whatever is in a patient's ears. ie no double dipping! Am also wondering if an ear wash solution made from decocted Lonicera [jin hua] & Forsythia [lain qiao] might help. I've previously used this to irrigate my cat's abcesses. Alternatively, an ear wash made from the ingredients in the patent formula - Coptis & Scute [Huang Lian Jie Du Wan] might also be useful. Veterinarians might have an opinion about this, as I'm guessing the ear canals need to be kept as dry as possible. I'd be thinking about using a warm ear wash once daily, and the 'onion' ear drops 3 times / day. Hope this helps. Margi http://margihealing.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Ah, I know Dr. Marty, I interviewed with him for a position. I agree with you and hair should not be plucked. If only thuja was the ticket for all vaccinosis. I have had a well trained herbalist tell me the triple burner heat is why we get those soupy ears. I know the AC points all around the ear would be helpful TH 17! And the food, yes, the food allergies are out there especially to corn. Activated Quetercin helps in food allergies, also feeding organic raw food diet. Putting anything in the ear that isn't a mild astringent, like witch hazel is a problem. Anything that stays wet, doesn't remove the grease,wax, inflamation is just another aggravation for the patient. I have had herbal products from Jing Tang not work better than Witch Hazel. The immune cells at the islets around the ears are paying hell for the inflamatory response. Anything that removes heat toxins should be helpful and find another groomer. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:11:31 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before the vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 2009 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare ________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Hi Patricia, I do like Witch Hazel - but I like Apple Cider Vinegar even more -I don't put any herbal formulas in the ears - just Long Dan XIe Gan Tang - liquid by Kan - dropper by mouth or in the food - I don't continue to vaccinate after the first puppy shot - but I do feel that there may also be an energetic vaccinosis from parents - I'm up near Saratoga Springs - and the racetrack - I've spoken to Vets who care for the racehorses and they feel that Steroids and HGH have an enegetic effect on the offspring.- (of course everyone denies using them) But that this is the reason that we see so many broken legs in the sport. I have had several homeopathic consultations with Pitcairn's clinic - but for pure homepathy I go to Dr. Tobin in Ct. I really don't have much of a problem with the ears if I watch the diet - however I will say that if my pets are under stress - I'm traveling or such - it will flare up. If you're interested there is a Dr. Lighthouse in Los Angeles - he is one of the few vets who also is a licensed acupunturist and herbalist - he went through the whole program about 20 years again and is fantastic when it come to herbal prescriptions for animals. Hopefully Dr. Zare will keep us updated on the Spaniel Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Sent: Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Ah, I know Dr. Marty, I interviewed with him for a position. I agree with you and hair should not be plucked. If only thuja was the ticket for all vaccinosis. I have had a well trained herbalist tell me the triple burner heat is why we get those soupy ears. I know the AC points all around the ear would be helpful TH 17! And the food, yes, the food allergies are out there especially to corn. Activated Quetercin helps in food allergies, also feeding organic raw food diet. Putting anything in the ear that isn't a mild astringent, like witch hazel is a problem. Anything that stays wet, doesn't remove the grease,wax, inflamation is just another aggravation for the patient. I have had herbal products from Jing Tang not work better than Witch Hazel. The immune cells at the islets around the ears are paying hell for the inflamatory response. Anything that removes heat toxins should be helpful and find another groomer. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:11:31 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before the vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 200 9 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare ________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > " If you are suggesting giving the dog garlic I would not.? Although garlic has been used in the past, it is now consider toxic to dogs as it is in the onion family and onions are very toxic to pets.? Onions and garlic contain the toxic ingredient thiosulphate. ? At least four years ago holistic vets started? warning against feeding dogs garlic.? There may be some controversy on this but I would not take the chance.? " Gosh! Is it dose-dependent? Are the biochemical pathways and metabolites the same for ingestion as for topical application? In humans it's actually very difficult to 'make' the skin absorb anything in measurable quantities, its quite a protective barrier. We often encounter similar cautionary thinking in the aromatherapy / aromatic medicine world. A number of essential oils have empirically been - incorrectly - assigned the same kinds of toxicity as the whole herb, or the herbal extracts that end up in tinctures. The profile of herbal chemical functional groups is very different in essential oils, compared to the whole herb, or a tincture, or a decoction - due to the molecular weight of molecules, whether they're soluble in oil or water etc etc The safety of any 'natural' substance is always going to depend upon preparation & extraction processes, presence of synergistic matter, route of administration, dose, frequency of use etc, preceded of course, by a correct diagnosis. Just think of aconite in TCM. So I shall qualify my onion-honey-frankincense-myrrh-ear drop post by restating it worked in one human; and add that safety and efficacy in dogs is unknown. Margi http://margihealing.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Margi, I'm sure it was fine in humans but I would not take a chance with my pet - knowing that onions are toxic to them.? As for absorbing it through the skin? - some flea and tick medications are given once a month on the skin - suggesting successful absorption.? Many human medications are given topically. Being the largest organ in the body - I do not consider the skin that much of a protective barrier or we wouldn't have so many cases of diseases caused by pesticides or so many cases of dermatitis. I also know that gynecologists are very cautious with pregnant woman as to what creams they may use - many advise against using hair dye..? I haven't? done the research and I do not know the statistics - and I also don't need to be right - I have no desire to argue about it - the point of this site is to share. information.? I have spent years studying holistic treatments and nutrition for dogs and when it comes to my beloved animals I am very cautious -? I would not give them anything with onions when there are things to use that are safer.? I can tell you that while that are many studies available on how to? safely use aconi in humans - there are no studies on safe ways to use onions in dogs. Margi wrote Gosh! Is it dose-dependent? Are the biochemical pathways and metabolites the same for ingestion as for topical application? In humans it's actually very difficult to 'make' the skin absorb anything in measurable quantities, its quite a protective barrier. We often encounter similar cautionary thinking in the aromatherapy / aromatic medicine world. A number of essential oils have empirically been - incorrectly - assigned the same kinds of toxicity as the whole herb, or the herbal extracts that end up in tinctures. The profile of herbal chemical functional groups is very different in essential oils, compared to the whole herb, or a tincture, or a decoction - due to the molecular weight of molecules, whether they're soluble in oil or water etc etc The safety of any 'natural' substance is always going to depend upon preparation & extraction processes, presence of synergistic matter, route of administration, dose, frequency of use etc, preceded of course, by a correct diagnosis. Just think of aconite in TCM. So I shall qualify my onion-honey- frankincense-myrrh-ear drop post by restating it worked in one human; and add that safety and efficacy in dogs is unknown. Margi Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 margi.macdonald <margi.macdonald Chinese Medicine Wed, Jul 29, 2009 6:09 pm Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > " If you are suggesting giving the dog garlic I would not.? Although garlic has been used in the past, it is now consider toxic to dogs as it is in the onion family and onions are very toxic to pets.? Onions and garlic contain the toxic ingredient thiosulphate. ? At least four years ago holistic vets started? warning against feeding dogs garlic.? There may be some controversy on this but I would not take the chance.? " http://margihealing.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Thanks but I already am certified and not only at a licensed Doctor of Veterinary Medicine but in TCVM as well through Chi Institute. www.tcvm.com and almost finished my Masters. I have also advanced training with Dr. Richard Pitcairn and don't mix the modalities but feel confident in my training there as well. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:04:06 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I do like Witch Hazel - but I like Apple Cider Vinegar even more -I don't put any herbal formulas in the ears - just Long Dan XIe Gan Tang - liquid by Kan - dropper by mouth or in the food - I don't continue to vaccinate after the first puppy shot - but I do feel that there may also be an energetic vaccinosis from parents - I'm up near Saratoga Springs - and the racetrack - I've spoken to Vets who care for the racehorses and they feel that Steroids and HGH have an enegetic effect on the offspring.- (of course everyone denies using them) But that this is the reason that we see so many broken legs in the sport. I have had several homeopathic consultations with Pitcairn's clinic - but for pure homepathy I go to Dr. Tobin in Ct. I really don't have much of a problem with the ears if I watch the diet - however I will say that if my pets are under stress - I'm traveling or such - it will flare up. If you're interested there is a Dr. Lighthouse in Los Angeles - he is one of the few vets who also is a licensed acupunturist and herbalist - he went through the whole program about 20 years again and is fantastic when it come to herbal prescriptions for animals. Hopefully Dr. Zare will keep us updated on the Spaniel Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Sent: Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Ah, I know Dr. Marty, I interviewed with him for a position. I agree with you and hair should not be plucked. If only thuja was the ticket for all vaccinosis. I have had a well trained herbalist tell me the triple burner heat is why we get those soupy ears. I know the AC points all around the ear would be helpful TH 17! And the food, yes, the food allergies are out there especially to corn. Activated Quetercin helps in food allergies, also feeding organic raw food diet. Putting anything in the ear that isn't a mild astringent, like witch hazel is a problem. Anything that stays wet, doesn't remove the grease,wax, inflamation is just another aggravation for the patient. I have had herbal products from Jing Tang not work better than Witch Hazel. The immune cells at the islets around the ears are paying hell for the inflamatory response. Anything that removes heat toxins should be helpful and find another groomer. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:11:31 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before the vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 200 9 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare ________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Hi Patricia, Didn't mean to offend you - just sharing info on other vets that might be of interest to you - I myself like to know who is is out there and what they're doing - I've found that people have been very helpful if I've called for help on a patient so I keep my contact list and their research up to date - there is always more to learn - at least that is my opinion. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Thu, Jul 30, 2009 2:40 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Thanks but I already am certified and not only at a licensed Doctor of Veterinary Medicine but in TCVM as well through Chi Institute. www.tcvm.com and almost finished my Masters. I have also advanced training with Dr. Richard Pitcairn and don't mix the modalities but feel confident in my training there as well. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:04:06 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I do like Witch Hazel - but I like Apple Cider Vinegar even more -I don't put any herbal formulas in the ears - just Long Dan XIe Gan Tang - liquid by Kan - dropper by mouth or in the food - I don't continue to vaccinate=2 0 after the first puppy shot - but I do feel that there may also be an energetic vaccinosis from parents - I'm up near Saratoga Springs - and the racetrack - I've spoken to Vets who care for the racehorses and they feel that Steroids and HGH have an enegetic effect on the offspring.- (of course everyone denies using them) But that this is the reason that we see so many broken legs in the sport. I have had several homeopathic consultations with Pitcairn's clinic - but for pure homepathy I go to Dr. Tobin in Ct. I really don't have much of a problem with the ears if I watch the diet - however I will say that if my pets are under stress - I'm traveling or such - it will flare up. If you're interested there is a Dr. Lighthouse in Los Angeles - he is one of the few vets who also is a licensed acupunturist and herbalist - he went through the whole program about 20 years again and is fantastic when it come to herbal prescriptions for animals. Hopefully Dr. Zare will keep us updated on the Spaniel Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Sent: Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Ah, I know Dr. Marty, I interviewed with him for a position. I agree with you and hair should not be plucked. If only thuja was the ticket for all vaccinosis. I have had a well trained herbalist tell me the triple burner heat is why we get those soupy ears. I know the AC points all around the ear would be helpful TH 17! And the food, yes, the food allergies are out there especially to corn. Activated Quetercin helps in food allergies, also feeding organic raw food diet. Putting anything in the ear that isn't a mild astringent, like witch hazel is a problem. Anything that stays wet, doesn't remove the grease,wax, inflamation is just another aggravation for the patient. I have had herbal products from Jing Tang not work better than Witch Hazel. The immune cells at the islets around the ears are paying hell for the inflamatory response. Anything that removes heat toxins should be helpful and find another groomer. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:11:31 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before th e vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 200 9 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare ________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 no ooffense, just many do not know we have a very authentic 100 % Chinese TCVM program here in the US and we are very lucky to have Dr. Xie here with us, not in CHina where he could have stayed. The program is great for fostering world involvement and we all go back and forth to China to study and......our degrees and certifications are also through the South China University of Agriculture.Most of those who came before had no place to turn for authentic TCVM training. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:06:27 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, Didn't mean to offend you - just sharing info on other vets that might be of interest to you - I myself like to know who is is out there and what they're doing - I've found that people have been very helpful if I've called for help on a patient so I keep my contact list and their research up to date - there is always more to learn - at least that is my opinion. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Thu, Jul 30, 2009 2:40 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Thanks but I already am certified and not only at a licensed Doctor of Veterinary Medicine but in TCVM as well through Chi Institute. www.tcvm.com and almost finished my Masters. I have also advanced training with Dr. Richard Pitcairn and don't mix the modalities but feel confident in my training there as well. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:04:06 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I do like Witch Hazel - but I like Apple Cider Vinegar even more -I don't put any herbal formulas in the ears - just Long Dan XIe Gan Tang - liquid by Kan - dropper by mouth or in the food - I don't continue to vaccinate=2 0 after the first puppy shot - but I do feel that there may also be an energetic vaccinosis from parents - I'm up near Saratoga Springs - and the racetrack - I've spoken to Vets who care for the racehorses and they feel that Steroids and HGH have an enegetic effect on the offspring.- (of course everyone denies using them) But that this is the reason that we see so many broken legs in the sport. I have had several homeopathic consultations with Pitcairn's clinic - but for pure homepathy I go to Dr. Tobin in Ct. I really don't have much of a problem with the ears if I watch the diet - however I will say that if my pets are under stress - I'm traveling or such - it will flare up. If you're interested there is a Dr. Lighthouse in Los Angeles - he is one of the few vets who also is a licensed acupunturist and herbalist - he went through the whole program about 20 years again and is fantastic when it come to herbal prescriptions for animals. Hopefully Dr. Zare will keep us updated on the Spaniel Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Sent: Wed, Jul 29, 2009 4:04 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa Ah, I know Dr. Marty, I interviewed with him for a position. I agree with you and hair should not be plucked. If only thuja was the ticket for all vaccinosis. I have had a well trained herbalist tell me the triple burner heat is why we get those soupy ears. I know the AC points all around the ear would be helpful TH 17! And the food, yes, the food allergies are out there especially to corn. Activated Quetercin helps in food allergies, also feeding organic raw food diet. Putting anything in the ear that isn't a mild astringent, like witch hazel is a problem. Anything that stays wet, doesn't remove the grease,wax, inflamation is just another aggravation for the patient. I have had herbal products from Jing Tang not work better than Witch Hazel. The immune cells at the islets around the ears are paying hell for the inflamatory response. Anything that removes heat toxins should be helpful and find another groomer. Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine acumary Tue, 28 Jul 2009 15:11:31 -0400 Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Hi Patricia, I agree with you - but I didn't vaccinate except for the first puppy shot -I do titers and my dog at 7 years is still protected - however I suspect that the problem may be inherited - Still if I use prepared foods I have problems with the ears. The other thing is if I have my dog groomed and they remove the hair from the ears it will cause problems - the local vet and the groomers say that the hair should be removed but I feel that the hair protects them. I used Micel A before th e vaccination and Thuja afterwards - Dr. Marty Goldstein is my holistic vet. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 Patricia Jordan <coastalcatclinic traditional chinese med <Chinese Traditional Medicine > Tue, Jul 28, 2009 12:55 pm RE: Dog with chronic otitis externa The vaccinations gave your dog the problem and the pharmaceuticals will not lead to cure.........the vaccines cause immune responses and the cells of langerhans involved are in the ears, eyes (tear ducts) above all four feet and the anal glands and in the pancreas. Vaccines do not protect your dog from disease, rather they cause increased IgE class switching and sensitized T cells. They also destroy the immune cells in the pancreas as well. Pharmaceuticals are suprressive and aplliative but not curing. I suggest you find a well qualified veterinary homeopath from Dr. Richard Pitcairn' s website and see about having your dogs vaccinosis cleared. Clearing chronic disease is not as simple as inoculating into them...... Sincerely, Patricia Jordan DVM,CVA,CTCVM & Herbology Chinese Medicine royam68 Sat, 25 Jul 200 9 14:22:23 +0000 Dog with chronic otitis externa I have a 4 years old dog, with a 7 months otitis externa in both ears. First it was in her right ear, then in both. She has pain, tenderness and puss drainage, smells bad and shakes her head continuously. I have tried different ear cleansers, like a mixture of propanol+ hydrogen dioxide+ gentian violet for every day cleaning for 2 weeks, and a few of other cleaners, and also otosporin drops, with no positive result. One month oral antibiotic amoxicillin was useless!! She's still suffering. Please help my poor Gold Spaniel, if you know something about the treatment. Thanks. Dr Zare ________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®: Celebrate the moment with your favorite sports pics. Check it out. http://www.windowslive.com/Online/Hotmail/Campaign/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_QA\ _HM_sports_photos_072009 & cat=sports Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 2009 Report Share Posted August 1, 2009 Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > > Margi, > > I'm sure it was fine in humans but I would not take a chance with my pet - knowing that onions are toxic to them.? As for absorbing it through the skin? - some flea and tick medications are given once a month on the skin - suggesting successful absorption.? Many human medications are given topically. > > Being the largest organ in the body - I do not consider the skin that much of a protective barrier or we wouldn't have so many cases of diseases caused by pesticides or so many cases of dermatitis. Hi Mary Hi All 'successful' absorption of anything through the skin is dependent upon disruption of dermal lipids, the epidermis, the dermis etc. The molecules then still have to be small enough to pass into the vessels of the capillary bed. Topically administered medications - such as via patches - are through carefully constructed membranes, and the medications often contain substances which have been designed to disrupt the lipids and cellular activity of the epidermis and dermis. Medicines and in-dwelling gizmos [ such as the latest IUCDs which release hormones ] which are in contact with mucous membranes definitely have a greater chance of systemic absorption, due to the type of tissue activity of mucous membranes. The skin remains a very protective barrier against most 'naturally' occcuring substances in their unprocessed state, and it is definitely the case that pesticides and all number of human-made chemicals will be absorbed - they've usually been designed to do just that - including those topical meds our pets are offered for flea and worm control. I've continued to respond along this thread, because it's a fascinating subject, and because any of us as herbalists are on the threshold of an explosion of greater knowledge about herbal medicines. We have to stay as educated about this stuff as allopaths. If we don't, they'll muscle-in on what we do, claiming 'science' on their side as somehow superior to empiricism. Margi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 I'm sure you're right - have you heard the expression Dead Right - are you really trying to convince the doctor to use your treatment? ..? When there are safe alternatives why would anyone take that risk - I have seen a dog die from eating an onion -? it's beyond me why he ate it but I also saw a dog who not only ate an entire bottle of Tylenol - but the plastic bottle itself.? I would never put something known to be toxic into the very Vascular ear of a dog. In addition dogs with this condition will scratch at their ears - perhaps get the mixture on their paws and lick it off - so you would have to put an Elizabethan collar around the dog which would very likely irritate the base of the ear. This has nothing to do with staying educated -you want to debate - so? please tell us why the Doctor should use your treatment over others that have been suggested - your suggestion worked for one person - why should we try it on dogs when onions are known to be toxic to dogs?? If you want to debate - please defend your treatment - not attack others. Mary Chamberlain, MS, LAc. 518-798-8899 margi.macdonald <margi.macdonald Chinese Medicine Sat, Aug 1, 2009 3:27 am Re: Dog with chronic otitis externa Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > > Margi, > > I'm sure it was fine in humans but I would not take a chance with my pet - knowing that onions are toxic to them.? As for absorbing it through the skin? - some flea and tick medications are given once a month on the skin - suggesting successful absorption.? Many human medications are given topically. > > Being the largest organ in the body - I do not consider the skin that much of a protective barrier or we wouldn't have so many cases of diseases caused by pesticides or so many cases of dermatitis. Hi Mary Hi All 'successful' absorption of anything through the skin is dependent upon disruption of dermal lipids, the epidermis, the dermis etc. The molecules then still have to be small enough to pass into the vessels of the capillary bed. Topically administered medications - such as via patches - are through carefully constructed membranes, and the medications often contain substances which have been designed to disrupt the lipids and cellular activity of the epidermis and dermis. Medicines and in-dwelling gizmos [ such as the latest IUCDs which release hormones ] which are in contact with mucous membranes definitely have a greater chance of systemic absorption, due to the type of tissue activity of mucous membranes. The skin remains a very protective barrier against most 'naturally' occcuring substances in their unprocessed state, and it is definitely the case that pesticides and all number of human-made chemicals will be absorbed - they've usually been designed to do just that - including those topical meds our pets are offered for flea and worm control. I've continued to respond along this thread, because it's a fascinating subject, and because any of us as herbalists are on the threshold of an explosion of greater knowledge about herbal medicines. We have to stay as educated about this stuff as allopaths. If we don't, they'll muscle-in on what we do, claiming 'science' on their side as somehow superior to empiricism. Margi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2009 Report Share Posted August 3, 2009 Chinese Medicine , Mary Chamberlain <acumary wrote: > > > I'm sure you're right - have you heard the expression Dead Right - are you really trying to convince the doctor to use your treatment? > Too right. Dead right. She'll be Right Mate. All fabulous colloquialisms of my country-men and women. Onions aint necessarily onions in this particular context. Medicating any mammal via ingestion, injection, subcutaneous, sublingual, intranasal, auricular modes of delivery is dependent upon the state the substance is in, and whether it can be metabolized. It's possible that dogs' livers may metabolize onions and onion by-products into a toxin. Paracetamol in large doses destroys human livers too, yet in correct therapeutic dose, administered properly, it's often a safer drug in humans than aspirin. Yet aspirin will kill a cat. I haven't ever insisted that onion ear drops are appropriate for dogs. I have stated twice that the remedy worked in one human, and clarified that safety and efficacy is unknown in dogs in a subsequent post. I'm imagining the owner of the dog will then make use of all generously proffered input in this forum, no doubt seek the treating veterinarian's opinion, and then proceed with an appropriate course of action. Persuading doctors to use 'my' treatments? Heck no! Few doctors understand them! Talking to doctors about herbal and natural medicine is a tricky business. That growing numbers of doctors now refer to natural medicine practitioners has opened many possibilities for all of us. To get to this stage in our work, we've had to learn to 'speak their language', and [un]fortunately, to come to grips with the concepts of Evidence Based Medicine. This includes learning how medicinal substances are derived, and delivered to the body, and metabolized. But this is now entirely off topic. Margi http://margihealing.wordpress.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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