best formulas for rotavirus/stomach flu?

[Guest guest]

Patient is an infant, pulse rapid. there is already sweating, high

fever, and severe diarrhea. Father of infant also affected. pulse is

rapid but soft. tongue bright red, esp tip.. severe, watery diarrhea

with painful stomach/abd cramping. I could probably still use a

formula to release the exterior, but I also want to add another to

address the GI symptoms. I thought perhaps huang bai jie du wan might

work. any advice?

 

Marie Sepich LAc new york

[Guest guest]

Marie,

Do you mean Huang lian jie du wan? or Huang bai jie du wan.... haven't heard

of that one....

 

Huang lian jie du wan can be used for dysentery...

maybe more for shao yin/ shao yang and less for for tai yang/ yang ming..

Huang lian, Huang qin, Huang Bai, Zhi zi

 

How about Ge gen Huang qin Huang lian tang?

Ge gen is for Tai yang and Yang ming and diarrhea

with maybe Huo xiang for the ext wind and turbid damp

and Shao yao gan cao tang for the abdominal cramping...

 

 

 

 

 

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 8:31 PM, shamanist1 <shamanist1 wrote:

 

> Patient is an infant, pulse rapid. there is already sweating, high

> fever, and severe diarrhea. Father of infant also affected. pulse is

> rapid but soft. tongue bright red, esp tip.. severe, watery diarrhea

> with painful stomach/abd cramping. I could probably still use a

> formula to release the exterior, but I also want to add another to

> address the GI symptoms. I thought perhaps huang bai jie du wan might

> work. any advice?

>

> Marie Sepich LAc new york

>

>

>

 

 

 

--

 

www.tcmreview.com

 

The Four Reliances:

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

meaning that underlies them.

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

rely upon the definitive meaning.

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi, and have someone besides the primary caregiver bleed the distal finger

points with a tri edge needle, or spring loaded pinprick device. If the TCM

primary does it, the child may have trust issues, better a stranger, but

qualified, of course.

 And a little Po Sum On type lotion on the abdomen, then cover, let the heat

come to the surface again, then rub w/o lotion. Adjunctive w herb.

 

--- On Fri, 2/20/09, <johnkokko wrote:

<johnkokko

Re: best formulas for rotavirus/stomach flu?

Chinese Medicine

Friday, February 20, 2009, 2:15 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Marie,

 

Do you mean Huang lian jie du wan? or Huang bai jie du wan.... haven't heard

 

of that one....

 

 

 

Huang lian jie du wan can be used for dysentery...

 

maybe more for shao yin/ shao yang and less for for tai yang/ yang ming..

 

Huang lian, Huang qin, Huang Bai, Zhi zi

 

 

 

How about Ge gen Huang qin Huang lian tang?

 

Ge gen is for Tai yang and Yang ming and diarrhea

 

with maybe Huo xiang for the ext wind and turbid damp

 

and Shao yao gan cao tang for the abdominal cramping...

 

 

 

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 8:31 PM, shamanist1 <shamanist1 > wrote:

 

 

 

> Patient is an infant, pulse rapid. there is already sweating, high

 

> fever, and severe diarrhea. Father of infant also affected. pulse is

 

> rapid but soft. tongue bright red, esp tip.. severe, watery diarrhea

 

> with painful stomach/abd cramping. I could probably still use a

 

> formula to release the exterior, but I also want to add another to

 

> address the GI symptoms. I thought perhaps huang bai jie du wan might

 

> work. any advice?

 

>

 

> Marie Sepich LAc new york

 

>

 

>

 

>

 

 

 

--

 

 

 

www.tcmreview. com

 

 

 

The Four Reliances:

 

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

 

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

 

meaning that underlies them.

 

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

 

rely upon the definitive meaning.

 

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

 

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

The Shixuan pts, not all, maybe even the first 2 fingers. The kid will cry, but,

tough love.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hi, and have someone besides the primary caregiver bleed the distal

finger points with a tri edge needle, or spring loaded pinprick device. If the

TCM primary does it, the child may have trust issues, better a stranger, but

qualified, of course.

 

 And a little Po Sum On type lotion massaged on the abdomen, then cover, let the

heat come to the surface again, then rub w/o lotion. Adjunctive w herb.

 

 

 

--- On Fri, 2/20/09, <johnkokko (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:

 

<johnkokko (AT) gmail (DOT) com>

 

Re: best formulas for rotavirus/stomach flu?

 

 

 

Friday, February 20, 2009, 2:15 AM

 

 

 

Marie,

 

 

 

Do you mean Huang lian jie du wan? or Huang bai jie du wan.... haven't heard

 

 

 

of that one....

 

 

 

Huang lian jie du wan can be used for dysentery...

 

 

 

maybe more for shao yin/ shao yang and less for for tai yang/ yang ming..

 

 

 

Huang lian, Huang qin, Huang Bai, Zhi zi

 

 

 

How about Ge gen Huang qin Huang lian tang?

 

 

 

Ge gen is for Tai yang and Yang ming and diarrhea

 

 

 

with maybe Huo xiang for the ext wind and turbid damp

 

 

 

and Shao yao gan cao tang for the abdominal cramping...

 

 

 

On Thu, Feb 19, 2009 at 8:31 PM, shamanist1 <shamanist1> wrote:

 

 

 

> Patient is an infant, pulse rapid. there is already sweating, high

 

 

 

> fever, and severe diarrhea. Father of infant also affected. pulse is

 

 

 

> rapid but soft. tongue bright red, esp tip.. severe, watery diarrhea

 

 

 

> with painful stomach/abd cramping. I could probably still use a

 

 

 

> formula to release the exterior, but I also want to add another to

 

 

 

> address the GI symptoms. I thought perhaps huang bai jie du wan might

 

 

 

> work. any advice?

 

 

 

>

 

 

 

> Marie Sepich LAc new york

 

 

 

>

 

 

 

>

 

 

 

>

 

 

 

--

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

www.tcmreview. com

 

 

 

The Four Reliances:

 

 

 

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

 

 

 

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

 

 

 

meaning that underlies them.

 

 

 

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

 

 

 

rely upon the definitive meaning.

 

 

 

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

 

 

 

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

The symptoms suggest that it is a typical White Tiger Decoction pattern

marked by high fever, sweating,etc. The disease is in qi aspect stage.

Add huang lian and huang qin for diarreha. Be hurry while the infant

patient is still in qi aspect satge. If the fever gets too high, he or

she will get into unconscious.

 

As no idea of how high the fever is, can't suggest further.

 

I guess we tcm practitioners should avoid using WM terminology among

us, if at all possible.

 

SUNG, Yuk-ming L Ac (Hong Kong)

[Guest guest]

Dr. Sung,...

 

I'm wondering why we should avoid using WM terminology among us?

If we don't allow it to over-ride our TCM diagnosis,

but just to let it inform us.... would'nt that be alright?

 

 

 

On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 6:45 AM, sxm2649 <sxm2649 wrote:

 

> The symptoms suggest that it is a typical White Tiger Decoction pattern

> marked by high fever, sweating,etc. The disease is in qi aspect stage.

> Add huang lian and huang qin for diarreha. Be hurry while the infant

> patient is still in qi aspect satge. If the fever gets too high, he or

> she will get into unconscious.

>

> As no idea of how high the fever is, can't suggest further.

>

> I guess we tcm practitioners should avoid using WM terminology among

> us, if at all possible.

>

> SUNG, Yuk-ming L Ac (Hong Kong)

>

>

>

 

 

 

--

 

www.tcmreview.com

 

The Four Reliances:

Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching.

As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the

meaning that underlies them.

Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but

rely upon the definitive meaning.

And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary

consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness.