Guest guest Posted October 5, 2008 Report Share Posted October 5, 2008 Hello: Does anyone have experience in dealing with emaciation after chronic illness? Thank you, Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Chinese Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy wrote: > > Hello: > > Does anyone have experience in dealing with emaciation after chronic illness? > Lonny: Hi Jack. Of course the approach will vary depending on the patient. That said, here aare a few general consideration: 1. Ginseng Nourishing Formula Or Shi CHuan Da Bu Wan. Also, in a women, consider Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan. 2. Moxa on Cv-8 on salt several times. 20-40 moxa each time. 3. Similarly, Moxa on Bl-43 Gao Huang Shu 4. General Earth Points-Research St-20 (Receiving Fullness), St-12 " Broken Bowl " , St-23, " Supreme Unity " , St-24, Lubrication Food Gate, St-25 " Heavenly Pivot " . Sp-21, Supreme Enveloping. 5. If both hand's pulses are deep and feeble: Exit and entry points on CV and GV. Then work on chong mo over time. 6. Moxa on Back shu points, particularly Bl-20,21, 23, GV-4. 7. SI-6, Nourishing the Old. These approaches are worth researching and would have to be modified in each case. Regards, Lonny Jarrett > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Lonny - what size cones are you using on Ren 8? Karen sppdestiny wrote: > Chinese Medicine > <Chinese Medicine%40>, Jack Sweeney > <mojavecowboy wrote: > > > > Hello: > > > > Does anyone have experience in dealing with emaciation after chronic > illness? > > > Lonny: Hi Jack. Of course the approach will vary depending on the > patient. That said, here aare a few general consideration: > > 1. Ginseng Nourishing Formula Or Shi CHuan Da Bu Wan. Also, in a > women, consider Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan. > 2. Moxa on Cv-8 on salt several times. 20-40 moxa each time. > 3. Similarly, Moxa on Bl-43 Gao Huang Shu > 4. General Earth Points-Research St-20 (Receiving Fullness), St-12 > " Broken Bowl " , St-23, " Supreme Unity " , St-24, Lubrication Food Gate, > St-25 " Heavenly Pivot " . Sp-21, Supreme Enveloping. > 5. If both hand's pulses are deep and feeble: Exit and entry points on > CV and GV. Then work on chong mo over time. > 6. Moxa on Back shu points, particularly Bl-20,21, 23, GV-4. > 7. SI-6, Nourishing the Old. > > These approaches are worth researching and would have to be modified > in each case. > > Regards, Lonny Jarrett > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Hi, Lonnie: Thank you for your response, that is quite helpful. I had a little trouble trying to find this formula: Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan The Wu Ji part is a little ambiguous but I get the Pai Feng Wan. Does " Wu " represent " five " or another character? Thank you, Jack --- On Mon, 10/6/08, sppdestiny <Revolution wrote: sppdestiny <Revolution Re: Emaciation Chinese Medicine Monday, October 6, 2008, 4:51 AM Traditional_ Chinese_Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy@ ...> wrote: > > Hello: > > Does anyone have experience in dealing with emaciation after chronic illness? > Lonny: Hi Jack. Of course the approach will vary depending on the patient. That said, here aare a few general consideration: 1. Ginseng Nourishing Formula Or Shi CHuan Da Bu Wan. Also, in a women, consider Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan. 2. Moxa on Cv-8 on salt several times. 20-40 moxa each time. 3. Similarly, Moxa on Bl-43 Gao Huang Shu 4. General Earth Points-Research St-20 (Receiving Fullness), St-12 " Broken Bowl " , St-23, " Supreme Unity " , St-24, Lubrication Food Gate, St-25 " Heavenly Pivot " . Sp-21, Supreme Enveloping. 5. If both hand's pulses are deep and feeble: Exit and entry points on CV and GV. Then work on chong mo over time. 6. Moxa on Back shu points, particularly Bl-20,21, 23, GV-4. 7. SI-6, Nourishing the Old. These approaches are worth researching and would have to be modified in each case. Regards, Lonny Jarrett > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Wu Ji is " black chicken " . It comes in a box of plastic balls with the herbs inside. - Bill Schoenbart Chinese Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy wrote: > > Hi, Lonnie: > > Thank you for your response, that is quite helpful. I had a little trouble trying to find this formula: > > Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan > > The Wu Ji part is a little ambiguous but I get the Pai Feng Wan. > > Does " Wu " represent " five " or another character? > > Thank you, > > Jack > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 There are a number of variation on this formula...the ones in the eggs are my favs. The Pai is actually bad spelling of Bai....the whole thing kinda translates into Black chicken transforms into white chicken....fun folklore story about ulgy becoming beautiful. Bob www.acuherbals.com --- On Mon, 10/6/08, bill_schoenbart <plantmed2 wrote: bill_schoenbart <plantmed2 Re: Emaciation Chinese Medicine Monday, October 6, 2008, 12:20 PM Wu Ji is " black chicken " . It comes in a box of plastic balls with the herbs inside. - Bill Schoenbart Traditional_ Chinese_Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy@ ...> wrote: > > Hi, Lonnie: > > Thank you for your response, that is quite helpful. I had a little trouble trying to find this formula: > > Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan > > The Wu Ji part is a little ambiguous but I get the Pai Feng Wan. > > Does " Wu " represent " five " or another character? > > Thank you, > > Jack > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 6, 2008 Report Share Posted October 6, 2008 Bill, Bob: Thank you very much, got it now, the Pai was the problem. Regards, Jack --- On Mon, 10/6/08, Bob Linde, AP, Herbalist <boblindeherbalist wrote: Bob Linde, AP, Herbalist <boblindeherbalist Re: Re: Emaciation Chinese Medicine Monday, October 6, 2008, 10:15 AM There are a number of variation on this formula...the ones in the eggs are my favs. The Pai is actually bad spelling of Bai....the whole thing kinda translates into Black chicken transforms into white chicken....fun folklore story about ulgy becoming beautiful. Bob www.acuherbals. com --- On Mon, 10/6/08, bill_schoenbart <plantmed2 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: bill_schoenbart <plantmed2 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Emaciation Monday, October 6, 2008, 12:20 PM Wu Ji is " black chicken " . It comes in a box of plastic balls with the herbs inside. - Bill Schoenbart Traditional_ Chinese_Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy@ ...> wrote: > > Hi, Lonnie: > > Thank you for your response, that is quite helpful. I had a little trouble trying to find this formula: > > Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan > > The Wu Ji part is a little ambiguous but I get the Pai Feng Wan. > > Does " Wu " represent " five " or another character? > > Thank you, > > Jack > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2008 Report Share Posted October 7, 2008 Lonny - what size cones are you using on Ren 8? Karen Lonny: Hi Karen. I honestly don't know how to measure moxa cones. Is there a standard? Mine take about 5-7 seconds to burn down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Jack: You have touched a very important issue that involves many fundamental principles of TCM. The model answer will be pattern idnetification as every individual patient is unique. The basic principle is to tonify the spleen and stomach. I recommend shu.yu wan (Dioscorea Pill) from chapter 6, Jia Gui Yao Lue. That statement discusses the pattern and treatment of right qi deficiency as the patient suffers from 'all kinds of deficiencies' marked by qi, blood, yin, and yang insufficiency. The characteristic of the formula is to tonify and regulate the spleen and stomach. In the formula, shan yao (dioscorea), bai zhu (ovate atractylodes), and fu ling (poria) tonify spleen deficiency while shan yao (dioscorea), da.zao (jujube), and gan cao (licorice) are in large dosage to tonify the spleen essence (yin)..... Combined, it manifests the administration of supporting the right qi and dispelling the evil qi. One thing is for sure, It takes time. You can also apply acupuncture and moxibustion that may not be appropriate for patients with yin deficiency(moxi). If you share with us a specific case, there will be a specific treatment method(s). Hope that helps, SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (Hong Kong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2008 Report Share Posted October 8, 2008 Dear SUNG, Yuk-ming Thank you for your email, that is quite helpful, Jack --- On Tue, 10/7/08, sxm2649 <sxm2649 wrote: sxm2649 <sxm2649 Re: Emaciation Chinese Medicine Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 8:02 PM Jack: You have touched a very important issue that involves many fundamental principles of TCM. The model answer will be pattern idnetification as every individual patient is unique. The basic principle is to tonify the spleen and stomach. I recommend shu.yu wan (Dioscorea Pill) from chapter 6, Jia Gui Yao Lue. That statement discusses the pattern and treatment of right qi deficiency as the patient suffers from 'all kinds of deficiencies' marked by qi, blood, yin, and yang insufficiency. The characteristic of the formula is to tonify and regulate the spleen and stomach. In the formula, shan yao (dioscorea), bai zhu (ovate atractylodes) , and fu ling (poria) tonify spleen deficiency while shan yao (dioscorea), da.zao (jujube), and gan cao (licorice) are in large dosage to tonify the spleen essence (yin)..... Combined, it manifests the administration of supporting the right qi and dispelling the evil qi. One thing is for sure, It takes time. You can also apply acupuncture and moxibustion that may not be appropriate for patients with yin deficiency(moxi) . If you share with us a specific case, there will be a specific treatment method(s). Hope that helps, SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (Hong Kong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 9, 2008 Report Share Posted October 9, 2008 You can moxa st and sp back shu points is good for this condition benefits the yin Chinese Medicine , Jack Sweeney <mojavecowboy wrote: > > Dear SUNG, Yuk-ming > > Thank you for your email, that is quite helpful, > > Jack > > > > --- On Tue, 10/7/08, sxm2649 <sxm2649 wrote: > sxm2649 <sxm2649 > Re: Emaciation > Chinese Medicine > Tuesday, October 7, 2008, 8:02 PM > > > > > Jack: > > You have touched a very important issue that involves many > > fundamental principles of TCM. The model answer will be pattern > > idnetification as every individual patient is unique. The basic > > principle is to tonify the spleen and stomach. > > I recommend shu.yu wan (Dioscorea Pill) from chapter 6, Jia Gui Yao > > Lue. That statement discusses the pattern and treatment of right qi > > deficiency as the patient suffers from 'all kinds of deficiencies' > > marked by qi, blood, yin, and yang insufficiency. > > The characteristic of the formula is to tonify and regulate the > > spleen and stomach. In the formula, shan yao (dioscorea), bai zhu > > (ovate atractylodes) , and fu ling (poria) tonify spleen deficiency > > while shan yao (dioscorea), da.zao (jujube), and gan cao (licorice) are > > in large dosage to tonify the spleen essence (yin)..... Combined, it > > manifests the administration of supporting the right qi and dispelling > > the evil qi. > > One thing is for sure, It takes time. You can also apply acupuncture > > and moxibustion that may not be appropriate for patients with yin > > deficiency(moxi) . > > If you share with us a specific case, there will be a specific > > treatment method(s). > > > > Hope that helps, > > > > SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (Hong Kong) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 10, 2008 Report Share Posted October 10, 2008 Jack, You are very welcome. I hope you do not mind me quoting something from the classic. It is rather long and may be dry to some TCM students. However, it is the root of TCM, the sources of core principles of treatment. Mastering of them help us a lot when confronting complicated cases. For example, in emaciation case, you can tackle diseases of HIV, psoriasis, and all other immune deficiency-related diseases. SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (Hong Kong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 11, 2008 Report Share Posted October 11, 2008 Hello Sung Yuk Ming: Please do quote from the classics, I don't find that boring at all. In fact I have been reading the Nan Jing this week, and it is always interesting to see what one finds in original document, compared with translations. If you have the original, especially in traditional characters, please do send a copy. I've been having a hard time with Chinese Word these days, since the version I now use won't translate to traditional characters. Regards, Jack --- On Thu, 10/9/08, sxm2649 <sxm2649 wrote: sxm2649 <sxm2649 Re: Emaciation Chinese Medicine Thursday, October 9, 2008, 7:15 PM Jack, You are very welcome. I hope you do not mind me quoting something from the classic. It is rather long and may be dry to some TCM students. However, it is the root of TCM, the sources of core principles of treatment. Mastering of them help us a lot when confronting complicated cases. For example, in emaciation case, you can tackle diseases of HIV, psoriasis, and all other immune deficiency-related diseases. SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (Hong Kong) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 12, 2008 Report Share Posted October 12, 2008 > Lonny: Hi Jack. Of course the approach will vary depending on the > patient. That said, here aare a few general consideration: > > > 1. Ginseng Nourishing Formula Or Shi CHuan Da Bu Wan. Also, in a > women, consider Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan. Lonny and list - I have found Wu Chi Bai Feng Wan (aka Wu Ji Pai Feng Wan) useful for men as well. When I was in school I was taught this formula was for women - period - but in real life I've seen it used effectively in both men and women. I suppose it depends on one's practice base. I have a number of younger gay men in my practice and have used the formula to good effect in helping them rebuild their health. I would not hesitate to use it for any man, gay or straight, who displayed with the appropriate signs and symptoms. Dia Dia Vickery PhD(Theology) Licensed Acupuncturist / Herbalist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2008 Report Share Posted October 14, 2008 Hi Jack, There are more than 15 statements (over 10 formulas) discussing emaciations. They include that are marked by sleeplessness; lumbar pain, urgency in the lower abdomen, and inhibited urination; abdominal urgency, palpitations, nose bleeding, abdominal pain, nocturnal emissions; a man who has spontaneous seminal emission while the woman who dreams of sexual intercourse; panting laboriously if walking quickly, counter-flow cold in four limbs, fullness in the abdomen, and even diarrhea; spontaneous seminal emissions, etc. Tell me the signs of your case so I can find the right statement for you. Regards, SUNG, Yuk-ming, L Ac (HK) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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