Guest guest Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 Alon and all, Is there any research on the clinical efficacy comparison between needling where De qi has been elicited versus needling where a filiform needle is merely inserted into the skin at an acupoint? The classics say that De qi must be attained for an efficacious treatment. Of course, it might be more difficult to keep the active needling group in the dark when De qi is reached or reproduce that kind of sensation for the placebo group; which would probably lead one back to the original conundrum. K. On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 3:22 PM, Alon Marcus <alonmarcus wrote: > Same here, lets push the schools to start doing some good research. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 12, 2008 Report Share Posted July 12, 2008 Koko, Interesting. My understanding is that there is a difference of interpretation of the classics as to who must feel the Qi. My experience has been is that ideally both patient and practitioner feels the qi, but that it is more important for the practitioner feel the qi while needling. David Toone L.Ac. On Jul 12, 2008, at 9:59 AM, wrote: > The classics say that De qi must be attained for an efficacious > treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 13, 2008 Report Share Posted July 13, 2008 Remember De Qi in Japanese tradition does not mean the patient feeling but practitioner's Alon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 koko you can also look in my book for a review of the literature. i also review some of the basic science so it may be easier for you to understand 400 29th St. Suite 419 Oakland Ca 94609 alonmarcus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 To ensure the best experience for our users, replies to the Groups Daily Digest are only supported through the " reply links " which immediately follow each message in the fully featured version of the digest. 400 29th St. Suite 419 Oakland Ca 94609 alonmarcus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 14, 2008 Report Share Posted July 14, 2008 Alon, Thanks. I'll look at that section in your book. I know that you read all of the clinical studies out there, so it must be comprehensive. What do you think of the clinical studies that were reviewed in Clinical Acupuncture (Scientific Basis) edited by G. Stux and R. Hammerschlag. Other than this text and your book, are there other resources we should check out? Medical Acupuncture Journals ? or do the clinical trials just pop up here and there in different journals? Which ones can you trust personally? K. On Sun, Jul 13, 2008 at 5:02 PM, alon marcus <alonmarcus wrote: > To ensure the best experience for our users, replies to the > Groups Daily Digest are only supported through the " reply links " which > immediately follow each message in the fully featured version of the > digest. > > > > 400 29th St. Suite 419 > Oakland Ca 94609 > > > > alonmarcus <alonmarcus%40wans.net> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 15, 2008 Report Share Posted July 15, 2008 CSOMA did a nice review, you can also look at the reading list in my book. The problem is that most, including my reviews, do not go into the problems in the studies. We do not truly grade the quality of each study. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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