Guest guest Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Peter- Thank you very much for your thoughtful response! Liver Blood sx: One of the patients has the ridged dry nails, dull complexion, difficulty getting to sleep, also itching which I take to be maybe wind invading over the Bl def..? (forgive me -I really havent been taught this and am tryingb on my own to work it out) would it be the Wind which cause the extreme dizziness both patients reported- and would allegy meds relieve that? (both HAVE gotten relief from meds) " Red tip shows heat or fire in the heart. Should be from the emotional distress, since the hear is always involved in emotial stuff no matter what reason. But in which kind is the emotion? Fear, Worry, Stress, Anger? " Ah -great info, that the heart heat need not be 'heart' specific emotion! Thank you. Id say , one patient, anger and stress, the other more fear and worry... " I there any sheat on the tongue? How are the sides of the tongue. How is the pulse?' in both these patients, I think the tongue is showing a little Sp qi deficienscy! One is slightly swollen, the other wet, with a wet coat and slight tremble... " Since you are 5E trained. Try to do the technique you have on the back shu points, don't remember the name. but you take them from up to down for the zang-organs and finish with the heart. that is Ub13, Ub15, Ub18, Ub20, Ub23 and finish with Ub14. " Yes! This IS a great treatment(we call it 'AE " , aggressive energy " . Its what to do AFTER!!. you are giving me some ideas with your questions about what to look into.. Thank you so much!! Lou --- In Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\ ogroups.com>, " lou hart " <loulumina wrote: > > I am a student, just beginning my clinic training. 2 patients have come to > me with similiar symptoms. at least in western terms : severe dizziness, > exacerbated seasonally, and relieved by allergy meds.Both patients show some > signs of liver blood deficiency and also have red tipped tongues, with > histories consistent with emotional distress. Ive been mostly trained in 5E, > and am very interested to hear how a TCM practitioner would (or has!) > managed such situations. Thank you very much. Lou > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Hi. Thanks for you extra information. The nail shows on the Liver since they are the extension of the sinews which comes from the Liver. Dull complexion I would also go on Blood deficiency. Sleep problem can be from deficient Blood in Liver, Heart or Spleen, hard to fall a sleep is from Blood deficiency, waking up is from Yin deficiency. Itching, yes Wind, from blood deficiency can be causing that. Dizziness though can have other reasons than just Liver related. - Wind, Yang, Phlegm and Deficiency To tell them apart you have to ask about the other signs. From Maciocia: - severe giddiness when everything sways and the patient loeses balance is from internal Wind - with throbbing headache; Liver Yang rising - with a feeling of heaviness and muzziness in the head indicates Phlergm obstructing the head and prevent clear Yang to ascend to the head. - Slight dizziness which is worse when tired indicates Blood deficiency - Sudden onset; full pattern - Gradual onset; empty pattern From the information I have right now if it would be my patients I would do like this. MAybe a littel difference since I dont know exactly which of the two have which symptoms and signs. Treat the insomnia and strengthen Blood. also move Qi. GV20 (directing needle backwards), Si-shen-cong (the 4 points 1 cun from GV20), HT7 for insomnia To strengthen Blood, ST36, SP6 Additional, The one that experience anger and stress: BL17, BL20, BL15 The one that experience fear: BL23, BL17, BL20, KI3, BL15 If there is phlegm, sedating techique on ST40 Otherwise, try to treat the symtoms of allergy also. Not everything during the same treatment though, you can alternate and take what is most obvious or bothering. Regards Peter Chinese Medicine , " lou hart " <loulumina wrote: > > Peter- Thank you very much for your thoughtful response! > > > Liver Blood sx: > > One of the patients has the ridged dry nails, dull complexion, difficulty > getting to sleep, also itching which I take to be maybe wind invading over > the Bl def..? (forgive me -I really havent been taught this and am tryingb > on my own to work it out) > > would it be the Wind which cause the extreme dizziness both patients > reported- and would allegy meds relieve that? (both HAVE gotten relief from > meds) > > " Red tip shows heat or fire in the heart. Should be from the emotional > distress, since the hear is always involved in emotial stuff no matter > what reason. But in which kind is the emotion? Fear, Worry, Stress, Anger? " > > Ah -great info, that the heart heat need not be 'heart' specific emotion! > Thank you. Id say , one patient, anger and stress, the other more fear and > worry... > > " I there any sheat on the tongue? How are the sides of the tongue. How > is the pulse?' > in both these patients, I think the tongue is showing a little Sp qi > deficienscy! One is slightly swollen, the other wet, with a wet coat and > slight tremble... > > > > " Since you are 5E trained. Try to do the technique you have on the back > shu points, don't remember the name. but you take them from up to down > for the zang-organs and finish with the heart. that is Ub13, Ub15, > Ub18, Ub20, Ub23 and finish with Ub14. " > > Yes! This IS a great treatment(we call it 'AE " , aggressive energy " . Its what > to do AFTER!!. you are giving me some ideas with your questions about what > to look into.. Thank you so much!! > > Lou > > > > --- In Chinese Medicine <Traditional_Chinese_Medic ine%40>, > " lou hart " > <loulumina@> wrote: > > > > I am a student, just beginning my clinic training. 2 patients have > come to > > me with similiar symptoms. at least in western terms : severe dizziness, > > exacerbated seasonally, and relieved by allergy meds.Both patients > show some > > signs of liver blood deficiency and also have red tipped tongues, with > > histories consistent with emotional distress. Ive been mostly > trained in 5E, > > and am very interested to hear how a TCM practitioner would (or has!) > > managed such situations. Thank you very much. Lou > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.