Guest guest Posted March 1, 2008 Report Share Posted March 1, 2008 Associates, Lo! One informs me that cordyceps is not only coming from caterpillars anymore? Inquiring minds must know... Does this change the Chinese name: dong chong xia cao (winter bug summer grass)? Secondly, what are the differences between the two, if any? Third, some concerns about allergies have been raised with respect to caterpillars, but the same could go for the fungus itself. Finally, what are some good North American and Chinese sources of both types. teri ma kasi! hosh. y.c. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2008 Report Share Posted March 2, 2008 Y.C., There's an informative article published in The Journal of Number 80 Feb 2006, written by Simon Canney. An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung Yin. Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice and/or spent silkworm larvae. Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. They also have capsules. There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing down by added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical issues with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and caviar " ...(Canney's article) From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of that. K. -- aka Mu bong Lim Father of Bhakti The Four Reliances: Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the meaning that underlies them. Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but rely upon the definitive meaning. And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2008 Report Share Posted March 2, 2008 I tend to use the organic lab grown stuff, since I can get it by the kilo, but there is another benefit to using the wild grown fungus. In some Tibetan villages, a very large percentage of their cash income comes from cordyceps harvesting. - Bill Schoenbart Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Y.C., > There's an informative article published in The Journal of Chinese Medicine > Number 80 Feb 2006, > written by Simon Canney. > > An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung Yin. > Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. > > Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice > and/or spent silkworm larvae. > Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. > The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. > They also have capsules. > > There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: > 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing down by > added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent > and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. > 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical issues > with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and > caviar " ...(Canney's article) > > From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. > It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. > Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. > That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. > > By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. > But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of > that. > > K. > > -- > aka Mu bong Lim > Father of Bhakti > > The Four Reliances: > Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. > As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the > meaning that underlies them. > Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but > rely upon the definitive meaning. > And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary > consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2008 Report Share Posted March 2, 2008 The fungus has yang and yin properties, there is no medicinal value to the insect part. Aloha medicinals has cold-grown (takes 6 months to mature) that is superior to any on the market, if you are paying less that $80 a kilo, you are getting inferior cordyceps. I have 10 kilos of the strong stuff I am trying to sell to pay the rent this month so if anyone wants a good price e-mail me please... Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from China and Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties than the Tibetan but is similar. Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Y.C., > There's an informative article published in The Journal of Chinese Medicine > Number 80 Feb 2006, > written by Simon Canney. > > An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung Yin. > Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. > > Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice > and/or spent silkworm larvae. > Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. > The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. > They also have capsules. > > There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: > 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing down by > added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent > and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. > 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical issues > with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and > caviar " ...(Canney's article) > > From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. > It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. > Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. > That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. > > By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. > But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of > that. > > K. > > -- > aka Mu bong Lim > Father of Bhakti > > The Four Reliances: > Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. > As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the > meaning that underlies them. > Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but > rely upon the definitive meaning. > And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary > consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Hi Bill, Nice point about supporting your local wildcrafter. Another detail about any fungus including nutritional yeast is that fungus concentrates what it grows upon. You could say that to some degree it is what it eats. Wild cordyceps concentrates the qi of caterpillar to butterfly homeostatic transformation. Taking a walk is not doing tai ji though what can be measured via calorie output might be the same. makes another very good point. Is the wildcrafted herb worth the money? If you are the Emperor, maybe you think it's worth the money. I can't afford the wild cordyceps. I've considered this issue a lot over the past two decades as the price has soared. I would not buy cordyceps grown on biomass because I don't know the function of the resulting herb. In my opinion it's not necessarily Chinese medicine. The biochemical " marker " is not the active ingredient in virtually any herb. (As an aside ... Do you want to be known for your high LDL/HDL blood concentrations? Your C reactive protein, your angiotensin or your elevated epinephrine? Which marker makes a really potent human?) So I choose not to buy wild or cultivated cordyceps. I would tend to use the saved money to buy herbs that accomplish my goal by other means. Respectfully and gratefully, Emmanuel Segmen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Jason, I'm not sold on the idea that the " insect part " has no medicinal value. My Tibetan friends have told me that a golden and robust " caterpillar worm " is also important. There may be a lot of protein along with other value to its life. We haven't defined it, but since the mycelium chooses to use its body as host, there must be some reason. Anyone know this? Jason wrote: " Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from China and Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties than the Tibetan but is similar. " Jason, in what ways are the 'scholar coryceps' different, but similar? Thanks.. K. On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 9:47 AM, jasonwcom <jasonwcom wrote: > The fungus has yang and yin properties, there is no medicinal value to > the insect part. Aloha medicinals has cold-grown (takes 6 months to > mature) that is superior to any on the market, if you are paying less > that $80 a kilo, you are getting inferior cordyceps. I have 10 kilos > of the strong stuff I am trying to sell to pay the rent this month so > if anyone wants a good price e-mail me please... > > Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from China and > Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties > than the Tibetan but is similar. > > > --- In Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\ ogroups.com>, > " " > <johnkokko wrote: > > > > Y.C., > > There's an informative article published in The Journal of Chinese > Medicine > > Number 80 Feb 2006, > > written by Simon Canney. > > > > An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung > Yin. > > Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. > > > > Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice > > and/or spent silkworm larvae. > > Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. > > The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. > > They also have capsules. > > > > There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: > > 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing > down by > > added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent > > and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. > > 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical > issues > > with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and > > caviar " ...(Canney's article) > > > > From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. > > It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. > > Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. > > That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. > > > > By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. > > But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of > > that. > > > > K. > > > > -- > > aka Mu bong Lim > > Father of Bhakti > > > > The Four Reliances: > > Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. > > As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely > upon the > > meaning that underlies them. > > Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning > alone, but > > rely upon the definitive meaning. > > And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary > > consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Hi, I have as much Cordyceps as you can handle.........in the form of 1:1 extract fermentation powder which is said to be equivalent to the real thing. Full analysis available if required or check website entry: http://herbalmedicineuk.com/shop/product_info.php? cPath=24 & products_id=597 I hope this is seen as part of the general query I have had detailed enquiries regarding this in the past it seems to work well with my patients. Lorraine Hodgkinson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Try eating just the insect part, if it does have effect it is very mild compared to the fungus part..in my experience, I have tried. The robust worms are the best because they have thicker fungus inside, thus more fungus per weight... Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Jason, > > I'm not sold on the idea that the " insect part " has no medicinal value. > My Tibetan friends have told me that a golden and robust " caterpillar worm " > is also important. There may be a lot of protein along with other value to > its life. > We haven't defined it, but since the mycelium chooses to use its body as > host, > there must be some reason. > > Anyone know this? > > Jason wrote: " Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from > China and > Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties > than the Tibetan but is similar. " > > Jason, in what ways are the 'scholar coryceps' different, but similar? > > Thanks.. K. > > > > > On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 9:47 AM, jasonwcom <jasonwcom wrote: > > > The fungus has yang and yin properties, there is no medicinal value to > > the insect part. Aloha medicinals has cold-grown (takes 6 months to > > mature) that is superior to any on the market, if you are paying less > > that $80 a kilo, you are getting inferior cordyceps. I have 10 kilos > > of the strong stuff I am trying to sell to pay the rent this month so > > if anyone wants a good price e-mail me please... > > > > Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from China and > > Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties > > than the Tibetan but is similar. > > > > > > --- In Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\ ogroups.com>, > > " " > > <johnkokko@> wrote: > > > > > > Y.C., > > > There's an informative article published in The Journal of Chinese > > Medicine > > > Number 80 Feb 2006, > > > written by Simon Canney. > > > > > > An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung > > Yin. > > > Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. > > > > > > Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice > > > and/or spent silkworm larvae. > > > Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. > > > The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. > > > They also have capsules. > > > > > > There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: > > > 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing > > down by > > > added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent > > > and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. > > > 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical > > issues > > > with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and > > > caviar " ...(Canney's article) > > > > > > From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. > > > It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. > > > Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. > > > That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. > > > > > > By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. > > > But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of > > > that. > > > > > > K. > > > > > > -- > > > aka Mu bong Lim > > > Father of Bhakti > > > > > > The Four Reliances: > > > Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. > > > As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely > > upon the > > > meaning that underlies them. > > > Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning > > alone, but > > > rely upon the definitive meaning. > > > And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary > > > consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 Its true that some herbs change effect due to growing conditions, however this is not the case with dong chong...You are doing your patients a dis-service by not using it, it is one of the strongest and safest herbs in Chinese medicine and now it can be bought at a price that the masses can afford(again I only suggest cold-grown, the other stuff is not very potent). I think it is a perfect choice for our adrenal-damaged society, and those suffering from lung problems and weakness either congenital(esp. in children) or due to illness. Chinese Medicine , " Emmanuel Segmen " <mrsegmen wrote: > > Hi Bill, > > Nice point about supporting your local wildcrafter. Another detail about any fungus including nutritional yeast is that fungus concentrates what it grows upon. You could say that to some degree it is what it eats. Wild cordyceps concentrates the qi of caterpillar to butterfly homeostatic transformation. Taking a walk is not doing tai ji though what can be measured via calorie output might be the same. makes another very good point. Is the wildcrafted herb worth the money? If you are the Emperor, maybe you think it's worth the money. I can't afford the wild cordyceps. > > I've considered this issue a lot over the past two decades as the price has soared. I would not buy cordyceps grown on biomass because I don't know the function of the resulting herb. In my opinion it's not necessarily Chinese medicine. The biochemical " marker " is not the active ingredient in virtually any herb. (As an aside ... Do you want to be known for your high LDL/HDL blood concentrations? Your C reactive protein, your angiotensin or your elevated epinephrine? Which marker makes a really potent human?) So I choose not to buy wild or cultivated cordyceps. I would tend to use the saved money to buy herbs that accomplish my goal by other means. > > Respectfully and gratefully, > Emmanuel Segmen > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2008 Report Share Posted March 3, 2008 According to the Chinese the scholar's cordyceps is better for studying things and memory retention. From my sampling I can tell you its almost the same except it grows on a different bug. You an buy it at herb shops in China. Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Jason, > > I'm not sold on the idea that the " insect part " has no medicinal value. > My Tibetan friends have told me that a golden and robust " caterpillar worm " > is also important. There may be a lot of protein along with other value to > its life. > We haven't defined it, but since the mycelium chooses to use its body as > host, > there must be some reason. > > Anyone know this? > > Jason wrote: " Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from > China and > Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties > than the Tibetan but is similar. " > > Jason, in what ways are the 'scholar coryceps' different, but similar? > > Thanks.. K. > > > > > On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 9:47 AM, jasonwcom <jasonwcom wrote: > > > The fungus has yang and yin properties, there is no medicinal value to > > the insect part. Aloha medicinals has cold-grown (takes 6 months to > > mature) that is superior to any on the market, if you are paying less > > that $80 a kilo, you are getting inferior cordyceps. I have 10 kilos > > of the strong stuff I am trying to sell to pay the rent this month so > > if anyone wants a good price e-mail me please... > > > > Someone I know was getting cordyceps grown on cicadas from China and > > Mexico it's called " scholar's cordyceps and has different properties > > than the Tibetan but is similar. > > > > > > --- In Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\ ogroups.com>, > > " " > > <johnkokko@> wrote: > > > > > > Y.C., > > > There's an informative article published in The Journal of Chinese > > Medicine > > > Number 80 Feb 2006, > > > written by Simon Canney. > > > > > > An interesting idea is that Cordyceps tonifies both KD yang and Lung > > Yin. > > > Yang comes from the animal part and Yin comes from the 'fungus' part. > > > > > > Canney writes that the non-wild cordyceps is often grown on brown rice > > > and/or spent silkworm larvae. > > > Mayway carries Cordyceps biomass powder (lab grown) in 100 gram bottles. > > > The material contains at least 10% cordyceptic acid content. > > > They also have capsules. > > > > > > There are at least 2 benefits from getting the lab-grown: > > > 1. You know that it's clean... no tampering ie. artificial weighing > > down by > > > added metal or soaking in solutions that are prevalent > > > and less bacteria and other molds that may grow on the wild cordyceps. > > > 2. No wild-harvesting and there are major political and economical > > issues > > > with wild crafting; cordyceps is worth more than " coca leaves and > > > caviar " ...(Canney's article) > > > > > > From my experience, the lab-grown is extremely potent. > > > It's definitely worth a try, as an alternative to the wild. > > > Good quality wild can run in excess of $10/ gram. > > > That's 100 times the cost of lab grown powder. > > > > > > By getting wild, you're paying for labor, shipping and the mystique. > > > But, today you don't have to be the Emperor to be able to afford all of > > > that. > > > > > > K. > > > > > > -- > > > aka Mu bong Lim > > > Father of Bhakti > > > > > > The Four Reliances: > > > Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. > > > As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely > > upon the > > > meaning that underlies them. > > > Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning > > alone, but > > > rely upon the definitive meaning. > > > And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary > > > consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 I am wondering if anyone has experience with Cordyceps from People's Herbs? What about KPC? I appreciate the thread. Meredith Young Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Those brands are weak, cold-grown is the only cordyceps that equals the natural type the others are very mild in effect. Chinese Medicine , " natdoc48 " <natdoc48 wrote: > > I am wondering if anyone has experience with Cordyceps from People's > Herbs? What about KPC? > I appreciate the thread. > Meredith Young > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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