Guest guest Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Phil, I heard that most of the deer antler comes from either, Alaska, New Zealand or Siberia. Korean medicine uses deer antler more than Chinese. It may go back to the old days; because deer are seen as sacred animals. There are drawings of deer, peaches, ling zhi and pines in old China and Korea. Interestingly, only Lu Rong and Gao Ben, to memory, have extraordinary channel descriptions. I've heard that makes them " spiritual " substances. Gao Ben opens up the vertex (crown chakra) on the Du channel. Lu Rong has interaction with the DU, Ren, Chong and Dai channels. Does anyone know the significance of these channel descriptions for the herbs? K. On Feb 5, 2008 7:24 PM, wrote: > Phil: > > thank you for this detailed and informative post. it is interesting and > most > helpful. > > kath > > > On Feb 2, 2008 7:53 PM, <<%40tinet.ie>> > wrote: > > > Hi Kath & All, > > > > Kath wrote: > > > i've been investigating delayed growth in childhood. a couple of posts > > > have recommended lu jiao or lu jiao sheng which is specific for tx > this > > > disorder. as a vegan, i have avoided lu jiao as my understanding of > the > > > harvesting process causes a great deal of pain and suffering to the > > > deer. the velvet is highly vascular, and my knowledge of the > harvesting > > > procedure involves a bloody process, painful and stressful to the > > > animals. does anyone know something different about the harvesting > > procedure > > > of lujiao? Kath Bartlett > > > > Kath, as a veterinarian but hopeless carnivore, I agree. > > > > From reading WWW, my understanding of the CHINESE use of Antler > > Velvet is that young, highly vascular velvet is the most highly > > prized (and priced!), especially young, fresh velvet with some blood > > remaining in it. > > > > IMO, scraping velvet from the horn of a LIVE deer is a very cruel > > process, EVEN IF local anaesthetic is administered around the horn- > > base beforehand. I doubt very much if Chinese deer farmers use a > > local anaesthetic for that purpose. > > > > However, as velvet dry weight is tiny relative to the weight of the > > whole antler, and as antler itself is removed as a medicinal, I think > > that most deer farmers would remove older (and less vascular) velvet > > AFTER dehorning the deer. > > > > Dehorning, even done under local anaesthetic, is stressful (but less > > cruel than scraping off velvet from a live deer) for any animal, > > especially deer unused to human handling. > > > > Finally, the documented presence of CWD (Chronic Wasting Disease - a > > transmissible prion disease akin to BSE / Kuru) in cervids in USA > > raises a huge question as to the SAFETY of deer products from farming > > systems that do not practice USA / EU protocols of food traceability > > and safety. Personally, I would not use antler products from China. > > > > Indeed, many colleagues in VBMA (Vet Med Botanical Assoc) avoid > > almost ALL medicinals of animal origin. Exceptions would include > > honey, meat, gelatin and other animal products that are deemed > > acceptable as a normal human food in USA / EU and whose food safety > > can be assured under our existing food legislation. > > > > For most animal-sourced Chinese medicinals, a plant-based substitute > > can be used instead. > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > -- > > Oriental Medicine > Experienced, Dedicated, Effective > > Flying Dragon Liniment: > Effective pain relief for muscles & joints > Formulated by Kath Bartlett, Traditional Chinese Herbalist > Available at Asheville Center for , or web order at: > https://www.kamwo.com/shop/product.php?productid=17442 & cat=0 & page=1 > > Asheville Center For > 70 Woodfin Place, Suite West Wing Two > Asheville, NC 28801 828.258.2777 > kbartlett <kbartlett%40AcupunctureAsheville.com> > www.AcupunctureAsheville.com > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Phil, I heard that most of the deer antler comes from either, Alaska, New > Zealand or Siberia. I think most of the antler used in Chinese medicine comes from Northeast China, in the same basic region as ginseng (Liaoning, Jilin, and Heilongjiang provinces). Deer antler, ginseng, and forest frog oviducts (xue ha) are often called the 3 treasures of the northeast, although a local herb called bu lao cao ( " don't get old herb " ) is also famous there. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Thanks Eric, I got my info from Koreans in L.A. who import from either New Zealand or Alaska. Don't have any documents on that though. Interesting that the NorthEast part of China has been bordering the Korean tribes for thousands of years now. The Koguryo kingdom of the Three Kingdoms of Korea rode their horses in that region. Interesting that Ginseng and Lu Rong both have a same home. I've been told that the best ginseng in Korea is the North, around 40 degrees latitude. Any ideas on the 8 extraordinary channels significance with herbs? K. On Feb 6, 2008 1:04 PM, Eric Brand <smilinglotus wrote: > --- In Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\ ogroups.com>, > " " > > <johnkokko wrote: > > > > Phil, I heard that most of the deer antler comes from either, > Alaska, New > > Zealand or Siberia. > > I think most of the antler used in Chinese medicine comes from > Northeast China, in the same basic region as ginseng (Liaoning, Jilin, > and Heilongjiang provinces). Deer antler, ginseng, and forest frog > oviducts (xue ha) are often called the 3 treasures of the northeast, > although a local herb called bu lao cao ( " don't get old herb " ) is also > famous there. > > Eric > > > -- aka Mu bong Lim Father of Bhakti The Four Reliances: Do not rely upon the individual, but rely upon the teaching. As far as teachings go, do not rely upon the words alone, but rely upon the meaning that underlies them. Regarding the meaning, do not rely upon the provisional meaning alone, but rely upon the definitive meaning. And regarding the definitive meaning, do not rely upon ordinary consciousness, but rely upon wisdom awareness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 6, 2008 Report Share Posted February 6, 2008 Xtra channels are related to hormones deer antler contains growth hormone-like substances Chinese Medicine , " " <johnkokko wrote: > > Phil, I heard that most of the deer antler comes from either, Alaska, New > Zealand or Siberia. > > Korean medicine uses deer antler more than Chinese. > It may go back to the old days; because deer are seen as sacred animals. > There are drawings of deer, peaches, ling zhi and pines in old China and > Korea. > > Interestingly, only Lu Rong and Gao Ben, to memory, > have extraordinary channel descriptions. > > I've heard that makes them " spiritual " substances. > Gao Ben opens up the vertex (crown chakra) on the Du channel. > Lu Rong has interaction with the DU, Ren, Chong and Dai channels. > > Does anyone know the significance of these channel descriptions for the > herbs? > > K. > > > > On Feb 5, 2008 7:24 PM, wrote: > > > Phil: > > > > thank you for this detailed and informative post. it is interesting and > > most > > helpful. > > > > kath > > > > > > On Feb 2, 2008 7:53 PM, <<% 40tinet.ie>> > > wrote: > > > > > Hi Kath & All, > > > > > > Kath wrote: > > > > i've been investigating delayed growth in childhood. a couple of posts > > > > have recommended lu jiao or lu jiao sheng which is specific for tx > > this > > > > disorder. as a vegan, i have avoided lu jiao as my understanding of > > the > > > > harvesting process causes a great deal of pain and suffering to the > > > > deer. the velvet is highly vascular, and my knowledge of the > > harvesting > > > > procedure involves a bloody process, painful and stressful to the > > > > animals. does anyone know something different about the harvesting > > > procedure > > > > of lujiao? Kath Bartlett > > > > > > Kath, as a veterinarian but hopeless carnivore, I agree. > > > > > > From reading WWW, my understanding of the CHINESE use of Antler > > > Velvet is that young, highly vascular velvet is the most highly > > > prized (and priced!), especially young, fresh velvet with some blood > > > remaining in it. > > > > > > IMO, scraping velvet from the horn of a LIVE deer is a very cruel > > > process, EVEN IF local anaesthetic is administered around the horn- > > > base beforehand. I doubt very much if Chinese deer farmers use a > > > local anaesthetic for that purpose. > > > > > > However, as velvet dry weight is tiny relative to the weight of the > > > whole antler, and as antler itself is removed as a medicinal, I think > > > that most deer farmers would remove older (and less vascular) velvet > > > AFTER dehorning the deer. > > > > > > Dehorning, even done under local anaesthetic, is stressful (but less > > > cruel than scraping off velvet from a live deer) for any animal, > > > especially deer unused to human handling. > > > > > > Finally, the documented presence of CWD (Chronic Wasting Disease - a > > > transmissible prion disease akin to BSE / Kuru) in cervids in USA > > > raises a huge question as to the SAFETY of deer products from farming > > > systems that do not practice USA / EU protocols of food traceability > > > and safety. Personally, I would not use antler products from China. > > > > > > Indeed, many colleagues in VBMA (Vet Med Botanical Assoc) avoid > > > almost ALL medicinals of animal origin. Exceptions would include > > > honey, meat, gelatin and other animal products that are deemed > > > acceptable as a normal human food in USA / EU and whose food safety > > > can be assured under our existing food legislation. > > > > > > For most animal-sourced Chinese medicinals, a plant-based substitute > > > can be used instead. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Oriental Medicine > > Experienced, Dedicated, Effective > > > > Flying Dragon Liniment: > > Effective pain relief for muscles & joints > > Formulated by Kath Bartlett, Traditional Chinese Herbalist > > Available at Asheville Center for , or web order at: > > https://www.kamwo.com/shop/product.php? productid=17442 & cat=0 & page=1 > > > > Asheville Center For > > 70 Woodfin Place, Suite West Wing Two > > Asheville, NC 28801 828.258.2777 > > kbartlett <kbartlett%40AcupunctureAsheville.com> > > www.AcupunctureAsheville.com > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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