question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer program

[Guest guest]

My wonderful and masterful Chinese doctor (acup and herbal) who is 72

years young and in practice for 50 years has been using a computer

program for a couple of years and is very serious about its value.

While holding a metal wand in one hand the patient then offers each

hand and foot to have the doctor hold a metal probe on each jing will

point (and i believe source pt...cant remember).

 

The passage and amount of qi in the meridians is assessed and the

program gives other feedback, on the state of the yin, yang, zong qi or

ying qi etc if there is a problem.

Quite amazing...he said the program cost $6,000.

 

Has anyone seen this? any ideas on where to get this?

 

R.Cooper

[Guest guest]

Why on earth would anyone want to use this? After so many years, a

practitioner should know with his hands eyes and ears how to know the

state of yin, yang, ying q, zong qi, etc. Also, I am not so sure

these are qualities that could be measured by a computer device.

More details about this program would be interesting.. . .

 

 

On May 29, 2007, at 12:37 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> My wonderful and masterful Chinese doctor (acup and herbal) who is 72

> years young and in practice for 50 years has been using a computer

> program for a couple of years and is very serious about its value.

> While holding a metal wand in one hand the patient then offers each

> hand and foot to have the doctor hold a metal probe on each jing will

> point (and i believe source pt...cant remember).

>

> The passage and amount of qi in the meridians is assessed and the

> program gives other feedback, on the state of the yin, yang, zong

> qi or

> ying qi etc if there is a problem.

> Quite amazing...he said the program cost $6,000.

>

> Has anyone seen this? any ideas on where to get this?

>

> R.Cooper

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Quite right Zev.

 

I'm very sceptical to hear of a machine that can measure the various aspects

of Qi.

 

Kind regards,

 

Attilio D'Alberto

Doctor of (Beijing, China)

BSc (Hons) TCM MBAcC

Editor

Times

+44 (0) 1189 612512

enquiries

<http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/> www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

<http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/forum/index.php>

www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/forum/index.php

 

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e-mail and any attachments are believed to be virus free, e-mail

communications are not 100% secure and the sender makes no warranty that

this message is secure or virus free. Nothing in this transmission shall or

shall be deemed to constitute an offer or acceptance of an offer or

otherwise have the effect of forming a contract by electronic communication.

Your name and address may be stored to facilitate communications. The sender

is registered in England. Registered office: PO Box 3521, Wokingham,

Berkshire, RG40 9DX, UK.

 

 

Chinese Medicine

Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Z'ev

Rosenberg

29 May 2007 21:53

Chinese Medicine

Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer

program

 

 

 

Why on earth would anyone want to use this? After so many years, a

practitioner should know with his hands eyes and ears how to know the

state of yin, yang, ying q, zong qi, etc. Also, I am not so sure

these are qualities that could be measured by a computer device.

More details about this program would be interesting.. . .

 

 

On May 29, 2007, at 12:37 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> My wonderful and masterful Chinese doctor (acup and herbal) who is 72

> years young and in practice for 50 years has been using a computer

> program for a couple of years and is very serious about its value.

> While holding a metal wand in one hand the patient then offers each

> hand and foot to have the doctor hold a metal probe on each jing will

> point (and i believe source pt...cant remember).

>

> The passage and amount of qi in the meridians is assessed and the

> program gives other feedback, on the state of the yin, yang, zong

> qi or

> ying qi etc if there is a problem.

> Quite amazing...he said the program cost $6,000.

>

> Has anyone seen this? any ideas on where to get this?

>

> R.Cooper

>

>

>

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Z'ev and Attilio...

I remember about 5 years back I attended a workshop and at the end of the

workshop one of the local TCM suppliers demonstrated a qi measurement machine.

It seemed to do a good and general assessment of each meridian that correlated

closely with the findings of senior practitioners at the event.

I was puzzled at the time because, although this machine seemed to be accurate,

I couldn't see it as useful for anyone but a 1st year practitioner struggling to

get their bearings, it simply didn't have any subtlety to it...and with a cost

of (I think?) $4000 it was also an expensive way to get one's bearings.

This sort of thing seems to be of interest to practitioners (perhaps MD

practitioners) who feel uncomfortable with the subjective " art " side of the

medical equation, or perhaps researchers who feel (sorry, " think " ) they need

numbers produced by a machine in order to produce viable medical data.

 

Hugo

 

Attilio D'Alberto <attiliodalberto wrote:

Quite right Zev.

 

I'm very sceptical to hear of a machine that can measure the various aspects

of Qi.

 

Kind regards,

 

Attilio D'Alberto

Doctor of (Beijing, China)

BSc (Hons) TCM MBAcC

Editor

Times

+44 (0) 1189 612512

enquiries

<http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/> www.chinesemedicinetimes.com

<http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/forum/index.php>

www.chinesemedicinetimes.com/forum/index.php

 

This message contains privileged and confidential information intended only

for the addressee. If you have received this message in error you must not

disseminate, copy or take action on it; please notify sender. Although this

e-mail and any attachments are believed to be virus free, e-mail

communications are not 100% secure and the sender makes no warranty that

this message is secure or virus free. Nothing in this transmission shall or

shall be deemed to constitute an offer or acceptance of an offer or

otherwise have the effect of forming a contract by electronic communication.

Your name and address may be stored to facilitate communications. The sender

is registered in England. Registered office: PO Box 3521, Wokingham,

Berkshire, RG40 9DX, UK.

 

Chinese Medicine

Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Z'ev

Rosenberg

29 May 2007 21:53

Chinese Medicine

Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer

program

 

Why on earth would anyone want to use this? After so many years, a

practitioner should know with his hands eyes and ears how to know the

state of yin, yang, ying q, zong qi, etc. Also, I am not so sure

these are qualities that could be measured by a computer device.

More details about this program would be interesting.. . .

 

On May 29, 2007, at 12:37 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> My wonderful and masterful Chinese doctor (acup and herbal) who is 72

> years young and in practice for 50 years has been using a computer

> program for a couple of years and is very serious about its value.

> While holding a metal wand in one hand the patient then offers each

> hand and foot to have the doctor hold a metal probe on each jing will

> point (and i believe source pt...cant remember).

>

> The passage and amount of qi in the meridians is assessed and the

> program gives other feedback, on the state of the yin, yang, zong

> qi or

> ying qi etc if there is a problem.

> Quite amazing...he said the program cost $6,000.

>

> Has anyone seen this? any ideas on where to get this?

>

> R.Cooper

>

>

>

 

[Guest guest]

Roseann:

 

Interesting. Which machine is it? I have heard of a Qi Machine that a pretty

experience practitioner was using. Also the Daryn Starr (sp) machine that keeps

blasting over my computer airways, I believe measures Qi. I just saw a

chiropractor with a fancy computer program at a health fair. Everyone was lined

up to get a picture read out of the nerves in their spine. Most of these

patients became his patients.

 

Anne

-------------- Original message ----------------------

ra6151

> I have been seeing a practitioner (originally from Taiwan) here for a year

> who uses one of these measuring devices (in his private practice, though not

at

> school where he is also a clinic superviser.) I cannot speak to the question

> as to why he would want to use this machine but i can give some anecdotal

> evidence that his diagnoses from this channel measuring match up almost

exactly

> with pulse diagnosis I received from Jeffrey Yuen within the same week, and

> also matched with a teacher of the Shen-Hammer pulse diagnosis system who gave

> me

> an assessment of my pulse in the context of a class, also during the same

> 2-week period. They were all 3 very similar in diagnosis of rather complex

and

> layered patterns, though the language used is somewhat different with each

> practitioner.

>

> So this person I know does not fit either the stereotype of beginning

> practitioner or insecure practitioner, but rather knows the medicine in a deep

> way.

> Maybe he just likes the device and the computer. It also automatically

> tracks all the info about the patient's readings so it is possible to see the

> shifts over a long period of time in treatment.

>

> --RoseAnne

> NYC

>

>

>

> In a message dated 5/29/07 5:48:10 PM, zrosenbe writes:

>

>

> > Why on earth would anyone want to use this? After so many years, a

> > practitioner should know with his hands eyes and ears how to know the

> > state of yin, yang, ying q, zong qi, etc. Also, I am not so sure

> > these are qualities that could be measured by a computer device.

> > More details about this program would be interesting.. . .

> >

> >

> > On May 29, 2007, at 12:37 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

> >

> > > My wonderful and masterful Chinese doctor (acup and herbal) who is 72

> > > years young and in practice for 50 years has been using a computer

> > > program for a couple of years and is very serious about its value.

> > > While holding a metal wand in one hand the patient then offers each

> > > hand and foot to have the doctor hold a metal probe on each jing will

> > > point (and i believe source pt...cant remember).

> > >

> > > The passage and amount of qi in the meridians is assessed and the

> > > program gives other feedback, on the state of the yin, yang, zong

> > > qi or

> > > ying qi etc if there is a problem.

> > > Quite amazing...he said the program cost $6,000.

> > >

> > > Has anyone seen this? any ideas on where to get this?

> > >

> > > R.Cooper

> >

>

>

>

>

> **************************************

> See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Chinese Medicine , " "

<zrosenbe wrote:

>

> Why on earth would anyone want to use this? After so many years, a

> practitioner should know with his hands eyes and ears how to know

the

> state of yin, yang, ying q, zong qi, etc.

 

Z'ev,

 

please do not be so quick to judge this ..Dr Wu is a perfectly seasoned

and competent doctor. His skills are what many of us wish we could have

after his practice of 50 years..

 

R.Cooper

[Guest guest]

although this machine seemed to be accurate, I couldn't see it as

useful for anyone but a 1st year practitioner struggling to get their

bearings

 

I do not think he is using it to " get his bearings " , he got them a long

time ago..I feel it is for different reasons..and I am not judging that-

--in any case I was just wondering what the program is- that is all. I

think we all understand the importance and elegance of traditional

Chinese diagnosis as done by a sensitive and skilled individual.

 

R. Cooper

[Guest guest]

How does a machine measure qi?

 

What is qi that it can be measured?

 

 

On May 29, 2007, at 6:18 PM, anne.crowley wrote:

 

> Roseann:

>

> Interesting. Which machine is it? I have heard of a Qi Machine that

> a pretty experience practitioner was using. Also the Daryn Starr

> (sp) machine that keeps blasting over my computer airways, I

> believe measures Qi. I just saw a chiropractor with a fancy

> computer program at a health fair. Everyone was lined up to get a

> picture read out of the nerves in their spine. Most of these

> patients became his patients.

>

> Anne

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Yes, that is why I am curious about his use of a machine like this

when he has such an amazing level of experience . . .

 

 

On May 29, 2007, at 8:17 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> Z'ev,

>

> please do not be so quick to judge this ..Dr Wu is a perfectly

> seasoned

> and competent doctor. His skills are what many of us wish we could

> have

> after his practice of 50 years..

>

> R.Cooper

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Zev

Perhaps it gives him better results?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

Chinese Medicine

Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:10 PM

Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer

program

 

 

Yes, that is why I am curious about his use of a machine like this

when he has such an amazing level of experience . . .

 

On May 29, 2007, at 8:17 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> Z'ev,

>

> please do not be so quick to judge this ..Dr Wu is a perfectly

> seasoned

> and competent doctor. His skills are what many of us wish we could

> have

> after his practice of 50 years..

>

> R.Cooper

 

[Guest guest]

I have never used it in practice, but I learned a dx method of

measuring the reaction to heat at the jing well points, using a stick

of incense.

 

It seemed to correlate with the pulses quite well, as I recall.

 

Seems like this may be a Hi-tech version of this (japanese?)diagnostic

practice. Its also seems to be very impressive to western patients.

 

Skip

[Guest guest]

Many of my friends who practice in Taiwan told me that having a digital read out

for the patient to take home gives them a level of confidence that the diagnosis

is " scientific. "

I am sure some of the lay people here in the states share that perspective.

 

There could be other reasons and I am curious about it too.

 

Mike L.

 

Alon Marcus <alonmarcus wrote:

Zev

Perhaps it gives him better results?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

 

Chinese Medicine

Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:10 PM

Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer

program

 

Yes, that is why I am curious about his use of a machine like this

when he has such an amazing level of experience . . .

 

 

On May 29, 2007, at 8:17 PM, rcooper1us wrote:

 

> Z'ev,

>

> please do not be so quick to judge this ..Dr Wu is a perfectly

> seasoned

> and competent doctor. His skills are what many of us wish we could

> have

> after his practice of 50 years..

>

> R.Cooper

 

 

[Guest guest]

I know of several systems that use electric diagnostics.

 

There's EAV: Electroacupuncture according to Voll http://www.eav.org/ that

measures all the jing well points and also will use various substances as

homeopathic medicines, herbs etc in their measurements. I know some people

that are very skilled in this (I have been told that it takes several years

to get reliable results) and I have also undergone one of these tests. The

results were amazing: the diagnosis was just as I or an other acupuncturist

had diagnosed myself.

 

Another system that built upon this is MORA therapy http://www.oirf

com/recinstr/mora-pait.html . They use expensive machines (up to 12.500€) to

measure electromagnetic disturbances in channels and systems. These machines

have sofisticated software that can measure things like immune disorders,

amalgame toxicities, tooth infections, candida infections,...areas where I

think TCM does not always function as well. When I have patients that

present with very complex patterns and with whom I suspect immunological

dysfunctions I might refer them out to a Mora therapist to get a diagnosis.

I have gotten good feedback this way.

 

Tom.

 

----

 

Alon Marcus

30/05/2007 4:49:19

Chinese Medicine

Re: Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian

computer program

 

is he using skin resistance measurements?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Recent Activity

7New Members

Visit Your Group

 

[Guest guest]

Chinese Medicine , " Tom Verhaeghe "

<tom.verhaeghe wrote:

>Tom:

Tom:

 

It seems that science and technology are beginning to catch up with

the subtleties of diagnosis in and this definitely

has its benefits. This serves as measurable proof of our theories.

However, when practitioners start relying on machines to do their

work for them, their senses and wisdom atrophy.

 

I remember taking an auricular course in school with an experienced

practitioner who used the ear for diagnosis. I asked him what hand-

held device I should buy for detection of problems. He said, " The

best device is your finger. " I took his advice and I have gotten

very good detecting problems through touch and sight. These are the

things I like about using our minds and bodies for diagnosis:

 

1 - No equipment with all those wires you have to purchase, worry

about keeping in a safe place, or take with you for out-of-office

visits.

2 - No computer software that will have a glitch or has to be

updated.

3 - Your brain will take in data, store it, and configure it in a

unique way that will give you unique wisdom.

4 - Its a lot faster!

 

Eclea

>

> I know of several systems that use electric diagnostics.

>

> There's EAV: Electroacupuncture according to Voll

http://www.eav.org/ that

> measures all the jing well points and also will use various

substances as

> homeopathic medicines, herbs etc in their measurements. I know

some people

> that are very skilled in this (I have been told that it takes

several years

> to get reliable results) and I have also undergone one of these

tests. The

> results were amazing: the diagnosis was just as I or an other

acupuncturist

> had diagnosed myself.

>

> Another system that built upon this is MORA therapy http://www.oirf

> com/recinstr/mora-pait.html . They use expensive machines (up to

12.500€) to

> measure electromagnetic disturbances in channels and systems.

These machines

> have sofisticated software that can measure things like immune

disorders,

> amalgame toxicities, tooth infections, candida infections,...areas

where I

> think TCM does not always function as well. When I have patients

that

> present with very complex patterns and with whom I suspect

immunological

> dysfunctions I might refer them out to a Mora therapist to get a

diagnosis.

> I have gotten good feedback this way.

>

> Tom.

>

> ----

>

> Alon Marcus

> 30/05/2007 4:49:19

> Chinese Medicine

> Re: Re: question for the group---acupuncture

meridian

> computer program

>

> is he using skin resistance measurements?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Recent Activity

> 7New Members

> Visit Your Group

>

[Guest guest]

Check out http://www.cihs.edu/whatsnew/ami_info.asp for another one and this one

has been

doing a lot of research work. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

 

:

tom.verhaeghe: Wed, 30 May 2007 07:52:23 +0200Re:

Re: question for the group---acupuncture meridian computer program

 

 

 

 

I know of several systems that use electric diagnostics. There's EAV:

Electroacupuncture according to Voll http://www.eav.org/ thatmeasures all the

jing well points and also will use various substances ashomeopathic medicines,

herbs etc in their measurements. I know some peoplethat are very skilled in this

(I have been told that it takes several yearsto get reliable results) and I have

also undergone one of these tests. Theresults were amazing: the diagnosis was

just as I or an other acupuncturisthad diagnosed myself. Another system that

built upon this is MORA therapy http://www.oirfcom/recinstr/mora-pait.html .

They use expensive machines (up to 12.500€) tomeasure electromagnetic

disturbances in channels and systems. These machineshave sofisticated software

that can measure things like immune disorders,amalgame toxicities, tooth

infections, candida infections,...areas where Ithink TCM does not always

function as well. When I have patients thatpresent with very complex patterns

and with whom I suspect immunologicaldysfunctions I might refer them out to a

Mora therapist to get a diagnosis.I have gotten good feedback this way. Tom.

---- Alon Marcus 30/05/2007 4:49:19 To:

Chinese Medicine Re: Re: TCM -

question for the group---acupuncture meridiancomputer program is he using skin

resistance measurements?

Recent Activity 7New Members

Visit Your Group

[Guest guest]

What R. Cooper describes does seem like some

variation on EAV or Voll technology, which has

been around for decades. And related to the

" akabane " technique, mentioned by Skip, which I

recall Alex Tiberi was teaching at PCOM 20 years

ago, and how much older in its Japanese (or Chinese?) origins.

 

If qi is understood as less necessarily

mysterious, but rather as a metaphor for

observable behavior of living organism, albeit

with indefinite degrees of variation and

subtlety, then increasing degrees of

quantifiability are inevitable, given basic human

inventiveness. Z'ev asked " What is qi that it

can be measured? " . Something does appear when

measurable by various means. (Lots of Japanese

research, even government sponsored, in this

area.) I would extend or modify his challenge to

say that attempts to REDUCE qi to any such

partial view are questionable. Qi is perceptible,

we can probably all agree. Current science is

discovering fascinating aspects of the complexity

in the pathways from raw sensory inputs through

layers of processing and mappings to our

" perceptions " . That can fire the imagination,

though some use it to fuel simplistic reductionism.

 

Hegel (Phenomenology of the Mind) noted that at

the moment the human mind forms some new

realization about itself, it has in fact

leapfrogged itself into another dimension that it

cannot directly perceive. Similarly, the authors

of " The Secret of the Golden Flower " (c.f. a

parallel reading of Wilhelm's and Cleary's

translations) map out detailed procedures for

turning the light of awareness back unto itself,

to trigger that moment when the golden flower

unfolds within with the luminosity of

Daoist/Buddhist (or you-name-it)

self-realization. But then they note that in fact

awareness cannot directly see itself, but only,

through the cultivation practice, set the scene

for some subtle event wherein it gains some kind

of sideways glance of something and enters that

state of being which words are used to characterize as seeing what is looking.

 

Elea's scenario - " … when practitioners start relying on machines to do their

work for them, their senses and wisdom

atrophy " doesn't automatically follow. That is,

having technology (needles are technology) can

empower the practitioner to perceive and

understand (or resonate) to higher degrees.

Atrophy would be just a lazy option.

 

On the one hand, a hardware/software system

developed at the Pine Street Clinic some 20 years

ago, reportedly objectified pulse pictures to a

degree that measurably accelerated teaching pulse

to students. On the other hand, a study said to

demonstrate the effectiveness of that system was

flawed in that the person who administered the

system, being compared to hands-on experts, was

himself an expert, and co-author of the system.

(This was all documented in an article printed in

CJOM, early 1990's, which I happened to have edited for that publication.)

 

I also recall discussions with Leon Hammer, later

in the 1990's, wherein he envisioned a pressure

sensitive technology to duplicate the degrees of

finger pressure to sense " qi " , " blood " , and

" organ " depths in his system. Having worked, back

in the early 1970's, programming alpha-wave

bio-feedback technology (at that time it was

hybrid, analog-digital technology), I expressed

skepticism in that such technology in fact

requires multiple levels of delicate calibration

to remotely mimic the sensitivity of the human

senses. That is, the difference between the

levels of pressure for a thick-skinned,

large-boned, muscular person vs a thin-skinned,

delicate or emaciated person can be easily,

unconsciously filtered out by an expert. Much

like human senses of vision or hearing can

unconsciously filter out huge amounts of sensory

noise and distortion to create those seemingly

crystal-clear perceptions we think we are simply " sensing " .

 

Clinical records too are a technology, freeing

memory for more interesting and insightful work.

 

 

 

 

--

 

 

Version: 7.5.472 / Virus Database: 269.8.4/825 - Release 5/30/2007 3:03 PM

[Guest guest]

Chris,

 

I am not too lazy to practice the best that I am able

to...I am too lazy to type, however...

Thank you for your reasoned response to my query. You wrote exactly my

sentiments about the way I saw it being used. One can toss out the idea

of such a tool as merely a patient magnet, money maker, or shortcut to

good diagnostic and treament skills--or one can see it's potential to

support findings and enlarge one's vision about each patient's needs.

I don't think anyone would say that it should take the place of

anything we are taught how to do by the 4 examinations.

 

R. Cooper

[Guest guest]

>

> Yes, that is why I am curious about his use of a machine like this

> when he has such an amazing level of experience . . .

>

> Z'ev,

I think it is because he is still open to learning and seeing new

things and is not insecure in that.

 

R.Cooper

[Guest guest]

>

> Many of my friends who practice in Taiwan told me that having a

digital read out for the patient to take home gives them a level of

confidence that the diagnosis is " scientific. "

>

 

No one gets a readout to take home.

 

R.Cooper

[Guest guest]

Chris,

My compass in this scenario is taken from the work of E.F.

Schumacher, who wrote " Small Is Beautiful " . He distinguishes between

a tool, which is any technology that serves a human being's purpose,

and a machine, which enslaves a human being to an agenda. Our use of

technology can either be as humankind's servant, or we serve the

machines.

 

 

On May 31, 2007, at 2:56 AM, wrote:

 

> Elea's scenario - " … when practitioners start relying on machines

> to do their

> work for them, their senses and wisdom

> atrophy " doesn't automatically follow. That is,

> having technology (needles are technology) can

> empower the practitioner to perceive and

> understand (or resonate) to higher degrees.

> Atrophy would be just a lazy option.

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Chris, I enjoyed your post and I would like to add 4 (hopefully sapient- i

mean, salient) points (and I hope everyone forgives my " Robot Empire " post):

 

Chris wrote:

" ...subtlety, then increasing degrees of

quantifiability are inevitable, given basic human

inventiveness. "

 

This is the race to, or process of, self-knowledge. A naive viewpoint of this

process presupposes that the chasers and knowers will catch up to the " all " or

" oneness " . A mature viewpoint aknowledges that we shall know more, due to our

inventiveness, as you put it, and yet we will never quite grasp " it " , or at

least we will not achieve a constant grasp of " it " and certainly we will not

achieve a cerebral grasp of " it " . As you say, it is all an attempt to get a

" sideways " glimpse. And machines help in the knowledge. However, in the end,

machines end up being no more than a type of " siddhi " (a " supernatural power "

which only distracts from true enlightenment).

 

Chris wrote:

" Elea's scenario - " … when practitioners start relying on machines to do their

work for them, their senses and wisdom

atrophy " doesn't automatically follow. That is,

having technology (needles are technology) can

empower the practitioner to perceive and

understand (or resonate) to higher degrees.

Atrophy would be just a lazy option. "

 

You are perfectly right, Chris. It is a choice. My contention, and perhaps

Elea's intimation, being that it is a very easy choice to make (to be lazy. for

me anyway).

 

:

" ...like human senses of vision or hearing can

unconsciously filter out huge amounts of sensory

noise and distortion... "

 

The above is very true. For example, right now I am filtering out in excess of

99% of reality. There are times when my filtration system is functioning so

excellently that I cannot see past the tip of my own nose. I am glad to

report supremely high personal functioning in this regard.

 

:

" Clinical records too are a technology, freeing

memory for more interesting and insightful work. "

 

A last broadside: your comment above reminds me of the old idea that the

ancients did not need to be schooled in the way of the dao etc. In other words,

they did not need technology (writing, reading, even medicine as we know it).

Implication being that schooling (and technology) is necessary only for dullards

who easily stray from the way, people who cannot live naturally. I feel it

personally as a mild sort of shame that I do not even, at the least, have any of

the classics memorised.

 

Thanks,

Hugo

 

 

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[Guest guest]

" " <zrosenbe wrote:

>

> Yes, that is why I am curious about his use of a machine like this

> when he has such an amazing level of experience . . .

>

 

In my opinion, Dr. Wu is open to trying and learning new things and

is not insecure about this. Also to clarify a point that was made by

someone about giving patients a readout for their own validation of

the medicine..he does not give one out to them.

I think he as much as anyone would agree that the doctor of CM must

employ the 4 examinations rigorously and that is the foremost thing

of importance.

 

R.Cooper

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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