Guest guest Posted April 2, 2007 Report Share Posted April 2, 2007 Thanks for all the reply's, after seeing the patient for the second visit I believe it's a neck problem due to the fact it's worse turning head to left and up. I can't elicit any Pain in his shoulder area. he is getting radiating pain down left arm. Seems to be Th-Gb channels. First Tx helped but still has problem. I did a Tan tx with him laying face up GB41 & TH5 SI3 & BL62, then locals into lower cervicles, GB20,21, TH 15 usuals. Some cupping(lower cervicles) & Tui Na in that area. Patient said slightly better, I wonder if an adjustment is in order? Thnaks again Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 an important thing about r. tan's method is to spread the image. so don't just use gb41, use 39 & 40 as well, etc. Chinese Medicine , " snydez99 " <snydez99 wrote: > > Thanks for all the reply's, after seeing the patient for the second > visit I believe it's a neck problem due to the fact it's worse turning > head to left and up. I can't elicit any Pain in his shoulder area. he > is getting radiating pain down left arm. Seems to be Th-Gb channels. > First Tx helped but still has problem. I did a Tan tx with him laying > face up GB41 & TH5 SI3 & BL62, then locals into lower cervicles, > GB20,21, TH 15 usuals. Some cupping(lower cervicles) & Tui Na in that > area. Patient said slightly better, I wonder if an adjustment is in > order? Thnaks again Steve > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2007 Report Share Posted April 3, 2007 Hi there Steve. My two cents: I have been learning japanese-style acupuncture recently (Nagano-sensei's school) and am very favourably impressed so far. One theoretical axiom of that school is that oketsu, or stagnant blood, is the cause of many symptoms that resist usually efficient, time-tested approaches in acupuncture. Oketsu is diagnosed through abdominal palpation: pain and stiffness to the left of the umbilicus, between E-26 / E-28 / R-15 is the main sign. Treatment follows a very simple but very powerful, as I've had the chance to verify, protocol: needling left F-4 and P-5, that last in its japanese location. After only a few minutes, usually, pain and stiffness disappear from the abdomen and the condition improves quite significantly at once (if it's something you can test on the spot, naturally) and progressively over the subsequent days. Maybe it's worth a try? Keep up the good work, Daniel Luz 2007/4/2, snydez99 <snydez99: > > Thanks for all the reply's, after seeing the patient for the second > visit I believe it's a neck problem due to the fact it's worse turning > head to left and up. I can't elicit any Pain in his shoulder area. he > is getting radiating pain down left arm. Seems to be Th-Gb channels. > First Tx helped but still has problem. I did a Tan tx with him laying > face up GB41 & TH5 SI3 & BL62, then locals into lower cervicles, > GB20,21, TH 15 usuals. Some cupping(lower cervicles) & Tui Na in that > area. Patient said slightly better, I wonder if an adjustment is in > order? Thnaks again Steve > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 Daniel; Are you still talking about shoulder pain, or strictly abdomen pain. This is very interesting. I believe blood stagnation is the cause of many ills, physical and mental. Can you translate these point locations to our traditional names, please. Anne -------------- Original message ---------------------- " Daniel Luz " <paraodaniel > Hi there Steve. My two cents: > > I have been learning japanese-style acupuncture recently (Nagano-sensei's > school) and am very favourably impressed so far. One theoretical axiom of > that school is that oketsu, or stagnant blood, is the cause of many symptoms > that resist usually efficient, time-tested approaches in acupuncture. Oketsu > is diagnosed through abdominal palpation: pain and stiffness to the left of > the umbilicus, between E-26 / E-28 / R-15 is the main sign. Treatment > follows a very simple but very powerful, as I've had the chance to verify, > protocol: needling left F-4 and P-5, that last in its japanese location. > After only a few minutes, usually, pain and stiffness disappear from the > abdomen and the condition improves quite significantly at once (if it's > something you can test on the spot, naturally) and progressively over the > subsequent days. Maybe it's worth a try? > > Keep up the good work, > Daniel Luz > > 2007/4/2, snydez99 <snydez99: > > > > Thanks for all the reply's, after seeing the patient for the second > > visit I believe it's a neck problem due to the fact it's worse turning > > head to left and up. I can't elicit any Pain in his shoulder area. he > > is getting radiating pain down left arm. Seems to be Th-Gb channels. > > First Tx helped but still has problem. I did a Tan tx with him laying > > face up GB41 & TH5 SI3 & BL62, then locals into lower cervicles, > > GB20,21, TH 15 usuals. Some cupping(lower cervicles) & Tui Na in that > > area. Patient said slightly better, I wonder if an adjustment is in > > order? Thnaks again Steve > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2007 Report Share Posted April 4, 2007 Yes, Anne. The points for the oketsu treatment are L-5 Chize and LV-4 Zhongfeng. Sorry, it's that I usually use the names to refer to the cavities and inadvertently wrote the codes in their portuguese version, dumb me. The japanese school locates Chize trough palpation of the elbow crease, fingers 45 degrees to the skin in the direction of the channel flux: first over the crease itself, then distally and then proximally, and that at about the midpoint between the tendon and the end of the crease, i.e. right on the middle of it. Uh, was that understandable? Anyway, the most painful (or " live " as the japanese name it) location is the best one to needle. It would be well to keep in mind that japanese-style acupuncture is very, very suave. I am sure this has a bearing on the efficaciousness of their protocols. I am cautiously enthusiastic about this protocol, as it has wide-ranging repercussions. If you consider that acupuncture is mostly a means of reconfiguring one's vital order through the manipulation of qi and has so far been considered of small use in blood-dynamic issues (prescriptions clearly having the upper hand here), well, if one should develop an useful (and, er, bloody simple!) way of dealing with stagnant blood - wether through moving, breaking, scattering or whatever - that would open up a whole new world of treatment possibilities, stagnant blood being the particularly pernicious evil it is, generating blood vacuity (think of all the associated conditions/symptoms just there! insomnia, nervousness, palpitations, night sweating, dizziness, weariness, poor memory, emotional instability, amenorrhea, methrorragia etc...) and toxic heat (heaps more, including some ugly skin conditions, autoimmune conditions, recurrent diseases with skin heat manifestations etc). It's what I would call a " major breakthrough " . I am still beginning to use the technique, however, so I just consider the possibilities heartening but will bide my time and see what actual response is. Cheers, Daniel. 2007/4/4, anne.crowley <anne.crowley: > > Daniel; > > Are you still talking about shoulder pain, or strictly abdomen pain. This > is very interesting. I believe blood stagnation is the cause of many ills, > physical and mental. > Can you translate these point locations to our traditional names, please. > > Anne > > > -------------- Original message ---------------------- > " Daniel Luz " <paraodaniel <paraodaniel%40gmail.com>> > > Hi there Steve. My two cents: > > > > I have been learning japanese-style acupuncture recently > (Nagano-sensei's > > school) and am very favourably impressed so far. One theoretical axiom > of > > that school is that oketsu, or stagnant blood, is the cause of many > symptoms > > that resist usually efficient, time-tested approaches in acupuncture. > Oketsu > > is diagnosed through abdominal palpation: pain and stiffness to the left > of > > the umbilicus, between E-26 / E-28 / R-15 is the main sign. Treatment > > follows a very simple but very powerful, as I've had the chance to > verify, > > protocol: needling left F-4 and P-5, that last in its japanese location. > > After only a few minutes, usually, pain and stiffness disappear from the > > abdomen and the condition improves quite significantly at once (if it's > > something you can test on the spot, naturally) and progressively over > the > > subsequent days. Maybe it's worth a try? > > > > Keep up the good work, > > Daniel Luz > > > > 2007/4/2, snydez99 <snydez99 <snydez99%40>>: > > > > > > Thanks for all the reply's, after seeing the patient for the second > > > visit I believe it's a neck problem due to the fact it's worse turning > > > head to left and up. I can't elicit any Pain in his shoulder area. he > > > is getting radiating pain down left arm. Seems to be Th-Gb channels. > > > First Tx helped but still has problem. I did a Tan tx with him laying > > > face up GB41 & TH5 SI3 & BL62, then locals into lower cervicles, > > > GB20,21, TH 15 usuals. Some cupping(lower cervicles) & Tui Na in that > > > area. Patient said slightly better, I wonder if an adjustment is in > > > order? Thnaks again Steve > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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