Guest guest Posted February 19, 2007 Report Share Posted February 19, 2007 All, I have learned that persons in Israel and Europe, including schools and teachers, are distributing an illegally scanned copy of Paul Unschuld's " Huang Di Nei Jing Su Wen " published by the University of California Press. If any of the honest among us should happen across an email containing this pirated text, please contact me so that I can advise you on how to forward the email in a manner that will allow tracing its source. Any other relevant information will also be welcome; I will provide anonymity if you so request. This means that these persons have so little respect for the field as to prioritize their own financial benefit over the several years of effort that have been invested in creating this source of knowledge. Yes, it is a lack of personal integrity. It is the act of persons whose concern for the field is less than the $95US this book costs. But, more than that, and more importantly, these are people whose understanding of the root principles of Chinese medicine, of the communicating nature of qi, of the nature of personal integrity and intention, is so weak as to void any theoretical or practical knowledge they may have. If you attend their schools, take you money back and leave. Find someone to study with who respects the knowledge and principles that you have paid to learn. No words can adequately describe the disgust I feel for these criminals. Let's drive them from the field. Bob Felt Paradigm Publications www.paradigm-pubs.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2007 Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 I'd like to point out that the following statements are to open discussion for solutions. I personally own a huge library of CM books that has cost me more than just money to have and that while I personally have published under open and public licenses more writings (mostly software source code) than you can imagine, I strongly advocate peoples rights to choose their manor of licensing of publications and proudly own all the software on my computer, etc. (I wonder how many can say that...) > Yes, it is a lack of personal integrity. It is the act of persons > whose concern for the field is less than the $95US this book costs. I'd like to point out that the issue here is that peoples personal moral/ethical views can not be forced upon some one else and the fruits of their efforts. That is what is done when some one possesses a digital copy (or xerox) of a book with out owning the original or having some license to it from the publisher/author. It is not always about " personal integrity " , it is often short sightedness on the affects of ones actions and overlooking the previous statement. I don't think the current approach is going to solve a thing. It has done nothing in other fields as the efforts of the RIAA to attack 12 year olds for stolen music has increased piracy and fixed nothing. I of course am not advocating negotiating with terrorists who abuse the law to force things their way, I am advocating discussion and more importantly actions, to solve the problem as completely as possible. So instead let us look at the root causes and hope that publishers and consumers will rise to balance the yin/yang and so bring prosperity to the field and all. Many people would feel that the information in these works is such that it should be more accessible and key works and references in the field that are not made available easily degrade the field. Yet rightfully so if no one is supporting such research and translations than the field fails also. Yin/Yang People are digitizing works for personal use that they own ever day (completely legal if they own the work). Once digital it is of course easier to hand to another that owns the original (also legal provided they own the original work). The problem is it also opens the door for those that do not own the original work and fall to their " evil inclination " and overlook the things above. Yin/Yang Key reference works _need_ to be at the side of students and practitioners and very few are available in digital form, it is not realistic to walk around with them. This forces the serious students to find a means to obtain them in digital form. Sometimes the legal means are physically or financially outside the ballpark of any student ($300 scanner and lots of time) or struggling practitioner and again they fall to their " evil inclination " and overlook the things above. Yin/Yang School libraries are often inadequate and those not near schools have no access to them. A library of digital books " just for reference " when needed is another tempting cause for people to overlook the above. Yin/Yang This can go on for some time and perhaps it would be constructive to bring out the complete etiology, but I think there is a clear pattern. There is a need for more availability of information to individuals in more flexible and affordable formats to quench the deficient fire of piracy that results in a clear exhaustion of funds for the researchers, authors and publishers combined with clear depression leading to emotional (all be it justified) responses to the problem. > No words can adequately describe the disgust I feel for these > criminals. Let's drive them from the field. If you drive out all those that ever has lapses of " integrity " as you say, you will have no one left to purchase the books either. So lets look at the solution landscape. I'll write my piece but I am sure that with the minds on this list alone more solutions exist and I think any solution that attacks the root will affect that long term cure that TCM often brings over western " branch " medicine. The ideal solution in my mind is one taken by the publishers in the computer field. I invite you to take a look at O'Reilly's Safari. http://safari.oreilly.com/ No one knows better how to pirate books than computer geeks. I don't think a single book in the field is not available on Usenet for free as a pirated download. The computer publishing solution, create a rental model on a vast library with search functionality. Today no one serious in the field wouldn't have a subscription. Schools require it or at least encourage the students to have a subscription. I and my pears often own many of the books we wish to read cover to cover in addition to having them on our digital bookshelf at safari. Other possible solutions are _reasonably priced_ (ie. reducing prices for the fact that there are no costs involved in printing and almost nothing for distribution) digital copies with DRM (digital rights management) they allow access to the works but not copying and have limited printing abilities if at all. I own many such e-books and while I don't like DRM based solutions personally, they still beat physical works for people with needs like mine. There are already well established distribution channels for this type of work (ie. e-books). There are many other hybrid solutions as well between these two. Amazon introduced an interesting idea, where if you purchase the physical book you can upgrade for a few dollars to also have the digital version. Another excellent solution. I have been intending on contacting your for some time and asked Nancy Brown from the AMC school in Miami to make such an introduction, but between the birth of my most recent child and some business issues I have not had this opportunity. I would be happy to help you and the other publishers work on a solution like any of the above if there is interest. I have the technical skills and knowledge and am not looking to profit beyond having access to the information. Feel free to contact me personally by e- mail if you wish to follow up on it and I'll give you my phone #s, etc. David Botton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2007 Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 I guess this will be my first message on this forum. As an introduction, I recently finished TCM school in Israel at an older age but I don't think that this has anything to do with integrity or standards. I agree that it would have been easier for me to manage with books on my laptop instead of shlepping them to school - but I took the challenge, and the summer before clinic sat down and made my own condensed versions of acupuncture and herb books (to include class notes with it). Of course it was tedious and I know that not everyone wants to do it, but almost everyone wanted a copy of my notes, charts of DD, etc. I told them that the most I learned what when I did it all myself! I think that we can raise the standards a bit, and show the students what it means to really " study " something - especially something that they have a passion for - to make the material " theirs. " One of my best experiences was sitting with samples of all the herbs, the summer before starting school, and sorting them out, checking them out and " connecting to them. " All of this is hard work, but I think that a person who intends to pursue this field and make a living out of it, should take the time, whatever that is, to feel comfortable with the material. If this means making their own books, etc., then I think that the instructors should recommend it. Joyce - David Botton Chinese Medicine Tuesday, February 20, 2007 6:20 PM Re: More Piracy I'd like to point out that the following statements are to open discussion for solutions. I personally own a huge library of CM books that has cost me more than just money to have and that while I personally have published under open and public licenses more writings (mostly software source code) than you can imagine, I strongly advocate peoples rights to choose their manor of licensing of publications and proudly own all the software on my computer, etc. (I wonder how many can say that...) > Yes, it is a lack of personal integrity. It is the act of persons > whose concern for the field is less than the $95US this book costs. I'd like to point out that the issue here is that peoples personal moral/ethical views can not be forced upon some one else and the fruits of their efforts. That is what is done when some one possesses a digital copy (or xerox) of a book with out owning the original or having some license to it from the publisher/author. It is not always about " personal integrity " , it is often short sightedness on the affects of ones actions and overlooking the previous statement. I don't think the current approach is going to solve a thing. It has done nothing in other fields as the efforts of the RIAA to attack 12 year olds for stolen music has increased piracy and fixed nothing. I of course am not advocating negotiating with terrorists who abuse the law to force things their way, I am advocating discussion and more importantly actions, to solve the problem as completely as possible. So instead let us look at the root causes and hope that publishers and consumers will rise to balance the yin/yang and so bring prosperity to the field and all. Many people would feel that the information in these works is such that it should be more accessible and key works and references in the field that are not made available easily degrade the field. Yet rightfully so if no one is supporting such research and translations than the field fails also. Yin/Yang People are digitizing works for personal use that they own ever day (completely legal if they own the work). Once digital it is of course easier to hand to another that owns the original (also legal provided they own the original work). The problem is it also opens the door for those that do not own the original work and fall to their " evil inclination " and overlook the things above. Yin/Yang Key reference works _need_ to be at the side of students and practitioners and very few are available in digital form, it is not realistic to walk around with them. This forces the serious students to find a means to obtain them in digital form. Sometimes the legal means are physically or financially outside the ballpark of any student ($300 scanner and lots of time) or struggling practitioner and again they fall to their " evil inclination " and overlook the things above. Yin/Yang School libraries are often inadequate and those not near schools have no access to them. A library of digital books " just for reference " when needed is another tempting cause for people to overlook the above. Yin/Yang This can go on for some time and perhaps it would be constructive to bring out the complete etiology, but I think there is a clear pattern. There is a need for more availability of information to individuals in more flexible and affordable formats to quench the deficient fire of piracy that results in a clear exhaustion of funds for the researchers, authors and publishers combined with clear depression leading to emotional (all be it justified) responses to the problem. > No words can adequately describe the disgust I feel for these > criminals. Let's drive them from the field. If you drive out all those that ever has lapses of " integrity " as you say, you will have no one left to purchase the books either. So lets look at the solution landscape. I'll write my piece but I am sure that with the minds on this list alone more solutions exist and I think any solution that attacks the root will affect that long term cure that TCM often brings over western " branch " medicine. The ideal solution in my mind is one taken by the publishers in the computer field. I invite you to take a look at O'Reilly's Safari. http://safari.oreilly.com/ No one knows better how to pirate books than computer geeks. I don't think a single book in the field is not available on Usenet for free as a pirated download. The computer publishing solution, create a rental model on a vast library with search functionality. Today no one serious in the field wouldn't have a subscription. Schools require it or at least encourage the students to have a subscription. I and my pears often own many of the books we wish to read cover to cover in addition to having them on our digital bookshelf at safari. Other possible solutions are _reasonably priced_ (ie. reducing prices for the fact that there are no costs involved in printing and almost nothing for distribution) digital copies with DRM (digital rights management) they allow access to the works but not copying and have limited printing abilities if at all. I own many such e-books and while I don't like DRM based solutions personally, they still beat physical works for people with needs like mine. There are already well established distribution channels for this type of work (ie. e-books). There are many other hybrid solutions as well between these two. Amazon introduced an interesting idea, where if you purchase the physical book you can upgrade for a few dollars to also have the digital version. Another excellent solution. I have been intending on contacting your for some time and asked Nancy Brown from the AMC school in Miami to make such an introduction, but between the birth of my most recent child and some business issues I have not had this opportunity. I would be happy to help you and the other publishers work on a solution like any of the above if there is interest. I have the technical skills and knowledge and am not looking to profit beyond having access to the information. Feel free to contact me personally by e- mail if you wish to follow up on it and I'll give you my phone #s, etc. David Botton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 20, 2007 Report Share Posted February 20, 2007 E-Books are not for everyone and most like myself almost always have two copies, one paper (for cover to cover reading and studying) and one electronic (for reference and research) when possible. Different students learn in different ways, perhaps you should consider sharing your notes. I am currently working to migrate notes I place at http://www.mindbodycures.com to the new Wiki, http://www.tcmpedia.com that would be an excellent place to make them available. (Sorry, it is taking me some time to bring the notes over, any one who is interested in helping feel free to copy anything off of http://www.mindbodycures.com to the the wiki) BTW, I am working on the OK, but a friend took excellent photos of about 306 herbs that we should be able to put up on http://www.tcmpedia.com as well. David Botton Chinese Medicine , Joyce <joyces wrote: << I agree that it would have been easier for me to manage with books on my laptop instead of shlepping them to school - but I took the challenge, and the summer before clinic sat down and made my own condensed versions of acupuncture and herb books (to include class notes with it). >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 21, 2007 Report Share Posted February 21, 2007 (Tue, 20 Feb 2007 16:20:28 -0000 " David Botton " <david…) David's points indicate that a critical turn has gradually arrived, from which there's no turning back. I'm reminded of the notion I think from the book " The Medium is the Message " by Marshall MacLuhan, a couple of decades ago that new media at first tend to simply ape the older media, and then gradually evolve the ways to more fully exploit their (new) possibilities. Example, early TV consisted of video-ized radio shows. Digital publishing at first mimics hardcopy publishing. We're seeing people beginning, naturally, to exploit digital and internet media in a way which confronts traditional publishing media. It's messy, as the evolution of human systems tends to be. At first resistance and conflict. Gradually some letting go and adapting. Recently, I think it was Steve Jobs (founder, CEO Apple Computer) who argued for relaxing the attitude in the digital recording industries towards more and more elaborate protection schemes. These simply challenge the kids, who inevitably crack the systems. He also had some proposal towards a system to preserve some sense of responsibility in some new form. On the other hand, any kind of total replacement of hardcopy is not quite on the horizon yet. The prediction of a paperless society has been made regularly for decades now, while more paper is used than ever before. Also, the technology is in some ways not unequivocally superior. With even the best digital displays (monitors), the resolution is still far coarser then fine printing on paper, and the physical taxation is significantly greater (as many of us see in the common head, neck, shoulder and back pain related to computer work). As David mentioned, e-books are not for everyone. If I'm going to read some large amount of text, I tend to print it out. Bob Felt's position is also defensible, but it's maybe like holding one's finger in the dyke against the flood. The " intellectual property rights " issue, in the blooming " age of globalization " is analogous, and virtually out of control. Just today New York Times, Science section front page article on " In the World of Life-Saving Drugs, a Growing Epidemic of Deadly Fakes " . Mostly out of China, massive export and consumption of fake anti-malarial drug (the one based on Artemesia), which results in ca. 200,000 deaths annually. Worse yet, some of them contain small (sub-clinical) amounts of artemisinin (the pharmaceutical derivative of Artemesia), which doesn't help patients much but actually promotes drug-resistant mutation of the pathogen. The effectiveness of this remedy may soon go the way of other, formerly effective but now useless remedies, such as chloroquine. The article indicates that while such production is large-scale (manufacturing plants, not home-grown kitchen labs) in China, it's punished severely if used on the Chinese themselves. Also, their traditional business model creates problems. The man who led the Chinese version of the FDA (USA drug monitoring agency) in its first years (1998-2005) and his top aides were recently arrested for taking bribes and approving drugs that killed Chinese babies. Export is different. Business is business. The government approaches this area with the lip-service and relative inaction comparable to the area of piracy in entertainment and software media. BTW, we, as users of Chinese exported herbs, are probably fortunate in that herbs are exported for the Chinese practitioners in around the world, as well as others like us. -- Version: 7.5.441 / Virus Database: 268.18.3/694 - Release 2/20/2007 1:44 PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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