Cinnabar (dangerous) and mercury detox

[Guest guest]

Hi All, & John,

 

wrote:

> Concerning Mercury detox: Garlic is listed here. I've heard that miso

> soup can help (miso/seaweed) Hai zao (wakame seaweed) and Kombu (kelp)

> is known to cleanse the body from mercury and also cleanses mercury

> from the seas, therefore most seaweed may contain higher levels of

> mercury. The seaweed from Hawaii (isolated from pollution) tends to be

> cleaner. In Prescription for Nutritional Healing (Balch and Balch 2nd

> ed) pgs 516-518, Essential nutrients listed: Glutathione plus

> L-methionine and L-cysteine Selenium and Vitamin E. Very important:

> Apple pectin, garlic, kelp or alfalfa, Vita A, Vit C Important: Vit. B

> complex Helpful: Brewer's yeast, HCl, Lecithin granules or caps

 

John, many thanks for that.

 

However, I am very sceptical of claims that specific herbs can detox heavy

metals effectively. For example, Medline has NO reliable hits for the profile:

mercury AND (detoxification OR elimination) AND (herb OR herbs OR

kampo OR herbal)

 

[i discount one hit by Omura et al using the BDORT method to show that

Chinese parsley (cilanthro) could remove Hg].

 

Cinnabar is a no-no for me; I would not use it internally. I would not use it

externally either if safer alternatives were available. Apart from being

banned by many national drug regulation authorities, is can cause mercury

build-up in tissues. See:

 

Young YH, Chuu JJ, Liu SH, Lin-Shiau SY. Neurotoxic mechanism of

cinnabar and mercuric sulfide on the vestibulo-ocular reflex system of

guinea pigs.Toxicol Sci. 2002 Jun;67(2):256-63. Dept of Otolaryngology,

National Taiwan University Hospital, No. 1 Section 1, Jen-Ai Road, Taipei,

Taiwan. Cinnabar, a naturally occurring mercuric sulfide (HgS), has been

combined with Chinese herbal medicine as a sedative for more than 2000

years. To date, its neurotoxic effect on the vestibulo-ocular reflex (VOR)

system has not been reported. By means of a caloric test coupled with

electronystagmographic recordings, the effect of commercial HgS and

cinnabar on the VOR system of guinea pigs was studied. HgS or cinnabar

was administered orally (1.0 g/kg) to Hartley-strain guinea pigs once daily

for 7 consecutive days. A battery of electrophysiological, biochemical, and

histopathological examinations were performed. The results showed that

HgS induced a 60% caloric response abnormality (40% caloric

hyperfunction and 20% hypofunction), whereas the abnormal responses

appeared to be more severe (six out of six) in the cinnabar group. The Hg

contents of whole blood and cerebellum were increased and correlated to

their neurotoxic effects on the VOR system, indicating that both insoluble

HgS and cinnabar could be absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract and

distributed to the cerebellum. Although the vestibular labyrinth revealed no

remarkable change under light microscopy, loss of Purkinje cells in the

cerebellum was detected, and the enzymatic Na(+)/K(+)-ATPase activity of

cerebellum (a higher inhibitory center of the VOR system) was significantly

inhibited by HgS and cinnabar. Moreover, cerebellar nitric oxide (NO)

production was increased significantly. Hence, we tentatively conclude that

the increased Hg contents in the cerebellum following oral administration of

HgS and cinnabar were responsible, at least in part, for the detrimental

neurotoxic effect on the VOR system. Potentially, decreasing Na(+)/K(+)-

ATPase activity and increasing NO production within the cerebellar

regulatory center are postulated to mediate this VOR dysfunction caused by

the mercurial compounds and cinnabar. PMID: 12011485 [PubMed -

indexed for MEDLINE]

 

Kang-Yum E, Oransky SH. Chinese patent medicine as a potential source

of mercury poisoning. Vet Hum Toxicol. 1992 Jun;34(3):235-8. Links

Hudson Valley Poison Control Center, Nyack, NY 10960. This research is

an effort to create an awareness of the potential hazards of some Chinese

patent medicines which contain mercurial ingredients. This should be of

consideration when screening symptomatic patients who are of Asian ethnic

background or other users of these medicines. This research discusses

reported cases of mercury poisoning related to the use of Chinese patent

medicines and the potential toxicity of cinnabar (red mercuric sulfide) and

calomel (mercurous chloride), 2 mercurials commonly used in these

medicines. A list of mercurial-containing Chinese patent medicines available

on the open market in North America has been compiled, together with their

traditional uses and mercurial contents and is presented as a quick

reference for Specialists in Poison Information. This class of medicine may

not pose a problem when used appropriately; however, its misuse, abuse,

overdosage and improper storage can lead to serious mercury poisoning.

PMID: 1609495 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

See also: Moore C, Adler R. Herbal vitamins: lead toxicity and

developmental delay. Pediatrics. 2000 Sep;106(3):600-2. Division of

General Pediatrics, Childrens Hospital Los Angeles, Los Angeles, CA

90027, USA. A case of lead poisoning from an Indian herbal vitamin is

presented. The patient who was developmentally delayed was given an

herbal vitamin from India to strengthen his brain. The tablet contained large

amounts of lead and mercury, leading to significant lead burden.

Vulnerability of families and lack of awareness of health care professionals

of dangers of unknown herbal supplementation are discussed. PMID:

10969109 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

 

Best regards,

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Phil,

 

--- < wrote:

 

> Cinnabar is a no-no for me; I would not use it

> internally. I would not use it

> externally either if safer alternatives were

> available. Apart from being

> banned by many national drug regulation authorities,

> is can cause mercury

> build-up in tissues. See:

 

I don't use it either, but more because this way I

cannot be accused of anything. Unfortunately, there is

no way to prove " innocence " on this topic, since it is

a commonly accepted idea that mercury is toxic in all

its forms. Except dental amalgam where it is still

used internally in contact with membraneous surfaces

for extremely long periods of time.

 

> cinnabar group. The Hg

> contents of whole blood and cerebellum were

> increased and correlated to

> their neurotoxic effects on the VOR system,

> indicating that both insoluble

> HgS and cinnabar could be absorbed from the

> gastrointestinal tract and

> distributed to the cerebellum.

 

Ah, but did the guinea pigs have heart-fire?

 

> This class of medicine may

> not pose a problem when used appropriately; however,

> its misuse, abuse,

> overdosage and improper storage can lead to serious

> mercury poisoning.

 

I would like to see elaborations on all 4 points

above.

Apart from that, it was made clear to me by my

teacher that a weak digestion was a strong

contraindication for cinnabar use. Having so many

people presenting with chronically weak digestions,

with or without heart-fire, precludes use of cinnabar

/ zhu sha in the vast majority of cases for me. Having

said that, I reiterate that I do not, in fact, use zhu

sha in practice even in those few cases where it might

seem appropriate due to its indefensibility as a

non-toxic substance.

 

Hugo

 

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

Hey guys,

 

" ... commonly accepted idea that mercury is toxic in all

its forms. Except dental amalgam where it is still

used internally in contact with membraneous surfaces

for extremely long periods of time. "

 

Actually this is incorrect as is evidenced by CA statutes whereby

a dentist must inform their patients of its dangers and provide

alternatives. The ADA has been blocking the publics knowledge

for fear of lawsuits. There has been a growing number of dentists

who are avoiding amalgams and some patients are seeing a reversal

of various health related conditions as well. Remember that the EPA

has no listed safe level for mercury exposure and it likes the brain and

nervous tissues.

 

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

________________________________

> Chinese Medicine

> subincor

> Tue, 9 Jan 2007 19:00:39 +0000

> Re: Cinnabar (dangerous) and mercury detox

>

> Hi Phil,

> --- <<> wrote:

> > Cinnabar is a no-no for me; I would not use it

> > internally. I would not use it

> > externally either if safer alternatives were

> > available. Apart from being

> > banned by many national drug regulation authorities,

> > is can cause mercury

> > build-up in tissues. See:

> I don't use it either, but more because this way I

> cannot be accused of anything. Unfortunately, there is

> no way to prove " innocence " on this topic, since it is

> a commonly accepted idea that mercury is toxic in all

> its forms. Except dental amalgam where it is still

> used internally in contact with membraneous surfaces

> for extremely long periods of time.

> > cinnabar group. The Hg

> > contents of whole blood and cerebellum were

> > increased and correlated to

> > their neurotoxic effects on the VOR system,

> > indicating that both insoluble

> > HgS and cinnabar could be absorbed from the

> > gastrointestinal tract and

> > distributed to the cerebellum.

> Ah, but did the guinea pigs have heart-fire?

> > This class of medicine may

> > not pose a problem when used appropriately; however,

> > its misuse, abuse,

> > overdosage and improper storage can lead to serious

> > mercury poisoning.

> I would like to see elaborations on all 4 points

> above.

> Apart from that, it was made clear to me by my

> teacher that a weak digestion was a strong

> contraindication for cinnabar use. Having so many

> people presenting with chronically weak digestions,

> with or without heart-fire, precludes use of cinnabar

> / zhu sha in the vast majority of cases for me. Having

> said that, I reiterate that I do not, in fact, use zhu

> sha in practice even in those few cases where it might

> seem appropriate due to its indefensibility as a

> non-toxic substance.

> Hugo

> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

>

 

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[Guest guest]

Hey Mike,

 

--- mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote:

 

> " ... commonly accepted idea that mercury is toxic in

> all

> its forms. Except dental amalgam where it is still

> used internally in contact with membraneous surfaces

> for extremely long periods of time. "

 

> Actually this is incorrect as is evidenced by CA

> statutes whereby

> a dentist must inform their patients of its dangers

> and provide

> alternatives.

 

I stand by my statement only because the safe level

of mercury amalgam in a mouth is no mercury amalgam in

a mouth, and this line is not yet being toed. Progress

is being made, but, as you went on to say, the ADA is

blocking proper knowledge of mercury's known effects.

i.e. mercury's toxic effects are not commonly

understood in relation to amalgam, which is why the

ADA is trying to block that understanding from

occurring.

 

> who are avoiding amalgams and some patients are

> seeing a reversal

> of various health related conditions as well.

 

While we're on the topic - any resources for finding

dental specialists who are well versed in removing

amalgams safely? Mail me off list and I will compile

results for anyone who is interested.

 

Hugo

 

 

Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

[Guest guest]

Hugo,

 

It was my understanding that the ADA lost this one in court

years ago and so CA dentists must share safe options with

their patients. They did try to intimidate their members as

well as make it unethical to say anything but in the end

they failed. I have run across many alternative dentists

from across the country, including the midwest and

have ties to the dental profession, my father was a

dentist (one of the first to use herbs for TMJ healing

and my ex was a hygenist. Hope this helps.

 

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

________________________________

> Chinese Medicine

> subincor

> Tue, 9 Jan 2007 19:26:26 +0000

> RE: Cinnabar (dangerous) and mercury detox

>

> Hey Mike,

> --- mike Bowser <naturaldoc1<naturaldoc1>

wrote:

> > " ... commonly accepted idea that mercury is toxic in

> > all

> > its forms. Except dental amalgam where it is still

> > used internally in contact with membraneous surfaces

> > for extremely long periods of time. "

> > Actually this is incorrect as is evidenced by CA

> > statutes whereby

> > a dentist must inform their patients of its dangers

> > and provide

> > alternatives.

> I stand by my statement only because the safe level

> of mercury amalgam in a mouth is no mercury amalgam in

> a mouth, and this line is not yet being toed. Progress

> is being made, but, as you went on to say, the ADA is

> blocking proper knowledge of mercury's known effects.

> i.e. mercury's toxic effects are not commonly

> understood in relation to amalgam, which is why the

> ADA is trying to block that understanding from

> occurring.

> > who are avoiding amalgams and some patients are

> > seeing a reversal

> > of various health related conditions as well.

> While we're on the topic - any resources for finding

> dental specialists who are well versed in removing

> amalgams safely? Mail me off list and I will compile

> results for anyone who is interested.

> Hugo

> Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.

>

 

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[Guest guest]

Phil,

 

I agree with you that Mercuric-Sulfide should not be used by anyone

unless they go by the name of Ge Hong and maybe not even then...

 

Because it is mercuric-sulfide, it holds both the yin and yang principles of

mercury (water) and sulfur (fire).

Tibetan doctors have told me that mercury is one of the most powerful

medicines and poisons;

the processing method (not heating) is very complex and requires major

dedication and knowledge and time.

Because it is a carrier par excellence for other substances (to the deepest

spaces)...

the heart and lower dantian (cinnabar field), there must be a place for it

in medicine. No?

All traditions have used it in some fashion, from India to Medieval Europe

to homeopathy and Chinese medicine. As some have already pointed out, we're

still using it today in modern dentistry.

At least they took mercury out of vaccinations in the U.S. right?

 

Mercury is used to refine gold (literally),

and many adepts died trying to turn dark matter into pure energy through

quicksilver.

 

Otherwise, I don't trust those red no. 40 covered medicine balls that look

like cinnabar coated magic pills.

The dye might be just as dangerous.

The US Pharmacopoeia levels are 3 ppm for Chinese herbal products.

If an herb company is not GMP certified, than there's no way to know if

their mercury levels are below that 3 ppm level. There are no regulations

at all

and you could be getting more than just mercury...

unlabeled pharmaceuticals, cadmium, arsenic, lead, sulfur, dyes, etc.

 

 

On 1/8/07, < wrote:

>

> Hi All, & John,

>

> wrote:

> > Concerning Mercury detox: Garlic is listed here. I've heard that miso

> > soup can help (miso/seaweed) Hai zao (wakame seaweed) and Kombu (kelp)

> > is known to cleanse the body from mercury and also cleanses mercury

> > from the seas, therefore most seaweed may contain higher levels of

> > mercury. The seaweed from Hawaii (isolated from pollution) tends to be

> > cleaner. In Prescription for Nutritional Healing (Balch and Balch 2nd

> > ed) pgs 516-518, Essential nutrients listed: Glutathione plus

> > L-methionine and L-cysteine Selenium and Vitamin E. Very important:

> > Apple pectin, garlic, kelp or alfalfa, Vita A, Vit C Important: Vit. B

> > complex Helpful: Brewer's yeast, HCl, Lecithin granules or caps

>

> John, many thanks for that.

>

> However, I am very sceptical of claims that specific herbs can detox heavy

>

> metals effectively. For example, Medline has NO reliable hits for the

> profile:

> mercury AND (detoxification OR elimination) AND (herb OR herbs OR

> kampo OR herbal)

>

> [i discount one hit by Omura et al using the BDORT method to show that

> Chinese parsley (cilanthro) could remove Hg].

>

> Cinnabar is a no-no for me; I would not use it internally. I would not use

> it

> externally either if safer alternatives were available. Apart from being

> banned by many national drug regulation authorities, is can cause mercury

> build-up in tissues. See:

>

> Young YH, Chuu JJ, Liu SH, Lin-Shiau SY. Neurotoxic mechanism of

> cinnabar and mercuric sulfide on the vestibulo-ocular reflex system of

> guinea pigs.Toxicol Sci. 2002 Jun;67(2):256-63. Dept of Otolaryngology,

> National Taiwan University Hospital, No. 1 Section 1, Jen-Ai Road, Taipei,

>

> Taiwan. Cinnabar, a naturally occurring mercuric sulfide (HgS), has been

> combined with Chinese herbal medicine as a sedative for more than 2000

> years. To date, its neurotoxic effect on the vestibulo-ocular reflex (VOR)

>

> system has not been reported. By means of a caloric test coupled with

> electronystagmographic recordings, the effect of commercial HgS and

> cinnabar on the VOR system of guinea pigs was studied. HgS or cinnabar

> was administered orally (1.0 g/kg) to Hartley-strain guinea pigs once

> daily

> for 7 consecutive days. A battery of electrophysiological, biochemical,

> and

> histopathological examinations were performed. The results showed that

> HgS induced a 60% caloric response abnormality (40% caloric

> hyperfunction and 20% hypofunction), whereas the abnormal responses

> appeared to be more severe (six out of six) in the cinnabar group. The Hg

> contents of whole blood and cerebellum were increased and correlated to

> their neurotoxic effects on the VOR system, indicating that both insoluble

>

> HgS and cinnabar could be absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract and

> distributed to the cerebellum. Although the vestibular labyrinth revealed

> no

> remarkable change under light microscopy, loss of Purkinje cells in the

> cerebellum was detected, and the enzymatic Na(+)/K(+)-ATPase activity of

> cerebellum (a higher inhibitory center of the VOR system) was

> significantly

> inhibited by HgS and cinnabar. Moreover, cerebellar nitric oxide (NO)

> production was increased significantly. Hence, we tentatively conclude

> that

> the increased Hg contents in the cerebellum following oral administration

> of

> HgS and cinnabar were responsible, at least in part, for the detrimental

> neurotoxic effect on the VOR system. Potentially, decreasing Na(+)/K(+)-

> ATPase activity and increasing NO production within the cerebellar

> regulatory center are postulated to mediate this VOR dysfunction caused by

>

> the mercurial compounds and cinnabar. PMID: 12011485 [PubMed -

> indexed for MEDLINE]

>

> Kang-Yum E, Oransky SH. Chinese patent medicine as a potential source

> of mercury poisoning. Vet Hum Toxicol. 1992 Jun;34(3):235-8. Links

> Hudson Valley Poison Control Center, Nyack, NY 10960. This research is

> an effort to create an awareness of the potential hazards of some Chinese

> patent medicines which contain mercurial ingredients. This should be of

> consideration when screening symptomatic patients who are of Asian ethnic

> background or other users of these medicines. This research discusses

> reported cases of mercury poisoning related to the use of Chinese patent

> medicines and the potential toxicity of cinnabar (red mercuric sulfide)

> and

> calomel (mercurous chloride), 2 mercurials commonly used in these

> medicines. A list of mercurial-containing Chinese patent medicines

> available

> on the open market in North America has been compiled, together with their

>

> traditional uses and mercurial contents and is presented as a quick

> reference for Specialists in Poison Information. This class of medicine

> may

> not pose a problem when used appropriately; however, its misuse, abuse,

> overdosage and improper storage can lead to serious mercury poisoning.

> PMID: 1609495 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

>

> See also: Moore C, Adler R. Herbal vitamins: lead toxicity and

> developmental delay. Pediatrics. 2000 Sep;106(3):600-2. Division of

> General Pediatrics, Childrens Hospital Los Angeles, Los Angeles, CA

> 90027, USA. A case of lead poisoning from an Indian herbal vitamin is

> presented. The patient who was developmentally delayed was given an

> herbal vitamin from India to strengthen his brain. The tablet contained

> large

> amounts of lead and mercury, leading to significant lead burden.

> Vulnerability of families and lack of awareness of health care

> professionals

> of dangers of unknown herbal supplementation are discussed. PMID:

> 10969109 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

>

> Best regards,

>

>

>

 

 

 

--

'Freedom from the desire for an answer is essential to the understanding of

a problem.'

 

Jiddu Krishnamurti