Does use of guide-tubes infer non-expert AP therapy?

[Guest guest]

Hi All,

 

I use the plastic (single-use) guide-tubes routinely in dogs and humans, I

would not be without them. They were a brilliant development, and make

painless insertion possible in dangerous dogs or fearful human patients.

 

In horses, I use 70mm, 20-gauge, Terumo hypodermic needles, usually

inserted very rapidly in a single movement. In some areas, I insert in two

movements (a) subcutaneously and (b) to the desired depth. Terumo

needles are very very sharp and are stiff, so they need no guide tube.

 

In nervous horses, I apply counterpressure with the plastic needle-holder

beside the point and release the pressure just as the needle goes in.

 

Some acupuncturists seem to regard free-hand needling as a sign of an

expert AP therapist. I disagree. Free-hand needling may indicate expert

NEEDLE INSERTION technique, but there is far more to being an expert

AP therapist than insertion of needles; indeed needle insertion is only one

way to activate the AP system. Many methods that do NOT require needle

insertion also exist.

 

Best regards,

 

[Guest guest]

Thanks Phil. I tend to think our profession is a bit under-educated when

it comes to the various techniques, theories, etc that exist outside of

China. There is good reason why many of these subtler aspects are

seeing a huge interest in the states, people do not like pain. Years ago,

I was amazed to watch the techniques of a Japanese master, Shudo Denmai.

His needling, over the years, went from deeper to non-insertion cutaneous with

good effect. Something to think about when treating senstive/fearful people

and also a very low chance of infection. The guidetubes, by themselves, can

also be used to stroke channels/points. For this, I would suggest those w/

a rounded end (like Seirin has).

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

________________________________

> Chinese Medicine

>

> Tue, 28 Nov 2006 23:44:15 +0000

> Does use of guide-tubes infer non-expert AP therapy?

>

> Hi All,

> I use the plastic (single-use) guide-tubes routinely in dogs and humans, I

> would not be without them. They were a brilliant development, and make

> painless insertion possible in dangerous dogs or fearful human patients.

> In horses, I use 70mm, 20-gauge, Terumo hypodermic needles, usually

> inserted very rapidly in a single movement. In some areas, I insert in two

> movements (a) subcutaneously and (b) to the desired depth. Terumo

> needles are very very sharp and are stiff, so they need no guide tube.

> In nervous horses, I apply counterpressure with the plastic needle-holder

> beside the point and release the pressure just as the needle goes in.

> Some acupuncturists seem to regard free-hand needling as a sign of an

> expert AP therapist. I disagree. Free-hand needling may indicate expert

> NEEDLE INSERTION technique, but there is far more to being an expert

> AP therapist than insertion of needles; indeed needle insertion is only one

> way to activate the AP system. Many methods that do NOT require needle

> insertion also exist.

> Best regards,

>

 

_______________

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[Guest guest]

Mike, Phil,

I agree that the use of guide tubes can be masterful also.

Another such master is Koji Ichihashi, who is a master at diagnosing with

his left hand

and inserting needles with his right (with a guide tube)

Koji Ichihashi, along with other Japanese practitioners that I have met, can

manipulate the guide tube and needle both in the right hand.

This frees up the left hand to palpate for the correct tsubo point.

Of course, with Kiiko style, it is also essential to palpate and needle the

active point.

 

I think that there are classical lines saying that the insertion hand was

not as important as the " feeling " - palpating hand.

 

One advantage of free-hand needling is being able to use both hands in your

practice,

as it was classically.

Today, most practitioners that I have met do not integrate both hands in

their needle practice, even when they free-hand needle.

An exception to that is Robert Johns, who studied with Andrew Tseng and

wrote the Art of Acupunture Techniques. He free-hands and integrates both

hands to both palpate, stimulate and needle.

 

There are so many traditions even amongst one county in one prefecture.

Robert Johns' book, I think, is a great survey of the dozens of classical

techniques derived from the Nei Jing.

 

Thanks, K.

 

 

On 11/30/06, mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote:

>

>

> Thanks Phil. I tend to think our profession is a bit under-educated when

> it comes to the various techniques, theories, etc that exist outside of

> China. There is good reason why many of these subtler aspects are

> seeing a huge interest in the states, people do not like pain. Years ago,

> I was amazed to watch the techniques of a Japanese master, Shudo Denmai.

> His needling, over the years, went from deeper to non-insertion cutaneous

> with

> good effect. Something to think about when treating senstive/fearful

> people

> and also a very low chance of infection. The guidetubes, by themselves,

> can

> also be used to stroke channels/points. For this, I would suggest those w/

> a rounded end (like Seirin has).

>

> Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

>

> ________________________________

> > To:

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>

> > <%40eircom.net>

> > Tue, 28 Nov 2006 23:44:15 +0000

> > Does use of guide-tubes infer non-expert AP therapy?

> >

> > Hi All,

> > I use the plastic (single-use) guide-tubes routinely in dogs and humans,

> I

> > would not be without them. They were a brilliant development, and make

> > painless insertion possible in dangerous dogs or fearful human patients.

> > In horses, I use 70mm, 20-gauge, Terumo hypodermic needles, usually

> > inserted very rapidly in a single movement. In some areas, I insert in

> two

> > movements (a) subcutaneously and (b) to the desired depth. Terumo

> > needles are very very sharp and are stiff, so they need no guide tube.

> > In nervous horses, I apply counterpressure with the plastic

> needle-holder

> > beside the point and release the pressure just as the needle goes in.

> > Some acupuncturists seem to regard free-hand needling as a sign of an

> > expert AP therapist. I disagree. Free-hand needling may indicate expert

> > NEEDLE INSERTION technique, but there is far more to being an expert

> > AP therapist than insertion of needles; indeed needle insertion is only

> one

> > way to activate the AP system. Many methods that do NOT require needle

> > insertion also exist.

> > Best regards,

> >

>

> ________

> Check the weather nationwide with MSN Search: Try it now!

> http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=weather & FORM=WLMTAG

>

>

 

 

 

--

'Freedom from the desire for an answer is essential to the understanding of

a problem.'

 

Jiddu Krishnamurti

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

John,

I have seen Koji also, just amazing work really! He puts the needle in

the guide tube with one hand (says it's essential, and further says

that it only takes a few hours to learn, i am a pretty bright guy, but

i still don't got it), he quotes, i think it's the great compendium,

" the superior physician concentrates on his non-dominant hand when

inserting the needle. " When you watch him you really understand what

the ancient practitioners were talking about.

Would be fantastic to learn this in school, but as we know the Chinese

are a very proud people and aren't inclined to allow other asian

techniques into the schools (though they let in worsley, which is

interesting to me).

Regards, Tym

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " "

<johnkokko wrote:

>

> Mike, Phil,

> I agree that the use of guide tubes can be masterful also.

> Another such master is Koji Ichihashi, who is a master at diagnosing

with

> his left hand

> and inserting needles with his right (with a guide tube)

> Koji Ichihashi, along with other Japanese practitioners that I have

met, can

> manipulate the guide tube and needle both in the right hand.

> This frees up the left hand to palpate for the correct tsubo point.

> Of course, with Kiiko style, it is also essential to palpate and

needle the

> active point.

>

> I think that there are classical lines saying that the insertion

hand was

> not as important as the " feeling " - palpating hand.

>

> One advantage of free-hand needling is being able to use both hands

in your

> practice,

> as it was classically.

> Today, most practitioners that I have met do not integrate both hands in

> their needle practice, even when they free-hand needle.

> An exception to that is Robert Johns, who studied with Andrew Tseng and

> wrote the Art of Acupunture Techniques. He free-hands and

integrates both

> hands to both palpate, stimulate and needle.

>

> There are so many traditions even amongst one county in one prefecture.

> Robert Johns' book, I think, is a great survey of the dozens of

classical

> techniques derived from the Nei Jing.

>

> Thanks, K.

>

>

> On 11/30/06, mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote:

> >

> >

> > Thanks Phil. I tend to think our profession is a bit

under-educated when

> > it comes to the various techniques, theories, etc that exist

outside of

> > China. There is good reason why many of these subtler aspects are

> > seeing a huge interest in the states, people do not like pain.

Years ago,

> > I was amazed to watch the techniques of a Japanese master, Shudo

Denmai.

> > His needling, over the years, went from deeper to non-insertion

cutaneous

> > with

> > good effect. Something to think about when treating senstive/fearful

> > people

> > and also a very low chance of infection. The guidetubes, by

themselves,

> > can

> > also be used to stroke channels/points. For this, I would suggest

those w/

> > a rounded end (like Seirin has).

> >

> > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

> >

> > ________________________________

> > > To:

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine%40yaho\

ogroups.com>

> > > <%40eircom.net>

> > > Tue, 28 Nov 2006 23:44:15 +0000

> > > Does use of guide-tubes infer non-expert AP therapy?

> > >

> > > Hi All,

> > > I use the plastic (single-use) guide-tubes routinely in dogs and

humans,

> > I

> > > would not be without them. They were a brilliant development,

and make

> > > painless insertion possible in dangerous dogs or fearful human

patients.

> > > In horses, I use 70mm, 20-gauge, Terumo hypodermic needles, usually

> > > inserted very rapidly in a single movement. In some areas, I

insert in

> > two

> > > movements (a) subcutaneously and (b) to the desired depth. Terumo

> > > needles are very very sharp and are stiff, so they need no guide

tube.

> > > In nervous horses, I apply counterpressure with the plastic

> > needle-holder

> > > beside the point and release the pressure just as the needle

goes in.

> > > Some acupuncturists seem to regard free-hand needling as a sign

of an

> > > expert AP therapist. I disagree. Free-hand needling may indicate

expert

> > > NEEDLE INSERTION technique, but there is far more to being an expert

> > > AP therapist than insertion of needles; indeed needle insertion

is only

> > one

> > > way to activate the AP system. Many methods that do NOT require

needle

> > > insertion also exist.

> > > Best regards,

> > >

> >

> > ________

> > Check the weather nationwide with MSN Search: Try it now!

> > http://search.msn.com/results.aspx?q=weather & FORM=WLMTAG

> >

> >

>

>

>

> --

> 'Freedom from the desire for an answer is essential to the

understanding of

> a problem.'

>

> Jiddu Krishnamurti

>

>

>