acupuncture degrees

[Guest guest]

Wow, I'm pretty amazed at how threatened you all are by MDs and DCs doing

acupuncture, and I'm also impressed by the amount of disinformation about

chiropractic being bandied about. One poster claims that chiropractic is

derived from tui na, while the next says chiropractic is only 100 years

old. Which is it? (answer: neither).

 

Just remember, where was the first acupuncture program in the U.S.

located? (answer: at a chiropractic college).

 

Instead of castigating chiropractic doctors, perhaps you should be

thanking the profession. During the post-Flexner jihad, chiropractic was

the only form of alternative medicine to survive the onslaught. Osteopaths

were co-opted and absorbed into allopathy. Homeopathy was utterly

destroyed, only surviving vestigially in Europe until the latter decades

of the 20th century. Naturopathy is not even licensed in all of the

states. Eclectism was eliminated, its last school closing in 1939. The

Thomsonians and the Hygenic movement were wiped out.

 

Chiropractic not only survived, but thrived, and in its landmark federal

suit in the 1970s and 1980s broke the stranglehold the AMA had on

alternative medicine.

 

That is why you, today, can practice acupuncture. We kept the lamp lit.

(BTW, the chiropractic doctor I had as a child had been jailed no less

than 13 times in the profession's effort to become legal. How many of you

or your predecessors in the U.S. made an equivalent sacrifice?)

 

None of this, of course, provides any rationale why chiropractors should

practice acupuncture. However, I would suggest that villifying the

profession that enabled your existence is probably not in your best

interest. Working together is usually the better thing.

 

Avery

 

 

On Mon, 30 Oct 2006 08:24:48 -0500, <acudoc11 wrote:

 

> A perfect example of the rediculousness of many MDs/DCs etc is when I

> testified in Washington, DC in 2003 before the Dept of Health and Human

> Services on

> alternative medicine's need for 4,000 billing codes. A panel member

> (most were

> MDs) had the nerve to say that all massage is the same and acupunctuire

> was

> nothing more than simply sticking a needle in a person. So I asked this

> MD if I

> handed her a needle and requested that she insert it into my leg.....did

> that

> make it acupuncture? What about the thousands of hours of didactic and

> clinical experience? Isn't that in large part what qualifies the

> procedure as

> acupuncture?

>

> The insurance companies are defrauding their insureds by reimbursing

> chiro-puncture and medi-puncture under the guise of calling it

> acupuncture. One of

> these days we will get to address those issues in the legal arena.

>

> Richard

>

> In a message dated 10/29/2006 12:13:38 AM Eastern Standard Time,

> writes:

> If we want to reduce the medicine to find a point, stick a needle in

> it, then yes, by all means, 500 hours (not 300) can get you in the

> door. But the medicine is so much more than this, and needling/moxa

> is so much more than this. After 4 years of clinical

> supervision/observation in needling tech and moxa, it is hard to

> fully embody the intricacies of needling. And without this guidance

> in the medicine, learning how you can use one point in 20 different

> ways is not possible. This is why historically the medicine was

> passed on generation to generation, through a

> observation/supervision type model.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Everyone has an opinion

 

First, on degree/professional designations....in California:

 

Please be advised that Attorney General Opinion No. 87-103, dated March 3,

1988, concluded that a licensed acupuncturist MAY NOT use the initials " O.M.D. "

or the title " Oriental Medical Doctor " or " D.O.M. " and the title " Doctor

Oriental Medicine " without the inclusion of more information (L.Ac. or C.A.) ,

in advertising an acupuncture practice. A licensed acupuncturist who can

document proof of an approved Doctorate Degree in Oriental Medicine MAY use

those terms in conjunction with more information, i.e. the title of licensed or

certified acupuncturist.

In addition, according to section 1399.456 of the Acupuncture Regulations,

anyone using the title Oriental Medical Doctor or Doctor Oriental Medicine must

have obtained the doctorate degree from a school or college that was approved by

the California Department of Education at the time of issuance.***

 

Please be advised also, that in the State of California, it is improper to use

any title that makes reference to a medical doctor, such as M.D. (China) or

C.M.D. (Chinese Medical Doctor), or otherwise. Only those individuals licensed

as a physician and surgeon, M.D. (medical doctor), by the State of California

may use such initials.

 

http://www.acupuncture.ca.gov/enforcement/prof_titles.htm

 

 

***Since the doctoral programs are so new, perhaps only 50 practitioners in CA.

can actually use such a designation legitimately. The board only enforces based

on a written complaint...so, it comes down to the ethics of an individual to not

mislead the public.

 

As far as Short course " cookbook " classes...I believe that Mr Rosenberg has

raised the key question. Most of us in the industry see ourselves as " Chinese

Medicine " practitioners (in quotes as we all know there is much more to it than

what is practiced in the mainland). Acupuncture is a modality. What is " Chinese

Medicine " ?

I would argue that it is a way to think...it is a method of viewing " reality "

and then people and disease. THIS can not be learned in 300 hours - period. It

can not be " mastered " (MSTCM) in 3000 hours. ._,___

 

I've been teaching at schools in the Bay Area for the last 7 years. At first,

there is a need for a paradigm shift in the basic thought process. I've had

students that were MDs and DCs...as well as many very smart people from other

disciplines. The average student takes about a year to start to " get it " .

 

In the hundreds of students I've worked with, about 25 were Chiropractors.

This surely doesn't represent the entire industry...only those who chose to come

to the schools (similar to a call-in opinion poll doesn't really represent the

population, only those that bother/want to call in)

 

Contrary to what was posited regarding the applicability of prior " holistic

health " training, my experience was that the DCs took more time to adjust their

thinking. Furthermore, over 50% of them dropped out of the program before it was

1/2 complete (there are as many reasons for this as there are people that did

it, but I found it very interesting)

 

So, as far as becoming " " 'doctors' (don't say the " D " word!

as per above) it is VERY difficult to operate in both paradigms (not

impossible). Can't be done in 300 hours. Most of the best students I've worked

with feel that the 3000 hours of training could easily be 4000 and even then...

 

As far as Acupuncture the modality... without the Theory underlying the

thought process, what can be achieved? Mostly what we refer to as CookBook Acu.

 

I believe this raises a few questions:

Why DO they want to learn this?

Most likely for pain management (what the DC students told me)

 

Can this style of CookBook Acu be effective for pain management?

Well, it might be...

 

On the one hand, remember that musculo-skeletal assessment is a BIG part of

this treatment and DCs do have more training in this than Acupuncture schools

provide. So, if it's trigger point release...I think it's hard to say that other

medical practitioners can't learn this in an abbreviated program.

Also, we should remember that the Barefoot Doctors were " cookbook "

practitioners.

 

Problem is: will they limit their use of Acupuncture to what they are

qualified by these programs? Obviously from the thread, many doubt this.

 

Will the minimal training be disclosed to the public?

Will the public even understand the difference?

 

This very limited use of the potential of acupuncture would be similar to folk

medicine. Judith Farquhar's book:

Knowing Practice: The Clinical Encounter in

has a section that illustrates the difference between true " "

and folk medicine...

 

In a nutshell, folk medicine goes from disease to treatment... " your stomach

hurts? Try this, maybe it'll help....maybe it won't....maybe it'll make things

worse "

" Your pain is due to Thoracic Outlet Syndrome...let's try this...maybe it'll

help....maybe it won't.... "

 

Stephen Woodley LAc

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

What do you all think of acupuncturists who " refer " to themselves as

" Doctor " and encourage patients to address them that way? I know of one

here in town who does this but you can't find it in print anywhere. It's

annoying because people go around thinking that this person actually is a

" doctor " and of course they (the practitioner) love that!

 

 

 

_____

 

Chinese Medicine

Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of steve

woodley

Monday, October 30, 2006 12:24 PM

Chinese Medicine

acupuncture degrees

 

 

 

Everyone has an opinion

 

First, on degree/professional designations....in California:

 

Please be advised that Attorney General Opinion No. 87-103, dated March 3,

1988, concluded that a licensed acupuncturist MAY NOT use the initials

" O.M.D. " or the title " Oriental Medical Doctor " or " D.O.M. " and the title

" Doctor Oriental Medicine " without the inclusion of more information (L.Ac.

or C.A.) , in advertising an acupuncture practice. A licensed acupuncturist

who can document proof of an approved Doctorate Degree in Oriental Medicine

MAY use those terms in conjunction with more information, i.e. the title of

licensed or certified acupuncturist.

In addition, according to section 1399.456 of the Acupuncture Regulations,

anyone using the title Oriental Medical Doctor or Doctor Oriental Medicine

must have obtained the doctorate degree from a school or college that was

approved by the California Department of Education at the time of

issuance.***

 

Please be advised also, that in the State of California, it is improper to

use any title that makes reference to a medical doctor, such as M.D. (China)

or C.M.D. (Chinese Medical Doctor), or otherwise. Only those individuals

licensed as a physician and surgeon, M.D. (medical doctor), by the State of

California may use such initials.

 

http://www.acupunct

<http://www.acupuncture.ca.gov/enforcement/prof_titles.htm>

ure.ca.gov/enforcement/prof_titles.htm

 

 

***Since the doctoral programs are so new, perhaps only 50 practitioners in

CA. can actually use such a designation legitimately. The board only

enforces based on a written complaint...so, it comes down to the ethics of

an individual to not mislead the public.

 

As far as Short course " cookbook " classes...I believe that Mr Rosenberg has

raised the key question. Most of us in the industry see ourselves as

" " practitioners (in quotes as we all know there is much

more to it than what is practiced in the mainland). Acupuncture is a

modality. What is " " ?

I would argue that it is a way to think...it is a method of viewing

" reality " and then people and disease. THIS can not be learned in 300 hours

- period. It can not be " mastered " (MSTCM) in 3000 hours. ._,___

 

I've been teaching at schools in the Bay Area for the last 7 years. At

first, there is a need for a paradigm shift in the basic thought process.

I've had students that were MDs and DCs...as well as many very smart people

from other disciplines. The average student takes about a year to start to

" get it " .

 

In the hundreds of students I've worked with, about 25 were Chiropractors.

This surely doesn't represent the entire industry...only those who chose to

come to the schools (similar to a call-in opinion poll doesn't really

represent the population, only those that bother/want to call in)

 

Contrary to what was posited regarding the applicability of prior " holistic

health " training, my experience was that the DCs took more time to adjust

their thinking. Furthermore, over 50% of them dropped out of the program

before it was 1/2 complete (there are as many reasons for this as there are

people that did it, but I found it very interesting)

 

So, as far as becoming " " 'doctors' (don't say the " D " word!

as per above) it is VERY difficult to operate in both paradigms (not

impossible). Can't be done in 300 hours. Most of the best students I've

worked with feel that the 3000 hours of training could easily be 4000 and

even then...

 

As far as Acupuncture the modality... without the Theory underlying the

thought process, what can be achieved? Mostly what we refer to as CookBook

Acu.

 

I believe this raises a few questions:

Why DO they want to learn this?

Most likely for pain management (what the DC students told me)

 

Can this style of CookBook Acu be effective for pain management?

Well, it might be...

 

On the one hand, remember that musculo-skeletal assessment is a BIG part of

this treatment and DCs do have more training in this than Acupuncture

schools provide. So, if it's trigger point release...I think it's hard to

say that other medical practitioners can't learn this in an abbreviated

program.

Also, we should remember that the Barefoot Doctors were " cookbook "

practitioners.

 

Problem is: will they limit their use of Acupuncture to what they are

qualified by these programs? Obviously from the thread, many doubt this.

 

Will the minimal training be disclosed to the public?

Will the public even understand the difference?

 

This very limited use of the potential of acupuncture would be similar to

folk medicine. Judith Farquhar's book:

Knowing Practice: The Clinical Encounter in

has a section that illustrates the difference between true " Chinese

Medicine " and folk medicine...

 

In a nutshell, folk medicine goes from disease to treatment... " your stomach

hurts? Try this, maybe it'll help....maybe it won't....maybe it'll make

things worse "

" Your pain is due to Thoracic Outlet Syndrome...let's try this...maybe it'll

help....maybe it won't.... "

 

Stephen Woodley LAc

 

 

[Guest guest]

I would like to add some correction and other possible explanation for the

following:

 

" One poster claims that chiropractic is derived from tui na, "

On the surface this may or may not be factual but the historical record does

show a

factual history in China and elsewhere that supports manipulations of bones.

 

" ...while the next says chiropractic is only 100 years old. "

Come to think of it, chiro is only a little over a hundred years old, that is if

we

stick with the formation by Palmer. If you are suggesting a bone-setter's

history

then you invite the hole enchilada.

 

" Just remember, where was the first acupuncture program in the U.S. located?

(answer: at a chiropractic college). "

I have found this statement to be technically correct but false in its premise.

Acupuncture

was imported with the many Asian immigrant workers, many of whom came to work on

the railroads prior to there being any chiro colleges. There is a nice memorial

in

Orroville, CA that commemorates this history. Licesing started as a way to

protect their

cultural medical practices.

 

" Instead of castigating chiropractic doctors, perhaps you should be thanking the

profession. "

There seems to be some misinformation on this issue as well. While the chiro

community

did show initial interest, one can argue then why they have sought to undermine

proper

training standards as set by the acu profession. This is much like what the MD

have done

as well.

 

" That is why you, today, can practice acupuncture. "

Actually, we have the Nixon trip to China and the many Asians living in the US

(at least those

in CA) to thank. Have you not wondered then why DC's in CA cannot practice

acupuncture w/o

graduation from a CA recognized program?

 

" None of this, of course, provides any rationale why chiropractors should

practice acupuncture. "

Agreed. Every profession has a set of standards that it sets up for safe

practice and by confusing

the training and role in this, the public can be harmed. If the roles were

reversed, I do not think

you would be arguing for abbreviated training programs that have no US Dept of

Ed oversight.

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

-------

> Chinese Medicine

> docaltmed

> Mon, 30 Oct 2006 13:35:46 -0500

> Re: acupuncture degrees

>

> Wow, I'm pretty amazed at how threatened you all are by MDs and DCs doing

> acupuncture, and I'm also impressed by the amount of disinformation about

> chiropractic being bandied about. One poster claims that chiropractic is

> derived from tui na, while the next says chiropractic is only 100 years

> old. Which is it? (answer: neither).

>

> Just remember, where was the first acupuncture program in the U.S.

> located? (answer: at a chiropractic college).

>

> Instead of castigating chiropractic doctors, perhaps you should be

> thanking the profession. During the post-Flexner jihad, chiropractic was

> the only form of alternative medicine to survive the onslaught. Osteopaths

> were co-opted and absorbed into allopathy. Homeopathy was utterly

> destroyed, only surviving vestigially in Europe until the latter decades

> of the 20th century. Naturopathy is not even licensed in all of the

> states. Eclectism was eliminated, its last school closing in 1939. The

> Thomsonians and the Hygenic movement were wiped out.

>

> Chiropractic not only survived, but thrived, and in its landmark federal

> suit in the 1970s and 1980s broke the stranglehold the AMA had on

> alternative medicine.

>

> That is why you, today, can practice acupuncture. We kept the lamp lit.

> (BTW, the chiropractic doctor I had as a child had been jailed no less

> than 13 times in the profession's effort to become legal. How many of you

> or your predecessors in the U.S. made an equivalent sacrifice?)

>

> None of this, of course, provides any rationale why chiropractors should

> practice acupuncture. However, I would suggest that villifying the

> profession that enabled your existence is probably not in your best

> interest. Working together is usually the better thing.

>

> Avery

>

>

> On Mon, 30 Oct 2006 08:24:48 -0500, <acudoc11 wrote:

>

> > A perfect example of the rediculousness of many MDs/DCs etc is when I

> > testified in Washington, DC in 2003 before the Dept of Health and Human

> > Services on

> > alternative medicine's need for 4,000 billing codes. A panel member

> > (most were

> > MDs) had the nerve to say that all massage is the same and acupunctuire

> > was

> > nothing more than simply sticking a needle in a person. So I asked this

> > MD if I

> > handed her a needle and requested that she insert it into my leg.....did

> > that

> > make it acupuncture? What about the thousands of hours of didactic and

> > clinical experience? Isn't that in large part what qualifies the

> > procedure as

> > acupuncture?

> >

> > The insurance companies are defrauding their insureds by reimbursing

> > chiro-puncture and medi-puncture under the guise of calling it

> > acupuncture. One of

> > these days we will get to address those issues in the legal arena.

> >

> > Richard

> >

> > In a message dated 10/29/2006 12:13:38 AM Eastern Standard Time,

> > writes:

> > If we want to reduce the medicine to find a point, stick a needle in

> > it, then yes, by all means, 500 hours (not 300) can get you in the

> > door. But the medicine is so much more than this, and needling/moxa

> > is so much more than this. After 4 years of clinical

> > supervision/observation in needling tech and moxa, it is hard to

> > fully embody the intricacies of needling. And without this guidance

> > in the medicine, learning how you can use one point in 20 different

> > ways is not possible. This is why historically the medicine was

> > passed on generation to generation, through a

> > observation/supervision type model.

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/30/06 8:23:29 AM, acudoc11 writes:

 

 

> The history of certain forces trying to keep AOM out of mainstream with the

> masters versus an entry level doctor degree (notice the word is

> not.....doctorate) has delayed the inevitable of AOM taking its place in

> American healthcare.

>

 

Our big mistake was when we didn't start with a doctorate entry level and

raise our hours, like every other health care field. Instead, we started out as

therapists and now have to work our way up to a first professional doctorate

degree. We are on the way, though.

DAVe

 

 

 

" No one wants advice- only corroboration. "

John Steinbeck

 

David Molony

101 Bridge Street

Catasauqua, PA 18032

Phone (610)264-2755

Fax (610) 264-7292

 

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[Guest guest]

Thats a good summation. Petra, do you mind if I copy this post to

another forum elsewhere.

regards,

Lea.

Chinese Medicine , " baitele "

<baitele wrote:

>

> Hi All,

>

> as a fourth-year Bachelor degree student in TCM in Beijing, I'd like

> to bring in a Chinese perspective of TCM education.

>

> As for the Chinese, a five-year undergraduate degree in TCM is first

> of all a medical degree, meaning it aims to train doctors majoring in

> Traditional /Acupuncture and Tuina/Herbology. The

> five-year program includes studies in both Western and Chinese

> Medicine, the ratio being a rough 1:2; however, there's often no

> clear distinction -for instance, Western perspective of a disease is

> often introduced as a comparison even for the " pure " TCM classes.

> First two years of the program are preclinical including most of the

> basic courses of both aspects of the medicine, followed by more

> advanced classes and clinical observation in the third and forth

> year. Fifth year is purely clinical practice in one of the

> university's affiliated hospitals. If one wants to work as an MD

> after graduation, an additional one (or more) year of clinical

> practice and a licence examination are required.

>

> Foreigners wishing to attend a Bachelor Degree study together with

> the Chinese students after the first year. This is not the case in

> all the TCM universities though.

>

> As for the class hours, Western medicine occupies roughly >1000

hrs

> and TCM >2000. This doesn't include fifth year's 40-week clinical or

> the home work/case studies/papers of course.

>

> For postgraduates, Master's and Doctor's take three years each,

> making the total length of the studies about 11 years. Most students

> continue to study and work with an old doctor or an experienced

> supervisor many years after graduation.

>

> TCM and WM are quite integrated in China today. Even if the

Chinese

> model did not work in the West, what could be learned, though, is the

> understanding of being a medical system of its

own,

> acupuncture being a part of it. Using acupuncture (or herbs, tuina...)

> succesfully requires deeper understanding of the whole system, just

> like treating patients with WM requires much more than knowing the

> names of different pills.

>

> In that aspect one would hope there is enough willingness for co-

> operation between the different branches/aspects of medicine -in the

> end they're all supposed to aim at the same, that is, to treat and

> hopefully cure the patient.

>

> Regards,

>

> Petra Vallisaari

> Beijing University of

> baitele

>

[Guest guest]

Chinese Medicine , " Barbara Beale "

<bbeale wrote:

>

> What do you all think of acupuncturists who " refer " to themselves as

> " Doctor " and encourage patients to address them that way? I know of

one

> here in town who does this but you can't find it in print anywhere. It's

> annoying because people go around thinking that this person actually is a

> " doctor " and of course they (the practitioner) love that!

>

>

>

> _____

>

I think I already covered this in an earlier post in regards to Australia. Here

Osteos and Chiros use the term " doctor " and TCM practitioners, especially

in the state of Victoria where there is government registration and

protection of title, can do the same. (Though generally not people who

solely practice acupuncture.) However, care must be taken to not " hold

forth " as a medical practitioner. So I can call myself Dr. Lea Starck

() or someone could say Dr. Jock McSporran (Doctor of

Chiropractic) or you can say Dr. Lee Lee PhD. But you have to qualify it,

and then to be on the safe side list your qualifications after it.

If you just used the term Doctor without qualifying it, then you are deemed

to be holding forth as a medical doctor and can, (and most probably will)

be prosecuted. Similarily, if you use the term " professor " you need to

qualify of where you are a professor.

I have just discovered that the Australian medical council does not accept

overseas TCM/ MD degrees from China or Doctor of osteopathy

qualifications from the USA, in terms of practicing WM in Australia. WHO

accreditations aside.

regards,

Lea.

[Guest guest]

I also found this interesting. In the US there tends to be a lot of

preference given to those educated in China yet when the issue

of making programs stronger comes up, many programs seem

to balk at this idea. We still have mom-and-pop schools that

teach as a cottage industry as opposed to being seen as really

a professional healthcare field. This does not seem to be an

issue for the Asian countries, blending of western and eastern

happens all the time and look at the many ops they have. I

guess we have some confidence issues to overcome first.

Thanks

 

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

 

________________________________

> Chinese Medicine

> leabun1

> Thu, 2 Nov 2006 02:14:19 +0000

> Re: acupuncture degrees

>

> Thats a good summation. Petra, do you mind if I copy this post to

> another forum elsewhere.

> regards,

> Lea.

> --- In

Chinese Medicine <Chinese Medicine\

@>, " baitele "

> <baitele wrote:

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > as a fourth-year Bachelor degree student in TCM in Beijing, I'd like

> > to bring in a Chinese perspective of TCM education.

> >

> > As for the Chinese, a five-year undergraduate degree in TCM is first

> > of all a medical degree, meaning it aims to train doctors majoring in

> > Traditional /Acupuncture and Tuina/Herbology. The

> > five-year program includes studies in both Western and Chinese

> > Medicine, the ratio being a rough 1:2; however, there's often no

> > clear distinction -for instance, Western perspective of a disease is

> > often introduced as a comparison even for the " pure " TCM classes.

> > First two years of the program are preclinical including most of the

> > basic courses of both aspects of the medicine, followed by more

> > advanced classes and clinical observation in the third and forth

> > year. Fifth year is purely clinical practice in one of the

> > university's affiliated hospitals. If one wants to work as an MD

> > after graduation, an additional one (or more) year of clinical

> > practice and a licence examination are required.

> >

> > Foreigners wishing to attend a Bachelor Degree study together with

> > the Chinese students after the first year. This is not the case in

> > all the TCM universities though.

> >

> > As for the class hours, Western medicine occupies roughly >1000

> hrs

> > and TCM >2000. This doesn't include fifth year's 40-week clinical or

> > the home work/case studies/papers of course.

> >

> > For postgraduates, Master's and Doctor's take three years each,

> > making the total length of the studies about 11 years. Most students

> > continue to study and work with an old doctor or an experienced

> > supervisor many years after graduation.

> >

> > TCM and WM are quite integrated in China today. Even if the

> Chinese

> > model did not work in the West, what could be learned, though, is the

> > understanding of being a medical system of its

> own,

> > acupuncture being a part of it. Using acupuncture (or herbs, tuina...)

> > succesfully requires deeper understanding of the whole system, just

> > like treating patients with WM requires much more than knowing the

> > names of different pills.

> >

> > In that aspect one would hope there is enough willingness for co-

> > operation between the different branches/aspects of medicine -in the

> > end they're all supposed to aim at the same, that is, to treat and

> > hopefully cure the patient.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Petra Vallisaari

> > Beijing University of

> > baitele

> >

>

 

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[Guest guest]

For those interested in the beginnings of chiropractic, read this chapter

from a book written by a D.C.:

http://www.chirobase.org/05RB/BCC/07.html

 

A must read on this subject.

 

Also, in the same book by Samuel Homola D.C., the first chapter describes

bone setting going back to Egyptian, Greek and Native American tribes,

virtually every race of people at all times. I don't believe there is

historically, a direct connection between Chinese tui-na and chiropractic,

except in form and function. The closest link may be P.H. Ling (not

Chinese), :

 

" But it was not until the contributions of Per Henrik Ling (1776-1839), a

Swedish fencing master, that a truly comprehensive and systemic compendium

of massage was published in Europe . He traveled extensively to China and

read the translations of the Chinese medical writings, which led him to

develop the Ling System, also known as the Swedish Movement Treatment. This

was a combination of massage and medical gymnastics, in which he classified

movements as either passive or active. With this he established the Royal

Swedish Central Institute of Gymnastics where he treated many patients wih

his concepts of massage therapy. "

The records of his work are extensive.

http://www.isisboston.com/artotouch/history.htm

 

Now researchers say that he is not the founder of what we incorrectly call

" Swedish Massage " , but his work may have had a slight influence on the late

19th century American chiropractic system.

http://www.massagemag.com/Magazine/2002/issue100/history100.php

 

The French Jesuits were influential in bringing Chinese medicine, including

" acupuncture " , which they coined in the French language, first to Europe.

 

I think a more valid connection, obviously, is the connection between

chiropractic and osteopathy.

Osteopathy was founded in 1874 by A.T. Still. Chiropractic in 1895 by

D.D.Palmer.

They were born a generation apart in the same political climate and social

fabric.

Please read: http://www.chirobase.org/05RB/BCC/07.html

 

As far as the beginnings of Oriental Medicine in America, please read the

well researched book by Peter Eckman:

In the Footsteps of the Yellow Emperor: Tracing the History of Traditional

Acupuncture

http://www.amazon.com/Footsteps-Yellow-Emperor-Traditional-Acupuncture/dp/083512\

5807

 

K.

 

On 10/31/06, acuman1 <acuman1 wrote:

>

>

> In a message dated 10/30/06 8:23:29 AM,

acudoc11<acudoc11%40aol.com>writes:

>

> > The history of certain forces trying to keep AOM out of mainstream with

> the

> > masters versus an entry level doctor degree (notice the word is

> > not.....doctorate) has delayed the inevitable of AOM taking its place in

>

> > American healthcare.

> >

>

> Our big mistake was when we didn't start with a doctorate entry level and

> raise our hours, like every other health care field. Instead, we started

> out as

> therapists and now have to work our way up to a first professional

> doctorate

> degree. We are on the way, though.

> DAVe

>

> " No one wants advice- only corroboration. "

> John Steinbeck

>

> David Molony

> 101 Bridge Street

> Catasauqua, PA 18032

> Phone (610)264-2755

> Fax (610) 264-7292

>

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> your system.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Lea,

 

go ahead.

 

BR

 

Petra

 

Chinese Medicine , " Lea Starck "

<leabun1 wrote:

>

> Thats a good summation. Petra, do you mind if I copy this post to

> another forum elsewhere.

> regards,

> Lea.

> Chinese Medicine , " baitele "

> <baitele@> wrote:

> >

> > Hi All,

> >

> > as a fourth-year Bachelor degree student in TCM in Beijing, I'd

like

> > to bring in a Chinese perspective of TCM education.

> >

> > As for the Chinese, a five-year undergraduate degree in TCM is

first

> > of all a medical degree, meaning it aims to train doctors

majoring in

> > Traditional /Acupuncture and Tuina/Herbology. The

> > five-year program includes studies in both Western and Chinese

> > Medicine, the ratio being a rough 1:2; however, there's often no

> > clear distinction -for instance, Western perspective of a disease

is

> > often introduced as a comparison even for the " pure " TCM classes.

> > First two years of the program are preclinical including most of

the

> > basic courses of both aspects of the medicine, followed by more

> > advanced classes and clinical observation in the third and forth

> > year. Fifth year is purely clinical practice in one of the

> > university's affiliated hospitals. If one wants to work as an MD

> > after graduation, an additional one (or more) year of clinical

> > practice and a licence examination are required.

> >

> > Foreigners wishing to attend a Bachelor Degree study together

with

> > the Chinese students after the first year. This is not the case

in

> > all the TCM universities though.

> >

> > As for the class hours, Western medicine occupies roughly >1000

> hrs

> > and TCM >2000. This doesn't include fifth year's 40-week clinical

or

> > the home work/case studies/papers of course.

> >

> > For postgraduates, Master's and Doctor's take three years each,

> > making the total length of the studies about 11 years. Most

students

> > continue to study and work with an old doctor or an experienced

> > supervisor many years after graduation.

> >

> > TCM and WM are quite integrated in China today. Even if the

> Chinese

> > model did not work in the West, what could be learned, though, is

the

> > understanding of being a medical system of its

> own,

> > acupuncture being a part of it. Using acupuncture (or herbs,

tuina...)

> > succesfully requires deeper understanding of the whole system,

just

> > like treating patients with WM requires much more than knowing

the

> > names of different pills.

> >

> > In that aspect one would hope there is enough willingness for co-

> > operation between the different branches/aspects of medicine -in

the

> > end they're all supposed to aim at the same, that is, to treat

and

> > hopefully cure the patient.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Petra Vallisaari

> > Beijing University of

> > baitele@

> >

>