Guest guest Posted May 31, 2006 Report Share Posted May 31, 2006 II currently have a patient that has lines running from their waist line over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13. This are smooth lines running parallel to each other, red in colour and in a concave fashion (they are dug into skin about 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in colour. There is also one of these lines going from Lung 2 to Lung 3. I am completely stumped....... Any ideas would be much appreciated. The person has them for a number of years....... Regards, Gordon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 Are they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be an idea to rule out Cushings syndrome. Lea. Chinese Medicine , " Gordon Mullins " <gordon.mullins wrote: > > II currently have a patient that has lines running from their waist line > over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13. > This are smooth lines running parallel to each other, red in colour and in a > concave fashion (they are dug into skin about 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in > colour. > > There is also one of these lines going from Lung 2 to Lung 3. > > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas would be much appreciated. > > The person has them for a number of years....... > > Regards, > > Gordon. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 Hi Lea, Yes, if you saw them you would say they were possibly strech marks, the patient notices them more now considering they have lost about 3 stone in the last 12 months, there is Liver qi stagnation and liver depression as a primary disharmony. Do you have much more info on Cushings syndrome? Thanks for your help. Gordon. On 6/1/06, Lea Starck <leabun1 wrote: > > Are they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be an idea to rule out > Cushings syndrome. > Lea. > Chinese Medicine , " Gordon > Mullins " <gordon.mullins wrote: > > > > II currently have a patient that has lines running from their > waist line > > over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 and Kidney 11 - > Kidney 13. > > This are smooth lines running parallel to each other, red in > colour and in a > > concave fashion (they are dug into skin about 1/2 cm) and smooth, > redish in > > colour. > > > > There is also one of these lines going from Lung 2 to Lung 3. > > > > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas would be much appreciated. > > > > The person has them for a number of years....... > > > > Regards, > > > > Gordon. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 I have not heard of striae running north-south along a channel. It is most interesting when we see a phenomenon that follows a pathway and yet still find a way to disregard it. I have seen an xray of a patient that showed an internal line that followed the stomach pathway and yet it was not pathological. Hmmh. Makes me wonder if there might be something physical to the pathways. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac : leabun1: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 06:11:22 +0000Re: Unexplained Jing Luo LinesAre they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be an idea to rule out Cushings syndrome.Lea.Chinese Medicine , " Gordon Mullins " <gordon.mullins wrote:>> II currently have a patient that has lines running from their waist line> over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13.> This are smooth lines running parallel to each other, red in colour and in a> concave fashion (they are dug into skin about 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in> colour.> > There is also one of these lines going from Lung 2 to Lung 3.> > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas would be much appreciated.> > The person has them for a number of years.......> > Regards,> > Gordon.> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 Mike, During my training a numbe rof years ago. My teacher, needled St 36 and St 41. He was able to needle to two points in such a way, I still don't know how, he just laughed. But he needled it such that it produced a white line for st 36 to st 41, now I couldn't see it properly at the time as the demo was being done on me, but 12 of my fellow students gasped as the' line of Qi' (thats how he described it) was made visible on the Jing Luo. IT HURT LIKE HELL!!!! Gordon. On 6/1/06, mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote: > > I have not heard of striae running north-south along a channel. It is > most interesting when we see a phenomenon that follows a pathway and yet > still find a way to disregard it. I have seen an xray of a patient that > showed an internal line that followed the stomach pathway and yet it was not > pathological. Hmmh. Makes me wonder if there might be something physical > to the pathways. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > : > leabun1: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 06:11:22 +0000Re: > Unexplained Jing Luo LinesAre they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be > an idea to rule out Cushings syndrome.Lea.--- In > Chinese Medicine , " Gordon Mullins " < > gordon.mullins wrote:>> II currently have a patient that has lines > running from their waist line> over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 > and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13.> This are smooth lines running parallel to each > other, red in colour and in a> concave fashion (they are dug into skin about > 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in> colour.> > There is also one of these lines > going from Lung 2 to Lung 3.> > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas > would be much appreciated.> > The person has them for a number of > years.......> > Regards,> > Gordon.> > > [Non-text portions of this message > have been removed]>Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at > Times http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com Download the > all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, > http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145To change your > email delivery settings, click, > and adjust > accordingly. Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication > outside the group requires prior permission from the author.Pleaseconsider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > necessary. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 Cushing's Syndrome is an adrenal disease. Typically with Cushing's, the stretch marks are darker in color than the rest of the skin, almost appearing like vertical stripes. They are typically found on the abdomen, so the ones you mentioned on the pectoral area would be unusual. You can do a web search for Cushing's for more informaiton. ,L.Ac. --- Gordon Mullins <gordon.mullins wrote: > Hi Lea, > > Yes, if you saw them you would say they were possibly strech marks, the > patient notices them more now considering they have lost about 3 stone in > the last 12 months, there is Liver qi stagnation and liver depression as a > primary disharmony. > > Do you have much more info on Cushings syndrome? > > Thanks for your help. > > Gordon. > > > On 6/1/06, Lea Starck <leabun1 wrote: > > > > Are they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be an idea to rule out > > Cushings syndrome. > > Lea. > > Chinese Medicine , " Gordon > > Mullins " <gordon.mullins wrote: > > > > > > II currently have a patient that has lines running from their > > waist line > > > over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 and Kidney 11 - > > Kidney 13. > > > This are smooth lines running parallel to each other, red in > > colour and in a > > > concave fashion (they are dug into skin about 1/2 cm) and smooth, > > redish in > > > colour. > > > > > > There is also one of these lines going from Lung 2 to Lung 3. > > > > > > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas would be much appreciated. > > > > > > The person has them for a number of years....... > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Gordon. > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2006 Report Share Posted June 1, 2006 Gordon, It is examples like these and many others that make me think that the work conducted by Bonghan, Vernajoule and now Soh, on biological structure ID as a logical way to describe this. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac -------------- > Chinese Medicine > gordon.mullins > Thu, 1 Jun 2006 15:39:02 +0100 > Re: Re: Unexplained Jing Luo Lines > > Mike, > During my training a numbe rof years ago. My teacher, needled St 36 and St > 41. He was able to needle to two points in such a way, I still don't know > how, he just laughed. But he needled it such that it produced a white line > for st 36 to st 41, now I couldn't see it properly at the time as the demo > was being done on me, but 12 of my fellow students gasped as the' line of > Qi' (thats how he described it) was made visible on the Jing Luo. IT HURT > LIKE HELL!!!! > Gordon. > On 6/1/06, mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote: > > > > I have not heard of striae running north-south along a channel. It is > > most interesting when we see a phenomenon that follows a pathway and yet > > still find a way to disregard it. I have seen an xray of a patient that > > showed an internal line that followed the stomach pathway and yet it was not > > pathological. Hmmh. Makes me wonder if there might be something physical > > to the pathways. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > > > > : > > leabun1: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 06:11:22 +0000Re: > > Unexplained Jing Luo LinesAre they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be > > an idea to rule out Cushings syndrome.Lea.--- In > > Chinese Medicine , " Gordon Mullins " < > > gordon.mullins wrote:>> II currently have a patient that has lines > > running from their waist line> over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 > > and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13.> This are smooth lines running parallel to each > > other, red in colour and in a> concave fashion (they are dug into skin about > > 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in> colour.> > There is also one of these lines > > going from Lung 2 to Lung 3.> > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas > > would be much appreciated.> > The person has them for a number of > > years.......> > Regards,> > Gordon.> > > [Non-text portions of this message > > have been removed]>Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at > > Times http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com Download the > > all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, > > http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145To change your > > email delivery settings, click, > > and adjust > > accordingly. Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication > > outside the group requires prior permission from the author.Pleaseconsider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > > necessary. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 The striae associated with cushings can be red in colour. I have also seen red coloured striae associated with the use of antipsychotic medication, and were a marked feature, out of proportion with any weight gain from the medication. I do not know if this is because the medication was having an effect on the adrenals. At the time I asked several doctors and pharmacologists if the specific type of antipsychotic involved could cause Cushings, and nobody had heard of this happening. This was a while ago, I should look into it some more and see what I turn up. Whats the TCM differentiation of this type of thing. Chinese Medicine , " mike Bowser " <naturaldoc1 wrote: > > Gordon, > It is examples like these and many others that make me think that the work conducted by Bonghan, Vernajoule and now Soh, on biological structure ID as a logical way to describe this. > > > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > -------------- > > Chinese Medicine > > gordon.mullins > > Thu, 1 Jun 2006 15:39:02 +0100 > > Re: Re: Unexplained Jing Luo Lines > > > > Mike, > > During my training a numbe rof years ago. My teacher, needled St 36 and St > > 41. He was able to needle to two points in such a way, I still don't know > > how, he just laughed. But he needled it such that it produced a white line > > for st 36 to st 41, now I couldn't see it properly at the time as the demo > > was being done on me, but 12 of my fellow students gasped as the' line of > > Qi' (thats how he described it) was made visible on the Jing Luo. IT HURT > > LIKE HELL!!!! > > Gordon. > > On 6/1/06, mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote: > > > > > > I have not heard of striae running north-south along a channel. It is > > > most interesting when we see a phenomenon that follows a pathway and yet > > > still find a way to disregard it. I have seen an xray of a patient that > > > showed an internal line that followed the stomach pathway and yet it was not > > > pathological. Hmmh. Makes me wonder if there might be something physical > > > to the pathways. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > > > > > > > : > > > leabun1: Thu, 1 Jun 2006 06:11:22 +0000Re: > > > Unexplained Jing Luo LinesAre they striae? Like stretch marks? It might be > > > an idea to rule out Cushings syndrome.Lea.--- In > > > Chinese Medicine , " Gordon Mullins " < > > > gordon.mullins@> wrote:>> II currently have a patient that has lines > > > running from their waist line> over the Kidney Jing Luo from St 30 - St 28 > > > and Kidney 11 - Kidney 13.> This are smooth lines running parallel to each > > > other, red in colour and in a> concave fashion (they are dug into skin about > > > 1/2 cm) and smooth, redish in> colour.> > There is also one of these lines > > > going from Lung 2 to Lung 3.> > I am completely stumped....... Any ideas > > > would be much appreciated.> > The person has them for a number of > > > years.......> > Regards,> > Gordon.> > > [Non-text portions of this message > > > have been removed]>Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at > > > Times http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com Download the > > > all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, > > > http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145To change your > > > email delivery settings, click, > > > and adjust > > > accordingly. Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication > > > outside the group requires prior permission from the author.Pleaseconsider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > > > necessary. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 Some more info on Cushings syndrome, which is an adrenal disorder and caused by chronic, excess glucocorticoid, which can happen for various reasons, explained later. Clinical features are as follows: * Centripetal fat deposition (buffalo hump and moon facies) * Skin thinning and red / purple striae over the abdomen and flanks. Bruising is common and wounds heal slowly. * Lower limb oedema. * Proximal muscle wasting. * Osteoporosis, particularly of the vertebral bodies, leading to compression fractures. * Impaired defence against infections. * Hypertension. * Mild hirsutism in women. * Amenorrhoea and infertility in women and impotence in men. * Electrolyte disturbances (hypernatraemia and hypokalaemia) * Impaired glucose tolerance or frank diabetes. Its worth noting that the main reasons for Cushings syndrome is various tumours that can cause secretion of ACTH or iatrogenic causes such as patient taking prescribed glucocorticoids. However, there is apparantly a pseudo-cushings syndrome that can be caused by alcoholism / alcohol withdrawal or endogenous severe depression / anxiety, or sometimes morbid obesity or diabetes, which can present with all or some of the clinical features of " true " cushings syndrome, and is differentiated by the fact that the hypothalamic- pituitary-adrenal axis is fairly normal in pseudo-cushings. One of my teachers, who taught diagnosis of western medicine, was always emphasising cushings syndrome and addisons disease as things that every TCM practitioner should be very familiar with, and refer patients to a western doctor if suspected. I seem to remember going over adrenal disorders constantly in that class, anyway. I dug out some notes and thought Id share some info. Hope this helps. Oh, if anyone has any info about treating patients with TCM for adrenal disorders, Id be very interested to learn more. Is solely TCM treatment advisable in these cases? regards, Lea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 Lea, Thank you very much for all the info, I really appreciate all your help. Thanks again, Gordon. On 6/2/06, Lea Starck <leabun1 wrote: > > Some more info on Cushings syndrome, which is an adrenal disorder > and caused by chronic, excess glucocorticoid, which can happen for > various reasons, explained later. > > Clinical features are as follows: > * Centripetal fat deposition (buffalo hump and moon facies) > * Skin thinning and red / purple striae over the abdomen and flanks. > Bruising is common and wounds heal slowly. > * Lower limb oedema. > * Proximal muscle wasting. > * Osteoporosis, particularly of the vertebral bodies, leading to > compression fractures. > * Impaired defence against infections. > * Hypertension. > * Mild hirsutism in women. > * Amenorrhoea and infertility in women and impotence in men. > * Electrolyte disturbances (hypernatraemia and hypokalaemia) > * Impaired glucose tolerance or frank diabetes. > > Its worth noting that the main reasons for Cushings syndrome is > various tumours that can cause secretion of ACTH or iatrogenic > causes such as patient taking prescribed glucocorticoids. However, > there is apparantly a pseudo-cushings syndrome that can be caused by > alcoholism / alcohol withdrawal or endogenous severe depression / > anxiety, or sometimes morbid obesity or diabetes, which can present > with all or some of the clinical features of " true " cushings > syndrome, and is differentiated by the fact that the hypothalamic- > pituitary-adrenal axis is fairly normal in pseudo-cushings. > One of my teachers, who taught diagnosis of western medicine, was > always emphasising cushings syndrome and addisons disease as things > that every TCM practitioner should be very familiar with, and refer > patients to a western doctor if suspected. I seem to remember going > over adrenal disorders constantly in that class, anyway. I dug out > some notes and thought Id share some info. Hope this helps. > Oh, if anyone has any info about treating patients with TCM for > adrenal disorders, Id be very interested to learn more. Is solely > TCM treatment advisable in these cases? > regards, > > Lea. > > > > Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at Times > http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com > > Download the all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, > http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145 > > > and adjust > accordingly. > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group > requires prior permission from the author. > > Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely > necessary. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 Read *Adrenoplex* on the Evergreen products line. Although Cushing Syndromes as you have described is way too far advanced, vs as described in the book, I would choice to treat this way: See: Adrenoplex (Clinical Manual of Oriental Medicine) There are also point selections suggested. My two cents. amy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 Of course, I might just be getting carried away with all the cushings syndrome stuff, and its probably just stretch marks. Try this link: http://dermis.multimedica.de/dermisroot/en/34736/diagnose.htm for striae differential diagnosis. Lea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2006 Report Share Posted June 2, 2006 Lea, You might try looking at hormonal disorder treatments and conditions in Kiiko Matsumoto's book on Clinical strategies vol 1. Her and her teachers approaches are to consider the western syndrome with certain identifiable reflexes. When the reflex disappears, so goes the problem that caused it. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac -------------- > Chinese Medicine > leabun1 > Fri, 2 Jun 2006 08:18:29 +0000 > Re: Unexplained Jing Luo Lines > > Some more info on Cushings syndrome, which is an adrenal disorder > and caused by chronic, excess glucocorticoid, which can happen for > various reasons, explained later. > Clinical features are as follows: > * Centripetal fat deposition (buffalo hump and moon facies) > * Skin thinning and red / purple striae over the abdomen and flanks. > Bruising is common and wounds heal slowly. > * Lower limb oedema. > * Proximal muscle wasting. > * Osteoporosis, particularly of the vertebral bodies, leading to > compression fractures. > * Impaired defence against infections. > * Hypertension. > * Mild hirsutism in women. > * Amenorrhoea and infertility in women and impotence in men. > * Electrolyte disturbances (hypernatraemia and hypokalaemia) > * Impaired glucose tolerance or frank diabetes. > Its worth noting that the main reasons for Cushings syndrome is > various tumours that can cause secretion of ACTH or iatrogenic > causes such as patient taking prescribed glucocorticoids. However, > there is apparantly a pseudo-cushings syndrome that can be caused by > alcoholism / alcohol withdrawal or endogenous severe depression / > anxiety, or sometimes morbid obesity or diabetes, which can present > with all or some of the clinical features of " true " cushings > syndrome, and is differentiated by the fact that the hypothalamic- > pituitary-adrenal axis is fairly normal in pseudo-cushings. > One of my teachers, who taught diagnosis of western medicine, was > always emphasising cushings syndrome and addisons disease as things > that every TCM practitioner should be very familiar with, and refer > patients to a western doctor if suspected. I seem to remember going > over adrenal disorders constantly in that class, anyway. I dug out > some notes and thought Id share some info. Hope this helps. > Oh, if anyone has any info about treating patients with TCM for > adrenal disorders, Id be very interested to learn more. Is solely > TCM treatment advisable in these cases? > regards, > Lea. > Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at Times http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com > Download the all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145 > and adjust accordingly. > > Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely necessary. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 Thanks Amy and Mike, Unfortunately Im not familiar with Evergreen or Kiiko Matsumoto. I think the former is a product line that is not available in Australia, do they have a web site? As for the latter, I will have to look out for any of her (her?) publications. I have noticed alot of practitioners from the US seem to follow her work, and it sounds very interesting. Out of curiosity, would either of you try to work with a patient with an adrenal disorder solely with TCM? (This is purely interest, I dont have a patient with an adrenal disorder at the moment, the striae discussion got me thinking, thats all. Ive only seen true cushings syndrome secondary to taking steroids, and that was in the rheumatology department in China.) Lea. Chinese Medicine , Amyc144 wrote: > > > Read *Adrenoplex* on the Evergreen products line. > Although Cushing Syndromes as you have described is way too far advanced, > vs as described in the book, I would choice to treat this way: > > See: Adrenoplex (Clinical Manual of Oriental Medicine) > There are also point selections suggested. > > My two cents. > amy > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 I have found that reactions that occur to various abdominal areas to be indicative of various disorders as well. I have seen improvement with many conditions and so the answer you are looking for would why not try and see how the person responds to the care unless you think it is an ER situation. So the answer is yes I would as long as the patient and I are able to have good communication and understanding. Kiiko has a lot more experience with this and writes about it. Even though the patient originally had an endocrine disorder in many cases, she was able to help them improve and in many cases eliminate the western medical condition. I should also mention here that this is not TCM but a conglomeration of various Japanese master practitioners she has and still spends time learning from. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac : leabun1: Sat, 3 Jun 2006 00:33:03 +0000Re: Unexplained Jing Luo LinesThanks Amy and Mike,Unfortunately Im not familiar with Evergreen or Kiiko Matsumoto. I think the former is a product line that is not available in Australia, do they have a web site? As for the latter, I will have to look out for any of her (her?) publications. I have noticed alot of practitioners from the US seem to follow her work, and it sounds very interesting.Out of curiosity, would either of you try to work with a patient with an adrenal disorder solely with TCM? (This is purely interest, I dont have a patient with an adrenal disorder at the moment, the striae discussion got me thinking, thats all. Ive only seen true cushings syndrome secondary to taking steroids, and that was in the rheumatology department in China.)Lea. --- In Chinese Medicine , Amyc144 wrote:>> > Read *Adrenoplex* on the Evergreen products line.> Although Cushing Syndromes as you have described is way too far advanced,> vs as described in the book, I would choice to treat this way: > > See: Adrenoplex (Clinical Manual of Oriental Medicine)> There are also point selections suggested.> > My two cents.> amy> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 Thanks for the answer Mike. Lea. Chinese Medicine , " mike Bowser " <naturaldoc1 wrote: > > I have found that reactions that occur to various abdominal areas to be indicative of various disorders as well. I have seen improvement with many conditions and so the answer you are looking for would why not try and see how the person responds to the care unless you think it is an ER situation. So the answer is yes I would as long as the patient and I are able to have good communication and understanding. > > Kiiko has a lot more experience with this and writes about it. Even though the patient originally had an endocrine disorder in many cases, she was able to help them improve and in many cases eliminate the western medical condition. I should also mention here that this is not TCM but a conglomeration of various Japanese master practitioners she has and still spends time learning from. Mike W. Bowser, L Ac > > > : leabun1: Sat, 3 Jun 2006 00:33:03 +0000Re: Unexplained Jing Luo LinesThanks Amy and Mike,Unfortunately Im not familiar with Evergreen or Kiiko Matsumoto. I think the former is a product line that is not available in Australia, do they have a web site? As for the latter, I will have to look out for any of her (her?) publications. I have noticed alot of practitioners from the US seem to follow her work, and it sounds very interesting.Out of curiosity, would either of you try to work with a patient with an adrenal disorder solely with TCM? (This is purely interest, I dont have a patient with an adrenal disorder at the moment, the striae discussion got me thinking, thats all. Ive only seen true cushings syndrome secondary to taking steroids, and that was in the rheumatology department in China.) Lea. Chinese Medicine , Amyc144@ wrote:>> > Read *Adrenoplex* on the Evergreen products line.> Although Cushing Syndromes as you have described is way too far advanced,> vs as described in the book, I would choice to treat this way: > > See: Adrenoplex (Clinical Manual of Oriental Medicine) > There are also point selections suggested.> > My two cents.> amy> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]>Subscribe to the new FREE online journal for TCM at Chinese Medicine Times http://www.chinesemedicinetimes.com Download the all new TCM Forum Toolbar, click, http://toolbar.thebizplace.com/LandingPage.aspx/CT145145To change your email delivery settings, click, and adjust accordingly. Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the group requires prior permission from the author.Please consider the environment and only print this message if absolutely necessary. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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