Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 I also use Colloidal silver in my practice. I had a patient that had the two middle toes shot of by a shot gun, they did skin grafts and the grafts where not taking. The doctors wanted to amputate his foot, I asked him to wait and apply the Colloidal silver to the wound. In one month the grafts took and the healing was remarkable. I give all my patients Colloidal silver and advise them to take it immediately if they suspect a cold or infection. It works every time. In Heath, Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 I also use Colloidal silver in my practice. I had a patient that had the two middle toes shot of by a shot gun, they did skin grafts and the grafts where not taking. The doctors wanted to amputate his foot, I asked him to wait and apply the Colloidal silver to the wound. In one month the grafts took and the healing was remarkable. I give all my patients Colloidal silver and advise them to take it immediately if they suspect a cold or infection. It works every time. >>>>> Mary which one do you use? Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 Dr. Alon.... What's your source? I have made generators in the past... Do you have a more stable/standardized method? <alonmarcus wrote: I also use Colloidal silver in my practice. I had a patient that had the two middle toes shot of by a shot gun, they did skin grafts and the grafts where not taking. The doctors wanted to amputate his foot, I asked him to wait and apply the Colloidal silver to the wound. In one month the grafts took and the healing was remarkable. I give all my patients Colloidal silver and advise them to take it immediately if they suspect a cold or infection. It works every time. >>>>> Mary which one do you use? Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 What voltage do you recommend Chris? " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 Hi Mary, > I also use Colloidal silver in my practice. I had a patient that had > the two middle toes shot of by a shot gun, they did skin grafts and the > grafts where not taking. The doctors wanted to amputate his foot, I > asked him to wait and apply the Colloidal silver to the wound. In one > month the grafts took and the healing was remarkable. I give all my > patients Colloidal silver and advise them to take it immediately if > they suspect a cold or infection. It works every time. In Heath, Mary Every time, Mary? That is a big claim, especially when contrasted with published data on Medline [sent earlier]. Best regards, Email: < WORK : Teagasc, c/o 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland Mobile: 353-; [in the Republic: 0] HOME : 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland Tel : 353-; [in the Republic: 0] WWW : http://homepage.eircom.net/~progers/searchap.htm Chinese Proverb: " Man who says it can't be done, should not interrupt man doing it " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 Is there a particular brand you recommend? Do you carry this in your practice, or send your patients out to find it for themselves? How much should people take/use topically? DrSpohn wrote: I also use Colloidal silver in my practice. I had a patient that had the two middle toes shot of by a shot gun, they did skin grafts and the grafts where not taking. The doctors wanted to amputate his foot, I asked him to wait and apply the Colloidal silver to the wound. In one month the grafts took and the healing was remarkable. I give all my patients Colloidal silver and advise them to take it immediately if they suspect a cold or infection. It works every time. In Heath, Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 What's your source? I have made generators in the past... Do you have a more stable/standardized method >>>>> Michael What is this regarding? Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 colloidal silver... do you use commercial sources or do you make your own... <alonmarcus wrote: What's your source? I have made generators in the past... Do you have a more stable/standardized method >>>>> Michael What is this regarding? Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 colloidal silver... do you use commercial sources or do you make your own... >>>> I do not use it Oakland, CA 94609 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 From what I could find about Sea silver, it has little or nothing to do with silver. It is a blend of herbs and juices. http://www.seasilver.com/product.aspx The FDA doesn't permit any health claims with anything other than drugs. The FDA ruling regarding colloidal silver is both biased and misinformed, as is often the case when evaluating " alternative " medical claims. I'm not familiar with the other research studies, but I find it interesting that they contradict other research claims. Being someone who has suffered from chronic sore throats and canker sores most of my life I can say from first hand experience that colloidal silver is the first product that has made a consistent impact with my health regarding these conditions. I do know that not all colloidal silver is created equal and that some forms are pretty much useless. Here are some web resources to look into: http://www.silver-colloids.com/ http://www.silver-colloids.com/Pubs/biostudies.html http://www.silverfacts.com/safety.html http://www.silvermedicine.org/ I produce my own colloidal silver using distilled water, 99.999% silver wire, four 9 volt batteries (27 volts total) in series, and alligator clips to connect the batteries to the wire. It is cheap, easy and simple to do. There are a lot of false and misleading claims about silver products and it is difficult to distill the facts from all the noise. The Quackwatch and skeptics clearly don't understand it's use and appeal to fear to make their points, and organizations such as the FDA and the AMA contradict themselves when prescription silver products are used in burn centers around the country Unfortunately profit drives so much medical research which can create a serious bias. I do know from my first hand experience, and that of many of my patients, that it works for conditions where the solution can flush the area affected, much like H2O2, but without the stinging or bubbling. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Phil Rogers Saturday, October 15, 2005 8:05 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver Hi Christopher, & All, http://wlapwww.gov.bc.ca/wat/wq/BCguidelines/silver/marine.htm says: Ambient levels of Ag in the oceans range from about 0.04-2.5 µg/L (40- 2500mg/tonne!) So, where does the term " sea silver " come from, as seawater contains such negligible amounts of Ag? Also, the Medline Abstracts on colloidal silver are not encouraging re clinical benefit: Fed Regist. 1999 Aug 17;64(158):44653-8. Over-the-counter drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), Public Health Service (PHS), Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Final rule. [No authors listed] The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is issuing a final rule establishing that all over-the-counter (OTC) drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for internal or external use are not generally recognized as safe and effective and are misbranded. FDA is issuing this final rule because many OTC drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts are being marketed for numerous serious disease conditions and FDA is not aware of any substantial scientific evidence that supports the use of OTC colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for these disease conditions. PMID: 10558603 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Int Endod J. 2001 Jun;34(4):300-7. An in vitro evaluation of the antimicrobial efficacy of irrigants on biofilms of root canal isolates. Spratt DA, Pratten J, Wilson M, Gulabivala K. Department of Conservative Dentistry, Eastman Dental Institute for Oral Health Care Sciences, University College London, University of London, London, UK. d.spratt AIM: The bactericidal effect of four antimicrobial agents was investigated against single-species biofilms derived from a range of root canal isolates. METHODOLOGY: Single- species biofilms of Prevotella intermedia, Peptostreptococcus micros, Streptococcus intermedius, Fusobacterium nucleatum and Enterococcus faecalis were generated on membrane filter discs and subjected to 15 min or 1 h incubation with 5 p.p.m. colloidal silver, 2.25% sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl), 0.2% chlorhexidine, 10% iodine or phosphate buffered saline (PBS) as a control. The antimicrobial activity of the agents was neutralized and the bacterial cells were harvested from the discs by vortexing, serially diluted in reduced transport fluid, plated on fastidious anaerobe agar containing 5% horse blood, incubated anaerobically and colony-forming units calculated. RESULTS: Iodine and NaOCl were more effective than chlorhexidine except against P. micros and P. intermedia where they were all 100% effective. Iodine and NaOCl elicited a 100% kill after 1 h incubation for all strains used. However, after 15 min, they showed differing bactericidal effects depending on the strain. None of the agents were effective against F. nucleatum after 15 min but NaOCl, iodine and chlorhexidine were all effective after 1 h. Colloidal silver was generally ineffective. CONCLUSIONS: The effectiveness of a particular agent was dependent on the nature of the organism in the biofilm and on the contact time. NaOCl was generally the most effective agent tested, followed by iodine. However the clinical efficacy of these agents must be considered in light of the complex root canal anatomy and polymicrobial nature of root canal infections. PMID: 11482142 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] J Wound Care. 2004 Apr;13(4):154-5. Colloidal silver as an antimicrobial agent: fact or fiction? van Hasselt P, Gashe BA, Ahmad J. Ear Clinic, Bamalete Lutheran Hospital, Ramotswa, Botswana. pvhasselt OBJECTIVE: Colloidal silver preparations are marketed on the internet as omnipotent antimicrobial agents, but scientific support for these claims is lacking. This study reports the results of in vitro tests of colloidal silver's antimicrobial activity against several pathogenic or non-pathogenic microorganisms. METHOD: Three samples of colloidal silver were tested: one available commercially on the internet (silver concentration of 22 ppm) and two samples (concentrations of 403 and 413 ppm) which were prepared in our laboratory using standard chemical methods. RESULTS: In an agar- well diffusion assay none of the three colloidal silver solutions had any effect on the growth of the test organisms. All tested bacterial strains were sensitive to ciprofloxacin. Colloidal silver 22 ppm showed no bactericidal activity in phenol coefficient tests. CONCLUSION: As the tested colloidal silver solutions did not show any antimicrobial effect in vitro on the microorganisms, claims of colloidal silver's antimicrobial potency are misleading and there is no place for it as an antiseptic. Publication Types: Evaluation Studies PMID: 15114827 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Best regards, Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) Ireland. Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) " Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " - Chinese Proverb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 I use four 9 volt batteries in series (27 volts total). A constant voltage is important and batteries seem to work best since it is a pure DC current. The current is very slight and with batteries I can make several gallons of 20ppm solution before they need to be replaced. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Michael Finnell Friday, October 14, 2005 1:50 PM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver What voltage do you recommend Chris? " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 15, 2005 Report Share Posted October 15, 2005 Hi Phil: I've used colloidal silver to effectively treat a persistent strain of lichen stratus and also for sinusitis.....so to quote.. " Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it.. " I don't know if the labs agar assays were anything like the patient's biochemistry...... < wrote: Hi Christopher, & All, http://wlapwww.gov.bc.ca/wat/wq/BCguidelines/silver/marine.htm says: Ambient levels of Ag in the oceans range from about 0.04-2.5 µg/L (40- 2500mg/tonne!) So, where does the term " sea silver " come from, as seawater contains such negligible amounts of Ag? Also, the Medline Abstracts on colloidal silver are not encouraging re clinical benefit: Fed Regist. 1999 Aug 17;64(158):44653-8. Over-the-counter drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), Public Health Service (PHS), Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Final rule. [No authors listed] The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is issuing a final rule establishing that all over-the-counter (OTC) drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for internal or external use are not generally recognized as safe and effective and are misbranded. FDA is issuing this final rule because many OTC drug products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts are being marketed for numerous serious disease conditions and FDA is not aware of any substantial scientific evidence that supports the use of OTC colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for these disease conditions. PMID: 10558603 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Int Endod J. 2001 Jun;34(4):300-7. An in vitro evaluation of the antimicrobial efficacy of irrigants on biofilms of root canal isolates. Spratt DA, Pratten J, Wilson M, Gulabivala K. Department of Conservative Dentistry, Eastman Dental Institute for Oral Health Care Sciences, University College London, University of London, London, UK. d.spratt AIM: The bactericidal effect of four antimicrobial agents was investigated against single-species biofilms derived from a range of root canal isolates. METHODOLOGY: Single- species biofilms of Prevotella intermedia, Peptostreptococcus micros, Streptococcus intermedius, Fusobacterium nucleatum and Enterococcus faecalis were generated on membrane filter discs and subjected to 15 min or 1 h incubation with 5 p.p.m. colloidal silver, 2.25% sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl), 0.2% chlorhexidine, 10% iodine or phosphate buffered saline (PBS) as a control. The antimicrobial activity of the agents was neutralized and the bacterial cells were harvested from the discs by vortexing, serially diluted in reduced transport fluid, plated on fastidious anaerobe agar containing 5% horse blood, incubated anaerobically and colony-forming units calculated. RESULTS: Iodine and NaOCl were more effective than chlorhexidine except against P. micros and P. intermedia where they were all 100% effective. Iodine and NaOCl elicited a 100% kill after 1 h incubation for all strains used. However, after 15 min, they showed differing bactericidal effects depending on the strain. None of the agents were effective against F. nucleatum after 15 min but NaOCl, iodine and chlorhexidine were all effective after 1 h. Colloidal silver was generally ineffective. CONCLUSIONS: The effectiveness of a particular agent was dependent on the nature of the organism in the biofilm and on the contact time. NaOCl was generally the most effective agent tested, followed by iodine. However the clinical efficacy of these agents must be considered in light of the complex root canal anatomy and polymicrobial nature of root canal infections. PMID: 11482142 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] J Wound Care. 2004 Apr;13(4):154-5. Colloidal silver as an antimicrobial agent: fact or fiction? van Hasselt P, Gashe BA, Ahmad J. Ear Clinic, Bamalete Lutheran Hospital, Ramotswa, Botswana. pvhasselt OBJECTIVE: Colloidal silver preparations are marketed on the internet as omnipotent antimicrobial agents, but scientific support for these claims is lacking. This study reports the results of in vitro tests of colloidal silver's antimicrobial activity against several pathogenic or non-pathogenic microorganisms. METHOD: Three samples of colloidal silver were tested: one available commercially on the internet (silver concentration of 22 ppm) and two samples (concentrations of 403 and 413 ppm) which were prepared in our laboratory using standard chemical methods. RESULTS: In an agar- well diffusion assay none of the three colloidal silver solutions had any effect on the growth of the test organisms. All tested bacterial strains were sensitive to ciprofloxacin. Colloidal silver 22 ppm showed no bactericidal activity in phenol coefficient tests. CONCLUSION: As the tested colloidal silver solutions did not show any antimicrobial effect in vitro on the microorganisms, claims of colloidal silver's antimicrobial potency are misleading and there is no place for it as an antiseptic. Publication Types: Evaluation Studies PMID: 15114827 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] Best regards, Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) Ireland. Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) " Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " - Chinese Proverb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. wrote: >>From what I could find about Sea silver, it has little or nothing to do > with silver. It is a blend of herbs and juices. > http://www.seasilver.com/product.aspx > > The FDA doesn't permit any health claims with anything other than drugs. > The FDA ruling regarding colloidal silver is both biased and > misinformed, as is often the case when evaluating " alternative " medical > claims. I'm not familiar with the other research studies, but I find it > interesting that they contradict other research claims. > > Being someone who has suffered from chronic sore throats and canker > sores most of my life I can say from first hand experience that > colloidal silver is the first product that has made a consistent impact > with my health regarding these conditions. Hi Christopher! As a child I was taken to an elderly MD for a canker sore. He touched it with a stick pre-coated with silver nitrate. It kind of cauterized the canker sore and it went away. No other doctor has ever done this for me since. Regards, Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Thanks Chris... this is very similar to the " generator " I had made... using the 99.99% silver wire... works very effective... At one time there were some pretty detailed web accounts of making and using... but haven't seen them much anymore... " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:I use four 9 volt batteries in series (27 volts total). A constant voltage is important and batteries seem to work best since it is a pure DC current. The current is very slight and with batteries I can make several gallons of 20ppm solution before they need to be replaced. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Michael Finnell Friday, October 14, 2005 1:50 PM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver What voltage do you recommend Chris? " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Hi Christopher, I've been following this thread and wondered why Phil's response was dismissed by referencing " scientific evidence " from commercial sites dedicated to the development and sale of silver colloid products. Not all of the papers from Medline relating to silver colloid studies are from the FDA. The explicit results from the Journal of Wound Care, April 2004 paper notes that colloidal silver has no antimicrobial effect in vitro. The control was Cipro that responded well to all of the bacterial solutions. I just had a surgical site staph infection from a broken bone reconstruction and would not have bought in to colloidal silver. I used highest dosage of Augmentin and a strong CM herbal formula for bone infection, which is what I had. Two months later I discontinued treatment with good radiological results. It's possible that the CM herbal formula alone could have done the job, but I chose to combine it with WM. Losing my arm was not an option I was prepared for. Nor did I want to spend weeks in the hospital with an ongoing dose of rifampin. Also I'm noticing that people are using colloidal silver for both viral (colds and canker sores) and bacterial infections. Since colloidal silver does not have anti-bacterial action, are you suggesting it's anti-viral or somehow directly augmenting immune response? Why wouldn't you use a Chinese herbal formula based on principles of CM? Would you really use colloidal silver on a serious wound site considering it's poor performance as compared to Cipro? If it was your own life and limb in the balance? I'm not quite getting what is compelling your motivation to use colloidal silver or the ionized silver solution you've been creating. Perhaps it's just your own empirical finding? Respectfully, Emmanuel Segmen Chinese Medicine , " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler@a...> wrote: > > From what I could find about Sea silver, it has little or nothing to do > with silver. It is a blend of herbs and juices. > http://www.seasilver.com/product.aspx > > The FDA doesn't permit any health claims with anything other than drugs. > The FDA ruling regarding colloidal silver is both biased and > misinformed, as is often the case when evaluating " alternative " medical > claims. I'm not familiar with the other research studies, but I find it > interesting that they contradict other research claims. > > Being someone who has suffered from chronic sore throats and canker > sores most of my life I can say from first hand experience that > colloidal silver is the first product that has made a consistent impact > with my health regarding these conditions. I do know that not all > colloidal silver is created equal and that some forms are pretty much > useless. > > Here are some web resources to look into: > http://www.silver-colloids.com/ > http://www.silver-colloids.com/Pubs/biostudies.html > http://www.silverfacts.com/safety.html > http://www.silvermedicine.org/ > > I produce my own colloidal silver using distilled water, 99.999% silver > wire, four 9 volt batteries (27 volts total) in series, and alligator > clips to connect the batteries to the wire. It is cheap, easy and > simple to do. There are a lot of false and misleading claims about > silver products and it is difficult to distill the facts from all the > noise. The Quackwatch and skeptics clearly don't understand it's use > and appeal to fear to make their points, and organizations such as the > FDA and the AMA contradict themselves when prescription silver products > are used in burn centers around the country Unfortunately profit drives > so much medical research which can create a serious bias. > > I do know from my first hand experience, and that of many of my > patients, that it works for conditions where the solution can flush the > area affected, much like H2O2, but without the stinging or bubbling. > > Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. > Oasis Acupuncture > <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com > 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte > Suite D-35 > Scottsdale, AZ 85258 > Phone: (480) 991-3650 > Fax: (480) 247-4472 > > > Chinese Medicine > Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Phil > Rogers > Saturday, October 15, 2005 8:05 AM > Chinese Medicine > Re: Sea silver > > > Hi Christopher, & All, > > http://wlapwww.gov.bc.ca/wat/wq/BCguidelines/silver/marine.htm says: > Ambient levels of Ag in the oceans range from about 0.04-2.5 µg/L (40- > 2500mg/tonne!) > > So, where does the term " sea silver " come from, as seawater contains > such negligible amounts of Ag? > > Also, the Medline Abstracts on colloidal silver are not encouraging re > clinical benefit: > > Fed Regist. 1999 Aug 17;64(158):44653-8. Over-the-counter drug > products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts. > Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), Public Health > Service (PHS), Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Final rule. [No > authors listed] The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is issuing a > final rule establishing that all over-the-counter (OTC) drug products > containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for internal or > external use are not generally recognized as safe and effective and are > misbranded. FDA is issuing this final rule because many OTC drug > products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts are > being > marketed for numerous serious disease conditions and FDA is not > aware of any substantial scientific evidence that supports the use of > OTC colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for these disease > conditions. PMID: 10558603 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > > Int Endod J. 2001 Jun;34(4):300-7. An in vitro evaluation of the > antimicrobial efficacy of irrigants on biofilms of root canal isolates. > > Spratt DA, Pratten J, Wilson M, Gulabivala K. Department of > Conservative Dentistry, Eastman Dental Institute for Oral Health Care > Sciences, University College London, University of London, London, UK. > d.spratt@e... AIM: The bactericidal effect of four > antimicrobial agents was investigated against single-species biofilms > derived from a range of root canal isolates. METHODOLOGY: Single- > species biofilms of Prevotella intermedia, Peptostreptococcus micros, > Streptococcus intermedius, Fusobacterium nucleatum and > Enterococcus faecalis were generated on membrane filter discs and > subjected to 15 min or 1 h incubation with 5 p.p.m. colloidal silver, > 2.25% sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl), 0.2% chlorhexidine, 10% iodine or > phosphate buffered saline (PBS) as a control. The antimicrobial activity > > of the agents was neutralized and the bacterial cells were harvested > from the discs by vortexing, serially diluted in reduced transport > fluid, > plated on fastidious anaerobe agar containing 5% horse blood, > incubated anaerobically and colony-forming units calculated. RESULTS: > Iodine and NaOCl were more effective than chlorhexidine except > against P. micros and P. intermedia where they were all 100% effective. > Iodine and NaOCl elicited a 100% kill after 1 h incubation for all > strains > used. However, after 15 min, they showed differing bactericidal effects > depending on the strain. None of the agents were effective against F. > nucleatum after 15 min but NaOCl, iodine and chlorhexidine were all > effective after 1 h. Colloidal silver was generally ineffective. > CONCLUSIONS: The effectiveness of a particular agent was dependent > on the nature of the organism in the biofilm and on the contact time. > NaOCl was generally the most effective agent tested, followed by iodine. > > However the clinical efficacy of these agents must be considered in > light > of the complex root canal anatomy and polymicrobial nature of root > canal infections. PMID: 11482142 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > > J Wound Care. 2004 Apr;13(4):154-5. Colloidal silver as an > antimicrobial agent: fact or fiction? van Hasselt P, Gashe BA, Ahmad J. > > Ear Clinic, Bamalete Lutheran Hospital, Ramotswa, Botswana. > pvhasselt@p... OBJECTIVE: Colloidal silver preparations are > marketed on the internet as omnipotent antimicrobial agents, but > scientific support for these claims is lacking. This study reports the > results of in vitro tests of colloidal silver's antimicrobial activity > against > several pathogenic or non-pathogenic microorganisms. METHOD: > Three samples of colloidal silver were tested: one available > commercially on the internet (silver concentration of 22 ppm) and two > samples (concentrations of 403 and 413 ppm) which were prepared in > our laboratory using standard chemical methods. RESULTS: In an agar- > well diffusion assay none of the three colloidal silver solutions had > any > effect on the growth of the test organisms. All tested bacterial strains > > were sensitive to ciprofloxacin. Colloidal silver 22 ppm showed no > bactericidal activity in phenol coefficient tests. CONCLUSION: As the > tested colloidal silver solutions did not show any antimicrobial effect > in > vitro on the microorganisms, claims of colloidal silver's antimicrobial > potency are misleading and there is no place for it as an antiseptic. > Publication Types: Evaluation Studies PMID: 15114827 [PubMed - > indexed for MEDLINE] > > Best regards, > > > Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) > <@e...>; > > > > Ireland. > Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) > <@e...>; > > > " Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " - > Chinese Proverb > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Hi Pete, Silver nitrate is a known antimicrobial agent used widely and very successfully on external infections from the 1960s ... especially on external otitis. Colloidal silver appears not to be antimicrobial based on non-commerical research. Respectfully, Emmanuel Segmen > > Hi Christopher! > > As a child I was taken to an elderly MD for a canker sore. He touched it > with a stick pre-coated with silver nitrate. It kind of cauterized the > canker sore and it went away. No other doctor has ever done this for me > since. > > Regards, > > Pete > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Emmanuel Segmen wrote: > Hi Pete, > > Silver nitrate is a known antimicrobial agent used widely and very > successfully on external infections from the 1960s ... especially on > external otitis. Colloidal silver appears not to be antimicrobial > based on non-commerical research. Hi Emmanuel! Wow! This was in the early 50s, the old guy must have been a radical. Regards, Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Phil, I have been in practice for 10 years. The # 1 is, do no harm to your patient. If you have not tried the silver i suggest you do. You may find something new In Health, Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Chris, How do you determine when your solution is done, and the concentration? Michael Finnell <mfinnell0401 wrote: Thanks Chris... this is very similar to the " generator " I had made... using the 99.99% silver wire... works very effective... At one time there were some pretty detailed web accounts of making and using... but haven't seen them much anymore... " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:I use four 9 volt batteries in series (27 volts total). A constant voltage is important and batteries seem to work best since it is a pure DC current. The current is very slight and with batteries I can make several gallons of 20ppm solution before they need to be replaced. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Michael Finnell Friday, October 14, 2005 1:50 PM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver What voltage do you recommend Chris? " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 I have a meter that measures dissolved solids in parts per million. Distilled water is zero, and I'm using 99.999% pure silver so it is a safe bet that any dissolved solids are silver. I it takes several hours, but my target is 20ppm. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Monday, October 17, 2005 6:59 AM Chinese Medicine RE: Sea silver Chris, How do you determine when your solution is done, and the concentration? Michael Finnell <mfinnell0401 wrote: Thanks Chris... this is very similar to the " generator " I had made... using the 99.99% silver wire... works very effective... At one time there were some pretty detailed web accounts of making and using... but haven't seen them much anymore... " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:I use four 9 volt batteries in series (27 volts total). A constant voltage is important and batteries seem to work best since it is a pure DC current. The current is very slight and with batteries I can make several gallons of 20ppm solution before they need to be replaced. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Michael Finnell Friday, October 14, 2005 1:50 PM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver What voltage do you recommend Chris? " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler wrote:Colloidal silver is different than " sea silver " . Colloidal silver is produced with distilled water and pure silver using a low voltage electrical process. Sea silver is much higher concentrations of silver (not a good thing as it is surface area, not the quantity of silver that makes the silver effective). Combining salts with silver greatly reduce the benefits of silver. Colloidal silver is completely safe even in higher doses since the silver binds with potassium almost instantly in the body, making it inert where it passes easily out of the body. The silver ions in colloidal silver are too small to get lodged in the cells and so the risk of Argyria is non-existent. I use colloidal silver myself and in my practice. It is a wonderful topical antiviral / antibacterial substance for anywhere in or on the body where the solution can be flushed (sinuses, throat, ears, eyes, vagina etc.) It is not effective for internal infections since the silver can not make it through the blood stream without binding to potassium. The information at Quackwatch paints silver with a very broad brush without investigating it thoroughly and with no attempt to understand the underlying issues or science. Silver products are used in most trauma centers for burn patients and to clean the eyes of newborns. It is widely accepted in Western medicine as an effective antiviral / antibacterial substance. You can even buy band-aids impregnated with silver. The only known health issues with silver (in any form) is a cosmetic condition called Argyria (a bluing of the skin). This typically is caused by high doses of low quality colloidal silver over a long period of time, or silver ingested where the molecules are large enough to become stuck within the cells. High quality colloidal silver is very safe and effective. Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Benjamin Hawes, L.Ac. Friday, October 14, 2005 9:30 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Digest Number 1148 I have found out the many of my patients take colloidal silver or " sea silver " as an antiviral/antibacterial. Does nayone know anything substantive about this substance(s)? Quackwatch has the usual bad news, and the side-effects are certainly there for overuse. But is there any real evidence for benefit anywhere, mechanism, research, etc.? Thanks. Ben Hawes L.Ac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Thanks Emmanuel, I never meant to suggest that colloidal silver was a substitute for WM antibiotics or CM. If an infection is threatening life or limb there is really no substitute for antibiotics in my opinion. But when the only tool in your tool box is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. Antibiotics are like a canon, and colloidal silver is like a fly swatter (on a par with H2O2 but with out the oxidation and potential toxicity). I prefer to use all the tools I have available. For my own condition of canker sores, colloidal silver works wonderfully, and I suspect that Cipro would be ineffective and even counterproductive. There are a number of studies to suggest that colloidal silver has both anti-bacterial and anti-viral properties. There are a list of studies at: http://www.silvermedicine.org/scientificstudies.html Thank you, Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. Oasis Acupuncture <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte Suite D-35 Scottsdale, AZ 85258 Phone: (480) 991-3650 Fax: (480) 247-4472 Chinese Medicine Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Emmanuel Segmen Sunday, October 16, 2005 3:02 AM Chinese Medicine Re: Sea silver Hi Christopher, I've been following this thread and wondered why Phil's response was dismissed by referencing " scientific evidence " from commercial sites dedicated to the development and sale of silver colloid products. Not all of the papers from Medline relating to silver colloid studies are from the FDA. The explicit results from the Journal of Wound Care, April 2004 paper notes that colloidal silver has no antimicrobial effect in vitro. The control was Cipro that responded well to all of the bacterial solutions. I just had a surgical site staph infection from a broken bone reconstruction and would not have bought in to colloidal silver. I used highest dosage of Augmentin and a strong CM herbal formula for bone infection, which is what I had. Two months later I discontinued treatment with good radiological results. It's possible that the CM herbal formula alone could have done the job, but I chose to combine it with WM. Losing my arm was not an option I was prepared for. Nor did I want to spend weeks in the hospital with an ongoing dose of rifampin. Also I'm noticing that people are using colloidal silver for both viral (colds and canker sores) and bacterial infections. Since colloidal silver does not have anti-bacterial action, are you suggesting it's anti-viral or somehow directly augmenting immune response? Why wouldn't you use a Chinese herbal formula based on principles of CM? Would you really use colloidal silver on a serious wound site considering it's poor performance as compared to Cipro? If it was your own life and limb in the balance? I'm not quite getting what is compelling your motivation to use colloidal silver or the ionized silver solution you've been creating. Perhaps it's just your own empirical finding? Respectfully, Emmanuel Segmen Chinese Medicine , " Christopher Vedeler L.Ac. " <ckvedeler@a...> wrote: > > From what I could find about Sea silver, it has little or nothing to do > with silver. It is a blend of herbs and juices. > http://www.seasilver.com/product.aspx > > The FDA doesn't permit any health claims with anything other than drugs. > The FDA ruling regarding colloidal silver is both biased and > misinformed, as is often the case when evaluating " alternative " medical > claims. I'm not familiar with the other research studies, but I find it > interesting that they contradict other research claims. > > Being someone who has suffered from chronic sore throats and canker > sores most of my life I can say from first hand experience that > colloidal silver is the first product that has made a consistent impact > with my health regarding these conditions. I do know that not all > colloidal silver is created equal and that some forms are pretty much > useless. > > Here are some web resources to look into: > http://www.silver-colloids.com/ > http://www.silver-colloids.com/Pubs/biostudies.html > http://www.silverfacts.com/safety.html > http://www.silvermedicine.org/ > > I produce my own colloidal silver using distilled water, 99.999% silver > wire, four 9 volt batteries (27 volts total) in series, and alligator > clips to connect the batteries to the wire. It is cheap, easy and > simple to do. There are a lot of false and misleading claims about > silver products and it is difficult to distill the facts from all the > noise. The Quackwatch and skeptics clearly don't understand it's use > and appeal to fear to make their points, and organizations such as the > FDA and the AMA contradict themselves when prescription silver products > are used in burn centers around the country Unfortunately profit drives > so much medical research which can create a serious bias. > > I do know from my first hand experience, and that of many of my > patients, that it works for conditions where the solution can flush the > area affected, much like H2O2, but without the stinging or bubbling. > > Christopher Vedeler L.Ac., C.Ht. > Oasis Acupuncture > <http://www.oasisacupuncture.com/> http://www.oasisacupuncture.com > 8233 N. Via Paseo del Norte > Suite D-35 > Scottsdale, AZ 85258 > Phone: (480) 991-3650 > Fax: (480) 247-4472 > > > Chinese Medicine > Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Phil > Rogers > Saturday, October 15, 2005 8:05 AM > Chinese Medicine > Re: Sea silver > > > Hi Christopher, & All, > > http://wlapwww.gov.bc.ca/wat/wq/BCguidelines/silver/marine.htm says: > Ambient levels of Ag in the oceans range from about 0.04-2.5 µg/L (40- > 2500mg/tonne!) > > So, where does the term " sea silver " come from, as seawater contains > such negligible amounts of Ag? > > Also, the Medline Abstracts on colloidal silver are not encouraging re > clinical benefit: > > Fed Regist. 1999 Aug 17;64(158):44653-8. Over-the-counter drug > products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts. > Department of Health and Human Services (HHS), Public Health > Service (PHS), Food and Drug Administration (FDA). Final rule. [No > authors listed] The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) is issuing a > final rule establishing that all over-the-counter (OTC) drug products > containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for internal or > external use are not generally recognized as safe and effective and are > misbranded. FDA is issuing this final rule because many OTC drug > products containing colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts are > being > marketed for numerous serious disease conditions and FDA is not > aware of any substantial scientific evidence that supports the use of > OTC colloidal silver ingredients or silver salts for these disease > conditions. PMID: 10558603 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > > Int Endod J. 2001 Jun;34(4):300-7. An in vitro evaluation of the > antimicrobial efficacy of irrigants on biofilms of root canal isolates. > > Spratt DA, Pratten J, Wilson M, Gulabivala K. Department of > Conservative Dentistry, Eastman Dental Institute for Oral Health Care > Sciences, University College London, University of London, London, UK. > d.spratt@e... AIM: The bactericidal effect of four > antimicrobial agents was investigated against single-species biofilms > derived from a range of root canal isolates. METHODOLOGY: Single- > species biofilms of Prevotella intermedia, Peptostreptococcus micros, > Streptococcus intermedius, Fusobacterium nucleatum and > Enterococcus faecalis were generated on membrane filter discs and > subjected to 15 min or 1 h incubation with 5 p.p.m. colloidal silver, > 2.25% sodium hypochlorite (NaOCl), 0.2% chlorhexidine, 10% iodine or > phosphate buffered saline (PBS) as a control. The antimicrobial activity > > of the agents was neutralized and the bacterial cells were harvested > from the discs by vortexing, serially diluted in reduced transport > fluid, > plated on fastidious anaerobe agar containing 5% horse blood, > incubated anaerobically and colony-forming units calculated. RESULTS: > Iodine and NaOCl were more effective than chlorhexidine except > against P. micros and P. intermedia where they were all 100% effective. > Iodine and NaOCl elicited a 100% kill after 1 h incubation for all > strains > used. However, after 15 min, they showed differing bactericidal effects > depending on the strain. None of the agents were effective against F. > nucleatum after 15 min but NaOCl, iodine and chlorhexidine were all > effective after 1 h. Colloidal silver was generally ineffective. > CONCLUSIONS: The effectiveness of a particular agent was dependent > on the nature of the organism in the biofilm and on the contact time. > NaOCl was generally the most effective agent tested, followed by iodine. > > However the clinical efficacy of these agents must be considered in > light > of the complex root canal anatomy and polymicrobial nature of root > canal infections. PMID: 11482142 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > > J Wound Care. 2004 Apr;13(4):154-5. Colloidal silver as an > antimicrobial agent: fact or fiction? van Hasselt P, Gashe BA, Ahmad J. > > Ear Clinic, Bamalete Lutheran Hospital, Ramotswa, Botswana. > pvhasselt@p... OBJECTIVE: Colloidal silver preparations are > marketed on the internet as omnipotent antimicrobial agents, but > scientific support for these claims is lacking. This study reports the > results of in vitro tests of colloidal silver's antimicrobial activity > against > several pathogenic or non-pathogenic microorganisms. METHOD: > Three samples of colloidal silver were tested: one available > commercially on the internet (silver concentration of 22 ppm) and two > samples (concentrations of 403 and 413 ppm) which were prepared in > our laboratory using standard chemical methods. RESULTS: In an agar- > well diffusion assay none of the three colloidal silver solutions had > any > effect on the growth of the test organisms. All tested bacterial strains > > were sensitive to ciprofloxacin. Colloidal silver 22 ppm showed no > bactericidal activity in phenol coefficient tests. CONCLUSION: As the > tested colloidal silver solutions did not show any antimicrobial effect > in > vitro on the microorganisms, claims of colloidal silver's antimicrobial > potency are misleading and there is no place for it as an antiseptic. > Publication Types: Evaluation Studies PMID: 15114827 [PubMed - > indexed for MEDLINE] > > Best regards, > > > Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) > <@e...>; > > > > Ireland. > Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0) > <@e...>; > > > " Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " - > Chinese Proverb > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2005 Report Share Posted October 18, 2005 Hi Mary, > Phil, I have been in practice for 10 years. The # 1 is, do no harm to > your patient. If you have not tried the silver i suggest you do. You > may find something new In Health, Mary Many thanks. Maybe I will try Christopher's way of making it (batteries & pure silver wire + distilled water) Best regards, Email: < WORK : Teagasc, c/o 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland Mobile: 353-; [in the Republic: 0] HOME : 1 Esker Lawns, Lucan, Dublin, Ireland Tel : 353-; [in the Republic: 0] WWW : http://homepage.eircom.net/~progers/searchap.htm Chinese Proverb: " Man who says it can't be done, should not interrupt man doing it " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2005 Report Share Posted October 18, 2005 Mary, Are you using sea silver or colloidal? Which product(s) do you use? DrSpohn wrote: Phil, I have been in practice for 10 years. The # 1 is, do no harm to your patient. If you have not tried the silver i suggest you do. You may find something new In Health, Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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