Blind spots in single TCM & WM modalities

[Guest guest]

Hi Ray & All,

 

Ray Ford wrote:

> ... With great respect to ANY five element practitioners I think that this

> is a blind spot in 5 elements.I was recently treated by a renowned

> master of five elements ...[with poor results]

 

Ray, I agree 100% but go beyond that. With great respect to ANY

practitioners of ANY medical or (veterinary!) modality, I think that ALL

single modalities have HUGE blind spots!

 

The study of medicine is a life-long task and few, if any humans can

master all modalities. Ray's example of HT09 versus releasing the local

block for a rotator cuff injury is a good one. But there are many others.

 

For example, how successful would a top herbalist (or top western

specialist in internal medicine) be in treating Keshan Disease (potentially

fatal cardiomyopathy) in children before Chinese researchers

discovered that the basic cause was due to severe endemic deficiency

of selenium? Today, provision of sodium selenite tablets via the schools

has (I understand) almost wiped out that killer disease in Keshan.

 

And then I checked Medline to find that I had a blind spot on Keshan

Disease because: (a) Med Science still cannot define minimum human

requirements for selenium, and (b) Selenium deficiency may be only

part of the Keshan Disease problem!:

 

(a) Eur J Clin Nutr. 2004 Mar;58(3):391-402. Assessment of

requirements for selenium and adequacy of selenium status: a review.

Thomson CD. Department of Human Nutrition, University of Otago,

Dunedin, New Zealand. cristine.thomson

OBJECTIVE: The intent of this review is to evaluate the scientific

evidence for the assessment of adequacy of selenium status and of the

requirements for selenium. From this evidence, attempts have been

made to define levels of plasma selenium and dietary selenium intake,

which could be used for the assessment of deficiency or adequacy of

selenium status. METHOD: The first section briefly reviews the methods

for assessment of selenium status. The second section outlines the

requirements for selenium based on a number of criteria, and how these

have been translated into recommended intakes of selenium. In the final

section, levels of plasma selenium and dietary intake based on different

criteria of adequacy have been proposed. RESULTS AND

CONCLUSION: The minimum requirement for selenium is that which

prevents the deficiency disease, Keshan disease. The recommended

intakes of selenium have been calculated from the requirement for

optimum plasma glutathione peroxidase (GPx) activity that must,

because of the hierarchy of selenoproteins, also take account of the

amounts needed for normal levels of other biologically necessary

selenium compounds. Whether optimal health depends upon

maximization of GPx or other selenoproteins, however, has yet to be

resolved, and the consequences of less-than-maximal GPx activities or

mRNA levels need investigation. Intakes, higher than recommended

intakes, and plasma selenium concentrations that might be protective

for cancer or result in other additional health benefits have been

proposed. There is an urgent need for more large-scale trials to assess

any such beneficial effects and to provide further data on which to base

more reliable estimates for intakes and plasma selenium levels that are

protective. Publication Types: Review Review, Tutorial PMID:

14985676 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

(b) World J Gastroenterol. 2004 Nov 15;10(22):3299-302.

Coxsackievirus B3 infection and its mutation in Keshan disease. Ren

LQ, Li XJ, Li GS, Zhao ZT, Sun B, Sun F. Department of Pathology,

Institute of Frontier Medical Science, Jilin University, Changchun

130021, Jilin Province, China. ligs AIM: To investigate

coxsackievirus B(3) infection and its gene mutation in Keshan disease.

METHODS: The expression of Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA was detected

in autopsy specimens of acute (12 cases), sub-acute (27 cases) and

chronic (15 cases) Keshan disease by in situ hybridization. In sub-acute

Keshan disease specimens, 3 cases with positive result by in situ

hybridization were selected RT-PCR analysis. The DNA segments were

then sequenced. RESULTS: Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA was detected in

the cytoplasm of myocardiocyte. The positive rate was 83% in acute,

67% in sub-acute and 80% in chronic Keshan disease. In the

conservative region of Coxsackievirus B(3) genome, there was a

mutation in 234 (C-T) compared to the non-cardiovirulent strain,

CVB(3/0). CONCLUSION: Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA can survive and

replicate in heart muscle of Keshan disease, which may play an

important role in the occurrence of Keshan disease. The possible

mechanism of occurrence of Keshan disease is associated with point a

mutation in Coxsackievirus B(3) genome. PMID: 15484304 [PubMed -

indexed for MEDLINE]

 

In 1983, Dr. Chien Chung (Head of the AP Clinic in the Veterans'

General Hospital) published his book " Ah-Shih Point: The Pressure Pain

Point in Acupuncture: An Illusteated Guide to Clinical Acupuncture "

(Chen Kwan Book Co, Taipei). That is a very useful book on Trigger

Points, but NOWHERE in the book was it mentioned that TPs can arise

in scars, tooth sockets, etc.

 

When I visited his clinic for 5 days in 1985, I was already familiar with

the great importance of TPs [Fox WW (1975) Arthritis and allied

conditions: a new and successful approach. Ranelagh Press, South Hill

Park, London. 75 pp; Travell JG & Simons M (1984) Myofascial pain &

dysfunction: the TP manual. Part 1. Williams & Wilkins, London &

Baltimore, 713pp] and also of the German/Austrian concepts of Neural

Therapy.

 

I was amazed at the high number of patients in the VGH clinic that had

scars (old injuries, scars from knife-wounds, moxa scars, carbumcle

scars, etc).

 

But I was even more amazed that the expert AP clinicians in the VGH

Clinic did not examine scars for sensitivity! I was amazed that [having

seen hundreds of cases treated] I did not see a single case of scar

therapy. On questioning my colleagues in the Clinics, I was told that the

concept of scar therapy was not widely known in Taiwan. THAT was one

of THEIR blind spots! See: Section 9. Scar Therapy at

http://users.med.auth.gr/~karanik/english/vet/taiwan1.htm

 

The tale of the Three Blind Men and the Elephant comes to mind again!

 

CM and WM are EVOLVING at unbelievable pace; each year millions of

new pages are published on all aspects of medicine. NO HUMAN

BEING (IMO) can possibly hope to read a fraction of that output, let

alone digest and utilise it in practice!

 

Therefore, we must be content to " find a small slot " in the medical

panorama and try to master THAT slot. Even that takes much study and

it leaves us aware of just how much we do NOT know because we have

not the time to study it!!

 

We all have blind spots that only continuing study, discussion and

interaction with professionals in MANY disciplines of medicine can

illuminate partially and gradually!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Best regards,

 

 

Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0)

 

 

 

 

Ireland.

Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0)

 

 

 

" Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " -

Chinese Proverb

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Phil wrote(in part)

 

Therefore, we must be content to " find a small slot " in the medical

panorama and try to master THAT slot. Even that takes much study and it

leaves us aware of just how much we do NOT know because we have not the time

to study it!!

 

We all have blind spots that only continuing study, discussion and

interaction with professionals in MANY disciplines of medicine can

illuminate partially and gradually!

 

Phil I agree with you. The point I was making using the rotator cuff example

is not that I have all the answers or maybe none at all or maybe some that

only work for me but on the advice on a mentor in China decided a long time

ago to focus on what I know works for me and ADMIT when I don't know and

THEN do one of two things.

 

1 Research, ask for help and TRY to find out

 

2 Refer,refer,refer

 

Knowing ones limitations is important when helping others.I used the example

I used because after talking to so many practitioners and having so much

acupuncture over the years with different people who have found their " slot "

many do not seem to realise that their " slot " cannot help for " everything "

but they go ahead anyway.In the example I used the practitioner later told

me that I had " failed " his treatment and that my problem would surely return

as only the symptom had been treated.I do not believe this for a second, it

is either supreme arrogance or just a defence mechanism.I think this

attitude has to change as it is endemic.I refer so much that I have been

accused by some fellow practitioners of not having enough confidence to " go

for it " but I really have worked out my " slot " and along the way try to learn

more.I know what I can do well and more importantly I know that I do not

know so much more.If a patient REALLY wants me to treat them then I explain

that I have not got a clue but will do my best although offer them advice on

where to go some still want to go ahead so we learn together,mostly with

mixed results but it does add to the body of experience.

 

I was astonished recently when I saw a report(cant remember where)on " failed

back syndrome " which seemed to actually be a medical term or condition,so

the poor patients failed the " treatment " This is such a cop out it is

laughable if it didn't involve real people and their pain I would

laugh.Seems even when " we " fail we still want to blame the patient.I just

can't accept such an attitude.

Ray ford

 

 

Chinese Medicine

Chinese Medicine On Behalf Of Phil

Rogers

Tuesday, 23 August 2005 8:48 AM

Chinese Medicine

Blind spots in single TCM & WM modalities

 

Hi Ray & All,

 

Ray Ford wrote:

> ... With great respect to ANY five element practitioners I think that

> this is a blind spot in 5 elements.I was recently treated by a

> renowned master of five elements ...[with poor results]

 

Ray, I agree 100% but go beyond that. With great respect to ANY

practitioners of ANY medical or (veterinary!) modality, I think that ALL

single modalities have HUGE blind spots!

 

The study of medicine is a life-long task and few, if any humans can master

all modalities. Ray's example of HT09 versus releasing the local block for a

rotator cuff injury is a good one. But there are many others.

 

For example, how successful would a top herbalist (or top western specialist

in internal medicine) be in treating Keshan Disease (potentially fatal

cardiomyopathy) in children before Chinese researchers discovered that the

basic cause was due to severe endemic deficiency of selenium? Today,

provision of sodium selenite tablets via the schools has (I understand)

almost wiped out that killer disease in Keshan.

 

And then I checked Medline to find that I had a blind spot on Keshan Disease

because: (a) Med Science still cannot define minimum human requirements for

selenium, and (b) Selenium deficiency may be only part of the Keshan Disease

problem!:

 

(a) Eur J Clin Nutr. 2004 Mar;58(3):391-402. Assessment of requirements for

selenium and adequacy of selenium status: a review.

Thomson CD. Department of Human Nutrition, University of Otago, Dunedin,

New Zealand. cristine.thomson

OBJECTIVE: The intent of this review is to evaluate the scientific evidence

for the assessment of adequacy of selenium status and of the requirements

for selenium. From this evidence, attempts have been made to define levels

of plasma selenium and dietary selenium intake, which could be used for the

assessment of deficiency or adequacy of selenium status. METHOD: The first

section briefly reviews the methods for assessment of selenium status. The

second section outlines the requirements for selenium based on a number of

criteria, and how these have been translated into recommended intakes of

selenium. In the final section, levels of plasma selenium and dietary intake

based on different criteria of adequacy have been proposed. RESULTS AND

CONCLUSION: The minimum requirement for selenium is that which prevents the

deficiency disease, Keshan disease. The recommended intakes of selenium have

been calculated from the requirement for optimum plasma glutathione

peroxidase (GPx) activity that must, because of the hierarchy of

selenoproteins, also take account of the amounts needed for normal levels of

other biologically necessary selenium compounds. Whether optimal health

depends upon maximization of GPx or other selenoproteins, however, has yet

to be resolved, and the consequences of less-than-maximal GPx activities or

mRNA levels need investigation. Intakes, higher than recommended intakes,

and plasma selenium concentrations that might be protective for cancer or

result in other additional health benefits have been proposed. There is an

urgent need for more large-scale trials to assess any such beneficial

effects and to provide further data on which to base more reliable estimates

for intakes and plasma selenium levels that are protective. Publication

Types: Review Review, Tutorial PMID:

14985676 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

(b) World J Gastroenterol. 2004 Nov 15;10(22):3299-302.

Coxsackievirus B3 infection and its mutation in Keshan disease. Ren LQ, Li

XJ, Li GS, Zhao ZT, Sun B, Sun F. Department of Pathology, Institute of

Frontier Medical Science, Jilin University, Changchun 130021, Jilin

Province, China. ligs AIM: To investigate coxsackievirus

B(3) infection and its gene mutation in Keshan disease.

METHODS: The expression of Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA was detected in autopsy

specimens of acute (12 cases), sub-acute (27 cases) and chronic (15 cases)

Keshan disease by in situ hybridization. In sub-acute Keshan disease

specimens, 3 cases with positive result by in situ hybridization were

selected RT-PCR analysis. The DNA segments were then sequenced. RESULTS:

Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA was detected in the cytoplasm of myocardiocyte. The

positive rate was 83% in acute, 67% in sub-acute and 80% in chronic Keshan

disease. In the conservative region of Coxsackievirus B(3) genome, there was

a mutation in 234 (C-T) compared to the non-cardiovirulent strain, CVB(3/0).

CONCLUSION: Coxsackievirus B(3) RNA can survive and replicate in heart

muscle of Keshan disease, which may play an important role in the occurrence

of Keshan disease. The possible mechanism of occurrence of Keshan disease is

associated with point a mutation in Coxsackievirus B(3) genome. PMID:

15484304 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

In 1983, Dr. Chien Chung (Head of the AP Clinic in the Veterans'

General Hospital) published his book " Ah-Shih Point: The Pressure Pain Point

in Acupuncture: An Illusteated Guide to Clinical Acupuncture "

(Chen Kwan Book Co, Taipei). That is a very useful book on Trigger Points,

but NOWHERE in the book was it mentioned that TPs can arise in scars, tooth

sockets, etc.

 

When I visited his clinic for 5 days in 1985, I was already familiar with

the great importance of TPs [Fox WW (1975) Arthritis and allied

conditions: a new and successful approach. Ranelagh Press, South Hill Park,

London. 75 pp; Travell JG & Simons M (1984) Myofascial pain &

dysfunction: the TP manual. Part 1. Williams & Wilkins, London & Baltimore,

713pp] and also of the German/Austrian concepts of Neural Therapy.

 

I was amazed at the high number of patients in the VGH clinic that had scars

(old injuries, scars from knife-wounds, moxa scars, carbumcle scars, etc).

 

But I was even more amazed that the expert AP clinicians in the VGH Clinic

did not examine scars for sensitivity! I was amazed that [having seen

hundreds of cases treated] I did not see a single case of scar therapy. On

questioning my colleagues in the Clinics, I was told that the concept of

scar therapy was not widely known in Taiwan. THAT was one of THEIR blind

spots! See: Section 9. Scar Therapy at

http://users.med.auth.gr/~karanik/english/vet/taiwan1.htm

 

The tale of the Three Blind Men and the Elephant comes to mind again!

 

CM and WM are EVOLVING at unbelievable pace; each year millions of new pages

are published on all aspects of medicine. NO HUMAN BEING (IMO) can possibly

hope to read a fraction of that output, let alone digest and utilise it in

practice!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Best regards,

 

 

Tel: (H): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0)

 

 

Ireland.

Tel: (W): +353-(0) or (M): +353-(0)

 

 

" Man who says it can't be done should not interrupt man doing it " - Chinese

Proverb