Guest guest Posted February 18, 2005 Report Share Posted February 18, 2005 Has anyone had success treating this? I actually have with one previous case, but the current case is more severe. This is a 60 year old with burning tongue lips and mouth worsened by most food and some scents and sometimes a salty taste especially when she drinks water. She also has diarrhea preceeded by cramping 3 times per week (IBS), history of low back and knee pain, psoriasis, anemia, tarry stools (but not recently), high cholesterol. She is thirsty and hungry all the time. Her eyes are sunken and pale complexion, slight build. Pulse is wiry and tongue is deep reddish purple, scant coat, swollen sides but no scallops. She feels cold. is depressed with the length of this problem (has been 2.5 yrs) and energy is moderate to low- she feels this is due to the depression. She says she has no other stress really except this condition. She eats egg white omlettes, bananas, and english muffins exclusively with occasional challenges with other foods and drinks exclusively diet sodas because it soothes the burning - about 4 cans per day. I think she has blood xu, spleen qi xu with invasion by liver and kidney xu Any thoughts (other than cutting out the aspartame which I am trying to convince her of...) on her diagnosis or treatment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2005 Report Share Posted February 19, 2005 Nicole - Has she been evaluated for Sjogren's Syndrome. This is an autoimmune disorder characterized by sicca symptoms such as dry and/or burning oral mucosa, tongue, lips, etc. You should be able to read all about it on any of the Sjogren's support group websites and see if you think it matches her presentation. If it is Sjogren's, this can be a stubborn problem to cure with TCM, but herbs and acupuncture can definitely lessen the severity and duration of symptoms. Ray. On Feb 18, 2005, at 3:28 PM, nicolehohmann wrote: > > > Has anyone had success treating this? I actually have with one > previous case, but the current case is more severe. > > This is a 60 year old with burning tongue lips and mouth worsened by > most food and some scents and sometimes a salty taste especially when > she drinks water. She also has diarrhea preceeded by cramping 3 times > per week (IBS), history of low back and knee pain, psoriasis, anemia, > tarry stools (but not recently), high cholesterol. She is thirsty and > hungry all the time. Her eyes are sunken and pale complexion, slight > build. > Pulse is wiry and tongue is deep reddish purple, scant coat, swollen > sides but no scallops. She feels cold. is depressed with the length > of this problem (has been 2.5 yrs) and energy is moderate to low- she > feels this is due to the depression. > She says she has no other stress really except this condition. > She eats egg white omlettes, bananas, and english muffins exclusively > with occasional challenges with other foods and drinks exclusively > diet sodas because it soothes the burning - about 4 cans per day. > > I think she has blood xu, spleen qi xu with invasion by liver and > kidney xu > Any thoughts (other than cutting out the aspartame which I am trying > to convince her of...) on her diagnosis or treatment? > > http://babel.altavista.com/ > > > and > adjust accordingly. > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the > group requires prior permission from the author. > > If you are a TCM academic and wish to discuss TCM with other > academics, > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2005 Report Share Posted February 19, 2005 Hi With regard to her diagnosis i think the following:- Stomach yin vacuity - thirsty and hungry, scant tongue coat Spleen qi vacuity - swollen tongue ( & complex disease) Kidney yin and yang vacuity - age, low back and knee pain, cold depressive heat of the liver - depression, burningtongue, lips and mouth, deep reddish purple tongue, wiry pulse Blood stasis - reddish purple tongue, age I think the aspartame is causing the liver heat which in turn has affected the stomach and spleen causing the burning feeling and yin vacuity as well as the bouts of diarrhea. blood stasis is evident from the purple nature of her tongue and even if it were not purple, blood stasis is a very important disease mechanism in the elderly. Depressive heat is the condition of replete heat that arises after long term qi stagnation. in her case this may be due to aspartame and other lifestyle factors. i agree about her stopping the aspartame otherwise treating her would be like adding fuel(yin) to the fire(aspartame) just giving her more to burn. for treatment besides whatever you are going to do with herbs/acupuncture you can also give her some watermelon frost to spray onto her tongue tec. to ease the burning while you address the root. Feroz Chinese Medicine , Ray Rubio <RTOO@e...> wrote: > Nicole - > > Has she been evaluated for Sjogren's Syndrome. This is an autoimmune > disorder characterized by sicca symptoms such as dry and/or burning > oral mucosa, tongue, lips, etc. You should be able to read all about it > on any of the Sjogren's support group websites and see if you think it > matches her presentation. > > If it is Sjogren's, this can be a stubborn problem to cure with TCM, > but herbs and acupuncture can definitely lessen the severity and > duration of symptoms. > > Ray. > > > > > On Feb 18, 2005, at 3:28 PM, nicolehohmann wrote: > > > > > > > Has anyone had success treating this? I actually have with one > > previous case, but the current case is more severe. > > > > This is a 60 year old with burning tongue lips and mouth worsened by > > most food and some scents and sometimes a salty taste especially when > > she drinks water. She also has diarrhea preceeded by cramping 3 times > > per week (IBS), history of low back and knee pain, psoriasis, anemia, > > tarry stools (but not recently), high cholesterol. She is thirsty and > > hungry all the time. Her eyes are sunken and pale complexion, slight > > build. > > Pulse is wiry and tongue is deep reddish purple, scant coat, swollen > > sides but no scallops. She feels cold. is depressed with the length > > of this problem (has been 2.5 yrs) and energy is moderate to low- she > > feels this is due to the depression. > > She says she has no other stress really except this condition. > > She eats egg white omlettes, bananas, and english muffins exclusively > > with occasional challenges with other foods and drinks exclusively > > diet sodas because it soothes the burning - about 4 cans per day. > > > > I think she has blood xu, spleen qi xu with invasion by liver and > > kidney xu > > Any thoughts (other than cutting out the aspartame which I am trying > > to convince her of...) on her diagnosis or treatment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To translate this message, copy and paste it into this web link page, > > http://babel.altavista.com/ > > > > > > and > > adjust accordingly. > > > > Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the > > group requires prior permission from the author. > > > > If you are a TCM academic and wish to discuss TCM with other > > academics, > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2005 Report Share Posted February 19, 2005 Hi This sounds like severe Jing deficiencey, and i have treated this a few times. This level of deficiency is nealy always accompanied by some major organic change ie cancer etc. She is exhibiting both strong yin heat/fire and cold /deficency symptoms, but her main complaint at the moment is her hot burning mouth and lips from yin xu fire. So for this first treatments i would use mostly yin tonics with moistening ability ie Sheng di, Tian Dong,Mai Dong, Xuan Shen, Nui Xi, Sha Shen. , also maybe some American Ginseng, Because she also has underlying cold and weakness in the lower heater as well , you will probably have to add some digestives to the yin tonics ie shen qu etc, and also Tu Su Zi good too. When her heat and dryness symptoms begin to abate, put her on some small doseages of Deer Antler Horn during winter to tonify her kidneys and other seasonal and herbal formulas more balanced depending on wether she is hot, cold or neutral Another point is, often with this level of deficiency fire you will need to add blood movers/hasteners also such as Chi Shao or Chuan Xiong If you require doseages please notify Best Wishes Anita -- Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 266.0.0 - Release 2/18/2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2005 Report Share Posted February 19, 2005 I would also suggest that she is checked out for B12 (and other B complex) deficiencies. Ann Brownbill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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