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My feeling now is that if you had a problem with money going in to

acupuncture school you are going to have money problems after UNLESS

you change something in the way you do things.

 

doug

 

 

 

On Nov 19, 2004, at 1:47 PM,

Chinese Medicine wrote:

 

> Message: 11

> Fri, 19 Nov 2004 01:53:35 -0500

> Pete Theisen <petet

> Re: New to the group and a potential TCM student:

>

>

> Jeremy wrote:

>> Hello everyone! I would just like to give a brief introduction of

>> myself as well as ask a few questions about TCM:

>

> Hi Jeremy!

>

> The only people I know who are doing even OK financially in TCM are

> people who had a *lot* of money going in. You are not in that situation

> so I want to say you should expect to be downright poor for a *long*

> time after you graduate. Poor as in poverty stricken, even. " Ill

> housed,

> ill clothed, ill fed . . . "

>

> I started my own clinic two years ago. I have three patients in the

> slow

> season and maybe ten in the tourist season. The stumbling block is

> Medicare not covering it. Because they don't, over half of the insurers

> don't either. It has been proposed for ten years that it be covered but

> it has not happened.

>

> If you *love* TCM and don't mind working hard for nothing, have at it.

> That is how most of us are, except those who started out rich, or have

> rich spouses, lovers, daddies - you know.

>

> Oh, yeah. Don't open a clinic in any town that has a TCM school, you

> have to compete with the student clinic that charges $25 for the full

> service visit. There are two TCM schools in my town.

>

> Regards,

>

> Pete

>

>

 

 

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Hi Jeremy,

 

 

 

I can't seem to find your email address on anything and would like to

discuss some of this " off-forum " because we're getting into personal, nitty

gritty stuff here and I would like to be able to help.

 

 

 

Email me if you'd like to discuss this further.

 

 

 

Barbara

 

bbeale

 

 

 

_____

 

Douglas [res19zl9]

Friday, November 19, 2004 2:34 PM

Chinese Medicine

money money etc..

 

 

 

My feeling now is that if you had a problem with money going in to

acupuncture school you are going to have money problems after UNLESS

you change something in the way you do things.

 

doug

 

 

 

On Nov 19, 2004, at 1:47 PM,

Chinese Medicine wrote:

 

> Message: 11

> Fri, 19 Nov 2004 01:53:35 -0500

> Pete Theisen <petet

> Re: New to the group and a potential TCM student:

>

>

> Jeremy wrote:

>> Hello everyone! I would just like to give a brief introduction of

>> myself as well as ask a few questions about TCM:

>

> Hi Jeremy!

>

> The only people I know who are doing even OK financially in TCM are

> people who had a *lot* of money going in. You are not in that situation

> so I want to say you should expect to be downright poor for a *long*

> time after you graduate. Poor as in poverty stricken, even. " Ill

> housed,

> ill clothed, ill fed . . . "

>

> I started my own clinic two years ago. I have three patients in the

> slow

> season and maybe ten in the tourist season. The stumbling block is

> Medicare not covering it. Because they don't, over half of the insurers

> don't either. It has been proposed for ten years that it be covered but

> it has not happened.

>

> If you *love* TCM and don't mind working hard for nothing, have at it.

> That is how most of us are, except those who started out rich, or have

> rich spouses, lovers, daddies - you know.

>

> Oh, yeah. Don't open a clinic in any town that has a TCM school, you

> have to compete with the student clinic that charges $25 for the full

> service visit. There are two TCM schools in my town.

>

> Regards,

>

> Pete

>

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

http://babel.altavista.com/

 

 

and adjust

accordingly.

 

If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop being

delivered.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I don't know if I would agree with this. Before going into Oriental

medicine, I was a management consultant and made several times the

national average salary. Now I find myself taking short term contracts

to fund my work as a healer. It isn't that I don't know how to start or

run a business, as I have started and run several of them. I have taught

entrepreneurship, and so I know that I have the theory. That said, even

after doing everything right, I am finding it longer to get things

perking along than it should have.

 

The reality is that people still don't really know the benefits that we

can offer them. I am finding educating people to be a real uphill

battle. I know that once people start to realize that it isn't just some

fringe practice, and that it really does work, then things will start to

turn around. I can honestly say that on Vancouver Island, here in BC

there are few practitioners making a good living at it.

 

- Mark Milotay

 

On Fri, 2004-11-19 at 14:33, Douglas wrote:

> My feeling now is that if you had a problem with money going in to

> acupuncture school you are going to have money problems after UNLESS

> you change something in the way you do things.

>

> doug

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Mark wrote: " The reality is that people still don't really know the benefits

that we

can offer them. I am finding educating people to be a real uphill

battle. I know that once people start to realize that it isn't just some

fringe practice, and that it really does work, then things will start to

turn around. "

 

Barb wrote: " many people drawn to acupuncture school are " artsy " , free-spirited

and

a little rebellious and don't like to be bothered by the more structured

portions of the profession, especially the concepts of money, marketing and

competition. I think this dimension has played a part in the downfall of

many. "

 

Put these two statements together and I think you get to the root of the

problem. Mark is right that we have not yet been successful in getting OM the

widespread respect it deserves as a healing resource. Barb is right that many in

our field are put off over the idea of marketing the healing art they love and

even feel a spiritual affinity with. Over the years I have heard countless

people say that all we need to do is become the best healers we can and the rest

will take care of itself. I actually respect the anti-commercial sentiment of

this philosophy but I think, as Barb wrote, that this has hurt the financial

aspects of our profession's growth. While I too would much rather spend my time

thinking of how to become a better healer for my patients than thinking of

marketing schemes, I think there is nothing wrong with doing smart public

education when you consider that this will truly help the public get better

health-care services. The fact that it will also help individual OM

practitioners make more money should not stop us from dealing with marketing.

There is such a thing as ethical marketing for an ethical cause.

 

I just read a recent survey done by the AAOM that showed practitioners ranked

the need for public education/outreach as the #2 task our profession faces

behind legislative concerns. I would rank it #1. While individual practitioners

can and should work at marketing their own services, the real great leap forward

Mark wrote of can happen only when our profession as a whole, with the

leadership of key organizations, decides to make public education/outreach a

true priority. How much further along we would be as a profession if we had

concentrated on this over the last several years rather than on differences of

opinion over education standards and the like.

 

Matt Bauer

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

Mark Milotay

TCM List

Friday, November 19, 2004 5:59 PM

Re: money money etc..

 

 

I don't know if I would agree with this. Before going into Oriental

medicine, I was a management consultant and made several times the

national average salary. Now I find myself taking short term contracts

to fund my work as a healer. It isn't that I don't know how to start or

run a business, as I have started and run several of them. I have taught

entrepreneurship, and so I know that I have the theory. That said, even

after doing everything right, I am finding it longer to get things

perking along than it should have.

 

The reality is that people still don't really know the benefits that we

can offer them. I am finding educating people to be a real uphill

battle. I know that once people start to realize that it isn't just some

fringe practice, and that it really does work, then things will start to

turn around. I can honestly say that on Vancouver Island, here in BC

there are few practitioners making a good living at it.

 

- Mark Milotay

 

On Fri, 2004-11-19 at 14:33, Douglas wrote:

> My feeling now is that if you had a problem with money going in to

> acupuncture school you are going to have money problems after UNLESS

> you change something in the way you do things.

>

> doug

 

 

 

http://babel.altavista.com/

 

and adjust

accordingly.

 

If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop being

delivered.

 

 

 

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Hi,

 

Mark Milotay wrote:

>... I know that once people start to realize that it isn't just some

> fringe practice,

 

What if you reversed that and decided that it IS a fringe practice

that needs better marketing to bring it mainstream awareness?

 

> and that it really does work, then things will start to

> turn around. I can honestly say that on Vancouver Island, here in BC

> there are few practitioners making a good living at it.

>

We examined a very specific product in Richmond-BC, where there's

a substantial very understanding Chinese population, and decided

that the clinic model would cause failure/perennial bloodletting.

We're tuning a much more proactive approach. We expect that our

approach will actually help a bunch of clinics somewhat, with an

overall effect much better for them than for us. And we'll grow

our niche fairly quickly.

 

bye,

vic

 

--

Vic Williams (604)433-5189 -- www.strategicprocess.com --

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