Take caution when facing someone with extremely negative Qi

[Guest guest]

Hi Rich and all,

 

Q:

> On " cold " Qi, I have to disagree that the cold-warm gradation is the

only dimension

> to Xie Qi, unless you expanded the meaning of " cold. " Let me try it

in a different

> way to see if helps. If you were not to use the hands or body's

sense of temperature

> to diagnose the patient (E.g, Four Diagnosis without the last, to

touch or sensing

> temperature without touching) will you be able to detect Xie Qi?

 

> As others have mentioned in other threads, they can detect Xie Qi

using senses other than touch. I can move my hand over a client and

feel the " cold qi " without touching. Just like pulse diagnosis which

takes training and skills, so does training of other senses. Some

people are apparently born with it. There is much in this world that I

haven't experienced, but I accept the possibility that it exists,

because I myself am discovering new things every day. Did they exist

before I discovered them - or only when I discovered them? An

interesting question for epistomologists. Do other people have

abilities that you do not understand simply because you have not

experienced them yet? That is a question you can answer for yourself.

> I have answered it for myself.

 

A:

 

This is the one track of diagnoses in qigong healing, which belongs to energy

medical system. The practitioner doesn't pay their attention to the diseases the

patient suffering from (in the structure system, conventional WM.), neither the

functional changes on functional dimension (TCM herbal theory system). Only

focus his mind on the energy level or qi. From the qi dimension on, (based on

qi) , Chinese ancient Dr established the third medical system, qigong. The sense

your used for finding " cold qi " , it is one of the basic art for qigong

practitioner to detect or value his patient' condition in qi dimension. The bad

sensation (qi) radiated from you patient is sometime very uncomfortable, which

is called Xie Qi or Du Qi (poison qi). Generally, we call it Bing Qi (ill qi or

bad energy). Bing Qi can manifest as cold, hot, itching, pain... when you detect

it in distant stroke or just stay with the patient or meditate with the patient.

Once you contract Bing Qi, it can stay in your body for 2~5 days, but you can do

nothing on it. Based on the qi sensations and the perceptions beyond qi, Chinese

ancient philosopher and mysticism created the theory system of Daoist.

 

Regards

 

 

Guigen Qigong

http://www.g321g.org guigen_qigong

Qigong Department, Xiyuan Hospital, Beijing.

 

 

 

 

-

Rich

Chinese Medicine

Thursday, September 16, 2004 1:16 AM

Re: Take caution when facing someone with extremely negative Qi

 

 

Hi Mike,

>

> First of all, Xie Qi is used extensively in Nei Jing. Z'ev's note

said all I wanted to say.

 

We can all translate words in the way we want. Is a " poison " (as used

in herbs or homeopathy) that cures a person " evil " ? Evil to one -

beneficial to another. When one gets sick because one's Wei Qi is low

is it " evil " or beneficial " ? Does it not warn the person that he/she

has a problem with their physical/mental/spiritual body? Is " sickness "

(which I view as the merging of " waves of qi " ) " evil " or a " gift of

nature " - a generous warning?

 

Other translations for Xie are " irregular " and " heretical " . (Who Can

Ride the Dragon?) Who am I to say which is correct? How am I to know

what what is the mind of the person who first wrote down this word

thousands of years ago? Interpretation and translation across cultures

and time is quite imprecise and subjective. It can be discussed - but

I believe it is ultimately quite subjective.

 

 

> On " cold " Qi, I have to disagree that the cold-warm gradation is the

only dimension

> to Xie Qi, unless you expanded the meaning of " cold. " Let me try it

in a different

> way to see if helps. If you were not to use the hands or body's

sense of temperature

> to diagnose the patient (E.g, Four Diagnosis without the last, to

touch or sensing

> temperature without touching) will you be able to detect Xie Qi?

 

As others have mentioned in other threads, they can detect Xie Qi

using senses other than touch. I can move my hand over a client and

feel the " cold qi " without touching. Just like pulse diagnosis which

takes training and skills, so does training of other senses. Some

people are apparently born with it. There is much in this world that I

haven't experienced, but I accept the possibility that it exists,

because I myself am discovering new things every day. Did they exist

before I discovered them - or only when I discovered them? An

interesting question for epistomologists. Do other people have

abilities that you do not understand simply because you have not

experienced them yet? That is a question you can answer for yourself.

I have answered it for myself.

 

But to continue the conversation along the lines that you suggest. Can

you tell me exactly and precisely how many different types of Xie Qi

there are and how your arrived at the categorization of types? Do you

agree with Zhuang Zi who wrote: " Throughout the world there is only

one Qi. " ? (Who Can Ride the Dragon) If there is only one Qi, what

makes it Evil? Is the Qi of Arsenicum " good " or " evil " ?

 

Regards,

Rich

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Z'ev and all

Q:

I mentioned a few types of evil qi in my last posting. Zhuang Zi is

speaking in terms of Chinese cosmology. We are discussing Chinese

medicine. Different context.

 

A:

In TCM field, there was a saying is " Yi Dao Tong Yuan " , which means " Medicine

and Daoist have same Source. " or Medicine and Daoist originated from the same

root or culture background.

 

Guigen Qigong

http://www.g321g.org guigen_qigong

Qigong Department, Xiyuan Hospital, Beijing.

 

 

-

Chinese Medicine

Thursday, September 16, 2004 4:32 AM

Re: Take caution when facing someone with extremely negative Qi

 

 

I mentioned a few types of evil qi in my last posting. Zhuang Zi is

speaking in terms of Chinese cosmology. We are discussing Chinese

medicine. Different context.

 

Arsenic/xiong huang is a du/toxin, not an evil. Different term. It is

employed in Chinese medicine according to the principle " yi du yao gong

xie " employ toxic medicinals to attack disease " .

 

On Sep 15, 2004, at 10:16 AM, Rich wrote:

 

> But to continue the conversation along the lines that you suggest. Can

> you tell me exactly and precisely how many different types of Xie Qi

> there are and how your arrived at the categorization of types? Do you

> agree with Zhuang Zi who wrote: " Throughout the world there is only

> one Qi. " ? (Who Can Ride the Dragon) If there is only one Qi, what

> makes it Evil? Is the Qi of Arsenicum " good " or " evil " ?

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

The weak Wei qi which allows intrusion of coarse pathogens such as Wind and

Cold,

as easily give free passage to a finer but more virulent form of Malefic Qi

emanating

from the Invader Being.

 

Add to this the willingness of the healer to give forth healing qi, for

which purpose

readily 'opening' his or her energy field, and the die is cast.

 

Cases are legion where a healer has walked away with an exact clone of the

illness,

while the sick person has meandered away miraculously cured, with a sinister

smile.

 

Healing when it involves an active interplay of qi, and open portals to

match as in

acupuncture needles opening up exact doors with weak or downright

destructive,

corrosive qi, must require a higher sense Self, and an understanding of how

it works,

or does not.

 

If all substance is gradation of qi, and if none can experience emotions

other than

within it, than all vampiric evil by intent or extent must be, in essence,

one form

of qi or the other.

 

As such it must follow the common Laws of qi circulation, or move by some

vicarious rules as yet unknown to healed or the healed.

 

The healer intent on curing by active moving of qi in a dramatic and

precipitate

manner, must be as ready to be summarily invaded, ravaged, and left spent

by the wayside.

 

Dr. Holmes Keikobad

MB BS DPH Ret. DIP AC NCCAOM LIC AC CO & AZ

www.acu-free.com - 15 CEUS by video.

NCCAOM reviewed. Approved in CA & most states.

[Guest guest]

Hi Dr. Keikobad, Guigen, et al,

>

> The healer intent on curing by active moving of qi in a dramatic and

> precipitate

> manner, must be as ready to be summarily invaded, ravaged, and left

spent

> by the wayside.

>

> Dr. Holmes Keikobad

 

Yes, this appears to be so. Then, can it be said that it is the

" Spirit " of the Qi, as opposed to the " Strength " of the Qi, that is

the determining factor?

 

A good example is the way that bridges are now built in order to

withstand even the smallest " vibrations " of the " wind " . Even the

strongest bridges can be brought down with the right " vibrations " , but

if the bridge's " pattern " is designed, it can better withstand the

" Wind " patterns. Is the " happy pattern " less susceptible to Wind

invasion than the " unhappy " or " overly serious " patterns?

 

Photographs of the Tacoma bridge:

 

http://www.civeng.carleton.ca/Exhibits/Tacoma_Narrows/DSmith/photos.html

 

Regards,

Rich

[Guest guest]

I use " young living " oil's " White Angelica, " myself,

to protect me from - Qi (and vice versa). I was told

to rub it on my shoulders 3 times, clockwise. It seems

to help.

John G.

--- Rich <rfinkelstein wrote:

 

> Hi Dr. Keikobad, Guigen, et al,

> >

> > The healer intent on curing by active moving of qi

> in a dramatic and

> > precipitate

> > manner, must be as ready to be summarily invaded,

> ravaged, and left

> spent

> > by the wayside.

> >

> > Dr. Holmes Keikobad

>

> Yes, this appears to be so. Then, can it be said

> that it is the

> " Spirit " of the Qi, as opposed to the " Strength " of

> the Qi, that is

> the determining factor?

>

> A good example is the way that bridges are now built

> in order to

> withstand even the smallest " vibrations " of the

> " wind " . Even the

> strongest bridges can be brought down with the right

> " vibrations " , but

> if the bridge's " pattern " is designed, it can better

> withstand the

> " Wind " patterns. Is the " happy pattern " less

> susceptible to Wind

> invasion than the " unhappy " or " overly serious "

> patterns?

>

> Photographs of the Tacoma bridge:

>

>

http://www.civeng.carleton.ca/Exhibits/Tacoma_Narrows/DSmith/photos.html

>

> Regards,

> Rich

>

>

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

The essential wisdom is to know one's own experience of qi.

 

If done well, at the end of the road, one will be unable to describe the

state

of being which cannot be invaded.

 

By the way, such a state has an added burden, that it can invade anyone and

anything, from whichever distance.

 

Dr. Holmes Keikobad

MB BS DPH Ret. DIP AC NCCAOM LIC AC CO & AZ

www.acu-free.com - 15 CEUS by video.

NCCAOM reviewed. Approved in CA & most states.

-

" Rich " <rfinkelstein

<Chinese Medicine >

Sunday, September 26, 2004 9:10 AM

Re: Take caution when facing someone with extremely negative

Qi

 

 

> Hi Dr. Keikobad, Guigen, et al,

>>

>> The healer intent on curing by active moving of qi in a dramatic and

>> precipitate

>> manner, must be as ready to be summarily invaded, ravaged, and left

> spent

>> by the wayside.

>>

>> Dr. Holmes Keikobad

>

> Yes, this appears to be so. Then, can it be said that it is the

> " Spirit " of the Qi, as opposed to the " Strength " of the Qi, that is

> the determining factor?

>

[Guest guest]

Same source,

 

Different development. The practice of Taoism is not necessarily the

practice of Chinese medicine, or visa versa.

 

 

On Sep 26, 2004, at 1:03 AM, guigen_qigong wrote:

 

> A:

>

> In TCM field, there was a saying is " Yi Dao Tong Yuan " , which means "

> Medicine and Daoist have same Source. " or Medicine and Daoist

> originated from the same root or culture background.

>

>

>

> Guigen Qigong

[Guest guest]

Hi Z'ev,

 

Your assertion is in my view a little too rigid.

Daoism may well be a a different development from the larger chinese

medicine context.

Daoism has at least 2 components the exoteric and esoteric. I Know

nothing of the exoteric Daoist religion, But, the esoteric practice of

Daoism is the awareness of emotions within the Organs, it is the

movement of physical mental and emotional energy as it flows through

the extraordinary meridians and through the primary meridians. It is

intimately linked to the 5 phases and five elements and a whole lot

more. as such, it is, in my opinion, an indispensable practice for

the advancement of any would be acupuncturist, or hands on bodyworker

wether chinese or western.

 

salvador

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " "

<zrosenbe@s...> wrote:

> Same source,

>

> Different development. The practice of Taoism is not necessarily the

> practice of Chinese medicine, or visa versa.

>

>

> On Sep 26, 2004, at 1:03 AM, guigen_qigong wrote:

>

> > A:

> >

> > In TCM field, there was a saying is " Yi Dao Tong Yuan " , which means "

> > Medicine and Daoist have same Source. " or Medicine and Daoist

> > originated from the same root or culture background.

> >

> >

> >

> > Guigen Qigong

[Guest guest]

True, but I think what the good doctor is really pointing out is that although

and Taoist Philosophy have their own respective path of

development, the relationship between these two disciplines are highly

complementary and not separate and distinct of one another. It has been my

experience that a study of Taoist Philosophy can only greatly enhance one's

understanding of .

 

Ming

 

<zrosenbe wrote:

Same source,

 

Different development. The practice of Taoism is not necessarily the

practice of Chinese medicine, or visa versa.

 

 

On Sep 26, 2004, at 1:03 AM, guigen_qigong wrote:

 

> A:

>

> In TCM field, there was a saying is " Yi Dao Tong Yuan " , which means "

> Medicine and Daoist have same Source. " or Medicine and Daoist

> originated from the same root or culture background.

>

>

>

> Guigen Qigong

 

 

 

 

http://babel.altavista.com/

 

 

and adjust

accordingly.

 

If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop being

delivered.

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Hi Ming and all,

 

In my own philosophical and health system studies, I have found that

much can be learned by studying the Yin/Yang symbol - as a three

dimensional representation of man and the universe:

 

" When internal energies are able to circulate smoothly and freely, and

the energy of the mind is not scattered, but is focused and

concentrated, illness and disease can be avoided. " [Chapter 1,

Neijing, Suwen - Ni translation]

 

" Thus, the body of one who undertands the Tao will remain strong and

healthy. The one who dies not understand the Tao will age. One who is

careless will often feel deficient, while one who knows will have an

abundance of energy. Those who are knowledgeable have clear orifices,

perceptions, hearing, vision, smell and taste, are are light and

strong. Even though their bodies are old, the can perform most of

life's activiites. " [Chapter 5, Neijing Suwen]

 

" Those who undertand the principles of wholesome living tame their

minds and prevent them from straying. They do not force anything upon

themselves or others, are happy and content, tranquil and quiet, and

can live indefinitely. These are the ancient methods of

self-maintenance. " [Chapter 5, Neijing, Suwen]

 

Circulating smoothly and freely. Non-scattered. Open. Tranquil.

Indefinitely. Self-maintaining. These concepts are all found in the

Yin/Yang symbol. I think it is all there, but it is up to each person

to become Aware of it. I believe there is much to be gained by studing

the roots of Chinese medicine, in whatever manner one sees fit.

 

Regards,

Rich

 

 

 

 

 

Chinese Medicine , " Ming H. Lee "

<aceqihealer> wrote:

> True, but I think what the good doctor is really pointing out is

that although and Taoist Philosophy have their own

respective path of development, the relationship between these two

disciplines are highly complementary and not separate and distinct of

one another. It has been my experience that a study of Taoist

Philosophy can only greatly enhance one's understanding of Chinese

Medicine.

>

> Ming

>

> <zrosenbe@s...> wrote:

> Same source,

>

> Different development. The practice of Taoism is not necessarily the

> practice of Chinese medicine, or visa versa.

>

>

> On Sep 26, 2004, at 1:03 AM, guigen_qigong wrote:

>

> > A:

> >

> > In TCM field, there was a saying is " Yi Dao Tong Yuan " , which means "

> > Medicine and Daoist have same Source. " or Medicine and Daoist

> > originated from the same root or culture background.

> >

> >

> >

> > Guigen Qigong

>

>

>

> To translate this message, copy and paste it into this web link

page, http://babel.altavista.com/

>

>

and

adjust accordingly.

>

> If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop

being delivered.

>

> Messages are the property of the author. Any duplication outside the

group requires prior permission from the author.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Salvador,

I agree with you wholeheartedly, but I did specify religious Taoism

in my post. Clearly there is a cross-fertilization of the two

disciplines, but we do at times need to be careful in distinguishing

them as well.

 

 

On Sep 27, 2004, at 2:38 AM, salvador_march wrote:

 

> Daoism has at least 2 components the exoteric and esoteric. I Know

> nothing of the exoteric Daoist religion, But, the esoteric practice of

> Daoism is the awareness of emotions within the Organs, it is the

> movement of physical mental and emotional energy as it flows through

> the extraordinary meridians and through the primary meridians. It is

> intimately linked to the 5 phases and five elements and a whole lot

> more. as such, it is, in my opinion, an indispensable practice for

> the advancement of any would be acupuncturist, or hands on bodyworker

> wether chinese or western.

>

> salvador

[Guest guest]

I also agree. My point is to not confuse the practice of Taoist

philosophy (or, more specifically, religious Taoism) with the practice

of Chinese medicine, especially modern. There is also a strong

Confucian element, and Buddhist elements as well.

 

 

On Sep 27, 2004, at 8:29 AM, Ming H. Lee wrote:

 

> True, but I think what the good doctor is really pointing out is that

> although and Taoist Philosophy have their own

> respective path of development, the relationship between these two

> disciplines are highly complementary and not separate and distinct of

> one another. It has been my experience that a study of Taoist

> Philosophy can only greatly enhance one's understanding of Chinese

> Medicine.

>

> Ming