Guest guest Posted August 9, 2004 Report Share Posted August 9, 2004 Dear all, Has anyone in this list had success treating women with hirsutism? I have two cases. both diagnosed with PCO'S & normal weight. One had no abnormality detected in blood tests and the other only had high LH. What is your approach regarding ovarian cysts? Can the cysts be reduced in size and amount by regulating the body Qi? Which herbs would you use? Thank you in advance for your reply Kind Regards Silvia (Medical Herbalist) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 10, 2004 Report Share Posted August 10, 2004 Silvia - It is definitely possible to treat PCOS effectively with Chinese herbal formulae, although it takes time and persistence. In TCM, PCOS is viewed as a Kidney/Spleen yang deficiency syndrome which allows damp, and ultimately phlegm to accumulate in the lower jiao. This phegm impedes the flow of qi and blood allowing for the formation of cysts. The tricky part of this pattern is that the patient will often not show any obvious signs of Kidney and Spleen yang def. such as aversion to cold, loose stools, etc. Also, the phlegm may not be obvious when looking at the tongue. The hirsutism and acne that the patient often experiences on the chin and around the mouth reflects the relative excess of testosterone in the patient's system and the heat in the Chongmai channel resulting from the lack of the normal monthly drainage of that channel (menses). If you would like to discuss the Chinese herbal treatment of this condition more specifically, please contact me off-list: rtoo All the best, Ray Rubio On Aug 9, 2004, at 2:36 PM, STawse wrote: > Dear all, > Has anyone in this list had success treating women with > hirsutism? > I have two cases. both diagnosed with PCO'S & normal weight. One had no > abnormality detected in blood tests and the other only had high LH. > > What is your approach regarding ovarian cysts? Can the cysts be > reduced in size > and amount by regulating the body Qi? Which herbs would you use? > > Thank you in advance for your reply > > Kind Regards > > Silvia > (Medical Herbalist) > > > > > Membership requires that you do not post any commerical, swear, > religious, spam messages,flame another member or swear. > > > http://babel.altavista.com/ > > > and > adjust accordingly. > > If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop being > delivered. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 10, 2004 Report Share Posted August 10, 2004 Ray...would you be kind enough to explain what s/s lead to the diagnosis? pulse? or..... - Ray Rubio Chinese Medicine Tuesday, August 10, 2004 7:57 AM Re: Re: Hirsutism Silvia - It is definitely possible to treat PCOS effectively with Chinese herbal formulae, although it takes time and persistence. In TCM, PCOS is viewed as a Kidney/Spleen yang deficiency syndrome which allows damp, and ultimately phlegm to accumulate in the lower jiao. This phegm impedes the flow of qi and blood allowing for the formation of cysts. The tricky part of this pattern is that the patient will often not show any obvious signs of Kidney and Spleen yang def. such as aversion to cold, loose stools, etc. Also, the phlegm may not be obvious when looking at the tongue. The hirsutism and acne that the patient often experiences on the chin and around the mouth reflects the relative excess of testosterone in the patient's system and the heat in the Chongmai channel resulting from the lack of the normal monthly drainage of that channel (menses). If you would like to discuss the Chinese herbal treatment of this condition more specifically, please contact me off-list: rtoo All the best, Ray Rubio On Aug 9, 2004, at 2:36 PM, STawse wrote: > Dear all, > Has anyone in this list had success treating women with > hirsutism? > I have two cases. both diagnosed with PCO'S & normal weight. One had no > abnormality detected in blood tests and the other only had high LH. > > What is your approach regarding ovarian cysts? Can the cysts be > reduced in size > and amount by regulating the body Qi? Which herbs would you use? > > Thank you in advance for your reply > > Kind Regards > > Silvia > (Medical Herbalist) > > > > > Membership requires that you do not post any commerical, swear, > religious, spam messages,flame another member or swear. > > > http://babel.altavista.com/ > > > and > adjust accordingly. > > If you , it takes a few days for the messages to stop being > delivered. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 16, 2004 Report Share Posted August 16, 2004 Turiya - Sorry it took so long to return your email, but here goes... From a western medical point of view, PCOS can be accompanied by many of the following signs and symptoms: irregular/infrequent or no periods; infrequent or absent ovulation; increased serum levels of male hormones such as testosterone; infertility; painful ovulation; weight gain or obesity; elevated blood lipids; hypertension; diabetes; hirsutism; acne and oily skin; balding; skin tags in the armpits or neck area; and, thickened patches of dark skin on the neck, groin or underarms. Obviously many of these would not be diagnosable by an acupuncturist unless they refer the patient for evaluation by OBGYN or reproductive endocrinologist. However - some of the signs are obvious to the trained observer: excessive facial hair and acne, especially around the mouth and chin. Weight gain. Thinning hair. Painful ovulation, and increasingly irregular, infrequent or absent menses. There will also occasionally be low back pain with the menses (if they have them), and some patients will mention abnormally damp vaginal discharge if questioned. The pulse in these patients can be variable depending on their constitution, lifestyle, medications, etc. However, you might notice a slippery-tight quality in the qi position of the left wrist. My teacher, Dr. Shen , related this area to the ovaries and uterus. It would be felt more at the organ/blood depth. The kidney positions in general may be weaker than the other pulses, and the pulse overall may be slightly submerged due to the dampness. The tongue may or may not show a sticky tongue coat. Because the tongue and pulse can be so subjective depending on the patient's constitution and lifestyle factors, I will generally refer a patient to one of the reproductive endocrinologists I work with if I see some of the signs mentioned above. This is important because of the possible insulin problems that can accompany this syndrome. I hope this helps, Ray Rubio. On Aug 10, 2004, at 10:12 AM, Turiya Hill wrote: > Ray...would you be kind enough to explain what s/s lead to the > diagnosis? pulse? or..... > - > Ray Rubio > Chinese Medicine > Tuesday, August 10, 2004 7:57 AM > Re: Re: Hirsutism > > > Silvia - > > It is definitely possible to treat PCOS effectively with Chinese > herbal > formulae, although it takes time and persistence. In TCM, PCOS is > viewed as a Kidney/Spleen yang deficiency syndrome which allows damp, > and ultimately phlegm to accumulate in the lower jiao. This phegm > impedes the flow of qi and blood allowing for the formation of cysts. > The tricky part of this pattern is that the patient will often not > show > any obvious signs of Kidney and Spleen yang def. such as aversion to > cold, loose stools, etc. Also, the phlegm may not be obvious when > looking at the tongue. The hirsutism and acne that the patient often > experiences on the chin and around the mouth reflects the relative > excess of testosterone in the patient's system and the heat in the > Chongmai channel resulting from the lack of the normal monthly > drainage > of that channel (menses). > > If you would like to discuss the Chinese herbal treatment of this > condition more specifically, please contact me off-list: > > rtoo > > All the best, > > Ray Rubio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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