Guest guest Posted August 20, 2004 Report Share Posted August 20, 2004 Thanks for reminding me Katja :-) I am finding my feet in my new vegan diet!! Doc's orders!! I have to reduce/eliminate acid-ash producing foods, including dairy - my biggest source of such foods as I never eat red meat, and white meat only occasionally. But milk.... I just loooove the stuff!! I've tried rice-milk from the store, and didn't much enjoy it - too watery. This milkmaker is also useable for making rice milk, but same question here: what about the boiling process? Will that not take all the goodnesses out? Good thing about the milkmaker is that YOU decide the thickness or fluidity of the milk, so if this boiling is okay, I could try making my own rice milk :-) I used (home-made) almond milk for quite a while, but started getting rashes. The rashes went after I stopped the almonds, so I assume these two facts to be related. Tried goats milk, but both my son and I hated the taste of it. Not sure what other milk I could try? I'm also hunting around for alternatives to ensuring a balanced diet, esp for protein in this case. Since learning about acid-ash producing foods I am concerned about my son's diet, who can devour half a chicken in a day, and he's only 6 years old!! Just looooves his chicken (organic of course). But, doesn't like veg. So I'm trying to find foods that will appeal to him also. And he definitely needs his protein, and a very well balanced diet. love Lisa - katja herbal remedies Friday, August 20, 2004 4:16 PM Re: Herbal Remedies - soya milk there's no good stuff in soy for your body to be gained by soy milk, and boiling the soy is not enough to neutralize the bad. the only safe way to consume soy is in the traditionally fermented form of miso, and then in very small quantities - no more than 2 cups of miso soup per week. for more soy information, check out www.westonaprice.org or any of these links:1. Effect of soy protein containing isoflavones on cognitive function,bone mineral density, and plasma lipids in postmenopausal women: arandomized controlled trial:<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=152385922. The article below was written by a vegetarian who didn't want tobelieve the negative stuff about soy at first.Should we be SCARED OF SOY? Research Links Tofu to Dementia<http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html3. Visit <http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/ and type 'soy' in the search box.There's a study called Report of the COT Working Group onPhytoestrogens and many others to view.4. Kaayla T. Daniel's soy article in Mothering magazine. Also read Kaayla T. Daniel's replies to the negative responses to her article in Mothering. That can be found onthe Mothering site, I believe, as well as the following issue.when you run out of these, if you want more, i have more...-katjaAt 03:55 AM 8/20/2004, you wrote:>Hi guys,>>I found this great website in UK for some organic foods! Anyhow, they also >have a *milkmaker* for making your own Soya milk (or any other milk you >want to make), such as rice milk. Anyhow, here's my question: this >milkmaker boils the Soya milk several times. I questioned the reason for >this boiling, and this is the answer they gave me:>>Indeed it's the inhibitory enzymes in Soya that require it to be fully >cooked, otherwise the milk would upset us. As for the destruction of any >nutritional factors, whilst heat will eventually do this, the 100 degrees >boiling in a domestic milk maker is nothing compared to industrial >production, which still yields a product that is not nutritionally void >(something that often surprises me).>>Is this true what they tell me? Is it really necessary to boil it? And >will it not spoil all the good stuff in it?>>Would appreciate some help, so I can decide whether this would be a good >thing to buy/use. Right now I buy my (Soya) milk in the shops.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Tried goats milk, but both my son and I hated the taste of it. Hey Lisa... Just a suggestion on goats milk for anyone interested-- If you find a place that separates their bucks & milk does-- the milk won't taste 'goaty'. A lot depends on their feed, but the bucks have very strong scent glands (so attractive to my does- go figure). My Saanen bucks are not too bad- but I have a Kiko/boer mix that lets you know there's a buck in the barn from 50 feet away! If left in with the does, especially during mating season- their scent will taint the flavor of the milk . My kids (human kind) were not raised on goats milk- they made the switch easily enough when I kept my bucks away from my milking does. We have found if it's properly taken care of- ie: refrigerated quickly & used in a timely manner, there's very rarely a 'goaty' taste to it. One of our favorite solutions to 'goaty' milk (it happens): my kids stir a Tbsp of blackstrap molasses into their milk. Disguises the taste & good for ya too. =o) My .02 for the day! hug ya buffy~ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 oh, lisa! i can't imagine if i had to give up milk! well, for starters, don't worry about your son. chicken is wonderful, and he'll be fine. if he only wants chicken, that's great - it's healthy, and good, and just make sure he eats the skin/fat too. there's plenty of vitamins there! he'll get around to veggies later. and far better chicken than sugar or wheat! as for veganness...i'm so sorry! as a practitioner myself, i have helped many people heal from the damage a vegan diet did to their bodies, and i can't imagine any situation that would ever cause me to prescribe a vegan diet. if you want to talk about that, i'd be more than happy to. but to answer your actual question - rice is another food with phylates, and needs to be " predigested " - so don't worry about the boiling there. there's not a lot of good to be gotten from rice, but what there is, you'll get. seems to me you'd be better off just skipping milk altogether. -katja At 06:24 PM 8/20/2004, you wrote: >Thanks for reminding me Katja :-) > >I am finding my feet in my new vegan diet!! Doc's orders!! I have to >reduce/eliminate acid-ash producing foods, including dairy - my biggest >source of such foods as I never eat red meat, and white meat only >occasionally. But milk.... I just loooove the stuff!! > >I've tried rice-milk from the store, and didn't much enjoy it - too >watery. This milkmaker is also useable for making rice milk, but same >question here: what about the boiling process? Will that not take all the >goodnesses out? Good thing about the milkmaker is that YOU decide the >thickness or fluidity of the milk, so if this boiling is okay, I could try >making my own rice milk :-) > >I used (home-made) almond milk for quite a while, but started getting >rashes. The rashes went after I stopped the almonds, so I assume these two >facts to be related. > >Tried goats milk, but both my son and I hated the taste of it. > >Not sure what other milk I could try? > >I'm also hunting around for alternatives to ensuring a balanced diet, esp >for protein in this case. Since learning about acid-ash producing foods I >am concerned about my son's diet, who can devour half a chicken in a day, >and he's only 6 years old!! Just looooves his chicken (organic of course). >But, doesn't like veg. So I'm trying to find foods that will appeal to him >also. And he definitely needs his protein, and a very well balanced diet. > >love >Lisa >- ><katjakatja ><herbal remedies >herbal remedies >Friday, August 20, 2004 4:16 PM >Re: Herbal Remedies - soya milk > >there's no good stuff in soy for your body to be gained by soy milk, and >boiling the soy is not enough to neutralize the bad. the only safe way to >consume soy is in the traditionally fermented form of miso, and then in >very small quantities - no more than 2 cups of miso soup per week. for more >soy information, check out ><http://www.westonaprice.org>www.westonaprice.org or any of these links: > >1. Effect of soy protein containing isoflavones on cognitive function, >bone mineral density, and plasma lipids in postmenopausal women: a >randomized controlled trial: > ><<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abs\ tract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retri\ eve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entre\ z/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.\ ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uid\ s=15238592 > >2. The article below was written by a vegetarian who didn't want to >believe the negative stuff about soy at first. > >Should we be SCARED OF SOY? Research Links Tofu to Dementia > ><<http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com\ /Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aq\ uarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html > >3. Visit ><<http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/>http:\ //www.food.gov.uk/ >and type 'soy' in >the search box. >There's a study called Report of the COT Working Group on >Phytoestrogens and many others to view. > >4. Kaayla T. Daniel's soy article in Mothering magazine. Also read Kaayla >T. Daniel's replies to the negative responses to her article in Mothering. >That can be found on >the Mothering site, I believe, as well as the following issue. > >when you run out of these, if you want more, i have more... > >-katja > >At 03:55 AM 8/20/2004, you wrote: > >Hi guys, > > > >I found this great website in UK for some organic foods! Anyhow, they also > >have a *milkmaker* for making your own Soya milk (or any other milk you > >want to make), such as rice milk. Anyhow, here's my question: this > >milkmaker boils the Soya milk several times. I questioned the reason for > >this boiling, and this is the answer they gave me: > > > >Indeed it's the inhibitory enzymes in Soya that require it to be fully > >cooked, otherwise the milk would upset us. As for the destruction of any > >nutritional factors, whilst heat will eventually do this, the 100 degrees > >boiling in a domestic milk maker is nothing compared to industrial > >production, which still yields a product that is not nutritionally void > >(something that often surprises me). > > > >Is this true what they tell me? Is it really necessary to boil it? And > >will it not spoil all the good stuff in it? > > > >Would appreciate some help, so I can decide whether this would be a good > >thing to buy/use. Right now I buy my (Soya) milk in the shops. > > > > > >Federal Law requires that we warn you of the following: >1. Natural methods can sometimes backfire. >2. If you are pregnant, consult your physician before using any natural >remedy. >3. The Constitution guarantees you the right to be your own physician and to >prescribe for your own health. >We are not medical doctors although MDs are welcome to post here as long as >they behave themselves. >Any opinions put forth by the list members are exactly that, and any person >following the advice of anyone posting here does so at their own risk. >It is up to you to educate yourself. By accepting advice or products from >list members, you are agreeing to >be fully responsible for your own health, and hold the List Owner and >members free of any liability. > >Dr. Ian Shillington >Doctor of Naturopathy >Dr.IanShillington > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 2004 Report Share Posted August 21, 2004 Katja Don't be too quick to blame vegan-ness for problems of those who try it. I was one who found that I adjusted very well to vegan and vegetarian approaches (was vegetarian all through college and a few years after and then went vegan). Others tried the approach with difficulties (people I knew around me). I found it perplexing that I seemed to thrive and they had problems with energy and overall health after a number of months or years. I know they were very conscientious about their overall diet so I didn't presume it was a difference in that. Later I read a book about blood types and how they influence (due to our evolution) the ability of individuals to deal with various diets. As an A, I was supposedly best able to handle a vegan or vegetarian diet and the book even suggested that I would be at my best on it (which is my experience exactly). For those that I was still in touch with, I did find out that they were usually O, which according to the book is the one least able to consider such a diet. I don't know what everyone's impression of the quality of the work of the Blood Type Diet, but from an anecdotal point of view, it explained alot to me. Julie - katja herbal remedies Friday, August 20, 2004 8:21 PM Re: Herbal Remedies - milk alternative and vegan diet oh, lisa! i can't imagine if i had to give up milk!well, for starters, don't worry about your son. chicken is wonderful, and he'll be fine. if he only wants chicken, that's great - it's healthy, and good, and just make sure he eats the skin/fat too. there's plenty of vitamins there! he'll get around to veggies later. and far better chicken than sugar or wheat!as for veganness...i'm so sorry! as a practitioner myself, i have helped many people heal from the damage a vegan diet did to their bodies, and i can't imagine any situation that would ever cause me to prescribe a vegan diet. if you want to talk about that, i'd be more than happy to.but to answer your actual question - rice is another food with phylates, and needs to be "predigested" - so don't worry about the boiling there. there's not a lot of good to be gotten from rice, but what there is, you'll get. seems to me you'd be better off just skipping milk altogether. -katjaAt 06:24 PM 8/20/2004, you wrote:>Thanks for reminding me Katja :-)>>I am finding my feet in my new vegan diet!! Doc's orders!! I have to >reduce/eliminate acid-ash producing foods, including dairy - my biggest >source of such foods as I never eat red meat, and white meat only >occasionally. But milk.... I just loooove the stuff!!>>I've tried rice-milk from the store, and didn't much enjoy it - too >watery. This milkmaker is also useable for making rice milk, but same >question here: what about the boiling process? Will that not take all the >goodnesses out? Good thing about the milkmaker is that YOU decide the >thickness or fluidity of the milk, so if this boiling is okay, I could try >making my own rice milk :-)>>I used (home-made) almond milk for quite a while, but started getting >rashes. The rashes went after I stopped the almonds, so I assume these two >facts to be related.>>Tried goats milk, but both my son and I hated the taste of it.>>Not sure what other milk I could try?>>I'm also hunting around for alternatives to ensuring a balanced diet, esp >for protein in this case. Since learning about acid-ash producing foods I >am concerned about my son's diet, who can devour half a chicken in a day, >and he's only 6 years old!! Just looooves his chicken (organic of course). >But, doesn't like veg. So I'm trying to find foods that will appeal to him >also. And he definitely needs his protein, and a very well balanced diet.>>love>Lisa>-><katjakatja><herbal remedies >herbal remedies >Friday, August 20, 2004 4:16 PM>Re: Herbal Remedies - soya milk>>there's no good stuff in soy for your body to be gained by soy milk, and>boiling the soy is not enough to neutralize the bad. the only safe way to>consume soy is in the traditionally fermented form of miso, and then in>very small quantities - no more than 2 cups of miso soup per week. for more>soy information, check out ><http://www.westonaprice.org>www.westonaprice.org or any of these links:>>1. Effect of soy protein containing isoflavones on cognitive function,>bone mineral density, and plasma lipids in postmenopausal women: a>randomized controlled trial:>><<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15238592>>2. The article below was written by a vegetarian who didn't want to>believe the negative stuff about soy at first.>>Should we be SCARED OF SOY? Research Links Tofu to Dementia>><<http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>http://www.aquarianonline.com/Wellness/soy.html>>3. Visit ><<http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/>http://www.food.gov.uk/ >and type 'soy' in>the search box.>There's a study called Report of the COT Working Group on>Phytoestrogens and many others to view.>>4. Kaayla T. Daniel's soy article in Mothering magazine. Also read Kaayla>T. Daniel's replies to the negative responses to her article in Mothering.>That can be found on>the Mothering site, I believe, as well as the following issue.>>when you run out of these, if you want more, i have more...>>-katja>>At 03:55 AM 8/20/2004, you wrote:> >Hi guys,> >> >I found this great website in UK for some organic foods! Anyhow, they also> >have a *milkmaker* for making your own Soya milk (or any other milk you> >want to make), such as rice milk. Anyhow, here's my question: this> >milkmaker boils the Soya milk several times. I questioned the reason for> >this boiling, and this is the answer they gave me:> >> >Indeed it's the inhibitory enzymes in Soya that require it to be fully> >cooked, otherwise the milk would upset us. As for the destruction of any> >nutritional factors, whilst heat will eventually do this, the 100 degrees> >boiling in a domestic milk maker is nothing compared to industrial> >production, which still yields a product that is not nutritionally void> >(something that often surprises me).> >> >Is this true what they tell me? Is it really necessary to boil it? And> >will it not spoil all the good stuff in it?> >> >Would appreciate some help, so I can decide whether this would be a good> >thing to buy/use. Right now I buy my (Soya) milk in the shops.> >>>>>Federal Law requires that we warn you of the following:>1. Natural methods can sometimes backfire.>2. If you are pregnant, consult your physician before using any natural >remedy.>3. The Constitution guarantees you the right to be your own physician and to>prescribe for your own health.>We are not medical doctors although MDs are welcome to post here as long as>they behave themselves.>Any opinions put forth by the list members are exactly that, and any person>following the advice of anyone posting here does so at their own risk.>It is up to you to educate yourself. By accepting advice or products from >list members, you are agreeing to>be fully responsible for your own health, and hold the List Owner and >members free of any liability.>>Dr. Ian Shillington>Doctor of Naturopathy>Dr.IanShillington>> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 22, 2004 Report Share Posted August 22, 2004 If you could find a source of raw milk, that would be less acid-producing than pasteurized milk. With all the enzymes left in it, it doesn't seem to be so difficult to digest, nor does it leave the mucus buildup that regular milk does. Sharyn Lisa Belcher [lisabelcher] But milk.... I just loooove the stuff!! Not sure what other milk I could try? --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.742 / Virus Database: 495 - Release 8/19/2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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