Poor Memory corrected

[Guest guest]

Hi Everybody!

 

Today's case is Poor Memory: Patient can remember things from years ago,

but not minutes ago. Have to call him to remind him to come to the office.

If I call 3 hours before the appointment, he forgets to come. If I call 30

minutes before he leaves for my office right then, so not to forget.

Mainly, he has lost his sense of time.

 

I misread the date, he was born in 58, not 53.

 

Patient number: 223040024 DOB: June 23, 1958

 

 

Observe:

 

Unhealthy complexion. Yes. (no spirit)

Dark or unclear face color. Yes. (no spirit)

Mind is unclear. Yes. (no spirit)

Small movement, continuous fidgeting especially of the legs. Yes.

(deficient heat in the kidneys)

Dry lifeless color (indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi)

Green face color (indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, pain or

interior Wind) Yes.

Fat body. Yes.

Dark face liver & kidney yin deficient (or stagnant qi and congealed blood)

Blue nails. Yes. Blue around moons, pale toward ends.

Tongue color. Pink.

Tongue shape. Teeth marks. Indent on right center.

Tongue coating. Slight white

Tongue moisture. Wet.

 

Inquire:

 

Sensation of heaviness. Yes. (damp cold, damp heat, qi deficiency or bi

syndrome)

Clear Urine. Yes.

Scanty urination. In between, but frequent.

Fall asleep too easily.

Throws off the blanket at night. Yes. (excess heat maybe liver or heart)

 

Listen & smell:

 

Weak cough. Yes.

 

Palpate:

 

Systolic blood pressure (Optimal <120; Normal <130; 127

Diastolic blood pressure (Optimal <80; 70

Heart rate. 60

Floating pulse. Yes. (weak, deficient yin; strong, interior wind)

Slow pulse less than 70 beats per minute. Yes. (cold or insufficient qi)

Hot hands and feet. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

Hot palms of hot hands. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

Hot dorsum of hot hand. Yes. (exterior syndrome)

Dry skin. Yes. (deficiency of liver blood)

 

Summary of Impressions:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind

stagnant qi and congealed blood

qi deficiency

excess heat maybe liver or heart

weak, deficient yin

insufficient qi

extreme yang heat

 

Organs/channels: Kidney, Stomach, Liver, Heart.

 

Treatment Principles:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys: Consolidate Kidney, Reinforce Qi.

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Strengthen Stomach Qi, Invigorate Spleen.

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Warm the Liver,

Dispel cold.

stagnant qi and congealed blood: Soothe Liver, Disperse Stagnation.

qi deficiency: Strengthen Spleen, Benefit Qi.

excess heat maybe liver or heart

weak, deficient yin

insufficient qi

extreme yang heat

Replenish Heart Blood, Reinforce Spleen, Kidney.

 

Points that may be used:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys: Du 4; Ki 3, 12; Ren 3, 4, 6; Sp 6; UB 22,

23, 28, 39.

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Ren 6, 12; Sp 6; St 21, 36; UB 20, 21.

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Lv 1, 5, 6; Ren 3,

4; Sp 6.

stagnant qi and congealed blood: GB 40, 41; Lv 2, 3, 4, 5, 13, 14; P 6; SJ

6; Sp 6; UB 18.

qi deficiency: Lv 13; Ren 12; Sp 3, 5, 6; St 36; UB 20.

excess heat maybe liver or heart GB 13, 24.

weak, deficient yin CV 15

insufficient qi L 7, CV 17.

extreme yang heat GV 16, 20; GB 20; Lv 2, 3.

Poor Memory Sishengcong (extra); UB 15, 20, 23; St 36; K 6. Ht 7; Sp 1, 4,

6; St 36; UB 15, 17, 20, 44.

 

Your comments are invited. Thanks very much.

 

Regards,

 

Pete

[Guest guest]

Pete wrote:

 

Today's case is Poor Memory: Patient can remember things from years ago,

but not minutes ago. Have to call him to remind him to come to the office.

If I call 3 hours before the appointment, he forgets to come. If I call 30

minutes before he leaves for my office right then, so not to forget.

Mainly, he has lost his sense of time.

 

I misread the date, he was born in 58, not 53.

 

Patient number: 223040024 DOB: June 23, 1958 6 1 1

--\

--------------------------

Hi This patient is simple and complex with a LI - KID/Bl - KID/BL

 

the possible combinations are LI and KID LI and BL or KID and BL

Pete your observations are great, but more symptoms would be useful.

 

This person has obvious problems with Water. (poor memory) What would help

me in this case would be . hystory of lower back problems, calf

spasms,oedema in the ankles, dull headaches like a cap on top of head?

tinnitus?5 palm heat thirst in the evening takes feet out of bed at night

you mention some of these which may lead to making a case for KID Yin XU if

so it would explain related symptoms in the LIV as well as the LU . IF the

root is KID then there isn't much point in working on the LIV or LU a Def

KID can also over rev the SP.(damp symptoms) but again I wouldn't touch the

SP., or the heart any palpitations?

 

Where is the excess? is it LI or BL ? this is where symptoms may help to

decide. sinus problems? bowels? discomfort on the meridian, susceptible to

colds? what's he like emotionally? frightened, controlling,?

 

I rather fancy excess BL as it could would show as weakness in the ST /SI .

Any dribbling? hystory of cystitis.

 

 

To follow my suggestion you would have to show restraint :)can you make a

case for Excess BL? if so

Sed. BL- 64 and wait 10 minutes. more saliva? change in ST pulse quality?

more relaxed? if it works do a couple of others on the BL but hard to say

without symptoms. then end by tonifying some points on the KID meridian .

and note changes to symptoms after a few sessions.

 

if sed BL is good BL-7, 8 and 10 might be good. KID? Back XU points, both

GV4 and Ren-4, KID- 16-27 take your pick.

 

Salvador

 

 

________________________

 

Observe:

 

Unhealthy complexion. Yes. (no spirit)

Dark or unclear face color. Yes. (no spirit)

Mind is unclear. Yes. (no spirit)

Small movement, continuous fidgeting especially of the legs. Yes.

(deficient heat in the kidneys)

Dry lifeless color (indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi)

Green face color (indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, pain or

interior Wind) Yes.

Fat body. Yes.

Dark face liver & kidney yin deficient (or stagnant qi and congealed blood)

Blue nails. Yes. Blue around moons, pale toward ends.

Tongue color. Pink.

Tongue shape. Teeth marks. Indent on right center.

Tongue coating. Slight white

Tongue moisture. Wet.

 

Inquire:

 

Sensation of heaviness. Yes. (damp cold, damp heat, qi deficiency or bi

syndrome)

Clear Urine. Yes.

Scanty urination. In between, but frequent.

Fall asleep too easily.

Throws off the blanket at night. Yes. (excess heat maybe liver or heart)

 

Listen & smell:

 

Weak cough. Yes.

 

Palpate:

 

Systolic blood pressure (Optimal <120; Normal <130; 127

Diastolic blood pressure (Optimal <80; 70

Heart rate. 60

Floating pulse. Yes. (weak, deficient yin; strong, interior wind)

Slow pulse less than 70 beats per minute. Yes. (cold or insufficient qi)

Hot hands and feet. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

Hot palms of hot hands. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

Hot dorsum of hot hand. Yes. (exterior syndrome)

Dry skin. Yes. (deficiency of liver blood)

 

Summary of Impressions:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind

stagnant qi and congealed blood

qi deficiency

excess heat maybe liver or heart

weak, deficient yin

insufficient qi

extreme yang heat

 

Organs/channels: Kidney, Stomach, Liver, Heart.

 

Treatment Principles:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys: Consolidate Kidney, Reinforce Qi.

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Strengthen Stomach Qi, Invigorate Spleen.

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Warm the Liver,

Dispel cold.

stagnant qi and congealed blood: Soothe Liver, Disperse Stagnation.

qi deficiency: Strengthen Spleen, Benefit Qi.

excess heat maybe liver or heart

weak, deficient yin

insufficient qi

extreme yang heat

Replenish Heart Blood, Reinforce Spleen, Kidney.

 

Points that may be used:

 

no spirit

deficient heat in the kidneys: Du 4; Ki 3, 12; Ren 3, 4, 6; Sp 6; UB 22,

23, 28, 39.

indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Ren 6, 12; Sp 6; St 21, 36; UB 20, 21.

indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Lv 1, 5, 6; Ren 3,

4; Sp 6.

stagnant qi and congealed blood: GB 40, 41; Lv 2, 3, 4, 5, 13, 14; P 6; SJ

6; Sp 6; UB 18.

qi deficiency: Lv 13; Ren 12; Sp 3, 5, 6; St 36; UB 20.

excess heat maybe liver or heart GB 13, 24.

weak, deficient yin CV 15

insufficient qi L 7, CV 17.

extreme yang heat GV 16, 20; GB 20; Lv 2, 3.

Poor Memory Sishengcong (extra); UB 15, 20, 23; St 36; K 6. Ht 7; Sp 1, 4,

6; St 36; UB 15, 17, 20, 44.

 

Your comments are invited. Thanks very much.

 

Regards,

 

Pete

 

_______________

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[Guest guest]

Hi Salvador!

 

What's 6 1 1? I am somewhat confused by LI - KID/Bl - KID/BL. Is the one in

the middle KID/B lowercase L or upper case I?

 

My questionnaire is over 120 points, I thought I posted it for comment once

upon a time - maybe not (?), and takes an hour and fifteen minutes to

complete. I didn't post more symptoms because he didn't *have* more

symptoms - in this sense, there is a frustrating character to the case.

 

My questionnaire includes dribbling, he doesn't dribble. History of lower

back problems, calf spasms,edema in the ankles, dull headaches like a cap

on top of head, tinnitus, 5 palm heat, thirst - does not have these. His

hands are hot palm *and* dorsum, next time I will check him with his shoes

off - he doesn't say his feet are hot, I didn't check with his shoes off.

No sinus problems, no bowel problems, no discomfort on the meridians, not

susceptible to colds. Emotionally he is dull, but maybe that is just the

fatigue, fell asleep a couple of times while I was interviewing him. He is

more concerned than frightened. Controlling I did not observe. I took his

pulse again yesterday, I noticed that it tends to be weaker at the deep

level than at the superficial - it is *very* superficial.

 

This appointment I tried to narrow the case amongst the possibilities I

noticed upon reflecting on the first reading of his results. Of course, his

memory is so bad he may have some additional symptoms and not remember

them. Perhaps I should interview his wife?

 

Interesting that we see signs of excess, I have a main hypotheses of

deficiency: Kidney yin and qi, Liver and Heart Blood, Spleen and Liver qi .

.. . but there isn't a clear case of anything. He doesn't just take the feet

out of the covers, he throws the whole blanket off. Of course, here in

Florida that just may be that the room has gotten warm. The hot hands may

be the key, a lot hotter than his forearms - have to check the feet more

closely, and also the chest. Now is this excess heat or deficient heat?

 

I started him with a bottle of Minshan Shi Chuan Da Bu Wan (12H 2-1,

Fratkin). The Minshan stuff I know I can get from Mayway. I was considering

Ching Chun Bao (12H1-3) but I have only one bottle of it and I don't know

where to get more if he liked the results. I also considered Wuchi Paifeng

Wan (6C-1). I also told him to go to the vitamin store and get some

multi-vitamins. I did not do acupuncture yesterday, I want to study the

case more thoroughly before I start that. I will see him again Friday.

 

At 05:13 PM 3/1/2004, you wrote:

>Pete wrote:

>

>Today's case is Poor Memory: Patient can remember things from years ago,

>but not minutes ago. Have to call him to remind him to come to the office.

>If I call 3 hours before the appointment, he forgets to come. If I call 30

>minutes before he leaves for my office right then, so not to forget.

>Mainly, he has lost his sense of time.

>

>I misread the date, he was born in 58, not 53.

>

>Patient number: 223040024 DOB: June 23, 1958 6 1 1

>-\

---------------------------

>Hi This patient is simple and complex with a LI - KID/Bl - KID/BL

>

>the possible combinations are LI and KID LI and BL or KID and BL

>Pete your observations are great, but more symptoms would be useful.

>

>This person has obvious problems with Water. (poor memory) What would help

>me in this case would be . hystory of lower back problems, calf

>spasms,oedema in the ankles, dull headaches like a cap on top of head?

>tinnitus?5 palm heat thirst in the evening takes feet out of bed at night

>you mention some of these which may lead to making a case for KID Yin XU if

>so it would explain related symptoms in the LIV as well as the LU . IF the

>root is KID then there isn't much point in working on the LIV or LU a Def

>KID can also over rev the SP.(damp symptoms) but again I wouldn't touch the

>SP., or the heart any palpitations?

>

>Where is the excess? is it LI or BL ? this is where symptoms may help to

>decide. sinus problems? bowels? discomfort on the meridian, susceptible to

>colds? what's he like emotionally? frightened, controlling,?

>

>I rather fancy excess BL as it could would show as weakness in the ST /SI .

>Any dribbling? hystory of cystitis.

>

>

>To follow my suggestion you would have to show restraint :)can you make a

>case for Excess BL? if so

>Sed. BL- 64 and wait 10 minutes. more saliva? change in ST pulse quality?

>more relaxed? if it works do a couple of others on the BL but hard to say

>without symptoms. then end by tonifying some points on the KID meridian .

>and note changes to symptoms after a few sessions.

>

>if sed BL is good BL-7, 8 and 10 might be good. KID? Back XU points, both

>GV4 and Ren-4, KID- 16-27 take your pick.

>

>Salvador

>

>

>________________________

>

>Observe:

>

>Unhealthy complexion. Yes. (no spirit)

>Dark or unclear face color. Yes. (no spirit)

>Mind is unclear. Yes. (no spirit)

>Small movement, continuous fidgeting especially of the legs. Yes.

>(deficient heat in the kidneys)

>Dry lifeless color (indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi)

>Green face color (indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, pain or

>interior Wind) Yes.

>Fat body. Yes.

>Dark face liver & kidney yin deficient (or stagnant qi and congealed blood)

>Blue nails. Yes. Blue around moons, pale toward ends.

>Tongue color. Pink.

>Tongue shape. Teeth marks. Indent on right center.

>Tongue coating. Slight white

>Tongue moisture. Wet.

>

>Inquire:

>

>Sensation of heaviness. Yes. (damp cold, damp heat, qi deficiency or bi

>syndrome)

>Clear Urine. Yes.

>Scanty urination. In between, but frequent.

>Fall asleep too easily.

>Throws off the blanket at night. Yes. (excess heat maybe liver or heart)

>

>Listen & smell:

>

>Weak cough. Yes.

>

>Palpate:

>

>Systolic blood pressure (Optimal <120; Normal <130; 127

>Diastolic blood pressure (Optimal <80; 70

>Heart rate. 60

>Floating pulse. Yes. (weak, deficient yin; strong, interior wind)

>Slow pulse less than 70 beats per minute. Yes. (cold or insufficient qi)

>Hot hands and feet. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

>Hot palms of hot hands. Yes. (extreme yang heat)

>Hot dorsum of hot hand. Yes. (exterior syndrome)

>Dry skin. Yes. (deficiency of liver blood)

>

>Summary of Impressions:

>

>no spirit

>deficient heat in the kidneys

>indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi

>indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind

>stagnant qi and congealed blood

>qi deficiency

>excess heat maybe liver or heart

>weak, deficient yin

>insufficient qi

>extreme yang heat

>

>Organs/channels: Kidney, Stomach, Liver, Heart.

>

>Treatment Principles:

>

>no spirit

>deficient heat in the kidneys: Consolidate Kidney, Reinforce Qi.

>indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Strengthen Stomach Qi, Invigorate Spleen.

>indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Warm the Liver,

>Dispel cold.

>stagnant qi and congealed blood: Soothe Liver, Disperse Stagnation.

>qi deficiency: Strengthen Spleen, Benefit Qi.

>excess heat maybe liver or heart

>weak, deficient yin

>insufficient qi

>extreme yang heat

>Replenish Heart Blood, Reinforce Spleen, Kidney.

>

>Points that may be used:

>

>no spirit

>deficient heat in the kidneys: Du 4; Ki 3, 12; Ren 3, 4, 6; Sp 6; UB 22,

>23, 28, 39.

>indicates exhausted Stomach-Qi: Ren 6, 12; Sp 6; St 21, 36; UB 20, 21.

>indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, interior Wind: Lv 1, 5, 6; Ren 3,

>4; Sp 6.

>stagnant qi and congealed blood: GB 40, 41; Lv 2, 3, 4, 5, 13, 14; P 6; SJ

>6; Sp 6; UB 18.

>qi deficiency: Lv 13; Ren 12; Sp 3, 5, 6; St 36; UB 20.

>excess heat maybe liver or heart GB 13, 24.

>weak, deficient yin CV 15

>insufficient qi L 7, CV 17.

>extreme yang heat GV 16, 20; GB 20; Lv 2, 3.

>Poor Memory Sishengcong (extra); UB 15, 20, 23; St 36; K 6. Ht 7; Sp 1, 4,

>6; St 36; UB 15, 17, 20, 44.

>

>Your comments are invited. Thanks very much.

>

>Regards,

>

>Pete

>

>_______________

>Sign-up for a FREE BT Broadband connection today!

>http://www.msn.co.uk/specials/btbroadband

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