RE: P Theisen- Peripheral Neuropathy 76yr old

[Guest guest]

Pete wrote:

 

> >Hi Everybody!

> >

> >I have a 76 year old patient who is suffering from Peripheral Neuropathy.

> >This has bothered him since he had a back operation some time ago. He

>feels

> >like he is walking on pebbles in his shoes when he is in bed trying to

> >sleep. I think that either the inter-vertebral foramina are too small

>after

> >the surgery for the nerves to fit without being pressed or the area has

> >scar tissue pressing on the nerves. The surgeon who did this to him says

> >there is nothing that can be done about it. Gotta love them.

> >

> >He has an overall yin deficient presentation. Hidden pulse, Pale tongue

> >material, swollen with thin white coating and little moisture. He has

> >central obesity and dry mouth but he is not diabetic. I have him taking

>Liu

> >Wei Di Huang Pian and Tien Wang Bu Xin Dan with no effect so far, a

>couple

> >of weeks. The MD guys have him taking neurotin, Inderal, and some others

> >which I have listed at my office (at another location now) Yes, the

>western

> >meds could cause neuropathy, but most likely not with the timing of the

> >symptoms starting right after the surgery. He didn't start the meds until

> >he had the symptoms.

> >

> >The first several Acupuncture treatments helped him - he was almost

>symptom

> >free, and he couldn't even feel the needles but now he is super sensitive

> >to needling so I can't needle his feet any more and the symptoms are

>back.

> >I have been using stick on electrodes at the K 1 and Bafeng areas

> >connecting the other ends of the circuits to SP 6 and St 36. He can

>barely

> >stand that. Other points are LI 4, 11; and Lu 7. I have tried other

>points

> >without lasting success.

> >

> >Lately he has had so much discomfort in his feet that he has been taking

> >amitriptyline. This really doesn't help, he stays awake tossing and

>turning

> >all night and then sleeps all day, amitriptyline or no amitriptyline.

> >

> >Any help will be most appreciated.

> >

> >Regards, D.O.B Jan 13,1930.

> >

> >Pete

 

_______________

 

Hi Pete,

 

Isn't it strange that a person has back pain probably due to long term

stress creating muscular back spasm that distorts the position of the

vertebrae and compresses disks. then has an operation. The assumption here

being that all that muscular distortion has miraculosly dissapeared and when

pain recurs the answer focuses anywhere except the posibility that stress

had / has anything to do with it. Of course this one patient might be one of

the few exceptions.......

 

 

The Keys to this patients dysharmonies are focused in the ST, GB, SI (by

using chinese astrology)

 

You don't give much info to make a case but either the ST or GB is likely

to be behind the back problems affecting the the Feet . I say this because

if it were due to the SI I would by this stage expect severe neck tension +

other symptoms like a history of spottiness from too much fat goint into the

pores etc.

 

As I have said in the other email you have to be clear on root To sedate a

def meridian or tonify an excess one will complicate matters.

 

Can you make a case for either of those two by looking back overt the years

as to which symptoms the patient has had when under stress?

 

 

If you like the way I share info you can return the favour by sharing with

us your obervations after treating your patients for say 3 treatments?

 

Salvador

 

_______________

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[Guest guest]

Hi Salvador!

 

My " Four Pillar " examination finding on this patient is at the end of this

note. I have no training in Chinese astrology, my school taught Traditional

and a fair amount of western medicine. It is interesting

that using the astrology model you come to a somewhat different impression

than I do.

 

I have treated him many times - maybe 15 treatments, and he has taken some

herbal pills. He stopped taking the pills because they have no wham-bam

western medicine like effect. I started by putting a few needles in his

feet - K 1, Bafeng, St 42, Sp 2, UB 66, GB 41 - this sort of thing, and the

Miriam Lee " Great Ten " prescription (Sp 6; St 36; LI 4, 11; L 7). The

objective I had in mind with the foot points was to give some stimulation

to the feet in the hopes of re-establishing communications with the central

nervous system, a primarily western med idea, the " Great Ten " is supposed

to be good for " everything " . I used electric stim between K 1 and Sp 6, and

one of the Bafeng points and St 36. This worked at first - the pain at

night in his feet stopped, but after a few treatments he recovered enough

nerve function that he could *feel* the needles and he couldn't bear the

treatments any more. I tried to use stim only with stick-on electrodes, but

while this avoided the needle pain it didn't help the peripheral neuropathy.

 

Last time I did the " Toe " , " Heel " and " Sole " ear-points, and made a bad pun

about soul food. When he comes back I will get his reaction to the

ear-points, I already have his reaction to the bad pun.

 

I received some replies from other lists that I should keep on with the

local stimulation, but it is a moot point because he can't tolerate it.

Next time he comes in I will do some SI points and GB scalp points because

he can't take needles in his legs and feet any more.

 

Observe Examination:

 

Small movement, continuous fidgeting especially of the legs. Yes.

(deficient heat in the kidneys)

Green face color (indicates a Liver pattern, interior Cold, pain or

interior Wind) Yes.

Broad, square shoulders, slow and deliberate, strong build, triangular

face, " Metal Type " . Yes

Slightly fat, calm, large head, belly and thighs, wide jaws, " Earth Type " . Yes.

Fat body. Yes.

5 element ear problem is mainly kidney; tinnitus is yin deficient,

Pale nails. Yes.

Tongue color. Red

Tongue shape. Thin

Tongue coating. White

Tongue moisture. Dry

 

Inquire Examination:

 

Time of day that there is sweating. On exertion.

Condition of the illness. Worse at night, or when inactive.

Location of the headache. Whole head.

Character of the headache pain: Dull.

Condition of the patient while having the headache. OK, an annoyance, but

not disabling.

Severe giddiness, everything seems to sway, loss of balance. Yes.

Sudden onset of dizziness. Yes.

Pain that is relieved by touch or pressure. Yes. (deficient)

Pain that is better after eating. Yes. (deficient)

Sharp stabbing pain usually in a fixed location. Yes. (blood stasis) in

various places in feet.

Pain that moves from place to place. Yes. (wind)

Frequent urination. Yes.

Stool dry at first, then wet. Yes.

Not able to fall asleep. Yes.

Dream disturbed sleep. Yes.

Restless sleep.

Dry mouth is liver, kidney, yin deficiency, heat.

Throws off the blanket at night.

 

Listen & Smell Examination

 

Shortness of breath.

Wheezing. Yes. (kidney deficiency)

 

Palpation Examination.

 

Systolic blood pressure (Optimal <120; 125 Normal <130

Diastolic blood pressure (Optimal <80; Normal <85; 88 High Normal <89

Heart rate. 81

Hidden pulse is an extreme form of the sinking pulse. (Deficient Yang if weak).

Cold feet. Yes. (deficient yin)

 

 

 

Overall impression, Kidney yin deficiency.

 

Liu Wei Di Huang Wan 12 D 1x

Tien Wang Bu Xin Dan 8C 2- 1

 

K 1, 3, 6; Ren 4; Sp 6; UB 23

 

 

At 03:40 PM 2/22/2004, you wrote:

 

>Pete wrote:

>

> > >Hi Everybody!

> > >

> > >I have a 76 year old patient who is suffering from Peripheral Neuropathy.

> > >This has bothered him since he had a back operation some time ago. He

> >feels

> > >like he is walking on pebbles in his shoes when he is in bed trying to

> > >sleep. I think that either the inter-vertebral foramina are too small

> >after

> > >the surgery for the nerves to fit without being pressed or the area has

> > >scar tissue pressing on the nerves. The surgeon who did this to him says

> > >there is nothing that can be done about it. Gotta love them.

> > >

> > >He has an overall yin deficient presentation. Hidden pulse, Pale tongue

> > >material, swollen with thin white coating and little moisture. He has

> > >central obesity and dry mouth but he is not diabetic. I have him taking

> >Liu

> > >Wei Di Huang Pian and Tien Wang Bu Xin Dan with no effect so far, a

> >couple

> > >of weeks. The MD guys have him taking neurotin, Inderal, and some others

> > >which I have listed at my office (at another location now) Yes, the

> >western

> > >meds could cause neuropathy, but most likely not with the timing of the

> > >symptoms starting right after the surgery. He didn't start the meds until

> > >he had the symptoms.

> > >

> > >The first several Acupuncture treatments helped him - he was almost

> >symptom

> > >free, and he couldn't even feel the needles but now he is super sensitive

> > >to needling so I can't needle his feet any more and the symptoms are

> >back.

> > >I have been using stick on electrodes at the K 1 and Bafeng areas

> > >connecting the other ends of the circuits to SP 6 and St 36. He can

> >barely

> > >stand that. Other points are LI 4, 11; and Lu 7. I have tried other

> >points

> > >without lasting success.

> > >

> > >Lately he has had so much discomfort in his feet that he has been taking

> > >amitriptyline. This really doesn't help, he stays awake tossing and

> >turning

> > >all night and then sleeps all day, amitriptyline or no amitriptyline.

> > >

> > >Any help will be most appreciated.

> > >

> > >Regards, D.O.B Jan 13,1930.

> > >

> > >Pete

>

>_______________

>

>Hi Pete,

>

>Isn't it strange that a person has back pain probably due to long term

>stress creating muscular back spasm that distorts the position of the

>vertebrae and compresses disks. then has an operation. The assumption here

>being that all that muscular distortion has miraculosly dissapeared and when

>pain recurs the answer focuses anywhere except the posibility that stress

>had / has anything to do with it. Of course this one patient might be one of

>the few exceptions.......

>

>

>The Keys to this patients dysharmonies are focused in the ST, GB, SI (by

>using chinese astrology)

>

>You don't give much info to make a case but either the ST or GB is likely

>to be behind the back problems affecting the the Feet . I say this because

>if it were due to the SI I would by this stage expect severe neck tension +

>other symptoms like a history of spottiness from too much fat goint into the

>pores etc.

>

>As I have said in the other email you have to be clear on root To sedate a

>def meridian or tonify an excess one will complicate matters.

>

>Can you make a case for either of those two by looking back overt the years

>as to which symptoms the patient has had when under stress?

>

>

>If you like the way I share info you can return the favour by sharing with

>us your obervations after treating your patients for say 3 treatments?

>

>Salvador

 

Regards,

 

Pete

[Guest guest]

Pete wrote:

>

>My " Four Pillar " examination finding on this patient is at the end of this

>note. I have no training in Chinese astrology, my school taught Traditional

> and a fair amount of western medicine. It is interesting

>that using the astrology model you come to a somewhat different impression

>than I do.

 

 

_

 

Hi Pete

 

4 Pillars is a very useful predictive astrological tool and I have done a

fair amount of research with it. It uses the concepts of Elements but I have

yet to find a correlation between its elemental descriptions and Meridian

Root dysharmonies within a person. The system I use is different, and for

what it is worth (i can imagine mutterings of arrogant in the background)

100% the real deal.

 

I say this because I have corroborated my findings with hundreds of patients

and, as the english saying goes. " The proof is in the pudding " .

 

Salvador

 

_______________

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[Guest guest]

Hi Salvador!

 

Well, don't stop now, tell us more about your system. Does anyone else use

it? Are there any web sites or books?

 

At 08:15 AM 2/23/2004, you wrote:

 

>Pete wrote:

> >

> >My " Four Pillar " examination finding on this patient is at the end of this

> >note. I have no training in Chinese astrology, my school taught Traditional

> > and a fair amount of western medicine. It is interesting

> >that using the astrology model you come to a somewhat different impression

> >than I do.

>

>

>_

>

>Hi Pete

>

>4 Pillars is a very useful predictive astrological tool and I have done a

>fair amount of research with it. It uses the concepts of Elements but I have

>yet to find a correlation between its elemental descriptions and Meridian

>Root dysharmonies within a person. The system I use is different, and for

>what it is worth (i can imagine mutterings of arrogant in the background)

>100% the real deal.

>

>I say this because I have corroborated my findings with hundreds of patients

>and, as the english saying goes. " The proof is in the pudding " .

>

>Salvador

>

>_______________

>Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends

>http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger

>

>

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