pH #'s

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/26/03 10:55:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

Chinese Medicine writes:

She stopped eating white refined wheat and pizza and such

fast calories because it made her pH lower (down towards 5)

and discovered that by eating more rootfruits etc it got closer to 7

and with some ph calcium in addition she changed

from sitting in a wheelchair to dancing, in just a month or two.

This is a great story but I am curious about one thing when it comes to pH.

Urine pH should be around 5 so there is acid to prevent infection. Blood pH

should be 7.5 for balance but it is impossible to get a blood pH in any test I

know of. I have heard that you can use litmus paper with saliva for a blood pH.

Can anyone shed more light on this?

 

Thanks,

 

Bobbi

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/26/2003 8:13:37 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Jackie writes:

 

> This is a great story but I am curious about one thing when it comes to pH.

> Urine pH should be around 5 so there is acid to prevent infection. Blood pH

> should be 7.5 for balance but it is impossible to get a blood pH in any test

> I

> know of.

>

 

Tis a true thing. It is unlikely any of us will have blood pH

equipment. On the other hand, I don't really think blood pH is that important.

The

body will do what ever it can to keep the blood pH as stable as possible at the

detriment of the rest of the body, so blood pH like many other blood tests

may be next to useless unless the person is obviously sick, then you can be

pretty sure the pH is off anyway. It takes a lot of body imbalance to show up

in

the blood.

By taking saliva pH, you get a pretty good idea of what the tendency

of tissue pH is, well before any pathology shows up.

In addition, although urine pH is typically on the slightly acidic

side, stating that it " should " be a pH of 5, would be pretty hard to prove. It

really seems a bit low to me.

If a person was eating a " healthy " diet that would tend to keep the pH

of the rest of the body in the 7.2-7.4 range, the urine pH would typically

only be slightly acidic but not as low as 5. TTBOMK

Anyhow, the whole pH thing is really pretty easy for most patients to

understand and gives them a goal to attain. Kind of a contest and when they

get to 7.0 consistently, they win.

If you have someone who is obviously imbalanced with heat and

inflammation symptoms and their pH is not low, check the blood tests for mineral

imbalances or ask about kidney problems. The answer will probably show itself

there. There aren't that many of these people around though. Just keep in mind

that there are some people who for reasons of metabolic imbalance, will show up

as very alkaline when they are sick.

Hope this helps,

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

This is a great story but I am curious about one thing when it comes to pH.

Urine pH should be around 5 so there is acid to prevent infection. Blood pH

should be 7.5 for balance but it is impossible to get a blood pH in any test

I

know of.

 

'Blood gas' will give you blood pH - usually arterial, done in hospital, run

immediately, but we developed a range for venous blood gas on horses, and a

local hospital agreed to run mine when I got it there within 20mins.

 

Jackie

[Guest guest]

'Blood gas' will give you blood pH

>>>>Blood pH is very closely controlled. I just checked my saliva pH its 7.0 on

the Atkins diet.

Alon

 

 

[Guest guest]

This is a great story but I am curious about one thing when it comes to pH.

Urine pH should be around 5 so there is acid to prevent infection. Blood pH

should be 7.5 for balance but it is impossible to get a blood pH in any test I

know of.

 

Jackie

 

Point of information, please. Blood pH is 7.35 to7.45 or you're not conscious

any more. It's buffered at that pH range. Urine pH is not " supposed " to be

anything in particular. It's the fluid portion of the blood that the kidney has

excreted. If your blood pH is below 7.4, your urine will be acidic. If your

blood pH is above 7.4, then your urine will be more basic. Urine is the result

of filtering the blood for what is not needed in the blood's steady state.

 

Emmanuel Segmen

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/27/2003 6:10:23 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

Jackie writes:

What us horse folk were interested in was two questions:

 

Even though blood pH is held within strict boundaries 'on pain of death', we

assume there can be greater cellular acidity?

 

How can we moniter/measure *that* - through saliva? We'd pretty much ruled

out urine pH, and even tried measuring fecal pH (which we know reduces

during a crisis, but seems pretty constant otherwise).

 

I found a passage somewhere which said an acid body will produce more

alkaline saliva to compensate - so our jury remained out on the usefulness

of saliva for monitering cellular acidity.

 

Jackie

Your assumption is correct. The body will hold blood pH pretty stable

even though the rest of the body is horribly out of whack. The body will pull

buffering minerals from where it can to keep blood pH within normal ranges. If

the blood pH is consistently on the low side, then rest of the body will be

severly lacking in buffering minerals.

This is the most common reason for osteoporosis. The consistent calcium

grabbing from the bones to buffer an over acid condition. Osteo arthritis, is

often the result of the uncontrolled release of calcium form the bones that

allows excess calcium to settle out in " weakened " areas of the body or areas

that have had chronic inflammation.

Using saliva pH will give you a pretty good indication of the tissue pH.

Just make sure you test before eating or about two hours after eating.

The most common reason pH of urine, feces or saliva would go up under

stress is the tendency of the body to start dumping calcium from the bones.

I disagree that an acid body produces basic saliva to compensate. I have

seen nothing in my practice to indicate that.

I typically tell people to test their pH over the course of the week.

This way we get a better picture of what is really happening. There will be

variations, but usually fairly consistent.

 

Hope this helps,

Chris

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

>Jackie

 

>Point of information, please.

 

Umm - I didn't write the para you responded to BTW!!!?? My name has been

appearing over quotes which are not mine, and I cannot seem to get automatic

quote - marking on this group. Attilio - is there a group setting that

removes the >>> I normally get when I reply to an email??

 

I know full well blood pH is held within tight control - from venous blood

in horses it is pH 7.345 - 7.433. My horse was 7.37 when I persuaded a

local hospital to run it for me. I wanted to make sure he was not too

alkaline before joining a clinical trial on a very alkalising nutritional

approach. As he was on the acid side of normal I went ahead - and had a HUGE

overnight positive response to that at the time. There was a sea change

which has never been reversed, but I wonder if acidity is part of the 'heat'

I see each summer.

 

(BTW, just got horse's insulin and cortisol in range again on my Bai Shao

mix without Bai Zhu - think atractylodes may have been a problem - too warm?

Suspect Dan Shen too.)

 

What us horse folk were interested in was two questions:

 

Even though blood pH is held within strict boundaries 'on pain of death', we

assume there can be greater cellular acidity?

 

How can we moniter/measure *that* - through saliva? We'd pretty much ruled

out urine pH, and even tried measuring fecal pH (which we know reduces

during a crisis, but seems pretty constant otherwise).

 

I found a passage somewhere which said an acid body will produce more

alkaline saliva to compensate - so our jury remained out on the usefulness

of saliva for monitering cellular acidity.

 

Jackie

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/28/2003 7:40:26 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

Jackie writes:

Maybe we will tests a few animals, see if we can find a variation - it

should be relatively simple after all. Is there special paper, or will

ordinary litmus do the job?

 

Jackie

I use rolls of paper from Pike Lab Supplies. I can send you a roll if

you like.

What kind of tests are you thinking of?

 

Chris

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/28/2003 7:45:03 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

alonmarcus writes:

>>>What kind of ranges are you seeing in saliva

Alon

I have seen people with saliva pH as low as 5.8 and as high as 8.0. The

lowest pH person had lots of symptoms of inflammation. So did the 8.0. The

8.0 saliva pH is a 63 year old man on Meds that make his body hang on to

potassium.

There was a fair amount of toxicity in both people.

 

Chris

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/28/2003 9:00:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

alonmarcus writes:

>>>What are you seeing in healthy people

alon

Well, that's an interesting question. I have seen a fairly wide range in

people who would call themselves healthy. Off hand I would say 6.0-7.2.

Many people seem to think getting a couple colds a year, having a few

allergies, or a slightly congested nose is just part of living.

When I was talking to a professor at my Acupuncture school, before I

decided to attend, we were talking about health. I told him, " I never got

colds,

had lots of energy, and was healthy. " His reply, " Your not healthy in my

eyes. You are 10lbs heavy, and puffy. "

It wasn't until I started school that I found out just how imbalanced I

was.

As far as saliva pH goes, if a person consistently tests out at 6, then

even if there are no apparent symptoms, that person in reality isn't healthy.

There are just symptoms that person isn't aware of yet.

 

Chris

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

>>>>>Your assumption is correct. The body will hold blood pH pretty stable

even though the rest of the body is horribly out of whack. The body will

pull

buffering minerals from where it can to keep blood pH within normal ranges.

If

the blood pH is consistently on the low side, then rest of the body will be

severly lacking in buffering minerals.

 

We do find we have to feed extra......or at least make sure they have ample.

 

>>>>Using saliva pH will give you a pretty good indication of the tissue pH.

 

Maybe we will tests a few animals, see if we can find a variation - it

should be relatively simple after all. Is there special paper, or will

ordinary litmus do the job?

 

Jackie

[Guest guest]

>>>>Using saliva pH will give you a pretty good indication of the tissue pH.

>>>What kind of ranges are you seeing in saliva

Alon

 

 

[Guest guest]

I have seen people with saliva pH as low as 5.8 and as high as 8.0. The

lowest pH person had lots of symptoms of inflammation. So did the 8.0. The

8.0 saliva pH is a 63 year old man on Meds that make his body hang on to

potassium.

There was a fair amount of toxicity in both people.

 

>>>What are you seeing in healthy people

alon