Physical Therapists ? RE: Digest Number 138

[Guest guest]

Sorry to sound like an ignoramus Matt, but could you make a list of the

professions / trades / back yard hobbies you include in Physical Therapists.

 

> I am more concerned about the possibility of Physical Therapists trying to

get control of acupuncture than M.D.s.

 

I have a feeling many allied health professions like Physiotherapists would

be far more open to the idea of meridians, channels and flow of Qi, and far

more capable of the practical aspect of needling as well. For example, most

doctors who have taken my blood are absolutely hopeless at it whereas

trained Phlebotomists are in the main real 'artists'.

 

So who are these Physical Therapist that you are concerned about, and (other

things being equal between them and the doctors who do not concern you) why

?

 

Many thanks.

 

Sammy.

 

matt bauer [acu.guy]

23 August 2003 02:13

Chinese Medicine

Re: Digest Number 138

 

 

Thanks Maya and Richard - Regarding this thread, I would have to say I am

more concerned about the possibility of Physical Therapists trying to get

control of acupuncture than M.D.s.

Matt Bauer

-

YinTangSong

Chinese Medicine

Friday, August 22, 2003 5:20 PM

Re: Digest Number 138

 

 

In a message dated 8/22/2003 3:46:08 PM Pacific Standard Time,

acu.guy writes:

 

 

> Let us also not forget - the scientists were once the David against

the

> Golieth of the Chruch. If ever our profession were to grow into a

position of

> power, we would be susceptible to the same corruption every other

powerful

> institution has succumbed to. I appreciate everyone who works to help

spread

> this gentle effective therapy. We may disagree on how to best do this,

but

> should keep working on how to work out our internal disputes so we can

be more

> effective.

 

I completely agree with you Matt. Well said.

 

Maya

 

 

[Guest guest]

Sammy Said " Sorry to sound like an ignoramus Matt, but could you make a list of

the

professions / trades / back yard hobbies you include in Physical Therapists. "

and " So who are these Physical Therapist that you are concerned about, and

(other

things being equal between them and the doctors who do not concern you) why

? "

 

 

I am here referring to licensed Physical Therapist who, as Richard pointed out,

work under a M.D. or D.O's Rx. and referral. I don't know their exact numbers or

know all of the specific legal licensing requirements for each state, but there

are tens of thousands of such P.T.s and some of their leaders have been

frustrated with not being allowed to diagnose and the requirement of working

under M.D.s They want to see their Scope of Practice and autonomy increased and

acupuncture is one of the things they would like to add although they would

likely use the term " dry needling. " If I am not mistaken, there may already be a

state or two that allows some limited dry needling by P.T.s Either way, this

would likely begin as being allowed to do such needling on limited cases such as

specific points for low back pain. It is not that I have no concern about M.D.s,

it is just that, given the high income expectations and little time most M.D.s

have, I find the possible threat to the vibrancy of an independent

acupuncturists/OMD type profession much greater from such licensed Therapists.

If the powers that be decided that they should be allowed to needle their

patients with certain limited training for specific orthopedic cases, we could

see many thousands of such P.T.s certified and doing this in no time. They

already have solid working relationships with M.D.s, speak their language, and

could afford to spend the time it takes to carry out such treatments. If they

learn such techniques under " neuro/anatomy " concepts that M.D.s can feel more

comfortable with - cookbook recipes of matching specific points for specific

problems - this would allow them to say they are doing this useful therapy using

scientific ideals. This would make the medical and insurance establishment more

comfortable than trying to reconcile TCM theories.

 

Matt Bauer

-

ga.bates

Chinese Medicine

Saturday, August 23, 2003 7:54 AM

Physical Therapists ? RE: Digest Number 138

 

 

Sorry to sound like an ignoramus Matt, but could you make a list of the

professions / trades / back yard hobbies you include in Physical Therapists.

 

> I am more concerned about the possibility of Physical Therapists trying to

get control of acupuncture than M.D.s.

 

I have a feeling many allied health professions like Physiotherapists would

be far more open to the idea of meridians, channels and flow of Qi, and far

more capable of the practical aspect of needling as well. For example, most

doctors who have taken my blood are absolutely hopeless at it whereas

trained Phlebotomists are in the main real 'artists'.

 

So who are these Physical Therapist that you are concerned about, and (other

things being equal between them and the doctors who do not concern you) why

?

 

Many thanks.

 

Sammy.

 

matt bauer [acu.guy]

23 August 2003 02:13

Chinese Medicine

Re: Digest Number 138

 

 

[Guest guest]

To add to this discussion.......what or better yet HOW could there ever be

this rediculous differentiation called 'dry needling'. So what do acupuncturists

perform...? wet needling?

Dry needling is in fact what acupuncturists DO.

 

Here is yet another attempt by the allopaths to co-opt something that is NOT

their invention (so to speak). There does not appear to be anything NEW

regarding Chan Gunn or so-called dry-nnedling techniques that the Chinese didn't

already know.

 

I seriously doubt that the MDs will allow the PTs to get out from underneath

their control.

 

Richard

In a message dated 8/23/03 12:46:46 PM, acu.guy writes:

 

<< I am here referring to licensed Physical Therapist who, as Richard pointed

out, work under a M.D. or D.O's Rx. and referral. I don't know their exact

numbers or know all of the specific legal licensing requirements for each state,

but there are tens of thousands of such P.T.s and some of their leaders have

been frustrated with not being allowed to diagnose and the requirement of

working under M.D.s They want to see their Scope of Practice and autonomy

increased and acupuncture is one of the things they would like to add although

they

would likely use the term " dry needling. " If I am not mistaken, there may

already be a state or two that allows some limited dry needling by P.T.s Either

way,

this would likely begin as being allowed to do such needling on limited cases

such as specific points for low back pain. It is not that I have no concern

about M.D.s, it is just that, given the high income expectations and little

time most M.D.s have, I find the possible threat to the vibrancy of an

independent acupuncturists/OMD type profession much greater from such licensed

Therapists. If the powers that be decided that they should be allowed to needle

their

patients with certain limited training for specific orthopedic cases, we could

see many thousands of such P.T.s certified and doing this in no time. They

already have solid working relationships with M.D.s, speak their language, and

could afford to spend the time it takes to carry out such treatments. If they

learn such techniques under " neuro/anatomy " concepts that M.D.s can feel more

comfortable with - cookbook recipes of matching specific points for specific

problems - this would allow them to say they are doing this useful therapy using

scientific ideals. This would make the medical and insurance establishment

more comfortable than trying to reconcile TCM theories.

 

Matt Bauer >>