Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 Thomas, HI!! We were in class together at PCOM. I hope you are well. Are you still in touch with Doug and Jackie (NY)? Anne Kinchen PS It is a huge plus to have Zev on this site! I often go back to my Bensky to read the notes I wrote in the margins from his classes. Although the book is beginning to be torn and tattered, I hold it dearly as my most valued text because of the info Zev shared. Peace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 Good Morning, Thanks for the invitation to this list, I look forward to some lively discussion. My name is and I practice in SW Oregon. I use acupuncture and herbs. I also use herbs from outside the TCM materia medica and will be finally finishing my book on the subject within a month or so. I am also a PCOM grad and Z'ev its good to see your text. A couple of points if I may. As to Paul Pitchford's book, I have not seen the revised edition but the " TCM " in the old edition leaves a bit to be desired, IOW, I would not rely on it as a text for TCM. Flaws book is far superior in that way, although the amount of other information in Pitchford's book makes it a great book. Using herbs with folks on meds can be tricky business but I totally agree with Z'ev, which is to say that I have had dozens of experiences getting people off or reducing their dosage of meds that were causing significant problems. Yes, herbs contain chemicals, this true, however the concentration of powerful chemicals, which cause significant health risks, are generally far less. AND! We as herbalists and healthcare practitioners are obligated to do all we can to help our patients live a full and healthy life. If we are scared of our own medicine then perhaps we need to reflect on our path. That being said, herbalism is not for everyone, some do best with acupuncture alone. There is a lot to learn in the acupuncture field and one could spend a lifetime studying and learning the art. But, if this is your path, please be conscious of what you say about a field that many of us are very passionate about. Looking forward to some good TCM discussion, thomas Chinese Herbology and Acupuncture acupuncture and herbal information phone: (541) 955-5031 fax: (541) 955-5069 " Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything. " Lao Tzu - " Lisa Oskardmay, DC, Dipl. Ac. NCCAOM " <drlisa <Chinese Medicine > Tuesday, May 27, 2003 8:08 AM [Chinese Medicine] Bob Flaw book > Anne, > Thank you for the book recommendation. Maybe it is a little more patient readable > than the Pitchford book? > Many issues are connected with what we eat. In Pitchford's book he also discusses the > environmental impact, spiritual content of various foods, as well as the effect of > different cooking methods on the yin/yang energies. It has been a good overall book > for me to not only understant foods but also TCM better. > I look forward to seeing Bob Flaw's book > Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 Greetings, Thanks for the invitation to join this group. My name is Teresa Hall, I am a PCOM graduate 2000. I have a growing practice in central San Diego, and also treat anywhere from 15 to 30 patients, of an MD, in Pacific Beach. Recently, I have been offered a position at a Rehab center, as their PTP for all new injury cases. Currently most all of my patients I see for narcotic detox/pain management, IVF assissted infertilty, chemo side effects, and Hepatitis C. I work with Acupuncture w/ and w/out micro-current, cranial electrical stimulation, vibrational healing, Japanese Kampo, and am writing more and more raw formulas. I feel very blessed to be partaking in my heart calling. I cannot think of anything I would rather be doing... then reading, thinking, teaching and living TCM. Warm regards, Teresa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2003 Report Share Posted May 27, 2003 If weare scared of our own medicine then perhaps we need to reflect on our path.That being said, herbalism is not for everyone, some do best withacupuncture alone. >>Containing chemicals should not scar anybody, but at the same time should also remind one that just because its herbs does not make it automatically safe. alon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 Hi to all, Good to hear from you Anne, sadly I've lost touch with Doug and Jackie but I'd love to catch up with them and many others. A philosophical comment re the recent discussions vis a vis TCM, terminology, branching out, and the practice of " American " . First, its important to validate what you all have said. There are myriad ways to practice Chinese medicine as has been the example of the forefathers of the medicine. Chinese medicine has been " standardized " by the government of China over the last 50 or so years and for most of us that has been the bulk, if not all, of what we have learned. The standardization is a revolution within the field and good or bad (and that could be a lively debate in and of itself) it has happened. That standardization has become the standard so much so that many practitioners (including Chinese taught in China) believe that it IS the medicine, in its entirety. But we don't have to look far into the past to see that Chinese medicine has taken many twists and turns through the millennia. In North American (particularly in the US) (I don't know about Europe) young practitioners of Chinese medicine have come to the medicine from many different angles, having, in many cases, only a crude introduction to the medicine mixed in with biomedicine. This has led to an inordinate number of tangential changes in the way in which the medicine is practiced. Good, bad? Neither, as best I can see. However, where I see a significant problem is part of what Z'ev was saying, when we are trying to branch out from Chinese medicine with whatever the style (NAET, vibrational medicine, using Western herbs, using supplements, etc.) then it is critical that we thoroughly understand the medicine, which is our starting point. Frankly, that can't be done in 3-4 years of school, especially not here in the West. The schools don't offer enough rigorous academics in Chinese medicine. Any teachers out there please don't take offense, it not you (hopefully) its the system that has been implemented in the West....... So to wrap up this long diatribe I would like to offer up some advice from someone who has been studying the medicine for 14 years or so, to those who want to branch out (and I encourage you to do so) please take 5-8 years and truly study Chinese medicine, stay true to it, learn what it has to offer, study the classics, maybe even learn some language, and practice. Fall in love with it all over again, then, and only then consider branching out. Otherwise, I fear that some of these tangents will be fruitless. Respectfully, thomas Chinese Herbology and Acupuncture acupuncture and herbal information phone: (541) 955-5031 fax: (541) 955-5069 " Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything. " Lao Tzu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 Hello all, Thomas, it's nice to reconnect with you. I have been wondering when I would hear from you again... I wholeheartedly agree with you! Eti wrote: Hi to all,Good to hear from you Anne, sadly I've lost touch with Doug and Jackie butI'd love to catch up with them and many others.A philosophical comment re the recent discussions vis a vis TCM,terminology, branching out, and the practice of "American ".First, its important to validate what you all have said. There are myriadways to practice Chinese medicine as has been the example of the forefathersof the medicine. Chinese medicine has been "standardized" by the governmentof China over the last 50 or so years and for most of us that has been thebulk, if not all, of what we have learned. The standardization is arevolution within the field and good or bad (and that could be a livelydebate in and of itself) it has happened. That standardization has becomethe standard so much so that many practitioners (including Chinese taught inChina) believe that it IS the medicine, in its entirety. But we don't haveto look far into the past to see that Chinese medicine has taken many twistsand turns through the millennia.In North American (particularly in the US) (I don't know about Europe) youngpractitioners of Chinese medicine have come to the medicine from manydifferent angles, having, in many cases, only a crude introduction to themedicine mixed in with biomedicine. This has led to an inordinate number oftangential changes in the way in which the medicine is practiced. Good, bad?Neither, as best I can see. However, where I see a significant problem ispart of what Z'ev was saying, when we are trying to branch out from Chinesemedicine with whatever the style (NAET, vibrational medicine, using Westernherbs, using supplements, etc.) then it is critical that we thoroughlyunderstand the medicine, which is our starting point. Frankly, that can't bedone in 3-4 years of school, especially not here in the West. The schoolsdon't offer enough rigorous academics in Chinese medicine. Any teachers outthere please don't take offense, it not you (hopefully) its the system thathas been implemented in the West.......So to wrap up this long diatribe I would like to offer up some advice fromsomeone who has been studying the medicine for 14 years or so, to those whowant to branch out (and I encourage you to do so) please take 5-8 years andtruly study Chinese medicine, stay true to it, learn what it has to offer,study the classics, maybe even learn some language, and practice. Fall inlove with it all over again, then, and only then consider branching out.Otherwise, I fear that some of these tangents will be fruitless.Respectfully,thomasChinese Herbology and Acupunctureacupuncture and herbal informationWilliams, OR 97544 USAphone: (541) 955-5031 fax: (541) 955-5069"Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything." Lao Tzu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 So to wrap up this long diatribe I would like to offer up some advice fromsomeone who has been studying the medicine for 14 years or so, to those whowant to branch out (and I encourage you to do so) please take 5-8 years andtruly study Chinese medicine, >>>>I agree it very important to be grounded in something first Alon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2003 Report Share Posted May 28, 2003 Nice discussion, Thomas, and good points. Nice to hear from you again. On Wednesday, May 28, 2003, at 09:03 AM, wrote: > A philosophical comment re the recent discussions vis a vis TCM, > terminology, branching out, and the practice of " American Chinese > Medicine " . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 29, 2003 Report Share Posted May 29, 2003 Great to hear from you Eti, email me privately to talk more....... thomas Chinese Herbology and Acupunctureacupuncture and herbal informationWilliams, OR 97544 USAphone: (541) 955-5031 fax: (541) 955-5069"Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything." Lao Tzu - Eti Domb Chinese Medicine Wednesday, May 28, 2003 9:56 AM Re: [Chinese Medicine] Intro and comments Hello all, Thomas, it's nice to reconnect with you. I have been wondering when I would hear from you again... I wholeheartedly agree with you! Eti wrote: Hi to all,Good to hear from you Anne, sadly I've lost touch with Doug and Jackie butI'd love to catch up with them and many others.A philosophical comment re the recent discussions vis a vis TCM,terminology, branching out, and the practice of "American ".First, its important to validate what you all have said. There are myriadways to practice Chinese medicine as has been the example of the forefathersof the medicine. Chinese medicine has been "standardized" by the governmentof China over the last 50 or so years and for most of us that has been thebulk, if not all, of what we have learned. The standardization is arevolution within the field and good or bad (and that could be a livelydebate in and of itself) it has happened. That standardization has becomethe standard so much so that many practitioners (including Chinese taught inChina) believe that it IS the medicine, in its entirety. But we don't haveto look far into the past to see that Chinese medicine has taken many twistsand turns through the millennia.In North American (particularly in the US) (I don't know about Europe) youngpractitioners of Chinese medicine have come to the medicine from manydifferent angles, having, in many cases, only a crude introduction to themedicine mixed in with biomedicine. This has led to an inordinate number oftangential changes in the way in which the medicine is practiced. Good, bad?Neither, as best I can see. However, where I see a significant problem ispart of what Z'ev was saying, when we are trying to branch out from Chinesemedicine with whatever the style (NAET, vibrational medicine, using Westernherbs, using supplements, etc.) then it is critical that we thoroughlyunderstand the medicine, which is our starting point. Frankly, that can't bedone in 3-4 years of school, especially not here in the West. The schoolsdon't offer enough rigorous academics in Chinese medicine. Any teachers outthere please don't take offense, it not you (hopefully) its the system thathas been implemented in the West.......So to wrap up this long diatribe I would like to offer up some advice fromsomeone who has been studying the medicine for 14 years or so, to those whowant to branch out (and I encourage you to do so) please take 5-8 years andtruly study Chinese medicine, stay true to it, learn what it has to offer,study the classics, maybe even learn some language, and practice. Fall inlove with it all over again, then, and only then consider branching out.Otherwise, I fear that some of these tangents will be fruitless.Respectfully,thomasChinese Herbology and Acupunctureacupuncture and herbal informationWilliams, OR 97544 USAphone: (541) 955-5031 fax: (541) 955-5069"Knowing nothing, you will be aware of everything." Lao Tzu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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