Guest guest Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Hi! My name's Peter, I'm new to the group. I just thought I'd ask: I'm making some dit Da Jow for martial arts practice, and some of the recipes call for some particularly wird things: 1. Sheep's bile 2. Elephant ears 3. Eagle's talons 4 Brimstone Are there more reasonable, less illegal, safer things I could substitute for these items. Also, any clues about what these ingredients contribute might be useful. Thanks! Peter ______________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 10, 2003 Report Share Posted March 10, 2003 Hi Peter... --- harmonywushu wrote: > Hi! My name's Peter, I'm new to the group. I just > thought I'd ask: I'm making some dit Da Jow for > martial arts practice, and some of the recipes call > for some particularly wird things: > > 1. Sheep's bile > 2. Elephant ears > 3. Eagle's talons > 4 Brimstone Jow recipes can be extremely specialised, the way much of TCM is, therefore you really should let us know what the jow is intended for. What are your sources??? See you, Hugo Everything you'll ever need on one web page from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 11, 2003 Report Share Posted March 11, 2003 HI! I got the recipe from someone who does Seven Stars Mantis. He siad they use it for minor external injuries and also to strengthen the libs against damage. He also didn't know what the ingredients contributed. Thanks! Join the Fight against violence! Subscribe to the Martial Artists Against Violence email list by sending a message to martialartistsagainstviolence- ______________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 19, 2003 Report Share Posted March 19, 2003 --- harmonywushu wrote: > HI! I got the recipe from someone who does Seven > Stars Mantis. He siad they use it for minor external > injuries and also to strengthen the libs against > damage. He also didn't know what the ingredients > contributed. Ok. I really doubt that the formula actually contained elephant ears, eagle's talons or anything like that. Those things are totally unnecessary. I think the best thing would be to find an herbalist who can mix a jow for you. Not knowing the indications and using an incomplete formula can be risky. Hope that helps, Hugo > Everything you'll ever need on one web page from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 20, 2003 Report Share Posted March 20, 2003 On Wed, 19 Mar 2003 04:39:43 +0000 (GMT) =?iso-8859-1?q?Hugo=20Ramiro?= <subincor writes: > --- harmonywushu wrote: > HI! I got the > recipe from someone who does Seven > > Stars Mantis. He siad they use it for minor external > > injuries and also to strengthen the libs against > > damage. He also didn't know what the ingredients > > contributed. > > Ok. I really doubt that the formula actually > contained elephant ears, eagle's talons or anything > like that. Those things are totally unnecessary. I > think the best thing would be to find an herbalist who > can mix a jow for you. > Not knowing the indications and using an incomplete > formula can be risky. > > Hope that helps, > Hugo > > > > > > > Everything you'll ever need on one web page > from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts > http://uk.my. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 20, 2003 Report Share Posted March 20, 2003 > > Ok. I really doubt that the formula actually > > contained elephant ears, eagle's talons or anything > > like that. >>> On the contrary, they can. There are formulas in Chinese martial art traditions that use elephant skin and eagle talons. I think that elephant skin is used in several of the formulas from the Secret Shaolin Formulas book Blue Poppy translated. And I've seen formulas containing eagle talons in the past that are used to train the fingers. > > Not knowing the indications and using an incomplete > > formula can be risky. >>> While not necessarily physically dangerous or risky to leave out, the formula might be less effective. Jim Ramholz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 Hi! --- James Ramholz <jramholz wrote: > > > Ok. I really doubt that the formula actually > > > contained elephant ears, eagle's talons or > anything > > > like that. >>> > > On the contrary, they can. My lack of clarity. I don't think anyone here can get a formula which actually includes those ingredients. > Shaolin Formulas book Blue Poppy translated. And > I've seen formulas > containing eagle talons in the past that are used to > train the > fingers. And have they contained eagle's talons? Or is it written tradition? For example, we have patents which include rhinoceros horn as an ingredient, but they don't. Same for tiger bones. These things are part of our written tradition, but are also extremely unlikely to be found in application. > > > Not knowing the indications and using an > incomplete > > > formula can be risky. >>> > While not necessarily physically dangerous or risky > to leave out, > the formula might be less effective. I maintain that it can be risky and even plain dangerous. Doing internal training, external training and then using a formula which doens't do exactly what it is suppsoed to can lead to injury, deformations, running-fire qi etc. Thanks, Hugo =] Everything you'll ever need on one web page from News and Sport to Email and Music Charts http://uk.my. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 21, 2003 Report Share Posted March 21, 2003 Chinese Traditional Medicine , Hugo Ramiro wrote: > My lack of clarity. I don't think anyone here can get > a formula which actually includes those ingredients. You're right. The formulas themselves are found in the Chinese literature; but acquiring the ingredients for endangered animals is an ethical problem. And, because of their expense and difficulty in obtaining them, Chinese practitioners will usually substitute cheaper materials and say it is authentic: horse or cow bone for tiger, water buffalo horn for rhinoceros, etc. In the past, I've heard that they even counterfeit old ginseng roots by putting cheaper roots together. > I maintain that it can be risky and even plain > dangerous. Doing internal training, external training > and then using a formula which doesn't do exactly what > it is suppsoed to can lead to injury, deformations, > running-fire qi etc. You are correct about there sometimes being great risks in martial art and meditation training. These problems are what the herbal formulas are intended to resolve. But after seeing a number of these cases over the last 30 years, I haven't seen this happen because of a substituted or a missing ingredient in a traditional training formula. When these kind of things happen, it is always because the herbal formula is totally wrong for the training method or the training method is inappropriate for the person or not done correctly---human error. Jim Ramholz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 22, 2003 Report Share Posted March 22, 2003 > I maintain that it can be risky and even plain > dangerous. Doing internal training, external training > and then using a formula which doens't do exactly what > it is suppsoed to can lead to injury, deformations, > running-fire qi etc. What is running-fire qi? Thanks, Victoria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 23, 2003 Report Share Posted March 23, 2003 I think that Victoria is correct when she talks of possible poor results from 'special potions'.It could be that there was a legend of some sort about the ingredients helping someone once. Its possible, but maybe the tradition is a way of saving the formula for posterity. Not to mention the possible environmental consequences victoria_dragon <victoria_dragon wrote:> I maintain that it can be risky and even plain > dangerous. Doing internal training, external training > and then using a formula which doens't do exactly what > it is suppsoed to can lead to injury, deformations, > running-fire qi etc. What is running-fire qi? Thanks, Victoria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 23, 2003 Report Share Posted March 23, 2003 > I think that Victoria is correct when she talks of possible poor results from 'special potions'. That wasn't me but Hugo. I'm afraid I know nothing about martial arts. I'm learning along with other readrs. Victoria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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