Homemade and ionic silver versus superior colloidal silver

[Guest guest]

IF you know what you are doing and IF you are willing to pay $175 to

$300 for a quality home silver maker and supplies and IF you plan on

using a lot of colloidal silver, then making it at home does make lots

of sense. Ionic silver is usually best for topical applications and

colloidal silver for internal applications.

 

My recommendation is to buy the superior commercial product from

Utopia Silver and also get a quality home silver maker to use for

topical applications, pets, and other general use. And use the good

stuff from Utopia Silver for the really tough and systemic conditions

like Crohns, Lymes, Fibromyalgia, HIV, Herpes, Cancer, Candida, Strep,

MRSA, etc.

 

When you are dealing with colloidal and ionic silver, it all comes

down to particle size. PPM is most a sales gimmick for anything over

20PPM if you have small particle sizes, because the smaller the

particle, the greater the surface area. Think of how many basketballs

you can fit in a 50 gallon drum and the total surface area they have.

Then think of bowling balls. More balls and more surface area.

Softballs even more surface area. And then think of BB's. A

tremendous number of BB's and a tremedous surface area! Utopia Silver

is the BB and homemade silver at the very best is a bowling ball to

softball. As a result, Utopoia Silver's 25% ionic silver content

still has much more surface area than does a home made ionic silver

with 85% ionic silver and 15% colloidal silver.

 

In laboratory tests, Utopia Silver has been found to have over 500

times as much surface area and over 550 times greater efficiency index

than typical home-made colloidal silver.

 

When it comes to internal applications, ionic silver has much more

difficulty getting past the hydrochloric acid and digestive enzymes

than does colloidal silver. And colloidal silver releases ionic

silver upon contact with a pathogen. THAT is why it is superior to

ionic silver for internal applications - even though there are some

bogus and self-serving advertisements and so-called studies that would

tell you otherwise.

 

oleander soup , Mike Golden <goldenmike86 wrote:

>

> We " re talking degrees here. For the 'bang for the buck " aspect home

made colloidal silver can be the superior product.. A clear product

that turns vary faintly to a pleasant amber color is the best result.

It takes 5 or 6 hours to get the faint color change. The ionic

portion of the solution is actually the most effective part, small

particles having a strong charge. This is how the it adheres to

microorganism, mostly through the charge. I'm glad you have good

results with colloidal silver from Utopia. I was on the email list

they sponsored a few years back and enjoyed it. My point is that, if

you know what you are doing, home made silver is the best way to go

for many people. If you think the commercial product is that much

better then you should use that. I drive a Saturn, not a Mercedes.

You can argue that a Mercedes is much better. I won't agree and will

continue driving my Saturn which I love.

>

> Mike Golden, D.C.

>

>

>

> May <luellamay129

> oleander soup

> Friday, June 13, 2008 8:28:20 AM

> Re: Small changes

>

>

>

>

> Mike, I must state here that the method for making colloidal silver that

> you are describing is of the lowest quality and I in no way recommend

> this for anybody, especially any of our forum members.

>

> The only colloidal silver that Tony and I recommend are: Utopia Silver,

> Mesosilver, and silver made with the Silver Puppy. Even then, the

> silver made with the Silver Puppy is mostly ionic. I am going to share

> with you that just as recently as five years ago, my health was very

> bad. I was in a very worn down and debilitated state. From where I

> stand this minute, I would never compromise my health with any

> substandard supplements. I will share with you that I am in no way

> rich, and at the moment, not even self sufficient. My life, as with

> many others, is a struggle. Yet, one area that I will not scrimp in is

> my health. And, when looking at the big picture, taking care of my

> health naturally is much cheaper and way more effective than relying on

> the cost and methods of conventional medicine.

>

> I would also like to point out that you can tell true colloidal silver

> by its color. True colloidal silver is a rust/amber color. Anything

> clear or yellowish is purely ionic.

>

> Hugs,

>

>

>

> oleander soup, Mike Golden <goldenmike86@ ...>

> wrote:

> >

> > It is not contaminated. The filtration is for safety reasons. I don't

> have to filter it. I choose to. The silver is the highest grade and the

> water is distilled. I've been making this for years with good quality.

> There is no color to the solution. The bubbler disperses the particles

> from between the poles keeping the conductivity from ramping up too

> abruptly. I always encourage people to filter what they make similar to

> the reason you wear a seat belt in your car. Most of the time it might

> not be necessary, but it is a simple thing to do. I'd rather have the

> filter paper do the work than have it done by my kidneys if I make a

> mistake. I also sometimes use a pulsed D.C. microcurrent machine to make

> the silver, turning down the intensity gradually.

> >

> > Mike Golden, D.C.

> >

> >

> >

> > bbanever bbanever@

> > oleander soup

> > Thursday, June 12, 2008 11:12:13 PM

> > Re: Re: Small changes

> >

> >

> > Mike,

> >

> > You shouldn't have to

> > filter your CS solution after making it. It should be crystal clear.

> > If it isn't, your particle size is too large, or your solution

> contains

> > contaminants. You should be making your silver with distilled water

> and

> > ..999 (or better) silver wire, and nothing else. A bubbler is fine but

> I

> > suspect something is causing your solution to be contaminated.

> >

> > Bob

> > -

> > Mike Golden

> > oleander soup

> > Thursday, June 12, 2008 5:59 PM

> > Re: Re: Small changes

> >

> > I've made consistently good solutions with several home made 9 volt x

> 3 units. I bubble air between the electrodes with a small aquarium pump,

> then filter the product through unbleached coffee filters.

> >

> > Mike

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > The colloidal silver you make from 9 volt batteries is really really

> > weak compared to the best commercial silver like Utopia Silver and

> > even weak compared to the best homemade silver like you get from a

> > Silver Puppy, SilverGen of Silver Edge machine - which are themselves

> > several orders less than the Utopia Silver but several times better

> > than the nine volt battery stuff.

> >

> >

> > > >

> > oleander soup, Mister Cee <mister.cee@ ...>

> wrote:

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Tony,-Your statement is first.....

When you are dealing with colloidal and ionic silver, it all comes

down to particle size. PPM is most a sales gimmick for anything over

20PPM if you have small particle sizes, because the smaller the

particle, the greater the surface area. Think of how many basketballs

you can fit in a 50 gallon drum and the total surface area they have.

Then think of bowling balls. More balls and more surface area.

Softballs even more surface area. And then think of BB's. A

tremendous number of BB's and a tremedous surface area! Utopia Silver

is the BB and homemade silver at the very best is a bowling ball to

softball. As a result, Utopoia Silver's 25% ionic silver content

still has much more surface area than does a home made ionic silver

with 85% ionic silver and 15% colloidal silver.......The smallest "particle" possible is the ion of the silver. It is the atom minus an electron. Ions in a hydrosol would have the greatest accumulative surface area.

In laboratory tests, Utopia Silver has been found to have over 500

times as much surface area and over 550 times greater efficiency index

than typical home-made colloidal silver......efficiency at doing what? Also, what is typical home-made silver? Also, I know that Utopia puts out a good product I'm simply saying that a good product that is biologically active can be made at home, also.

When it comes to internal applications, ionic silver has much more

difficulty getting past the hydrochloric acid and digestive enzymes

than does colloidal silver. .........silver ions have no difficulty at all with stomach acid. ( They are carried to the stomach associated with the water in hydration shells, due to the polar nature of water). They are already as small as they can get, there is no breakdown aspect. If you are referring to some sort of catalyst effect that would cause them to complex with other substances, that is largely handled by the transport capacity of mineraloproteins. All the minerals we use in our bodies are handled this way. As far as digestive enzymes go, they are not related to ionic minerals. They break down starches and proteins.And colloidal silver releases ionic

silver upon contact with a pathogen. THAT is why it is superior to

ionic silver for internal applications - even though there are some

bogus and self-serving advertisements and so-called studies that would

tell you otherwise.........Yes, bacterial cells are generally relatively negatively charged. This fluctuates with aggregation and other growth cycle related elements. In vitro atomic silver is very good at killing bacteria on contact, due to the relative opposite polarity of the silver. In vivo, however ions are presented to cell membranes in a more complex way by carrier proteins. Large molecules of any metal in its atomic form meander about and must "find" pathogens by chance. As far as viruses go, only an ionic form of a metal can be transported into a cell where viruses do their dirty work. Human physiology is complex and in- vitro -processes often don't apply. I'm not part of the world of "advertisements" . I'm just a physician and college biology instructor with a 40 year interest in alternative health science. I don't sell or endorse anything.Having said all

that, I like Utopia Silver. I also think Tony does a wonderful job, both on this list and in his journalistic work.Mike

[Guest guest]

What I am referring can be illustrated in this chart:

 

/CSChart3.jpg

 

Yes, the smallest possible particle is the silver ion, but the silver

particles in colloidal and ionic silver do not come in particles that

small. Most come in sizes that are several nanometers at the very

least. The very tiniest to be found in any product are the ones made

by Utopia Silver and Mesosilver by a similar process no one else uses.

Those particles are as small as 0.64 nanometers - about twice the

size of a silver atom.

 

From the literature I have seen, ionic silver degrades rather quickly

as does it's affect on pathogens in the presence of hydrochloric acid

(the main component of stomach acid).

 

Regardless, it all comes down to particle size and surface area.

Homemade silver particles are much larger than Utopia Silver and so

are almost all other commercial products.

 

Thanks for your compliments. As for myself, I am just a self taught

person with a bit of smarts who has had a great interest in both

science and nature all of my life. I am neither a physician nor a

biology instructor, although I did make an A on the college chemistry

final - while still in high school. LOL. Although I am not as learned

in the intricacies of physiology and biology, neither am I as

deficient in the knowledge of what nature, diet, nutrition, lifestyle,

toxins and alternative therapies as 99% of the doctors and others

whose education is limited to mainstream texts. Of course I do not

include you in that group due to your laudable interest in alternative

health.

 

Unlike you, I DO endorse things - many of which I have no relationship

with. Some I do have a relationship with and in a given month, I

might make enough to pay the bills for my websites and memberships.

However, one thing you can count on is that I will not endorse

anything that I do not believe is beneficial and, when given a choice,

I will endorse what I feel is superior regardless of any relationship

that I have.

 

One of the companies I do endorse wholeheartedly is Utopia Silver. It

is owned by a lifelong friend of mine - a friendship that goes back to

playing with toy trucks and plastic soldiers in the dirt in my back

yard in grades school, not to mention fighting the Battle of the Alamo

more times than you can count after the John Wayne movie we watched at

least 5 times. Except we alway won . . . lol.

 

Because of my friendship, the owner created a discount code just for

this group (LR001) good for 15% off any item not already on sale.

Despite all of that, you will not find me recommending any of his

products unless I feel they are worthwhile. In fact, you can scroll

back through these pages and find me recommending AGAINST buying their

cheap home-made silver maker (and I have NO relationship with any of

the silver machine makers).

 

I feel that it is my duty to this group and my website and other forum

visitors to identify the products and therapies that will best serve them.

 

Since we both like Utopia Silver and both like good homemade silver,

perhaps we can move on now to other subjects where my time can be

spent more productively. Like the battle of the Alamo, it has been

played and re-played enough. And like my own childhood version with

my friend Ben Taylor, we always win when it does get replayed in my

own backyard.

 

 

 

oleander soup , Mike Golden <goldenmike86 wrote:

>

> Tony,-

>

> Your statement is first.....

>

> When you are dealing with colloidal and ionic silver, it all comes

> down to particle size. PPM is most a sales gimmick for anything over

> 20PPM if you have small particle sizes, because the smaller the

> particle, the greater the surface area. Think of how many basketballs

> you can fit in a 50 gallon drum and the total surface area they have.

> Then think of bowling balls. More balls and more surface area.

> Softballs even more surface area. And then think of BB's. A

> tremendous number of BB's and a tremedous surface area! Utopia Silver

> is the BB and homemade silver at the very best is a bowling ball to

> softball. As a result, Utopoia Silver's 25% ionic silver content

> still has much more surface area than does a home made ionic silver

> with 85% ionic silver and 15% colloidal silver.

>

> .......The smallest " particle " possible is the ion of the silver.

It is the atom minus an electron. Ions in a hydrosol would have the

greatest accumulative surface area.

>

>

> In laboratory tests, Utopia Silver has been found to have over 500

> times as much surface area and over 550 times greater efficiency index

> than typical home-made colloidal silver.

> ......efficiency at doing what? Also, what is typical home-made

silver? Also, I know that Utopia puts out a good product I'm simply

saying that a good product that is biologically active can be made at

home, also.

>

>

> When it comes to internal applications, ionic silver has much more

> difficulty getting past the hydrochloric acid and digestive enzymes

> than does colloidal silver.

>

>

> ..........silver ions have no difficulty at all with stomach acid.

( They are carried to the stomach associated with the water in

hydration shells, due to the polar nature of water). They are already

as small as they can get, there is no breakdown aspect. If you are

referring to some sort of catalyst effect that would cause them to

complex with other substances, that is largely handled by the

transport capacity of mineraloproteins. All the minerals we use in

our bodies are handled this way. As far as digestive enzymes go, they

are not related to ionic minerals. They break down starches and proteins.

>

> And colloidal silver releases ionic

> silver upon contact with a pathogen. THAT is why it is superior to

> ionic silver for internal applications - even though there are some

> bogus and self-serving advertisements and so-called studies that would

> tell you otherwise.

>

> .........Yes, bacterial cells are generally relatively negatively

charged. This fluctuates with aggregation and other growth cycle

related elements. In vitro atomic silver is very good at killing

bacteria on contact, due to the relative opposite polarity of the

silver. In vivo, however ions are presented to cell membranes in a

more complex way by carrier proteins. Large molecules of any metal in

its atomic form meander about and must " find " pathogens by chance. As

far as viruses go, only an ionic form of a metal can be transported

into a cell where viruses do their dirty work. Human physiology is

complex and in- vitro -processes often don't apply. I'm not part of

the world of " advertisements " . I'm just a physician and college

biology instructor with a 40 year interest in alternative health

science. I don't sell or endorse anything.

>

> Having said all that, I like Utopia Silver. I also think does a wonderful job, both on this list and in his journalistic work.

>

>

>

> Mike

>