Are organic pesticides a myth ??

January 5, 2005

If any of you know of reliable methods of dealing with fire ants, please

respond to this posting. Thank you !

~*~*~*~*~

Hi,

I've been trying to find ways of dealing with my healthy ant population

and as of this afternoon, haven't a clue about this problem ! Furthermore,

The ant population has increased again due to our rainy weather in Texas. I

finally

found a company which allegedly deals in organic pesicides and was told

about Permethrin, which is supposed to be harmless. Sure. Then I looked

it up on the net and........yikes !

Toxicological Effects:

Acute toxicity: Permethrin is moderately to practically non-toxic via the

oral route, with a reported LD50 for technical permethrin in rats of 430 to 4000

mg/kg [12]. Via the dermal route, it is slightly toxic, with a reported dermal

LD50 in rats of over 4000 mg/kg, and in rabbits of greater 2000 mg/kg [12,2].

Permethrin caused mild irritation of both the intact and abraded skin of

rabbits. It also caused conjunctivitis when it was applied to the eyes [9]. The

4-hour inhalation LC50 for rats was greater than 23.5 mg/L, indicating

practically no inhalation toxicity. The toxicity of permethrin is dependent on

the

ratio of the isomers present; the cis-isomer being more toxic [12].

Chronic toxicity: No adverse effects were observed in dogs fed permethrin at

doses of 5 mg/kg/day for 90 days [15]. Rats fed 150 mg/kg/day for 6 months

showed a slight increase in liver weights [9]. Very low levels of permethrin in

the diet of chickens (0.1 ppm for 3 to 6 weeks after hatching) have been

reported to suppress immune system activity [9].

Reproductive effects: The fertility of female rats was affected when they

received very high oral doses of 250 mg/kg/day of permethrin during the 6th to

15th day of pregnancy [25]. It is not likely that reproductive effects will be

seen in humans under normal circumstances.

Teratogenic effects: Permethrin is reported to show no teratogenic activity

[9].

Mutagenic effects: Permethrin is reported to show no mutagenic activity [9].

Carcinogenic effects: The evidence regarding the carcinogenicity of

permethrin is inconclusive.

Organ toxicity: Permethrin is suspected of causing liver enlargement of the

liver and nerve damage [9]. Effects on the immune system have been noted in

animal studies.

Fate in humans and animals: Permethrin is efficiently metabolized by

mammalian livers [40]. Breakdown products, or " metabolites, " of permethrin are

quickly

excreted and do not persist significantly in body tissues [41]. When

permethrin is administered orally to rats, it is rapidly metabolized and almost

completely eliminated from the body in a few days. Only 3 to 6% of the original

dose

was excreted unchanged in the feces of experimental animals [41]. Permethrin

may persist in fatty tissues, with half-lives of 4 to 5 days in brain and body

fat [9]. Permethrin does not block, or inhibit, cholinesterase enzymes [40].

**

source: http://extoxnet.orst.edu/pips/permethr.htm

*******************************************************************

Did you all read the part about it being suspected of causing nerve damage

and enlarging the liver ? And that company had the nerve to tell me that it

doesn't bother dogs. I don't believe anyone. No one.

If any of you would like to raise ants, just e-mail me privately

and I'll ship some out to you. :>)

Shirley in rainy Texas

January 6, 2005

In a message dated 1/5/2005 7:49:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

Shirl4116 writes:

If any of you know of reliable methods of dealing with fire ants, please

respond to this posting. Thank you

Pennyroyal repels ants and fleas.

also spraying with a bottle of water mixed with 15 drops of peppermint

essential oil.. or , better yet.. PLANTING peppermint .. ants won't cross it!

Fleas either!

January 6, 2005

TO; PRIMAL MOMMIE:

Are you talking about treating an entire lawn/yard

using 15 drops of peppermint to a water bottle?

If so, what would be the most effective way of

covering an " entire yard " with peppermint? AND,

would this be a one-time application? Like in the

Spring ... or when would be best time??

As far as planting peppermint plants, do you suggest

using these plants as a border along the front of

a house? What those plants be effective for the

entire front yard then? And doing the same in the

back yard along the back of the house? Or would

more strategic planting need to be done?

Anxiously awaiting a response. I'm mostly concerned

about eliminating fleas in the grass/yard for my dogs.

Just me...... Jan

=================================================

On Thu, 6 Jan 2005 00:55:04 EST primalmommieto5 writes:

In a message dated 1/5/2005 7:49:16 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

Shirl4116 writes:

If any of you know of reliable methods of dealing

with fire ants, please respond to this posting.

Thank you

---------

Pennyroyal repels ants and fleas.

also spraying with a bottle of water mixed with 15 drops of peppermint

essential oil.. or , better yet.. PLANTING peppermint .. ants won't

cross it!

Fleas either!

January 6, 2005

I would say that spraying, while highly effective.. would require serious

muliplication of the AMOUNT suggested. I'd plant some pepperment. It doesn't

have to be an entire bed or border.. but just kind of " here and there " to

create a wide scope of protection/repellent.

In a message dated 1/6/2005 2:45:58 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

creativesources writes: