Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 Todd. I believe we are more in agreement than not. I support student dissent (of the much talked about rumor) to oppose the school's removal of those books. And to demand quality - especially where the human ego wanders. To Your Health, Ed Kasper LAc. http://HappyHerbalist.com Tuesday, February 22, 2000 11:21 PM censorship Ed You are missing the point. this has nothing to do with the academic curricula of any school. It is about removing books from an exisitng library collection. That is censorship, pure and simple. And while I am glad you have chosen to focus yourself on mastery of a specific style of practice, herbal practice does not exhibit the same diversity as acupuncture practice. there is virtually unamimous agreement that classics such as li dong yuan's pi wei lun and zhang zhong jing's shang han lun are vital to anyone's practice of herbology. Since blue poppy has done most such translations, to ban their publications effectively eliminates the possibility of any non chinese speaking student from grasping herbology at more than a superficial level. Also, remember, these books were not allegedly banned because of their content; no one disputes that. They were banned as retaliatory action for unpopular political speech. this is perhaps more akin to McCarthyism than anything else as many artists were blacklisted, not necessarily because of the content of their works, but because of what they were accused of saying in a political context. ------ For the fastest, easiest way to backup files and access them from anywhere. Try @backup Free for 30 days. Click here for a chance to win a digital camera. http://click./1/1783/4/_/_/_/951261642/ ------ Chronic Diseases Heal - Chinese Herbs Can Help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 OK, OK, UNCLE!!!! IF YOU FEEL SO STRONGLY I WOULD SUGGEST YOU CONTACT THE SCHOOL IN QUESTION (I STILL DON'T KNOW WHO THAT IS, ALTHOUGH I AM CURIOUS) AND TALK TO THEM. FOR THE MOST PART YOU ARE PREACHING TO THE CHOIR, SO TO SPEAK, AND I FOR ONE AM OVER IT, I HOPE YOU WILL BE SOON. > has done most such translations, to ban their publications effectively > eliminates the possibility of any non chinese speaking student from > grasping herbology at more than a superficial level. WITH THIS I DISAGREE. I PRACTICED AND LEARNED FROM SOMEONE WHO PRACTICED WITHOUT EVER READING ANY OF THESE BOOKS. I DO AGREE THAT SINCE STUDYING THEM I BELIEVE MY TCM HERBOLOGY HAS GOTTEN BETTER, I DON'T BELIEVE MY TEACHER ONLY PRACTICES AT A SUPERFICIAL LEVEL. NOT TO MENTION THAT NONE OF THAT MATERIAL WILL ASSIST ANY STUDENT IN PASSING THE EXAMS NEEDED TO GET A LICENSE, WHICH IS UNFORTUNATELY WHAT THEY NEED TO FOCUS ON. ONCE THEY GET BY THAT THEY CAN LEARN TCM. Respectfully, Chinese Herbology and Acupuncture Formulator and Consultant Summer Jo's (botanicals) " Serve others and cultivate yourself simultaneously " Lao Tzu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 Dear listers, such a form of censorship infringes upon the principles of academic freedom for students and faculty. Avoidence of substantive literature that is based on sociopolitical issues will hurt students, teachers, and eventually the patients. However, any owner of a private institution has the right to do this. I don't think it is in their best interest for a long term commitment to education. Sincerely, Will Morris wrote: > > > Ed > > You are missing the point. this has nothing to do with the academic > curricula of any school. It is about removing books from an exisitng > library collection. That is censorship, pure and simple. And while I > am glad you have chosen to focus yourself on mastery of a specific style > of practice, herbal practice does not exhibit the same diversity as > acupuncture practice. there is virtually unamimous agreement that > classics such as li dong yuan's pi wei lun and zhang zhong jing's shang > han lun are vital to anyone's practice of herbology. Since blue poppy > has done most such translations, to ban their publications effectively > eliminates the possibility of any non chinese speaking student from > grasping herbology at more than a superficial level. Also, remember, > these books were not allegedly banned because of their content; no one > disputes that. They were banned as retaliatory action for unpopular > political speech. this is perhaps more akin to McCarthyism than > anything else as many artists were blacklisted, not necessarily because > of the content of their works, but because of what they were accused of > saying in a political context. > > > ------ > For the fastest, easiest way to backup files and access them from > anywhere. Try @backup Free for 30 days. Click here for a chance > to win a digital camera. > http://click./1/1783/4/_/_/_/951261642/ > ------ > > Chronic Diseases Heal - Chinese Herbs Can Help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 actually, they risk losing accreditation and/or loss of federal financial aid, but certainly they are free to do this if they don't care about those other things. [This message contained attachments] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 check out blue poppy's bulletin board for related issues. I have no intention of libeling anyone by naming names. sorry. I do agree that this thread should end, but I would like to point out that netiquette considers such an all bolded post to be an expression of hostility. I could care less, but it is inappropriate and should be avoided in the future on this list. several members have already expreseed concern about this to me. BTW, as usual, I disagree with just about everything you say. [This message contained attachments] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 22, 2000 Report Share Posted February 22, 2000 Todd said: > this thread should end, but I would like to point out that netiquette > considers such an all bolded post to be an expression of hostility. I The only hostility I have seen here is coming from you! I was simply trying to make a point that your hostility was getting quite tiresome and clogging up the list.........I apologize for the capitalized (not bolded) post, I was in error. > BTW, as usual, I disagree with just about everything you say. You disagree with just about everything I say? What? If you disagree, please contribute constructively. This is case and point of the hostility that exudes from your recent posts. I'm not a part of this list to bicker, this type of comment is childish. If you disagree, quote me and state what it is you disagree with and why. That is proper netiquette, not the type of statement made above . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2000 Report Share Posted February 23, 2000 When i joined this list i was under the impression that it was going to fill a void of communication between older practitioners and newr ones in the fiels od practicing herbs and and helping patients, not airing dirty laundry i've sat and read for months now my experience has been one of observing several overpuffed juvenile egos airing their adgendas....what a disservice. I wish you all well, and hopefully go on to find a more mature forum for a much needed communication which was once all based on apprenticeship but is not available anylonger....this list could have filled this need but instead it leaves a bad taste in ones mouth Respectfully Alighta Averbukh - <> < > Tuesday, February 22, 2000 10:57 PM Re: censorship > " " <> > > said: > > this thread should end, but I would like to point out that netiquette > > considers such an all bolded post to be an expression of hostility. I > > The only hostility I have seen here is coming from you! I was simply trying > to make a point that your hostility was getting quite tiresome and clogging > up the list.........I apologize for the capitalized (not bolded) post, I was > in error. > > > BTW, as usual, I disagree with just about everything you say. > > You disagree with just about everything I say? What? If you disagree, please > contribute constructively. This is case and point of the hostility that > exudes from your recent posts. I'm not a part of this list to bicker, this > type of comment is childish. If you disagree, quote me and state what it is > you disagree with and why. That is proper netiquette, not the type of > statement made above . > > > ------ > Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! ZERO! Rates as low as > 0.0% Intro APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points, no > hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the credit > you deserve! Apply now! Get your NextCard Visa at: > http://click./1/966/4/_/_/_/951283204/ > ------ > > Chronic Diseases Heal - Chinese Herbs Can Help > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2000 Report Share Posted February 23, 2000 I apologize to anyone who has perceived my words as personally hostile. I have been a civil libertarian free speech advocate since I was eleven years old. I still consider censorship to be an element of fascist thought and I will attack the idea as forcefully as I please. If you stand behind censorship, you will get caught in the crossfire. As to constructive debate, I believe I have posted extensively over the months about the certain issues Thomas raises, such as western herbs, intuition and now the importance of texts in TCM. I think my positions are clear. I always disagree with thomas on these issues and in the last post, the situation remains unchanged. I have already laid out my position on texts ad nauseum and I saw no reason to add anymore details to this position, but just to underscore my dissent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 23, 2000 Report Share Posted February 23, 2000 A bit defensive, but I guess it will have to do. Mark wrote: > > > > I apologize to anyone who has perceived my words as personally hostile. > I have been a civil libertarian free speech advocate since I was eleven > years old. I still consider censorship to be an element of fascist > thought and I will attack the idea as forcefully as I please. If you > stand behind censorship, you will get caught in the crossfire. > > As to constructive debate, I believe I have posted extensively over the > months about the certain issues Thomas raises, such as western herbs, > intuition and now the importance of texts in TCM. I think my positions > are clear. I always disagree with thomas on these issues and in the > last post, the situation remains unchanged. I have already laid out my > position on texts ad nauseum and I saw no reason to add anymore details > to this position, but just to underscore my dissent. > > ------ > Get what you deserve with NextCard Visa! ZERO! Rates as low as > 0.0% Intro APR, online balance transfers, Rewards Points, no > hidden fees, and much more! Get NextCard today and get the credit > you deserve! Apply now! Get your NextCard Visa at: > http://click./1/966/4/_/_/_/951329186/ > ------ > > Chronic Diseases Heal - Chinese Herbs Can Help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 24, 2000 Report Share Posted February 24, 2000 In a message dated 2/23/00 1:07:59 PM, writes: >As to constructive debate, I believe I have posted extensively over the >months about the certain issues Thomas raises, such as western herbs, >intuition and now the importance of texts in TCM. I think my positions >are clear. I always disagree with thomas on these issues and in the >last post, the situation remains unchanged. I think that we have to also see that Todd seems to be approaching this list as a participant and not as a moderator, and that we seem to have a number of people with strong opinions, all of which are welcome from this corner. A little contention can be fun as long as it is done in the spirit of contention and not evolving into personalties, which we should work at steering clear of. It is difficult to make this happen consistently with strong opinioins, which is usually the job of the moderator..... So, recognizing this, I hope that everyone, including Thomas and Todd can jump back on the boat with our slightly thicker skins and get back to the work of discussing both censorship and herbal diagnosis and treatment. I heard a plea from some soul who sent a question on treatment a short while ago. Would he please re-send it as I pressthe delete button way to quickly sometimes and assume someone else will take up the gauntlet on a clinical challenge. David MOlony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 25, 2000 Report Share Posted February 25, 2000 todd, thought I would throw my five cents worth of comments re censorship? Like you I agree free speech is the only way forward however, everyone is entitled to their own point of view we dont have to like it but we should listen. Secondly I for one living in the UK have had my understanding of 'Traditional' Chinese medicine enhanced by the work of Bob Flaws. We owe him a debt of gratitude for undertaking such a huge task as the translation of the classics. Long may he continue to do so. Even over here there are those 'institutions' where his views are not welcome especially on the subject of education. Party on and be humble Ray Knudsen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 28, 2004 Report Share Posted June 28, 2004 Joseph Allen The burning of an author’s books, imprisonment for opinion’s sake, has always been the tribute that an ignorant age pays to the genius of its time. Hollis Alpert The artist, viewing his fellows through his personal vision, has through the ages attempted to portray what he sees and to present his understanding of it. Censorship in his case has perpetrated heavy and sometimes reprehensible blunders. American Library Association The freedom to read is essential to our democracy. It is continuously under attack… These actions apparently arise from a view that our national tradition of free expression is no longer valid; that censorship and suppression are needed to avoid the subversion of politics and the corruption of morals. American Library Association We trust Americans to recognize propaganda and misinformation, and to make their own decisions about what they read and believe. William M. Anderson, Jr. The intellectually stifling results of censorship -- while deplorable in any setting -- would be all the more abominable if allowed to exist within the college environment. Thurman Arnold The spectacle of a judge pouring over the picture of some nude, trying to ascertain the extent to which she arouses prurient interests, and then attempting to write an opinion which explains the difference between that nude and some other nude has elements of low comedy. Margaret Atwood The use of “religion” as an excuse to repress the freedom of expression and to deny human rights is not confined to any country or time. Sir Francis BaconA forbidden writing is thought to be a certain spark of truth, that flies up in the face of them who seek to tread it out. Carl Friedrich Bahrdt The freedom to share one’s insights and judgments verbally or in writing is, just like the freedom to think, a holy and inalienable right of humanity that, as a universal human right, is above all the rights of princes. Robert Baird The freedom allowed in the United States to all sorts of inquiry and discussion necessarily leads to a diversity of opinion, which is seen not only in there being different denominations, but different opinions also in the same denomination. Hosea Ballou The oppression of any people for opinion’s sake has rarely had any other effect than to fix those opinions deeper, and render them more important. Alan Barth Thought that is silenced is always rebellious. Majorities, of course, are often mistaken. This is why the silencing of minorities is necessarily dangerous. Criticism and dissent are the indispensable antidote to major delusions. Pierre-Augustin Beaumarchais As long as I don’t write about the government, religion, politics, and other institutions, I am free to print anything. W. Lance Bennett Perhaps the most obvious political effect of controlled news is the advantage it gives powerful people in getting their issues on the political agenda and defining those issues in ways likely to influence their resolution. Jeremy Bentham As to the evil which results from censorship, it is impossible to measure it, because it is impossible to tell where it ends. Mark Berley Political correctness is really a subjective list put together by the few to rule the many -- a list of things one must think, say, or do. It affronts the right of the individual to establish his or her own beliefs. Mark Berley Purveyors of political correctness will, in the final analysis, not even allow others their judgments... They celebrate “difference,” but they will not allow people truly to be different -- to think differently, and to say what they think. David K. Berninghausen In order to get the truth, conflicting arguments and expression must be allowed. There can be no freedom without choice, no sound choice without knowledge. John Berry If your library is not ‘unsafe’, it probably isn’t doing its job. Harry A. Blackmun By placing discretion in the hands of an official to grant or deny a license, such a statute creates a threat of censorship that by its very existence chills free speech. Napoleon Bonaparte, I want a situation without censorship, because I do not want to be responsible for whatever they may say. Neal Boortz How many Catholic schools do you think teach the students to question the authority of the Pope? Do you believe Christian schools teach students to question or challenge the authority of Jesus Christ? Do military schools teach the cadets to challenge the authority of superior officers? Well, why should we then expect government schools to teach children to question the authority of government? David Booth This kind of rhetoric should be familiar to any who lived through the McCarthy era of the 1950s. It allows for no differences, not agreement to disagree, among adults or children. William E. Borah No more fatuous chimera has ever infested the brain than that you can control opinions by law or direct belief by statute, and no more pernicious sentiment ever tormented the heart than the barbarous desire to do so. The field of inquiry should remain open, and the right of debate must be regarded as a sacred right. Jorge Luis Borges Censorship is the mother of metaphor. Heywood Broun The censor believes that he can hold back the mighty traffic of life with a tin whistle and a raised right hand. For after all, it is life with which he quarrels. Buddha Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world. George W. Bush Let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories concerning the attacks of September the 11th; malicious lies that attempt to shift the blame away from the terrorists, themselves, away from the guilty. Noam Chomsky Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever. Noam Chomsky From a comparative perspective, the United States is unusual if not unique in the lack of restraints on freedom of expression. It is also unusual in the range and effectiveness of methods employed to restrain freedom of thought... Where the voice of the people is heard, elite groups must insure their voice says the right things. Bill Clinton When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of individual freedom to Americans, it was assumed that the Americans who had that freedom would use it responsibly.... [However, now] there's a lot of irresponsibility. And so a lot of people say there's too much freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it. Bill Clinton The purpose of government is to rein in the rights of the people. Bill Clinton We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans... Henry Steele Commager Censorship always defeats its own purpose, for it creates, in the end, the kind of society that is incapable of exercising real discretion... In the long run it will create a generation incapable of appreciating the difference between independence of thought and subservience. Robert Corn-Revere Censorship is contagious, and experience with this culture of regulation teaches us that regulatory enthusiasts herald each new medium of communications as another opportunity to spread the disease. Judith Crist What censorship accomplishes, creating an unreal and hypocritical mythology, fomenting an attraction for forbidden fruit, inhibiting the creative minds among us and fostering an illicit trade. Above all, it curtails the right of the individual, be he creator or consumer, to satisfy his intellect and his interest without harm. In our law-rooted society, we are not the keeper of our brother’s morals – only of his rights. Graceanne A. Decandido If librarianship is the connecting of people to ideas – and I believe that is the truest definition of what we do – it is crucial to remember that we must keep and make available, not just good ideas and noble ideas, but bad ideas, silly ideas, and yes, even dangerous or wicked ideas. Alan Dershowitz Students throughout the totalitarian world risk life and limb for freedom of expression, many American college students are demanding that big brother restrict their freedom of speech on campus. This demand for enhanced censorship is not emanating only from the usual corner – the know-nothing fundamentalist right – it is coming from the radical, and increasingly not-so-radical left as well. Justice William O. Douglas The function of free speech under our system of government is to invite dispute. It may indeed best serve its high purpose when it invites a condition of unrest, creates dissatisfaction with conditions as they are, or even stirs people to anger. Speech is often provocative and challenging. It may strike at prejudices and preconceptions and have profound unsettling effects as it passes for acceptance of an idea. Justice William O. Douglas It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies. William O. Douglas The First and Fourteenth Amendments say that Congress and the States shall make “no law” which abridges freedom of speech or of the press. In order to sanction a system of censorship I would have to say that “no law” does not mean what it says, that “no law” is qualified to mean “some” laws. I cannot take this step. Robert P. Doyle When books are challenged, restricted, removed, or banned, an atmosphere of suppression exists…. The fear of the consequences of censorship is as damaging as, or perhaps more damaging than, the actual censorship attempt. After all, when a published work is banned, it can usually be found elsewhere. Unexpressed ideas, unpublished works, unpurchased books are lost forever. Ronald Dworkin ‘Balanced’ is a code for ‘denied’: a right to free speech that must be ‘balanced’ against so exhaustive a list of other supposed values means a right that can be exercised only when those in power judge that the speech in question is innocuous to them. Dwight D. Eisenhower It is an ancient truth that freedom cannot be legislated into existence, so it is no less obvious that freedom cannot be censored into existence. And any who act as if freedom’s defenses are found in suppression and suspicion and fear confess a doctrine that is alien to America. Thomas I. Emerson The function of the censor is to censor. He has a professional interest in finding things to suppress. Thomas I. Emerson The Right of all members of society to form their own beliefs and communicate them freely to others must be regarded as an essential principle of a democratically organized society. Thomas I. Emerson Every man – in the development of his own personality – has the right to form his own beliefs and opinions. Hence, suppression of belief, opinion and expression is an affront to the dignity of man, a negation of man’s essential nature. Desiderius Erasmus In the country of the blind the one-eyed man is king. Harold Evans Propaganda is persuading people to make up their minds while withholding some of the facts from them. Federico Fellini Censorship is advertising paid by the government. Feminists Against Censorship Censorship is a dangerous tool that is primarily used to suppress from those who would challenge oppression by the society and that state, and particularly victimizes minorities. [it] can never eliminate evil ideas, and so the best answer to bad speech is more speech. Owen Fiss The idea of neutrality in the speech context not only requires that the state refrain from choosing among viewpoints, but also that it not structure public debate in such a way as to favor one viewpoint over another. The state must act as a high-minded parliamentarian, making certain that all viewpoints are fully and fairly heard. Bruce E. Fleury Censorship in any form, represents a lack of trust in the judgment of the individual. The passage of time provides the best perspective for sorting the wheat from the chaff. Larry Flynt If the human body's obscene, complain to the manufacturer, not me. E. M. Forster We are willing enough to praise freedom when she is safely tucked away in the past and cannot be a nuisance. In the present, amidst dangers whose outcome we cannot foresee, we get nervous about her, and admit censorship. Jay Fox Every attempt to gag the free expression of thought is an unsocial act against society. That is why judges and juries who try to enforce such laws make themselves ridiculous. Jerome D. Frank To vest a few fallible men – prosecutors, judges, jurors – with vast powers of literary or artistic censorship, to convert them into what J. S. Mill has called the “Moral Police,” it is to make them despotic arbiters of literary products. Ruth Gavison Describing an action or an event as the “consequence” of speech presupposes that there is some causal connection between them. A central issue in any debate about the limits of free speech is the nature and the imminence of the causal connection between speech and its alleged consequences…. In actual social situations it is impossible to isolate factors and determine their contribution to effects. Such control is extremely complicated even in a scientific laboratory. Jo Godwin A truly great library contains something in it to offend everyone. Mike Godwin The First Amendment was designed to protect offensive speech, because nobody ever tries to ban the other kind. Richard Goldstein To subject an artist’s work to a litmus test of political probity – and to punish institutions that will not carry out the mandate of the state – is to traffic in the thought control that gave us Stalinism and Nazism… Paul Goodman When there is official censorship it is a sign that speech is serious. Where there is none, it is pretty certain that the official spokesmen have all the loud-speakers. Joseph Paul Göebbels Not every item of news should be published. Rather must those who control news policies endeavor to make every item of news serve a certain purpose. Joseph Paul Göebbels During a war, news should be given out for instruction rather than information. A. Whitney Griswold Books won’t stay banned. They won’t burn. Ideas won’t go to jail. In the long run of history, the censor and the inquisitor have always lost. The only sure weapon against bad ideas is better ideas. The source of better ideas is wisdom. Ann Lyon Haight In the history of censorship, the oldest and most frequently recurring controls have been those designed to prevent unorthodox and unpopular expressions of political or religions opinions. William Randolph Hearst We hold that no person or set of persons can properly establish a standard of expression for others. Simon Heffer This is, in theory, still a free country, but our politically correct, censorious times are such that many of us tremble to give vent to perfectly acceptable views for fear of condemnation. Freedom of speech is thereby imperiled, big questions go undebated, and great lies become accepted, unequivocally as great truths. Robert A. Heinlein Limiting the freedom of news ‘just a little bit’ is in the same category within the classic example ‘a little bit pregnant’. Claude-Adrien Helvetius To limit the press is to insult a nation; to prohibit reading of certain books is to declare the inhabitants to be either fools or knaves. Granville HicksThe sooner we all learn to make a decision between disapproval and censorship, the better off society will be... Censorship cannot get at the real evil, and it is an evil in itself. Granville Hicks A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. Adolf HitlerThe size of the lie is a definite factor in causing it to be believed, for the vast masses of a nation are in the depths of their hearts more easily deceived than they are consciously and intentionally bad. The primitive simplicity of their minds renders them a more easy prey to a big lie than a small one, for they themselves often tell little lies, but would be ashamed to tell big lies. Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr I think that we should be eternally vigilant against attempts to check the expression of opinions that we loathe and believe to be fraught with death, unless they are so imminently threaten immediate interference with the lawful and pressing purposes of the law that an immediate check is required to save the country... Only the emergency that makes it immediately dangerous to leave the correction of evil counsels to time warrants making any exception to the sweeping command, “Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech.” Sidney Hook To silence criticism is to silence freedom. Hubert H. Humphrey None of us would trade freedom of expression for the narrowness of the public censor. America is a free market for people who have something to say, and need not fear to say it. Joseph Henry Jackson Did you ever hear anyone say, “That work had better be banned because I might read it and it might be very damaging to me.” Jeff Jacoby The First Amendment says nothing about a right not to be offended. The risk of finding someone else's speech offensive is the price each of us pays for our own free speech. Free people don't run to court -- or to the principal -- when they encounter a message they don't like. They answer it with one of their own. Ernest Jones [Censors are] people with secret attractions to various temptations... They are defending themselves under the pretext of defending others, because at heart they fear their own weaknesses. Howard Mumford Jones Persecution is the first law of society because it is always easier to suppress criticism than to meet it. John F. Kennedy There is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger than an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. Krzysztof Kieslowski Why did they devise censorship? To show a world which doesn’t exist, an ideal world, or what they envisaged as the ideal world. And we wanted to depict the world as it was. Milton Konvitz The invaluable and the valueless, the noble and the tawdry, the beautiful and the ugly, the true and the false, the good and the evil, are equally protected by the First and the Fourteenth Amendments’ guarantees of a free press and religious freedom. Charles Kors, It seems now that the place where you see the most obvious censorship is on college campuses --- the precise place where you would expect to see the least. ALAN Arthur Lelyveld Censorship…is always and everywhere an evil. Censorship means the screening of material by an authority invested with power to ban that which it disapproves….And who is that paragon to whom we would be willing to entrust such authority? Vladimir Ilyich Lenin The bourgeoisie is many times stronger than we. To give it the weapon of freedom of the press is to ease the enemy’s cause, to help the class enemy. We do not desire to end in suicide, so we will not do this. Max Lerner The Seven Deadly Sins of the Press: - Concentrated Power of the Big Press. - Passing of competition and the coming of monopoly. - Governmental control of the press. - Timidity, especially in the face of group and corporate pressures. - Big Business mentality. - Clannishness among the newspaper publishers that has prevented them from criticizing each other. - Social blindness. Max Lerner In societies like the American and West European where the dynamics of energy come from freedom and where the climate and the whole ethos are those of freedom, censorship is bound to be at worst , stupid; at best, futile; and always, to some degree, inconsonant with the character of the society as a whole. Doris Lessing With a library you are free, not confined by temporary political climates. It is the most democratic of institutions because no one – but no one at all – can tell you what to read and when and how. Dorris Lessing Political correctness is the natural continuum from the party line. What we are seeing once again is a self-appointed group of vigilantes imposing their views on others. Joseph Lewis The burning of an author’s books, imprisonment for opinion’s sake, has always been the tribute that an ignorant age pays to the genius of its time. Sinclair Lewis Every compulsion is put upon writers to become safe, polite, obedient, and sterile. In protest, I declined election to the National Institute of Arts and Letters some years ago, and now I must decline the Pulitzer Prize. A. J. Liebling People everywhere confuse, What they read in newspapers with news. Walter Lippmann Without some form of censorship, propaganda in the strict sense of the word is impossible. In order to conduct propaganda there must be some barrier between the public and the event. Archibald Macleish Once you permit those who are convinced of their own superior rightness to censor and silence and suppress those who hold contrary opinions, just at that moment the citadel has been surrendered. James Madison The people shall not be deprived or abridged of their right to speak, or to publish their sentiments; and the freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable. Kenan Malik It is the freedom to blaspheme, to transgress, to move beyond the pale, that is at the heart of all intellectual, artistic and political endeavor. Far from censoring offensive speech, a vibrant and diverse society should encourage it. In any society that is not uniform, grey and homogeneous, there are bound to be clashes of viewpoints. David Mamet We live in oppressive times. We have, as a nation, become our own thought police; but instead of calling the process by which we limit our expression of dissent and wonder ‘censorship,’ we call it ‘concern for commercial viability.’ Eugene Mccarthy There is danger in the concentration of control in the television and radio networks, especially in the large television and radio stations; danger in the concentration of ownership in the press…and danger in the increasing concentration of selection by book publishers and reviewers and by the producers of radio and television programs. Gail W. Mcgee I’m going to introduce a resolution to have the postmaster general stop reading dirty books and deliver the mail. William McGowan In May 1998, [Los Angeles Times publisher Mark] Willis told the Wall Street Journal that he wanted to make the Times more appealing to women and minorities by producing stories that were “more emotional, more personal and less analytic.” Carey Mcwilliams Censors are infused with the sentiment of moral indignation – a dangerous and misleading sentiment because, by blinding those who voice it to the real reasons for their indignation, it makes them puppets whose fears can be manipulated for ends and purposes they do not foresee or intend. Carey Mcwilliams I am opposed to censorship in all forms, without any exceptions. As a matter of social philosophy, I do not like the idea of some people trying to protect the minds and morals of other people. In practice, this means that a majority seeks to impose its standards on a minority; hence, an element of coercion is inherent in the idea of censorship. Carey Mcwilliams, Whatever the individual motives of the censors may be, censorship is a form of social control. It is a means of holding a society together, of arresting the flux which censors fear. And since the fear cannot be appeased, the demands for censorship mount in volume and intensity. And one form of censorship can easily lead to other forms. H. L. Mencken The whole drift of our law is toward the absolute prohibition of all ideas that diverge in the slightest form from the accepted platitudes, and behind that drift of law there is a far more potent force of growing custom, and under that custom there is a natural philosophy which erects conformity into the noblest of virtues and the free functioning of personality into a capital crime against society. Charles W. Moore If the political-correctness fascists get their way, we can safely assume it will be correct-thinking, “political cleansing” squads deciding what we can or cannot say on the Intenet. These people fear public debate and demand homogenization of “acceptable” attitudes compatible with their emotional, utopian idealism. John Morley When it is a duty to worship the sun it is pretty sure to be a crime to examine the laws of heat. Edward R. Morrow If none of us ever read a book that was “dangerous,” had a friend who was “different,” or joined an organization that advocated “change,” we would all be the kind of people Joe McCarthy wants. Bill Moyers If you think there is freedom of the press in the United States, I tell you there is no freedom of the press... They come out with the cheap shot. The press should be ashamed of itself. They should come to both sides of the issue and hear both sides and let the American people make up their minds. George Jean Nathan The artist and the censor differ in this wise: that the first is a decent mind in an indecent body and that the second is an indecent mind in a decent body. Reverend Martin Niemoeller In Germany, the Nazis first came for the communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I didn't speak up because I was a protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak for me. Eugene O’Neill Censorship of anything, at any time, in any place, on whatever pretense, has always been and will always be the last resort of the boob and the bigot. George Orwell At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is “not done”… Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with surprising effectiveness. A genuinely unfashionable opinion is almost never given a fair hearing, either in the popular press or in the highbrow periodicals. John Osborne Censorship is the commonest social blasphemy because it is mostly concealed, built into us by indolence, self-interest and cowardice. Katherine Patterson All of us can think of a book... that we hope none of our children or any other children have taken off the shelf. But if I have the right to remove that book from the shelf -- that book I abhor -- then you also have exactly the same right and so does everyone else. And then we have no books left on the shelf for any of us. Laurence J. Peter A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. Pope Leo XIII The liberty of thinking and publishing whatsoever each one likes, without any hindrances, is not in itself an advantage over which society can wisely rejoice. On the contrary, it is the fountainhead and origin of many evils. Pope Pius X Henceforth it will be the task of this Sacred Congregation not only to examine carefully the books denounced to it, to prohibit them if necessary, and to grant permission for reading forbidden books, but also to supervise, ex officio, books that are being published, and to pass sentence on such as deserve to be prohibited. Neil Postman Make no mistake about it: the labeling of someone’s language as ‘sexist’ involves a political judgment and implies the desirability of a particular sociological doctrine. One may be in favor of that doctrine//%Who%(as I believe I am)//%Source%but it is quite another matter to force writers by edicts and censorship into accepting it. Terence H. Qualter The weapon of the dictator is not so much propaganda as censorship. Charles RembarAside from the collective gain that comes from that free interchange of ideas, there is a direct personal value for the individual concerned. Each of us should have the right to speak his thoughts and to hear the thoughts of others… Eleanor Roosevelt We do not move forward by curtailing people’s liberty because we are afraid of what they may do or say. Franklin D. Roosevelt If the fires of freedom and civil liberties burn low in other lands, they must be made brighter in our own. If in other lands the press and books and literature of all kinds are censored, we must redouble our efforts here to keep them free. If in other lands the eternal truths of the past are threatened by intolerance, we must provide a safe place for their perception. Salman Rushdie The worst, most insidious effect of censorship is that, in the end, it can deaden the imagination of the people. Where there is no debate, it is hard to go on remembering, every day, that there is a suppressed side to every argument. Bertrand Russell Heretical views arise when the truth is uncertain, and it is only when the truth is uncertain that censorship is invoked. Bertrand Russell It is clear that thought is not free if the profession of certain opinions make it impossible to earn a living. Willy Russell I pray that no child of mine would ever descend into such a place as a library. They are indeed most dangerous places and unfortunate is she or he who is lured into such a hellhole of enjoyment, stimulus, facts, passion and fun. Richard Salant If newsmen do not tell the truth as they see it because it might make waves, or if their bosses decide something should or should not be broadcast because of Washington or Main Street consequences, we have dishonored ourselves and we have lost the First Amendment by default. George Bernard Shaw Assassination is the extreme form of censorship. George Bernard Shaw Censorship ends in logical completeness when nobody is allowed to read any books except the books that nobody reads. George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950)All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions, and executed by supplanting existing institutions. Consequently, the first condition of progress is the removal of censorships. John Silber The reduction of political discourse to sound bites is one of the worst things that’s happened in American political life. Hedrick Smith This is precisely the purpose of censorship – not only to block unwanted views, but to keep people who are unhappy from knowing how many millions of others share their unhappiness; to keep the dormant opposition from awakening to its own developing strength. Tommy Smothers The only valid censorship of ideas is the right of people not to listen. Gerry Spence The Internet…has become the voice of the people in the first genuine experiment in democracy yet conducted in America. It stands ready to serve every facet, every faction. Herbert Spencer The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. Lysander Spooner Vices are not crimes. John Paul Stevens As a matter of constitutional tradition, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, we presume that governmental regulation of the content of speech is more likely to interfere with the free exchange of ideas than to encourage it. The interest in encouraging free-dom of expression in a democratic society outweighs any theoretical but unproven benefit of censorship. Justice Potter Stewart Censorship reflects a society’s lack of confidence in itself. It is the landmark of an authoritarian regime... Donald Thompson Political censorship is necessarily based on fear of what will happen if those whose work is censored get their way, or if they are effecting in persuading a large number of readers to share their point of view. The nature of political censorship at any given time depends on the censor’s answer to the simple question, “What are you afraid of?” Henry David Thoreau Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes. Mark Twain Censorship is telling a man he can't have a steak just because a baby can't chew it. Voltaire It is the characteristic of the most stringent censorships, that they give credibility to the opinions they attack. Kurt Vonnegut, Jr. All these people talk so eloquently about getting back to good old-fashioned values…and I say let’s get back to the good old-fashioned First Amendment of the good old-fashioned Constitution of the United States – and to hell with the censors! Give me knowledge or give me death! Earl Warren The censor’s sword pierces deeply into the heart of free expression. Mae WestI believe in censorship. After all, I made a fortune out of it. Rebecca West But once a culture develops sufficiently to become skeptical, the idea of censorship becomes less attractive. To suppress a book or a picture or a sculpture or a play or a film is a terrible act of aggression against the artist who created it. This is a miming of capital punishment; it destroys the life that has been emanated by a life. Rebecca West God forbid that any book should be banned. The practice is as indefensible as infanticide. George Will Freedom is not only the absence of external restraints. It is also the absence of irresistible internal compulsions, unmanageable passion, and uncensorable highlights. Bertram Wolfe Since direct political discussion was prohibited, all literature tended to become a criticism of Russian life, and literary criticism but another form of social criticism… If the censor forbade explicit statement, he was skillfully eluded by indirection – by innocent seeming tales of other lands or times, by complicated parables, animal fables, double meanings, overtones, by investing apparently trivial events with the pent-up energies possessing the writer, so that the reader became compelled to dwell upon them until their hidden meanings became manifest. Francis Wright Persecution for opinion is the master vice of society. Pope Leo Xiii Books of apostates, heretics, schismatics, and all other writers defending heresy or schism or in any attacking the foundations of religion, are altogether prohibited. John Peter Zenger No nation, ancient or modern, ever lost the liberty of speaking freely, writing, or publishing their sentiments, but forthwith lost their liberty in general and became slaves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 28, 2004 Report Share Posted June 28, 2004 I just took this list off a random website that I found. I think that some of the quotes here have been shortened or taken completely out of context though, so they may appear to say something different than the author intended. So whoever made this list possibly tried to censor it in a way by making it more politically correct to his/her way of thinking. Frank , Frank <califpacific> wrote: List of Quotes. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 29, 2004 Report Share Posted June 29, 2004 Hi... I am really confused - is this an alternative medicine group?? I have read over lots of the posts and nothing has anything to do with that! I just want to make sure I am not in the wrong group!! I am looking for help with alternative medicine for my epstein barr symptoms, fatigue, etc. Not a big deal, just thought I would ask!! Thanks!! Carrie... http://www.carrieskiddiecloset.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 29, 2004 Report Share Posted June 29, 2004 Thanks Frank!! I didn't mean to be a jerk or anything - I just wanted some support and info. and was getting tons of emails about that stuff!! Anyway, didn't mean to complain!! Anyway, thanks again!! Carrie... http://www.carrieskiddiecloset.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 29, 2004 Report Share Posted June 29, 2004 Re:Libraries Many years later I read an account of the small B. religious Junior College that I had attended. The teacher that wrote the book, revealed that the President of the college used to peruse the shelves and remove any books he felt unfit for tender young B. eyes. I used to work in that library! I had a revelation ,when later on I went into the stacks of our State supported University I then was able to attend. Local town Libraries were rather vanilla flavored in book collecting when I was young , I was later to learn. My best revenge has been to be able to OWN my books and stay out of the libraries. NG - " Frank " <califpacific <alternative_medicine_forum > Monday, June 28, 2004 3:11 PM Censorship Joseph Allen The burning of an author's books, imprisonment for opinion's sake, has always been the tribute that an ignorant age pays to the genius of its time. Hollis Alpert The artist, viewing his fellows through his personal vision, has through the ages attempted to portray what he sees and to present his understanding of it. Censorship in his case has perpetrated heavy and sometimes reprehensible blunders. American Library Association The freedom to read is essential to our democracy. It is continuously under attack. These actions apparently arise from a view that our national tradition of free expression is no longer valid; that censorship and suppression are needed to avoid the subversion of politics and the corruption of morals. American Library Association We trust Americans to recognize propaganda and misinformation, and to make their own decisions about what they read and believe. William M. Anderson, Jr. The intellectually stifling results of censorship -- while deplorable in any setting -- would be all the more abominable if allowed to exist within the college environment. Thurman Arnold The spectacle of a judge pouring over the picture of some nude, trying to ascertain the extent to which she arouses prurient interests, and then attempting to write an opinion which explains the difference between that nude and some other nude has elements of low comedy. Margaret Atwood The use of " religion " as an excuse to repress the freedom of expression and to deny human rights is not confined to any country or time. Sir Francis BaconA forbidden writing is thought to be a certain spark of truth, that flies up in the face of them who seek to tread it out. Carl Friedrich Bahrdt The freedom to share one's insights and judgments verbally or in writing is, just like the freedom to think, a holy and inalienable right of humanity that, as a universal human right, is above all the rights of princes. Robert Baird The freedom allowed in the United States to all sorts of inquiry and discussion necessarily leads to a diversity of opinion, which is seen not only in there being different denominations, but different opinions also in the same denomination. Hosea Ballou The oppression of any people for opinion's sake has rarely had any other effect than to fix those opinions deeper, and render them more important. Alan Barth Thought that is silenced is always rebellious. Majorities, of course, are often mistaken. This is why the silencing of minorities is necessarily dangerous. Criticism and dissent are the indispensable antidote to major delusions. Pierre-Augustin Beaumarchais As long as I don't write about the government, religion, politics, and other institutions, I am free to print anything. W. Lance Bennett Perhaps the most obvious political effect of controlled news is the advantage it gives powerful people in getting their issues on the political agenda and defining those issues in ways likely to influence their resolution. Jeremy Bentham As to the evil which results from censorship, it is impossible to measure it, because it is impossible to tell where it ends. Mark Berley Political correctness is really a subjective list put together by the few to rule the many -- a list of things one must think, say, or do. It affronts the right of the individual to establish his or her own beliefs. Mark Berley Purveyors of political correctness will, in the final analysis, not even allow others their judgments... They celebrate " difference, " but they will not allow people truly to be different -- to think differently, and to say what they think. David K. Berninghausen In order to get the truth, conflicting arguments and expression must be allowed. There can be no freedom without choice, no sound choice without knowledge. John Berry If your library is not 'unsafe', it probably isn't doing its job. Harry A. Blackmun By placing discretion in the hands of an official to grant or deny a license, such a statute creates a threat of censorship that by its very existence chills free speech. Napoleon Bonaparte, I want a situation without censorship, because I do not want to be responsible for whatever they may say. Neal Boortz How many Catholic schools do you think teach the students to question the authority of the Pope? Do you believe Christian schools teach students to question or challenge the authority of Jesus Christ? Do military schools teach the cadets to challenge the authority of superior officers? Well, why should we then expect government schools to teach children to question the authority of government? David Booth This kind of rhetoric should be familiar to any who lived through the McCarthy era of the 1950s. It allows for no differences, not agreement to disagree, among adults or children. William E. Borah No more fatuous chimera has ever infested the brain than that you can control opinions by law or direct belief by statute, and no more pernicious sentiment ever tormented the heart than the barbarous desire to do so. The field of inquiry should remain open, and the right of debate must be regarded as a sacred right. Jorge Luis Borges Censorship is the mother of metaphor. Heywood Broun The censor believes that he can hold back the mighty traffic of life with a tin whistle and a raised right hand. For after all, it is life with which he quarrels. Buddha Words have the power to both destroy and heal. When words are both true and kind, they can change our world. George W. Bush Let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories concerning the attacks of September the 11th; malicious lies that attempt to shift the blame away from the terrorists, themselves, away from the guilty. Noam Chomsky Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever. Noam Chomsky >From a comparative perspective, the United States is unusual if not unique in the lack of restraints on freedom of expression. It is also unusual in the range and effectiveness of methods employed to restrain freedom of thought... Where the voice of the people is heard, elite groups must insure their voice says the right things. Bill Clinton When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of individual freedom to Americans, it was assumed that the Americans who had that freedom would use it responsibly.... [However, now] there's a lot of irresponsibility. And so a lot of people say there's too much freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it. Bill Clinton The purpose of government is to rein in the rights of the people. Bill Clinton We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans... Henry Steele Commager Censorship always defeats its own purpose, for it creates, in the end, the kind of society that is incapable of exercising real discretion... In the long run it will create a generation incapable of appreciating the difference between independence of thought and subservience. Robert Corn-Revere Censorship is contagious, and experience with this culture of regulation teaches us that regulatory enthusiasts herald each new medium of communications as another opportunity to spread the disease. Judith Crist What censorship accomplishes, creating an unreal and hypocritical mythology, fomenting an attraction for forbidden fruit, inhibiting the creative minds among us and fostering an illicit trade. Above all, it curtails the right of the individual, be he creator or consumer, to satisfy his intellect and his interest without harm. In our law-rooted society, we are not the keeper of our brother's morals - only of his rights. Graceanne A. Decandido If librarianship is the connecting of people to ideas - and I believe that is the truest definition of what we do - it is crucial to remember that we must keep and make available, not just good ideas and noble ideas, but bad ideas, silly ideas, and yes, even dangerous or wicked ideas. Alan Dershowitz Students throughout the totalitarian world risk life and limb for freedom of expression, many American college students are demanding that big brother restrict their freedom of speech on campus. This demand for enhanced censorship is not emanating only from the usual corner - the know-nothing fundamentalist right - it is coming from the radical, and increasingly not-so-radical left as well. Justice William O. Douglas The function of free speech under our system of government is to invite dispute. It may indeed best serve its high purpose when it invites a condition of unrest, creates dissatisfaction with conditions as they are, or even stirs people to anger. Speech is often provocative and challenging. It may strike at prejudices and preconceptions and have profound unsettling effects as it passes for acceptance of an idea. Justice William O. Douglas It is our attitude toward free thought and free expression that will determine our fate. There must be no limit on the range of temperate discussion, no limits on thought. No subject must be taboo. No censor must preside at our assemblies. William O. Douglas The First and Fourteenth Amendments say that Congress and the States shall make " no law " which abridges freedom of speech or of the press. In order to sanction a system of censorship I would have to say that " no law " does not mean what it says, that " no law " is qualified to mean " some " laws. I cannot take this step. Robert P. Doyle When books are challenged, restricted, removed, or banned, an atmosphere of suppression exists.. The fear of the consequences of censorship is as damaging as, or perhaps more damaging than, the actual censorship attempt. After all, when a published work is banned, it can usually be found elsewhere. Unexpressed ideas, unpublished works, unpurchased books are lost forever. Ronald Dworkin 'Balanced' is a code for 'denied': a right to free speech that must be 'balanced' against so exhaustive a list of other supposed values means a right that can be exercised only when those in power judge that the speech in question is innocuous to them. Dwight D. Eisenhower It is an ancient truth that freedom cannot be legislated into existence, so it is no less obvious that freedom cannot be censored into existence. And any who act as if freedom's defenses are found in suppression and suspicion and fear confess a doctrine that is alien to America. Thomas I. Emerson The function of the censor is to censor. He has a professional interest in finding things to suppress. Thomas I. Emerson The Right of all members of society to form their own beliefs and communicate them freely to others must be regarded as an essential principle of a democratically organized society. Thomas I. Emerson Every man - in the development of his own personality - has the right to form his own beliefs and opinions. Hence, suppression of belief, opinion and expression is an affront to the dignity of man, a negation of man's essential nature. Desiderius Erasmus In the country of the blind the one-eyed man is king. Harold Evans Propaganda is persuading people to make up their minds while withholding some of the facts from them. Federico Fellini Censorship is advertising paid by the government. Feminists Against Censorship Censorship is a dangerous tool that is primarily used to suppress from those who would challenge oppression by the society and that state, and particularly victimizes minorities. [it] can never eliminate evil ideas, and so the best answer to bad speech is more speech. Owen Fiss The idea of neutrality in the speech context not only requires that the state refrain from choosing among viewpoints, but also that it not structure public debate in such a way as to favor one viewpoint over another. The state must act as a high-minded parliamentarian, making certain that all viewpoints are fully and fairly heard. Bruce E. Fleury Censorship in any form, represents a lack of trust in the judgment of the individual. The passage of time provides the best perspective for sorting the wheat from the chaff. Larry Flynt If the human body's obscene, complain to the manufacturer, not me. E. M. Forster We are willing enough to praise freedom when she is safely tucked away in the past and cannot be a nuisance. In the present, amidst dangers whose outcome we cannot foresee, we get nervous about her, and admit censorship. Jay Fox Every attempt to gag the free expression of thought is an unsocial act against society. That is why judges and juries who try to enforce such laws make themselves ridiculous. Jerome D. Frank To vest a few fallible men - prosecutors, judges, jurors - with vast powers of literary or artistic censorship, to convert them into what J. S. Mill has called the " Moral Police, " it is to make them despotic arbiters of literary products. Ruth Gavison Describing an action or an event as the " consequence " of speech presupposes that there is some causal connection between them. A central issue in any debate about the limits of free speech is the nature and the imminence of the causal connection between speech and its alleged consequences.. In actual social situations it is impossible to isolate factors and determine their contribution to effects. Such control is extremely complicated even in a scientific laboratory. Jo Godwin A truly great library contains something in it to offend everyone. Mike Godwin The First Amendment was designed to protect offensive speech, because nobody ever tries to ban the other kind. Richard Goldstein To subject an artist's work to a litmus test of political probity - and to punish institutions that will not carry out the mandate of the state - is to traffic in the thought control that gave us Stalinism and Nazism. Paul Goodman When there is official censorship it is a sign that speech is serious. Where there is none, it is pretty certain that the official spokesmen have all the loud-speakers. Joseph Paul Göebbels Not every item of news should be published. Rather must those who control news policies endeavor to make every item of news serve a certain purpose. Joseph Paul Göebbels During a war, news should be given out for instruction rather than information. A. Whitney Griswold Books won't stay banned. They won't burn. Ideas won't go to jail. In the long run of history, the censor and the inquisitor have always lost. The only sure weapon against bad ideas is better ideas. The source of better ideas is wisdom. Ann Lyon Haight In the history of censorship, the oldest and most frequently recurring controls have been those designed to prevent unorthodox and unpopular expressions of political or religions opinions. William Randolph Hearst We hold that no person or set of persons can properly establish a standard of expression for others. Simon Heffer This is, in theory, still a free country, but our politically correct, censorious times are such that many of us tremble to give vent to perfectly acceptable views for fear of condemnation. Freedom of speech is thereby imperiled, big questions go undebated, and great lies become accepted, unequivocally as great truths. Robert A. Heinlein Limiting the freedom of news 'just a little bit' is in the same category within the classic example 'a little bit pregnant'. Claude-Adrien Helvetius To limit the press is to insult a nation; to prohibit reading of certain books is to declare the inhabitants to be either fools or knaves. Granville HicksThe sooner we all learn to make a decision between disapproval and censorship, the better off society will be... Censorship cannot get at the real evil, and it is an evil in itself. Granville Hicks A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. Adolf HitlerThe size of the lie is a definite factor in causing it to be believed, for the vast masses of a nation are in the depths of their hearts more easily deceived than they are consciously and intentionally bad. The primitive simplicity of their minds renders them a more easy prey to a big lie than a small one, for they themselves often tell little lies, but would be ashamed to tell big lies. Justice Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr I think that we should be eternally vigilant against attempts to check the expression of opinions that we loathe and believe to be fraught with death, unless they are so imminently threaten immediate interference with the lawful and pressing purposes of the law that an immediate check is required to save the country... Only the emergency that makes it immediately dangerous to leave the correction of evil counsels to time warrants making any exception to the sweeping command, " Congress shall make no law...abridging the freedom of speech. " Sidney Hook To silence criticism is to silence freedom. Hubert H. Humphrey None of us would trade freedom of expression for the narrowness of the public censor. America is a free market for people who have something to say, and need not fear to say it. Joseph Henry Jackson Did you ever hear anyone say, " That work had better be banned because I might read it and it might be very damaging to me. " Jeff Jacoby The First Amendment says nothing about a right not to be offended. The risk of finding someone else's speech offensive is the price each of us pays for our own free speech. Free people don't run to court -- or to the principal -- when they encounter a message they don't like. They answer it with one of their own. Ernest Jones [Censors are] people with secret attractions to various temptations... They are defending themselves under the pretext of defending others, because at heart they fear their own weaknesses. Howard Mumford Jones Persecution is the first law of society because it is always easier to suppress criticism than to meet it. John F. Kennedy There is little value in insuring the survival of our nation if our traditions do not survive with it. And there is very grave danger than an announced need for increased security will be seized upon by those anxious to expand its meaning to the very limits of official censorship and concealment. Krzysztof Kieslowski Why did they devise censorship? To show a world which doesn't exist, an ideal world, or what they envisaged as the ideal world. And we wanted to depict the world as it was. Milton Konvitz The invaluable and the valueless, the noble and the tawdry, the beautiful and the ugly, the true and the false, the good and the evil, are equally protected by the First and the Fourteenth Amendments' guarantees of a free press and religious freedom. Charles Kors, It seems now that the place where you see the most obvious censorship is on college campuses --- the precise place where you would expect to see the least. ALAN Arthur Lelyveld Censorship.is always and everywhere an evil. Censorship means the screening of material by an authority invested with power to ban that which it disapproves..And who is that paragon to whom we would be willing to entrust such authority? Vladimir Ilyich Lenin The bourgeoisie is many times stronger than we. To give it the weapon of freedom of the press is to ease the enemy's cause, to help the class enemy. We do not desire to end in suicide, so we will not do this. Max Lerner The Seven Deadly Sins of the Press: - Concentrated Power of the Big Press. - Passing of competition and the coming of monopoly. - Governmental control of the press. - Timidity, especially in the face of group and corporate pressures. - Big Business mentality. - Clannishness among the newspaper publishers that has prevented them from criticizing each other. - Social blindness. Max Lerner In societies like the American and West European where the dynamics of energy come from freedom and where the climate and the whole ethos are those of freedom, censorship is bound to be at worst , stupid; at best, futile; and always, to some degree, inconsonant with the character of the society as a whole. Doris Lessing With a library you are free, not confined by temporary political climates. It is the most democratic of institutions because no one - but no one at all - can tell you what to read and when and how. Dorris Lessing Political correctness is the natural continuum from the party line. What we are seeing once again is a self-appointed group of vigilantes imposing their views on others. Joseph Lewis The burning of an author's books, imprisonment for opinion's sake, has always been the tribute that an ignorant age pays to the genius of its time. Sinclair Lewis Every compulsion is put upon writers to become safe, polite, obedient, and sterile. In protest, I declined election to the National Institute of Arts and Letters some years ago, and now I must decline the Pulitzer Prize. A. J. Liebling People everywhere confuse, What they read in newspapers with news. Walter Lippmann Without some form of censorship, propaganda in the strict sense of the word is impossible. In order to conduct propaganda there must be some barrier between the public and the event. Archibald Macleish Once you permit those who are convinced of their own superior rightness to censor and silence and suppress those who hold contrary opinions, just at that moment the citadel has been surrendered. James Madison The people shall not be deprived or abridged of their right to speak, or to publish their sentiments; and the freedom of the press, as one of the great bulwarks of liberty, shall be inviolable. Kenan Malik It is the freedom to blaspheme, to transgress, to move beyond the pale, that is at the heart of all intellectual, artistic and political endeavor. Far from censoring offensive speech, a vibrant and diverse society should encourage it. In any society that is not uniform, grey and homogeneous, there are bound to be clashes of viewpoints. David Mamet We live in oppressive times. We have, as a nation, become our own thought police; but instead of calling the process by which we limit our expression of dissent and wonder 'censorship,' we call it 'concern for commercial viability.' Eugene Mccarthy There is danger in the concentration of control in the television and radio networks, especially in the large television and radio stations; danger in the concentration of ownership in the press.and danger in the increasing concentration of selection by book publishers and reviewers and by the producers of radio and television programs. Gail W. Mcgee I'm going to introduce a resolution to have the postmaster general stop reading dirty books and deliver the mail. William McGowan In May 1998, [Los Angeles Times publisher Mark] Willis told the Wall Street Journal that he wanted to make the Times more appealing to women and minorities by producing stories that were " more emotional, more personal and less analytic. " Carey Mcwilliams Censors are infused with the sentiment of moral indignation - a dangerous and misleading sentiment because, by blinding those who voice it to the real reasons for their indignation, it makes them puppets whose fears can be manipulated for ends and purposes they do not foresee or intend. Carey Mcwilliams I am opposed to censorship in all forms, without any exceptions. As a matter of social philosophy, I do not like the idea of some people trying to protect the minds and morals of other people. In practice, this means that a majority seeks to impose its standards on a minority; hence, an element of coercion is inherent in the idea of censorship. Carey Mcwilliams, Whatever the individual motives of the censors may be, censorship is a form of social control. It is a means of holding a society together, of arresting the flux which censors fear. And since the fear cannot be appeased, the demands for censorship mount in volume and intensity. And one form of censorship can easily lead to other forms. H. L. Mencken The whole drift of our law is toward the absolute prohibition of all ideas that diverge in the slightest form from the accepted platitudes, and behind that drift of law there is a far more potent force of growing custom, and under that custom there is a natural philosophy which erects conformity into the noblest of virtues and the free functioning of personality into a capital crime against society. Charles W. Moore If the political-correctness fascists get their way, we can safely assume it will be correct-thinking, " political cleansing " squads deciding what we can or cannot say on the Intenet. These people fear public debate and demand homogenization of " acceptable " attitudes compatible with their emotional, utopian idealism. John Morley When it is a duty to worship the sun it is pretty sure to be a crime to examine the laws of heat. Edward R. Morrow If none of us ever read a book that was " dangerous, " had a friend who was " different, " or joined an organization that advocated " change, " we would all be the kind of people Joe McCarthy wants. Bill Moyers If you think there is freedom of the press in the United States, I tell you there is no freedom of the press... They come out with the cheap shot. The press should be ashamed of itself. They should come to both sides of the issue and hear both sides and let the American people make up their minds. George Jean Nathan The artist and the censor differ in this wise: that the first is a decent mind in an indecent body and that the second is an indecent mind in a decent body. Reverend Martin Niemoeller In Germany, the Nazis first came for the communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, but I didn't speak up because I was a protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak for me. Eugene O'Neill Censorship of anything, at any time, in any place, on whatever pretense, has always been and will always be the last resort of the boob and the bigot. George Orwell At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is " not done " . Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with surprising effectiveness. A genuinely unfashionable opinion is almost never given a fair hearing, either in the popular press or in the highbrow periodicals. John Osborne Censorship is the commonest social blasphemy because it is mostly concealed, built into us by indolence, self-interest and cowardice. Katherine Patterson All of us can think of a book... that we hope none of our children or any other children have taken off the shelf. But if I have the right to remove that book from the shelf -- that book I abhor -- then you also have exactly the same right and so does everyone else. And then we have no books left on the shelf for any of us. Laurence J. Peter A censor is a man who knows more than he thinks you ought to. Pope Leo XIII The liberty of thinking and publishing whatsoever each one likes, without any hindrances, is not in itself an advantage over which society can wisely rejoice. On the contrary, it is the fountainhead and origin of many evils. Pope Pius X Henceforth it will be the task of this Sacred Congregation not only to examine carefully the books denounced to it, to prohibit them if necessary, and to grant permission for reading forbidden books, but also to supervise, ex officio, books that are being published, and to pass sentence on such as deserve to be prohibited. Neil Postman Make no mistake about it: the labeling of someone's language as 'sexist' involves a political judgment and implies the desirability of a particular sociological doctrine. One may be in favor of that doctrine//%Who%(as I believe I am)//%Source%but it is quite another matter to force writers by edicts and censorship into accepting it. Terence H. Qualter The weapon of the dictator is not so much propaganda as censorship. Charles RembarAside from the collective gain that comes from that free interchange of ideas, there is a direct personal value for the individual concerned. Each of us should have the right to speak his thoughts and to hear the thoughts of others. Eleanor Roosevelt We do not move forward by curtailing people's liberty because we are afraid of what they may do or say. Franklin D. Roosevelt If the fires of freedom and civil liberties burn low in other lands, they must be made brighter in our own. If in other lands the press and books and literature of all kinds are censored, we must redouble our efforts here to keep them free. If in other lands the eternal truths of the past are threatened by intolerance, we must provide a safe place for their perception. Salman Rushdie The worst, most insidious effect of censorship is that, in the end, it can deaden the imagination of the people. Where there is no debate, it is hard to go on remembering, every day, that there is a suppressed side to every argument. Bertrand Russell Heretical views arise when the truth is uncertain, and it is only when the truth is uncertain that censorship is invoked. Bertrand Russell It is clear that thought is not free if the profession of certain opinions make it impossible to earn a living. Willy Russell I pray that no child of mine would ever descend into such a place as a library. They are indeed most dangerous places and unfortunate is she or he who is lured into such a hellhole of enjoyment, stimulus, facts, passion and fun. Richard Salant If newsmen do not tell the truth as they see it because it might make waves, or if their bosses decide something should or should not be broadcast because of Washington or Main Street consequences, we have dishonored ourselves and we have lost the First Amendment by default. George Bernard Shaw Assassination is the extreme form of censorship. George Bernard Shaw Censorship ends in logical completeness when nobody is allowed to read any books except the books that nobody reads. George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950)All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions, and executed by supplanting existing institutions. Consequently, the first condition of progress is the removal of censorships. John Silber The reduction of political discourse to sound bites is one of the worst things that's happened in American political life. Hedrick Smith This is precisely the purpose of censorship - not only to block unwanted views, but to keep people who are unhappy from knowing how many millions of others share their unhappiness; to keep the dormant opposition from awakening to its own developing strength. Tommy Smothers The only valid censorship of ideas is the right of people not to listen. Gerry Spence The Internet.has become the voice of the people in the first genuine experiment in democracy yet conducted in America. It stands ready to serve every facet, every faction. Herbert Spencer The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools. Lysander Spooner Vices are not crimes. John Paul Stevens As a matter of constitutional tradition, in the absence of evidence to the contrary, we presume that governmental regulation of the content of speech is more likely to interfere with the free exchange of ideas than to encourage it. The interest in encouraging free-dom of expression in a democratic society outweighs any theoretical but unproven benefit of censorship. Justice Potter Stewart Censorship reflects a society's lack of confidence in itself. It is the landmark of an authoritarian regime... Donald Thompson Political censorship is necessarily based on fear of what will happen if those whose work is censored get their way, or if they are effecting in persuading a large number of readers to share their point of view. The nature of political censorship at any given time depends on the censor's answer to the simple question, " What are you afraid of? " Henry David Thoreau Beware of all enterprises that require new clothes. Mark Twain Censorship is telling a man he can't have a steak just because a baby can't chew it. Voltaire It is the characteristic of the most stringent censorships, that they give credibility to the opinions they attack. Kurt Vonnegut, Jr. All these people talk so eloquently about getting back to good old-fashioned values.and I say let's get back to the good old-fashioned First Amendment of the good old-fashioned Constitution of the United States - and to hell with the censors! Give me knowledge or give me death! Earl Warren The censor's sword pierces deeply into the heart of free expression. Mae WestI believe in censorship. After all, I made a fortune out of it. Rebecca West But once a culture develops sufficiently to become skeptical, the idea of censorship becomes less attractive. To suppress a book or a picture or a sculpture or a play or a film is a terrible act of aggression against the artist who created it. This is a miming of capital punishment; it destroys the life that has been emanated by a life. Rebecca West God forbid that any book should be banned. The practice is as indefensible as infanticide. George Will Freedom is not only the absence of external restraints. It is also the absence of irresistible internal compulsions, unmanageable passion, and uncensorable highlights. Bertram Wolfe Since direct political discussion was prohibited, all literature tended to become a criticism of Russian life, and literary criticism but another form of social criticism. If the censor forbade explicit statement, he was skillfully eluded by indirection - by innocent seeming tales of other lands or times, by complicated parables, animal fables, double meanings, overtones, by investing apparently trivial events with the pent-up energies possessing the writer, so that the reader became compelled to dwell upon them until their hidden meanings became manifest. Francis Wright Persecution for opinion is the master vice of society. Pope Leo Xiii Books of apostates, heretics, schismatics, and all other writers defending heresy or schism or in any attacking the foundations of religion, are altogether prohibited. John Peter Zenger No nation, ancient or modern, ever lost the liberty of speaking freely, writing, or publishing their sentiments, but forthwith lost their liberty in general and became slaves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 29, 2004 Report Share Posted June 29, 2004 Hi, It is not a pretty sight is it? This site usually has the cleanest best information that is avalable on the web. If you want health information, you will have to go back a few days and read or wait till recess is over for the kids. I have had about as much as I can take now, so lets make it official. Posting about anything and everything is over. Posting must be " responsible " . To do otherwise you will be posting at your own peril in the group. We can discuss it later. Frank , shoregirl1000@a... wrote: > Hi... > > I am really confused - is this an alternative medicine group?? I have read > over lots of the posts and nothing has anything to do with that! I just want > to make sure I am not in the wrong group!! I am looking for help with > alternative medicine for my epstein barr symptoms, fatigue, etc. Not a big deal, just > thought I would ask!! > > Thanks!! > > Carrie... > > http://www.carrieskiddiecloset.com/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 29, 2004 Report Share Posted June 29, 2004 Dear Carrie, The Michael Moore controversy sparked a discussion about freedom of speech, and the concern actually has a lot to do with health freedom as well. For example, This last September, 2003 several hundred alternative health sites were shut down by the FTC. Websites that the rest of the world can access are not accessible to Americans due to the FTC action. You might think that you can access all sites, but in fact some sites you think are gone are actually just gone for Americans. This is just one very small aspect of the numerous assaults on our health freedom. It's a long story, a story of corruption, dishonesty,and abuse of power. The Michael Moore film controversy has touched a nerve in the Alternative Health community. Stay tuned for regular programming... Hi... I am really confused - is this an alternative medicine group?? I have read over lots of the posts and nothing has anything to do with that! I just want to make sure I am not in the wrong group!! I am looking for help with alternative medicine for my epstein barr symptoms, fatigue, etc. Not a big deal, just thought I would ask!! Thanks!! Carrie... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 30, 2004 Report Share Posted June 30, 2004 Dear Carrie, Please go to our links page and click on a few of the links that interst you. One that I recommend to all newcomers ( as well to some of our not so new members too) is the site. http://www.doctoryourself.com Start there, welcome to the madhouse (not usual) Frank , shoregirl1000@a... wrote: > Thanks Frank!! I didn't mean to be a jerk or anything - I just wanted some > support and info. and was getting tons of emails about that stuff!! Anyway, > didn't mean to complain!! > > Anyway, thanks again!! > > Carrie... > > http://www.carrieskiddiecloset.com/ > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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