Guest guest Posted July 20, 2005 Report Share Posted July 20, 2005 Do most members of this group have this issue The Bratman Test for Orthorexia -- Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking about your diet? -- Do you plan your meals several days ahead? -- Is the nutritional value of your meal more important than the pleasure of eating it? -- Has the quality of your life decreased as the quality of your diet has increased? -- Have you become stricter with yourself lately? -- Does your self-esteem get a boost from eating healthily? -- Have you given up foods you used to enjoy in order to eat the `right' foods -- Does your diet make it difficult for you to eat out, distancing you from family and friends? -- Do you feel guilty when you stray from your diet? -- Do you feel at peace with yourself and in total control when you eat healthily? -- Yes to 4 or 5 of the above questions means it is time to relax more about food. -- Yes to all of them means a full-blown obsession with eating healthy food. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 20, 2005 Report Share Posted July 20, 2005 The Bratman Test, is very strange! "Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking about your diet?" I take it for granted that you won't need anything resembling "3 hours" to think through your diet, if you've made a sustained effort to work it out, once and for all. "Do you plan your meals several days ahead?" See above: which will make planning of meals as clear cut as your diet in general; requiring little time, planning or thought. "Is the nutritional value of your meal more important than the pleasure of eating it." The most peculiar question of all. It's like asking whether survival is more important to you, than partying. "Has the quality of your life decreased as the quality of your diet has increased?" Well, if all my life consisted of, is yearning after those foods that I've learned to avoid because they're toxic to and destructive of my health, I'd have to say yes. But I have dozens of things going on in my life besides getting the junk-food I'm used to. And, just as I got "used to" junk food, I can get "used to" not having it, and "used to" having and finally enjoying healthful foods. "Have you become stricter with yourself lately?" I hope I have; particularly in those areas where we're all inclined to be selfish, self-centered adolescents. "Does you self-esteem get a boost from eathing healthily? Yes, a little; but not nearly as much of a boost as my basic health does. "Have you given up foods you used to enjoy in order to eat the "right" foods?" You mean, have I, for example, given up soda pop for fresh vegetable and fruit juices, or chocolate cake for fresh salads, or nuts and seeds for ice cream and hershey bars, etc.; well, I guess I have. "Does your diet make it difficult for you to eat out, distancing you from friends and family?" Regrettably, no. This is one stubborn area where I've let myself and everyone around me down, by remaining silent about foods we eat at restaurants, that are loaded with low-quality grease, sugar, salt, pesticides, and carcinogens. But I'm working on this problem. For one thing, the work makes me feel better. For another, there are all kinds of places where I can mingle with "friends and family," and not just in over-priced, disease-promoting restaurants. But I suppose I'll never completely give up this practice.. I'll probably end up confining restaurant-going to a couple of times a month. "Do you feel guilty when you stray from your diet?" Yes, but not so it cripples me emotionally. I easily forgive myself for my lack of discipline, and go back to work on my dietary problems. But, let's get serious. I feel a twinge of guilt when I stray from generosity, friendliness, sound judgment in dealing with people, proper use of the environment, responsible driving, and mature business and other financial dealings with people, etc. "Do you feel at peace with yourself and in total control when you eat healthily?" Well, that's two questions, isn't it? I certainly feel "more" at peace with myself when I eat healthily. But "total" control; what on earth is that? When I exercise the control necessary to eat healthily, of course I'm in "more" control of myself. The answer is contained in the question. For me, this is also true with the first part of your question. I can't feel at "peace with myself," if I'm eating in a way that exposes me to an early death from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc., so, once more, the answer is contained in the question. Feeling at peace with myself, is not an unexpected reward for eating wisely, it's a precondition for it. "Yes to 4 or 5 of the above questions means it is time to relax more about food." Is't it possible to eat sensibly and still relax more? In fact, after some time passes, I believe we can only become more relaxed if we know we're eating wisely. "Yes to all of the above means a full blown obsession with eating healthy food." You bet your life fellow. And, I wish the obsession were ten times more intense than it is. JP - mgsboediitodpc Wednesday, July 20, 2005 12:27 PM Orthorexia Do most members of this group have this issueThe Bratman Test for Orthorexia-- Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking about your diet? -- Do you plan your meals several days ahead? -- Is the nutritional value of your meal more important than the pleasure of eating it? -- Has the quality of your life decreased as the quality of your diet has increased? -- Have you become stricter with yourself lately? -- Does your self-esteem get a boost from eating healthily? -- Have you given up foods you used to enjoy in order to eat the `right' foods -- Does your diet make it difficult for you to eat out, distancing you from family and friends? -- Do you feel guilty when you stray from your diet? -- Do you feel at peace with yourself and in total control when you eat healthily? -- Yes to 4 or 5 of the above questions means it is time to relax more about food. -- Yes to all of them means a full-blown obsession with eating healthy food. 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Guest guest Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Why do you say that. I am reading Bratman's book Health Food Junkies. I am sure you will find it interseting as well. read here http://www.orthorexia.com/ --- John Polifronio <counterpnt wrote: > The Bratman Test, is very strange! > > " Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking about > your diet? " > I take it for granted that you won't need > anything resembling " 3 hours " to think through your > diet, if you've made a sustained effort to work it > out, once and for all. > > > " Do you plan your meals several days ahead? " > See above: which will make planning of > meals as clear cut as your diet in general; > requiring little time, planning or thought. > > > " Is the nutritional value of your meal more > important than the pleasure of eating it. " > The most peculiar question of all. It's > like asking whether survival is more important to > you, than partying. > > > " Has the quality of your life decreased as the > quality of your diet has increased? " > Well, if all my life consisted of, is > yearning after those foods that I've learned to > avoid because they're toxic to and destructive of my > health, I'd have to say yes. But I have dozens of > things going on in my life besides getting the > junk-food I'm used to. And, just as I got " used to " > junk food, I can get " used to " not having it, and > " used to " having and finally enjoying healthful > foods. > > > " Have you become stricter with yourself lately? " > I hope I have; particularly in those areas > where we're all inclined to be selfish, > self-centered adolescents. > > > > " Does you self-esteem get a boost from eathing > healthily? > Yes, a little; but not nearly as much of a > boost as my basic health does. > > > " Have you given up foods you used to enjoy in order > to eat the " right " foods? " > You mean, have I, for example, given up > soda pop for fresh vegetable and fruit juices, or > chocolate cake for fresh salads, or nuts and seeds > for ice cream and hershey bars, etc.; well, I guess > I have. > > > > " Does your diet make it difficult for you to eat > out, distancing you from friends and family? " > Regrettably, no. This is one stubborn > area where I've let myself and everyone around me > down, by remaining silent about foods we eat at > restaurants, that are loaded with low-quality > grease, sugar, salt, pesticides, and carcinogens. > But I'm working on this problem. For one thing, the > work makes me feel better. For another, there are > all kinds of places where I can mingle with " friends > and family, " and not just in over-priced, > disease-promoting restaurants. But I suppose I'll > never completely give up this practice.. I'll > probably end up confining restaurant-going to a > couple of times a month. > > > " Do you feel guilty when you stray from your diet? " > Yes, but not so it cripples me > emotionally. I easily forgive myself for my lack of > discipline, and go back to work on my dietary > problems. But, let's get serious. I feel a twinge > of guilt when I stray from generosity, friendliness, > sound judgment in dealing with people, proper use of > the environment, responsible driving, and mature > business and other financial dealings with people, > etc. > > > " Do you feel at peace with yourself and in total > control when you eat healthily? " > Well, that's two questions, isn't it? I > certainly feel " more " at peace with myself when I > eat healthily. But " total " control; what on earth > is that? When I exercise the control necessary to > eat healthily, of course I'm in " more " control of > myself. The answer is contained in the question. > For me, this is also true with the first part of > your question. I can't feel at " peace with myself, " > if I'm eating in a way that exposes me to an early > death from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc., > so, once more, the answer is contained in the > question. Feeling at peace with myself, is not an > unexpected reward for eating wisely, it's a > precondition for it. > > > " Yes to 4 or 5 of the above questions means it is > time to relax more about food. " > Is't it possible to eat sensibly and still > relax more? In fact, after some time passes, I > believe we can only become more relaxed if we know > we're eating wisely. > > > > " Yes to all of the above means a full blown > obsession with eating healthy food. " > You bet your life fellow. And, I wish the > obsession were ten times more intense than it is. > > JP > > > - > mgsboediitodpc > > Wednesday, July 20, 2005 12:27 PM > Orthorexia > > > Do most members of this group have this issue > > The Bratman Test for Orthorexia > > > > -- Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking > about your diet? > > > > -- Do you plan your meals several days ahead? > > > > -- Is the nutritional value of your meal more > important than the > pleasure of eating it? > > > > -- Has the quality of your life decreased as the > quality of your > diet has increased? > > > > -- Have you become stricter with yourself lately? > > > > -- Does your self-esteem get a boost from eating > healthily? > > > > -- Have you given up foods you used to enjoy in > order to eat > the `right' foods > > > > -- Does your diet make it difficult for you to eat > out, distancing > you from family and friends? > > > > -- Do you feel guilty when you stray from your > diet? > > > > -- Do you feel at peace with yourself and in total > control when you > eat healthily? > > > > -- Yes to 4 or 5 of the above questions means it > is time to relax > more about food. > > > > -- Yes to all of them means a full-blown obsession > with eating > healthy food. > > > > === message truncated === Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 25, 2005 Report Share Posted July 25, 2005 Mike Man You ask " why " I say what I say? I provide the answer to your question in my replies to each of the questions asked in the Bratman test. For example: in question 1), " Do you spend more than 3 hours a day thinking about your diet, " my reply expresses my feeling that the question is ridiculous. I can't think of anyone I've known, that spends 3 hours a day thinking about their diet. It isn't necessary. When you're working out a dietary program, you typically spend some time on it for a few days, and then you forget about it, and simply follow your diet. If a person spends " 3 hours a day " thinking about their diet, that's not a dietary problem. Suppose we ask the question from a different angle. Suppose I ask, " do you spend 3 hours a day, thinking about your marriage? " The point is, what does " thinking 3 hours a day " about your marriage, have to do with marriage? If you think 3 hours a day about your diet or about your marriage, that doesn't have anything to do with diet or marriage. It means you're an obsessive personality, or something wierd like that. But your diet, and your marriage, are just as important to the quality of your life, as they are if you think 15 minutes a day about them. The idea is to get the right information, so that you don't have to worry for 3 hours a day. But to suggest that your diet " isn't important, " and that's why you shouldn't think about it for 3 hours, is stupid. Your diet, or your marriage, couldn't be more important. The Bratman Test conceals anger and contempt for people that are careful and responsible about what they eat. In every area of our lives, people are either thoughtful or irresponsible. I think about how I drive my car, about how I treat people, about how I dress, about how I work at my profession, about how I exercise, etc. Does this make me a junky? The Bratman test was conceived of by someone that underestimates the importance of careful dieting, and just wants to eat whatever they want, and not worry about it. That's great, if you're a child. That's great, if you don't care what happens to your health, whether you become obese, or develop cancer or heart disease, etc. We don't need to have it explained to us, that it's much easier to just chuck your concern for your health out the window, and live like you haven't a concern in the world. We all want to do that, but only a fool thinks you can get away with it. JP - mike man Monday, July 25, 2005 10:26 AM Re: Orthorexia Why do you say that. I am reading Bratman's book Health Food Junkies. I am sure you will find it interseting as well. read here http://www.orthorexia.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 1, 2005 Report Share Posted August 1, 2005 interesting answer --- John Polifronio <counterpnt wrote: > Mike Man > You ask " why " I say what I say? I provide the > answer to your question in my replies to each of > the questions asked in the Bratman test. For > example: in question 1), " Do you spend more than 3 > hours a day thinking about your diet, " my reply > expresses my feeling that the question is > ridiculous. I can't think of anyone I've known, > that spends 3 hours a day thinking about their diet. > It isn't necessary. When you're working out a > dietary program, you typically spend some time on it > for a few days, and then you forget about it, and > simply follow your diet. > > If a person spends " 3 hours a day " thinking about > their diet, that's not a dietary problem. Suppose > we ask the question from a different angle. Suppose > I ask, " do you spend 3 hours a day, thinking about > your marriage? " The point is, what does " thinking 3 > hours a day " about your marriage, have to do with > marriage? If you think 3 hours a day about your > diet or about your marriage, that doesn't have > anything to do with diet or marriage. It means > you're an obsessive personality, or something wierd > like that. But your diet, and your marriage, are > just as important to the quality of your life, as > they are if you think 15 minutes a day about them. > The idea is to get the right information, so that > you don't have to worry for 3 hours a day. But to > suggest that your diet " isn't important, " and that's > why you shouldn't think about it for 3 hours, is > stupid. Your diet, or your marriage, couldn't be > more important. > > The Bratman Test conceals anger and contempt for > people that are careful and responsible about what > they eat. In every area of our lives, people are > either thoughtful or irresponsible. I think about > how I drive my car, about how I treat people, about > how I dress, about how I work at my profession, > about how I exercise, etc. Does this make me a > junky? The Bratman test was conceived of by someone > that underestimates the importance of careful > dieting, and just wants to eat whatever they want, > and not worry about it. That's great, if you're a > child. That's great, if you don't care what happens > to your health, whether you become obese, or develop > cancer or heart disease, etc. We don't need to have > it explained to us, that it's much easier to just > chuck your concern for your health out the window, > and live like you haven't a concern in the world. > We all want to do that, but only a fool thinks you > can get away with it. > > JP > > - > mike man > > Monday, July 25, 2005 10:26 AM > Re: Orthorexia > > > Why do you say that. I am reading Bratman's book > Health Food Junkies. > > I am sure you will find it interseting as well. > > read here > > http://www.orthorexia.com/ > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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