Guest guest Posted July 21, 2003 Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 Dear Pam, Honey, please do NOT let that post from Susan Van Allen upset or introvert you. Shortly after she replied to your post, she unsub'ed from the list, and five seconds after that I permanently banned "toasted" her from ever coming back. I have not had the chance to comment on the subject until now, so I'm sorry to have kept you hanging for so long. But this is the usual case with me and my email, and I'm answering my email backwards today just to stay in the loop keep things sequitur ;o) Please don't leave our Herbal Rememdies list as I have valued your input even though lacking the time to comment on any of your posts. They are read and appreciated ;o) I have no personal experience with the "Pus in the Milk" phenomenon, but the bovine practices and subsequent results would not surprise me in the least. I have personally seen the way commercial chickens are raised in their cramped quarters (1' by 2' cages) for the entirety of their short little lives and would not be surprised at any thing in any part of the commercial meat industry. I do have experience in the beef "meat" industry and a very good site to explore is http://www.eatwild.com . The amount of hormones, steroids, and antibiotics used in this industry are unreal, and I have heard that this practice extends to the milk industry as well regardless of my own personal experience. Also, please read my article in the files called "Dead Meat". This really does say it all and the article is very well researched. Many people have very little confront in the area of healing. They truly do. You start mentioning words like "pus, blood, guts, puke, vomit, feces, saliva, stink, smell, insane, evil, and even body odor" and these little Miss Cupcakes head for the hills and back to their allopaths where they can safely let others take responsibility for them. It takes a lot of courage to be a natural healer. It takes a lot of "facing up to" of reality. Life can be very hard and cruel, but it can also be a helluva lot of fun if you can face up to the toughness of it all and don't let the negative get to you. Part of that, is dealing with "victims" like Susan above who doesn't even have the confront level of a carrot, doesn't have the tenacity of her convictions enough to stick around and either argue it out or see you corrected (if you were wrong, which I strongly doubt), and then leaves in a huff making everyone wrong. Honey, these types are simply not worth the aggravation. Do not let them under your skin. It just ain't worth it!!! In the past there have been many good individual farmers who did well with their dairy cows and treated them with respect (as all life should be unless it is threatening the good of all). One of my neigbors who had a Guernsey cow and who I used to get "RAW ORGANIC" milk from, told me that you had to love your cows. He once spoke harshly to her and her milk production dropped. After that he always spoke lovingly to her, and even sang to her even if she stepped on his foot, and her production came right back up. I know that very few farmers and none of the big operations of today operate that way. Today, they are only interested in profit. They feed the cows grain (their natural food is grass), and when they inevitably get sick from eating the wrong food, load 'em up with antibiotics to keep 'em alive and pump them full of hormones to keep 'em producing. Ahhhhhhhhh, for the good ole days with the many small organic farmers LOL ;o) Much love, Doc Ian "Doc" Shillington N.D.505-772-5889Dr.IanShillington - Suzanne Lisa Belcher ; Doc ; Don Eitner ; Janet ; Ann Melin ; Ann Webb Monday, July 21, 2003 12:33 PM Fwd: Re: pus in milk/I'M SOOO SORRY!! Hey gang!!! I thought you should all read this.and know what is going on...... I got an email from Pam regarding the pus in milk discussions... You will see my answer to her.... SuziSuzanne <suziesgoats wrote: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:32:10 -0700 (PDT)Suzanne Re: pus in milk/I'M SOOO SORRY!!pam Well Pam, I'm sitting here laughing ... I'm sorry but it is funny from my point... People want to know the truth of things but when it isn't the way they want it... it's wrong in their eyes...... You must remember you can't please everyone all of the time... And as mods, we sure know that.... I was looking on line to either prove or disprove the article... found alot of info but nothing that really told me it was an independent reseach... You have to wonder sometimes depending on who comes out with information..(ex... a pro PETA person you would wonder about if the article was actually true versus say a college student doing research...). I want to see Doc's response... But don't leave... There will always be people that don't want to hear the truth or just don't want to believe some things.... For instance, with all the evidence of alien life.... you have to wonder (if you don't believe) could it be real?... There are some that say No... no way.. same with the Holocaust... there are people that to this day still believe it never happened.... On this site we don't sugar coat the truth so appease people... And I think Doc and us mods have thicker skins and can absorb some of the comments we get... And it is the individuals choice if they choose to leave... It is their loss, not the memberships. OVer the years we have had some great debates, discussions... whatever... but most all of us are still here and still friends.. and we all learned from it... look at what we all learned from the Essiac discussion. Your heart was in the right place... and if what was written is untrue... someone will show it to be... don't be so down on yourself. Suzipam <peetee1965 wrote: Good day Suzi, I hope you don't mind me contacting you off list. I am feeling absolutely Horrible about bringing this topic here. I'm not sure if it was Zeb (not important who) posted about chicken beaks getting removed to protect the meat of other chickens from damage. The whole story on PUS came to mind and I just posted it. A couple people were shocked and I knew than it had nothing to do with herbal remedies and that I should've at the least posted a warning. Now a member left and slammed everything in her wake. I after the first replies came in was and still am considering leaving this list as much as I like it. Bottom line I'm feeling guilt ridden. I cannot however make excuses for what I try to present here by bringing in other sights relating to cures etc.. I definately don't want to step on any feet/Docs or his wonderful knowledge and product cures you so stand behind. (that is a good thing).So if I'm a little out of line with some of my postings please let me know because I don't like feeling like I do after this cow milk issue. I sincerely have the groups best interests at heart but than again I cannot help but share some of the stuff I know wether it relates to herbal rememdies or the sad state of consumer affairs. Feel free to email me off list if there is something that maybe "pissing" Doc and the moderators off!!!Pam SBC DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 21, 2003 Report Share Posted July 21, 2003 I really feel like I've been eaves dropping...and for that, I apologize... But, I just GOT TO say my piece since I did see this... And, this is just my own opinion here...I'm sure that out of 1400 plus members someone will disagree, but here goes... Did you knowingly post something that was untrue or just hyped up to get sales on something else? Was it a personal attack on anyone on this list? Assuming you say no to both these questions...I CAN'T UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD FEEL GUILTY. First, even Doc will tell you to do your own research...no one has said, and it's not in the files of list rules, that everything posted on this list must be taken as fact or law...wouldn't that be like a cult? And, since there's no religion tolerated here...I assume cults aren't either. This brings me to the conclusion that it was her own fault for not doing a search or researching (what ever) on her own. Did you notice that there wasn't alot of posts right after you posted that...? (Except for my TMI one, that is) Well, that's because alot of us were searching that seen it. A few just weren't here yesterday. I guarantee you, if you do something on this list that's wrong, Ms. Suzi will be the first to tell you. The other mods will too, but so far as I've been here, she's on pretty much the same time I am... Come on Chic, please don't leave...I appreciate the things you post. I have to admit that when I first read that post about the pus, I was taken aback...really. Even after learning all the things I have here recently...but, I did do a search and found other sites...and, I don't know if it's true or not...it is logical in the right conditions. And, no one is going to convince me that conditions are not right in this day and time. I just contradicted my own self, huh? Well, what I meant to say is I have not done any hands on research with cows myself, but common sense would tell you this can happen. And, knowledge and experience tells me that it does happen. Anyhow, don't worry about people that have no common sense and expect for everything on this list to be fact or stated as so and are afraid to do a little searching on their own... I don't believe that was the purpose for this list since there are no medical doctors or government officials running it. In other words, don't sweat the small stuff... And, besides all that, I bet the ones on here WITH the knowledge didn't get where they are at today by listening to people like that... Angel All incoming and outgoing scanned with NAV for both our protection. Suzanne <suziesgoats wrote: Mon, 21 Jul 2003 11:32:10 -0700 (PDT)Suzanne Re: pus in milk/I'M SOOO SORRY!!pam Well Pam, I'm sitting here laughing ... I'm sorry but it is funny from my point... People want to know the truth of things but when it isn't the way they want it... it's wrong in their eyes...... You must remember you can't please everyone all of the time... And as mods, we sure know that.... I was looking on line to either prove or disprove the article... found alot of info but nothing that really told me it was an independent reseach... You have to wonder sometimes depending on who comes out with information..(ex... a pro PETA person you would wonder about if the article was actually true versus say a college student doing research...). I want to see Doc's response... But don't leave... There will always be people that don't want to hear the truth or just don't want to believe some things.... For instance, with all the evidence of alien life.... you have to wonder (if you don't believe) could it be real?... There are some that say No... no way.. same with the Holocaust... there are people that to this day still believe it never happened.... On this site we don't sugar coat the truth so appease people... And I think Doc and us mods have thicker skins and can absorb some of the comments we get... And it is the individuals choice if they choose to leave... It is their loss, not the memberships. OVer the years we have had some great debates, discussions... whatever... but most all of us are still here and still friends.. and we all learned from it... look at what we all learned from the Essiac discussion. Your heart was in the right place... and if what was written is untrue... someone will show it to be... don't be so down on yourself. Suzipam <peetee1965 wrote: Good day Suzi, I hope you don't mind me contacting you off list. I am feeling absolutely Horrible about bringing this topic here. I'm not sure if it was Zeb (not important who) posted about chicken beaks getting removed to protect the meat of other chickens from damage. The whole story on PUS came to mind and I just posted it. A couple people were shocked and I knew than it had nothing to do with herbal remedies and that I should've at the least posted a warning. Now a member left and slammed everything in her wake. I after the first replies came in was and still am considering leaving this list as much as I like it. Bottom line I'm feeling guilt ridden. I cannot however make excuses for what I try to present here by bringing in other sights relating to cures etc.. I definately don't want to step on any feet/Docs or his wonderful knowledge and product cures you so stand behind. (that is a good thing).So if I'm a little out of line with some of my postings please let me know because I don't like feeling like I do after this cow milk issue. I sincerely have the groups best interests at heart but than again I cannot help but share some of the stuff I know wether it relates to herbal rememdies or the sad state of consumer affairs. Feel free to email me off list if there is something that maybe "pissing" Doc and the moderators off!!!Pam SBC DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! Federal Law requires that we warn you of the following: 1. Natural methods can sometimes backfire. 2. If you are pregnant, consult your physician before using any natural remedy. 3. The Constitution guarantees you the right to be your own physician and toprescribe for your own health. We are not medical doctors although MDs are welcome to post here as long as they behave themselves. Any opinions put forth by the list members are exactly that, and any person following the advice of anyone posting here does so at their own risk. It is up to you to educate yourself. By accepting advice or products from list members, you are agreeing to be fully responsible for your own health, and hold the List Owner and members free of any liability. Dr. Ian ShillingtonDoctor of NaturopathyDr.IanShillington Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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