Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid studies

[Guest guest]

I do wish you would back up those statements with links to

real research. I have been wrong in the past, and probably will be

wrong in the future, but without substantive evidence I sure am not

going to throw out I believe to be real about ascorbic acid.

 

Alobar

 

 

-

" wingsofsong " <wingsofsong

 

Tuesday, September 30, 2003 6:35 PM

Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid

studies

 

 

> Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid studies-

>

> I read an article the other day that really explained the

negative

> controversy over vit. C & ascorbic acid in the Pure Planet

> newsletter. I couldn't find the article on their site at

>

> www.pureplanet.com

> and thought I'd share some of it with you.

>

> ......Thousands of bottles of ascorbic acid are purchased everyday

> under the misguided assumption that ascorbic acid is the same as

> Vitamin C. In reality, ascorbic acid is an isolated nutrient that

> is part of vitamin C but it is not the whole Vitamin C.

>

> So you are getting cheated if you buy ascorbic acid thinking it

> is Vitamin C.

>

> But that might be the least of the consequences you

> may suffer. Studies over the last several years have demonstrated

> that people who take high doses of ascorbic acid actually put

> themselves at risk for a number of health challenges.

>

> One study demonstrates that doses of 500 mg a day or more of

> ascorbic acid increases the incidence of arterial plaque buildup.

> another study indicates that gallstones are more likely to appear

in

> those taking large doses of ascorbic acid.

>

> Are these backlash studies against the health food industry? No,

> they are legitimate studies.

>

> Wait a minute, you may be thinking. What about all the studies

> done by Linus Pauling and a multitude of other reputable

researchers

> who have proven the health promoting benefits of Vitamin C and

> ascorbic acid?

>

> Let us put a little perspective on the subject.

>

> Back in the 1930's ascorbic acid was isolated out of little red

> peppers.

>

>

> The man who first performed this experiment was Dr. Albert

> Szent-Gyorgyi who won a Nobel Prize for this work. What he also

> found, which has mostly been ignored until recently, was that

> ascorbic acid was far more biologically available and active, while

> it was still in the red pepper.

>

>

> Scientists of the era of " Better Living Through Chemistry and

> Science " (which we have been experiencing for the last fifty years)

> decided to take the discoveries about Vitamin C and " improve " on

> Mother Nature.

>

>

> First they found that extracting ascorbic acid from foods, such as

> red peppers is expensive.

>

>

> Ascorbic acid can be created in the laboratory much less

> expensively (and of course much more profitably).

>

>

>

> Scientists discovered that they could take corn syrup, mix it with

> hydrochloric acid, and voila: ascorbic acid!

>

>

>

> (By the way, the corn is more likely than ever to be genetically

> modified.)

>

>

>

> Later, scientists discovered what Dr. Szent-Gyorgyi had

> discovered about ascorbic acid, it is not as effective when

detached

> from the whole food matrix!

>

>

> So they went about trying to determine what other factors could be

> in the whole food that would make the ascorbic acid work better.

>

> First they discovered the importance of bioflavoinoids, so they

> figured out how to produce these synthetically in the laboratory,

to

> be added to the ascorbic acid.

>

>

> Then they found that fat-soluble ascorbic acid was superior,

because

> it went directly to the liver vs. water-soluble ascorbic acid.

>

>

> In fact if you put 100 mg of ascorbic acid in the body, within a

> few hours at least 90% of it will be excreted in the urine.

>

>

> If you put 10 times more into the body to account for 90% loss it

> may cause diarrhea.

>

>

> Scientists experimented with various things and concluded

> that if the ascorbic acid molecule was attached to a metabolite,

the

> ascorbic acid would stay in the body longer (they didn't seem to

> care why it stayed in the body longer, but it stayed in the body

> longer and hopefully that was a good thing).

>

> Today there is a broad verity of ascorbic acid products with

> various things attached to them.

>

> With all this research, time, thought and dollars being put into

> creating a synthetic Vitamin C, the fact remains that no scientist

> can even come close to the potentials of what Mother Nature

> created.

>

> One important factor that science has been unable to

> duplicate is the special kind of energy that holds living food

> together.

>

> Whether this energy is found in the enzymes or in the

> energy patterns of whole food structure, it is unlikely that

science

> will ever be able to reproduce it in a laboratory.

>

> This may be on of several reasons why studies have shown that the

> body will absorb close to 100% of the Vitamin C that is consumed as

> part of whole food, whereas barely 10% of the " stripped down "

> ascorbic acid is absorbed.

>

>

> Then the article goes on--

>

> Ascorbic acid is an acid and acids stress the body

> setting the stage for all kinds of malfunctions and disease.

>

> I thought this article explained in simple terms why we

> hear such conflict in the Vitamin C studies!

> Thought you may have been as interested as I was.

>

> Hugs, Katherine

>

[Guest guest]

I very much feel the same thing, Lorenzo. But I like to

keep reminding myself to keep an open mind & read things I think are

wrong provided claims are backed up with references to research I am

able to read online. One of the traps of age is getting trapped

into particular belief structures, so I remind myself to keep an open

mind.

 

Alobar

 

 

-

" Lorenzo " <lorenzo1

 

Wednesday, October 01, 2003 4:45 AM

Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid

studies

 

 

> This I believe is simply an attack on Vitamin C.

>

> It is like the Studies that refute the work done by Pauling.

Pauling would

> use 500 mg in a study so the study to prove Pauling wrong would use

100 mg.

>

> Lorenzo

>

>

>

> Re: Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic

acid

> studies

>

> >

> I do wish you would back up those statements with links to

> real research. I have been wrong in the past, and probably will

be

> wrong in the future, but without substantive evidence I sure am not

> going to throw out I believe to be real about ascorbic acid.

>

> Alobar

>

>

> -

> " wingsofsong " <wingsofsong

>

> Tuesday, September 30, 2003 6:35 PM

> Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic

acid

> studies

>

>

> >> Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid studies-

> >

> > I read an article the other day that really explained the

> negative

> > controversy over vit. C & ascorbic acid in the Pure Planet

> > newsletter. I couldn't find the article on their site at

> >

> > www.pureplanet.com

> > and thought I'd share some of it with you.

> >

> > ......Thousands of bottles of ascorbic acid are purchased

everyday

> > under the misguided assumption that ascorbic acid is the same as

> > Vitamin C. In reality, ascorbic acid is an isolated nutrient that

> > is part of vitamin C but it is not the whole Vitamin C.

> >

> > So you are getting cheated if you buy ascorbic acid thinking it

> > is Vitamin C.

> >

> > But that might be the least of the consequences you

> > may suffer. Studies over the last several years have demonstrated

> > that people who take high doses of ascorbic acid actually put

> > themselves at risk for a number of health challenges.

> >

> > One study demonstrates that doses of 500 mg a day or more of

> > ascorbic acid increases the incidence of arterial plaque buildup.

> > another study indicates that gallstones are more likely to appear

> in

> > those taking large doses of ascorbic acid.

> >

> > Are these backlash studies against the health food industry? No,

> > they are legitimate studies.

> >

> > Wait a minute, you may be thinking. What about all the studies

> > done by Linus Pauling and a multitude of other reputable

> researchers

> > who have proven the health promoting benefits of Vitamin C and

> > ascorbic acid?

> >

> > Let us put a little perspective on the subject.

> >

> > Back in the 1930's ascorbic acid was isolated out of little red

> > peppers.

> >

> >

> > The man who first performed this experiment was Dr. Albert

> > Szent-Gyorgyi who won a Nobel Prize for this work. What he also

> > found, which has mostly been ignored until recently, was that

> > ascorbic acid was far more biologically available and active,

while

> > it was still in the red pepper.

> >

> >

> > Scientists of the era of " Better Living Through Chemistry and

> > Science " (which we have been experiencing for the last fifty

years)

> > decided to take the discoveries about Vitamin C and " improve " on

> > Mother Nature.

> >

> >

> > First they found that extracting ascorbic acid from foods, such

as

> > red peppers is expensive.

> >

> >

> > Ascorbic acid can be created in the laboratory much less

> > expensively (and of course much more profitably).

> >

> >

> >

> > Scientists discovered that they could take corn syrup, mix it

with

> > hydrochloric acid, and voila: ascorbic acid!

> >

> >

> >

> > (By the way, the corn is more likely than ever to be genetically

> > modified.)

> >

> >

> >

> > Later, scientists discovered what Dr. Szent-Gyorgyi had

> > discovered about ascorbic acid, it is not as effective when

> detached

> > from the whole food matrix!

> >

> >

> > So they went about trying to determine what other factors could

be

> > in the whole food that would make the ascorbic acid work better.

> >

> > First they discovered the importance of bioflavoinoids, so they

> > figured out how to produce these synthetically in the laboratory,

> to

> > be added to the ascorbic acid.

> >

> >

> > Then they found that fat-soluble ascorbic acid was superior,

> because

> > it went directly to the liver vs. water-soluble ascorbic acid.

> >

> >

> > In fact if you put 100 mg of ascorbic acid in the body, within a

> > few hours at least 90% of it will be excreted in the urine.

> >

> >

> > If you put 10 times more into the body to account for 90% loss it

> > may cause diarrhea.

> >

> >

> > Scientists experimented with various things and concluded

> > that if the ascorbic acid molecule was attached to a metabolite,

> the

> > ascorbic acid would stay in the body longer (they didn't seem to

> > care why it stayed in the body longer, but it stayed in the body

> > longer and hopefully that was a good thing).

> >

> > Today there is a broad verity of ascorbic acid products with

> > various things attached to them.

> >

> > With all this research, time, thought and dollars being put into

> > creating a synthetic Vitamin C, the fact remains that no

scientist

> > can even come close to the potentials of what Mother Nature

> > created.

> >

> > One important factor that science has been unable to

> > duplicate is the special kind of energy that holds living food

> > together.

> >

> > Whether this energy is found in the enzymes or in the

> > energy patterns of whole food structure, it is unlikely that

> science

> > will ever be able to reproduce it in a laboratory.

> >

> > This may be on of several reasons why studies have shown that

the

> > body will absorb close to 100% of the Vitamin C that is consumed

as

> > part of whole food, whereas barely 10% of the " stripped down "

> > ascorbic acid is absorbed.

> >

> >

> > Then the article goes on--

> >

> > Ascorbic acid is an acid and acids stress the body

> > setting the stage for all kinds of malfunctions and disease.

> >

> > I thought this article explained in simple terms why we

> > hear such conflict in the Vitamin C studies!

> > Thought you may have been as interested as I was.

> >

> > Hugs, Katherine

> >

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Alobar--

 

I must confess that I am a real beginner at all this. Can you likewise,

please post the scientific research links about what you know and believe

about the ascorbic acid? Thanks.

 

I just have difficulty seeing the need for laboratory created anything, if

in fact the real thing is so readily available in nature ... which I don't

know either!

 

Regards/Roger, in Bangkok

 

 

Alobar [alobar]

Wednesday, 01 October, 2003 9:10 AM

 

Re: Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid

studies

 

 

I do wish you would back up those statements with links to

real research. I have been wrong in the past, and probably will be

wrong in the future, but without substantive evidence I sure am not going to

throw out I believe to be real about ascorbic acid.

 

Alobar

 

 

-

" wingsofsong " <wingsofsong

 

Tuesday, September 30, 2003 6:35 PM

Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid studies

 

 

> Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic acid studies-

>

> I read an article the other day that really explained the

negative

> controversy over vit. C & ascorbic acid in the Pure Planet newsletter.

> I couldn't find the article on their site at

>

[Guest guest]

-

" roger " <mercies

 

Thursday, October 02, 2003 12:52 AM

RE: Outcome of Vit.C/ascorbic

acid studies

 

 

> Hi Alobar--

>

> I must confess that I am a real beginner at all this. Can you

likewise,

> please post the scientific research links about what you know and

believe

> about the ascorbic acid? Thanks.

>

> I just have difficulty seeing the need for laboratory created

anything, if

> in fact the real thing is so readily available in nature ... which

I don't

> know either!

>

> Regards/Roger, in Bangkok

 

Hi Roger,

Frank, among others, has put a ton of material onto this

list. Lots of URLs to websites. Lots of footnotes with references

to published papers. All can be found from going to

and

searching thru the groups archives.

 

To get you started, I have compiled a short list of material

you might want to read. I give brief snippets from some websites &

then the referencing URL. As all this has been posted to this list in

entirety several times already, I shall not reprint the entire

articles here. If you go to the websites referenced below, you will

get the full story with references.

 

Us humans (along with Guinea pigs) do not produce our own

vitamin C. Other animals all make their own. And they do so at

much vaster quantities than the US RDA. If we eat the same amount of

vitamin C as is produced daily by a gorilla of the same body weight,

we would be taking over 10 grams of C a day. According to the

USDA, 1 cup of orange juice contains 124 mg of C. I have no proof,

but I strongly suspect that very few humans have ever drank 6 gallons

of orange juice a day even once, let alone each day for their entire

lives. Other natural sources are higher in C than oranges, but not

that much higher. There is just no way humans can get the same

amount of C all the other animals manufacture inside themselves,

except by taking it as a supplement.

 

Alobar

 

______________

 

Explanation of how Massive Doses of Ascorbate Cures Acute Viral

Diseases

from Colds to Polio and Lassa Fever, EBOLA. Etc., Distemper and

Kennel Fever

by Robert F. Cathcart, III, M.D.

Allergy, Environmental, and Orthomolecular Medicine

http://www.orthomed.com/explain.htm

VITAMIN C HAS BEEN KNOWN TO CURE OVER 30 MAJOR DISEASES FOR OVER 50

YEARS

The first physician to aggressively use Vitamin C to cure diseases

was Frederick R. Klenner, M.D. beginning back in the early 1940's.

Dr. Klenner consistently cured chicken pox, measles, mumps, tetanus

and polio with huge doses of the vitamin. While vaccines are now

available for these illnesses, please remember this was not the case

in the 1940's.

The following is a list of the conditions that Dr. Klenner

successfully treated with aggressive Vitamin C therapy:

Pneumonia

Encephalitis

Herpes Zoster (shingles)

Herpes Simplex

Mononucleosis

Pancreatitis

Hepatitis

Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever

Bladder Infection

Alcoholism

Arthritis

Some Cancers

Leukemia

Atherosclerosis

Ruptured Intervertebral Disc

High Cholesterol

Corneal Ulcer

Diabetes

Glaucoma

Schizophrenia

Burns and secondary infections

Heat Stroke

Radiation Burns

Heavy Metal Poisoning (Mercury, Lead)

Venomous Bites (insects, snakes)

Multiple Sclerosis

Chronic Fatigue

Complications of Surgery

http://www.doctoryourself.com/vitaminc.html

 

 

 

Notes On Orthomolecular (Megavitamin) Use of Vitamin C

 

Vitamin C (ascorbate, ascorbic acid) has varying activity in the body

at varying levels of intake. At low levels of consumption, vitamin C

is like a trace nutrient: you need very little of it to stay alive,

but without any at all you die. Even a few milligrams a day will

suffice to preserve life. At moderate levels of consumption, say 500

to 1,500 mg per day for an adult, the vitamin works to build health

in a positive sense. statistically, fewer colds will be reported;

incidence, severity and duration of influenza will be less. (Stone,

The Healing Factor, 1972 and Pauling, Vitamin C, the Common Cold and

the Flu, 1976). But it is at high levels, say 8,000 to 40,000 mg per

day for an adult, that we begin to obtain therapeutic properties for

the vitamin.

 

At the proper (high) level, vitamin C has anti-histamine, anti-toxin,

and anti-biotic properties. The pharmacological effects of a vitamin

at high concentration do not disqualify our continuing to call it,

and think of it, as a vitamin. Money still buys things even if you

have a lot of it; its nature has not changed but its power has. If it

takes 50 gallons of gas to drive from New York City to Albuquerque,

you simply are not going to make it on 10 gallons, no matter how you

try. Likewise, if your body wants 35,000 mg of vitamin C to fight an

infection, 7,000 mg won't do. The key is to take enough C, take it

often enough, and take it long enough.

http://www.doctoryourself.com/ortho_c.html

 

 

ABSTRACTA method of utilizing vitamin C in amounts just short of the

doses which produce diarrhea is described (TITRATING TO BOWEL

TOLERANCE). The amount of oral ascorbic acid tolerated by a patient

without producing diarrhea increases somewhat proportionately to the

stress or toxicity of his disease. Bowel tolerance doses of ascorbic

acid ameliorate the acute symptoms of many diseases. Lesser doses

often have little effect on acute symptoms but assist the body in

handling the stress of disease and may reduce the morbidity of the

disease. However, if doses of ascorbate are not provided to satisfy

this potential draw on the nutrient, first local tissues involved in

the disease, then the blood, and then the body in general become

deplete of ascorbate (ANASCORBEMIA and ACUTE INDUCED SCURVY). The

patient is thereby put at risk for complications of metabolic

processes known to be dependent upon ascorbate.

http://www.doctoryourself.com/titration.html

 

http://www.vitamincfoundation.org

http://www.cforyourself.com

http://www.orthomed.com

http://www.orthomed.org

 

 

RETHINKING HEMOCHROMATOSIS AND VITAMIN C...

http://www.vitamincfoundation.org/faq.html

 

RETHINKING HEART DISEASE AND VITAMIN C

http://www.hon.ch/News/HSN/514162.html

 

 

Report: Vitamins C Lowers LDL Cholesterol More than Statins...

http://www.internetwks.com/billcook/BillCookPR.htm

 

 

" " I've never seen such a drop in cholesterol numbers... If

cardiologists knew this, they would be recommending Pauling's vitamin

C/lysine therapy to all their patients. " William Cook's Doctor after

seeing

[Lab reports]) http://www.internetwks.com/billcook/

Report: Vitamins C and Unique E Erase EKG Evidence of Heart

Attacks...

http://www.internetwks.com/CarolSmithPR.htm

 

" These EKGs don't look like they are from the same person " (Robert

Waters, MD, after examing Carl Smith's 1997 and 2003 EKG printouts.)

 

Interview: Vitamin C and Heart Disease... Foundation's cofounder two

hour interview on Americans Freedom Radio Network (May 2003, Requires

RealPlayer) http://vitamincfoundation.org/radio/

 

Why They Lie...

http://www.internetwks.com/owen/TwilightZone.htm

 

 

Lowering Lp(a) with Ascorbate, Lysine and Proline.Our Grant

Application to Study Pauling Therapy for Heart Disease that was

submitted to the Federal NIH National Center for Complimentary and

Alternative Medicine... DENIED!!

http://vitamincfoundation.org/NCCAMgrant/

 

Join Internet Study: Is Vitamin C a Risk Factor in Heart Disease?...

http://www.internetwks.com/pauling/survey.htm

 

COLOSSAL MEDICAL BLUNDER?

http://www.paulingtherapy.com/

 

Vitamin C Does Not Cause Kidney Stones!!!

http://www.vitamincfoundation.org/news.htm#KIDNEY