Stop Smoking

December 7, 2004

Dear Attilio,

Thus far, my experience is that fresh lime or lemon a few drops regularly

on the tongue does not go well with the smoking it usually changes the taste

of the smoke.

Also ask them to inhale air every time deeply at least three or more times

everytime they are about to smoke, this creates an antagonistic effect (at

least in my experience).

Also tell them not to worry if theystart to get coughing up phlegm, it is a

good thing the lung qi and yin getting stronger.

Things that can wake up the sense of smell and taste are usually

recommended.

Probably, some one like Health concern or ITM have devised a general formula

for people that are chronic smokers and wants to stop, it might be a

starting place.

Read somewhere that smoking consumes lung yin any more ideas creating

upperjao heat?

All addiction in one way or other is related to desire so maybe water fire

aspect, both from five phases and zang fu perspective might be interesting

to contemplate.

Consider the sleep...

Would like to hear others comments and opinions...

Marco

>

> Hi all,

>

> Does anyone have any good advice on additional lifestyle changes for a

> patient that wants to stop smoking.

>

> I'll be using the standard NADA points aswell as additional body points.

> He's on a formula for a different condition and wants to stop smoking.

>

> Will need additional lifestyle advice to back up my course of treatment.

>

> Any recommendations?

December 7, 2004

Dear Attilio,

I have found that recommending 20 - 30 minutes of aerobic workout (for those who

are in appropriate physical condition) daily for 4 - 6 weeks can be very

beneficial. Make sure this will not exacerbate any other conditions and have

them start slowly, of course. Smokers tend to inhale deeply when smoking, and

when they quit they are no longer breathing deeply. This exercise forces them

to breathe deeply and can help the lungs to detox. The attendant energy boost

and benefits to their overall health tend to strongly reinforce the process and

make relapses less likely.

Kim Blankenship, L.Ac.

Attilio D'Alberto <attiliodalberto wrote:

Hi all,

Does anyone have any good advice on additional lifestyle changes for a

patient that wants to stop smoking.

I'll be using the standard NADA points aswell as additional body points.

He's on a formula for a different condition and wants to stop smoking.

Will need additional lifestyle advice to back up my course of treatment.

Any recommendations?

Kind regards

Attilio D'Alberto

Doctor of (Beijing, China)

BSc (Hons) TCM MATCM

07786198900

attiliodalberto

<http://www.attiliodalberto.com/> www.attiliodalberto.com

December 7, 2004

Attilio: I took a workshop on a stop smoking program for acupuncture

designed around 5 element acupuncture. I have only used it for one

patient - he had good results. I plan to incorporate it in a group

format. Basically the idea is to change behaviors - remove yourself

from the trigger of when you smoke. You start by charting when you do

smoke and what's around it. Then if you smoke in the morning in the

house with a cup of coffee you change that. You go out of the house and

consciously smoke without the coffee. That is one very effective aspect

of it. There is a lot of education and working around the 5E's,

breathing exercises, Qi Gong. If you want more info on the program,

email me privatley and I will give you a contact.

I thought the other suggestions given here were helpful too.

Anne

Attilio D'Alberto wrote:

> Hi all,

>

> Does anyone have any good advice on additional lifestyle changes for a

> patient that wants to stop smoking.

>

> I'll be using the standard NADA points aswell as additional body points.

> He's on a formula for a different condition and wants to stop smoking.

>

> Will need additional lifestyle advice to back up my course of treatment.

>

> Any recommendations?

>

> Kind regards

>

> Attilio D'Alberto

> Doctor of (Beijing, China)

> BSc (Hons) TCM MATCM

> 07786198900

> attiliodalberto

> <http://www.attiliodalberto.com/> www.attiliodalberto.com

>

December 8, 2004

Thanks so much Laura, I will add this to my thinking on this stop

smoking. I live in a town called Port Tobacco. There are resturants in

the Southern part of Charles County, MD that are smoking only. So there

is a definite need and I have been wanting to do some group work around

this. Thanks again.

Anne

heylaurag wrote:

>

> Hi Josie, Attilio and all, That was a great post Josie. I thought

> I'd share something I use:

>

> Stop Smoking Support Program

> by By Leah Martino, OMD, L.Ac.

> Homepage

> Acupuncture Index

>

> After setting the appointment for my first smoking treatment as a new

> practitioner 12 years ago. I looked up the protocol. Only one

> paragraph outlined the treatment points and frequency of treatment.

> End of subject. Sound familiar?

>

> I administered the auricular treatment, sent the patient home and

> hoped for the best. There were times when this treatment worked.

> However, my results over time didn't equal my expectations. It wasn't

> until I learned that acupuncture only reduces nicotine cravings that

> I realized I didn't really understand the role of acupuncture and

> hadn't been coaching my patients properly.

>

> Later I received an announcement from James S. Olms, M.D., regarding

> the discovery of a new point, Tim Mee and the resulting successes for

> patients trying to stop smoking.

>

> Adding that point to my protocol showed promise. Over the years I

> continued to gather information about smoking. Through trial and

> error I gained further insight and developed a comprehensive stop-

> smoking program that gives effective and lasting results. There are

> numerous smoking-cessation point formulas, all of which can be quite

> effective. But there is no " magic bullet " treatment that can make the

> detox experience disappear. A successful acupuncture program requires

> proper case management which includes patient preparation, patient

> commitment, and education about what acupuncture will and will not

> do.

>

> There are five steps to the stop-smoking program I developed:

>

> telephone consultation;

> patient information;

> acupuncture treatment;

> herbal treatment; and

> maintenance.

>

> TELEPHONE CONSULTATION

> The telephone consultation is important, so your office staff needs

> to be properly trained. Along with the fear of quitting smoking and

> the fear of acupuncture in general, it takes lots of courage for a

> person to make the call. This is a time you can offer hope and

> encouragement. You can also weed out those who are not yet ready to

> quit.

>

> Speak personally to the person who wants to quit smoking. Explain

> that acupuncture is an effective tool to enable one to quit smoking

> by minimizing cravings, calming the nervous system and strengthening

> will power. Acupuncture can only work if the person is ready to quit

> and willing to commit to the process. I always mention that I've

> helped many people successfully quit smoking.

> Explain what people can expect acupuncture to do for them.

> Acupuncture intercepts messages sent by the brain to the body that

> demand more nicotine, thereby disrupting the addictive process. It

> can eliminate most cravings, but not the habit. Generally the

> treatment reduces cravings from 20 plus to only 3-5 a day. The

> person's responsibility is to make it through those few cravings,

> which you will discuss in greater detail at the initial appointment

> Outline your treatment program - how many visits, how often, cost,

> etc. Ask if the person is ready to quit now and would like to set an

> appointment.

> Set a morning appointment when possible. Acupuncture works best if

> the person is in detox. Instruct the client to refrain from smoking

> upon awakening, or for at least five hours before the treatment.

>

> PATIENT INFORMATION HANDOUT

> At the initial office visit I give a handout to the patient with the

> following instructions:

>

> Support Person - The decision to stop smoking can elicit

> uncomfortable emotions. Ask someone who is available to you in the

> next few weeks to act as a sounding board and provide encouragement

> when needed.

>

> Affirmation - An affirmation is a positive statement repeated often

> to create desired changes in your life. Repeating the affirmation

> helps not only to remind you why you are no longer smoking but

> imprints a new image of health so that the body can then produce

> health. Examples: " I am a non-smoker. I make healthy choices in my

> life. "

>

> Setting Boundaries - Set up contracts with other smokers to refrain

> from smoking in your presence. This includes spouses. When possible

> stay away from smokers until you feel more confident with your

> nonsmoking health status.

>

> Drink water - Research shows that dryness causes cravings. Sip water

> frequently throughout the day.

>

> Refrain from drinking coffee - Research shows that coffee causes

> cravings and dehydrates the body.

>

> Food choices - Eat a lot of carrots. celery and other vegetables

> throughout the next few days. Candies upset blood sugar level, which

> can aggravate smoking-withdrawal symptoms. Sugar substitutes such as

> NutraSweet are sweeter than sugar and cause further sugar cravings.

>

> Managing cravings - Cravings feel like they will last forever but

> actually fade in two minutes. Plan what you will do during a craving.

> Examples: Take your herbs; repeat your affirmation; breathe deeply;

> walk to another place; sing a song; dance; call your support person.

>

> ACUPUNCTURE TREATMENT

> During the initial treatment instruct patients to refrain from

> smoking or having any cigarettes in their possession. If they make it

> through the next 24 hours smoke-free, they have a 90% chance of being

> successful. I give four treatments total, two the first week, two

> days apart, and two follow-up appointments a week apart. I've tried

> many ear points and find the following points work best:

>

> Ear points:

> Shenmen-alleviates tension

> Kidney- increases will power

> Master Point Zero (Nogier system) returns the body to homeostatic

> balance

> Lung 1 or 2 - relieves withdrawal symptoms

> Hunger - Diminishes appetite and cravings.

>

> Body points:

> Tim Mee-located at the level of Lung 7, proximal to L.I. 5 in a

> depression between the tendons that make up the anatomical snuffbox.

> Perpendicular needle insertion.

> LI 4 (Hegu) - pacifies spirit, regulates chi and blood.

>

> Treatment Method:

> Treat ear and body points on one side only, alternating sides with

> each visit. Using electrical stimulation, connect a positive (red)

> clip to ear Shen Men and negative (black) clip to hand Tim Mee, and

> positive (red) clip to hand LI-4 and negative (black) to ear Lung 1

> or 2 using 10 Hz for 40-45 minutes. After removing the needles, apply

> either ear press needles or silver magrain pellets to the ear points.

>

> HERBS

> There are three areas to address for herbal support:

>

> Lung yin tonic. Remember that dryness causes cravings.

> Liver Qi stagnation.

> Craving Support.

>

> Any quality herbal products can be used. I use Seven Forest Lily 14

> by ITM, similar to Ophiopogon Combination, for lung yin support.

> Although clients don't feel a direct effect from Lily 14, when I

> added it to my treatment, they reported a feeling of sustenance

> and " not running on empty. " I recommend a second bottle and many

> people continue taking it for months. Other formulas may be indicated

> if there is lung disease.

>

> Ardisia 16 (Seven Forest by ITM), similar to Bupleurum Dragon Bone,

> helps relieve irritability and anxiety associated with detox. I

> instruct the client to take it three times a day for two days, then

> on an as-needed basis. Many people use this formula to help them

> through stressful situations. I believe it helps minimize relapse.

>

> Allertox Tobacco by Apex Energetics, is a homeopathic remedy which

> relieves tobacco cravings. Any homeopathic formulas for smoking

> cessation could be helpful. I haven't used Chinese smelling herbs,

> but they would probably serve the same purpose.

>

> MAINTENANCE

> After the initial four treatments, the focus becomes wellness, so

> differential diagnosis and constitutional work is appropriate. I

> recommend monthly treatments for four to six months. I usually

> include auricular points in the treatment since patients generally

> look forward to the treatment that gave them results.

>

> RECIDIVISM

> No one expects a person to quit drinking alcohol by attending a few

> AA meetings. Quitting smoking is only the tip of the iceberg.

>

> There are a lot of triggers that can cause relapse. Cigarettes can

> act as a shield to insulate uncomfortable feelings and situations. A

> new nonsmoker can feel vulnerable and confused when trying to handle

> a stressful situation. Monthly treatments provide support and bring

> the person back into harmony. It is not our job to provide therapy.

> However, we can help the client clarify feelings. If a person " slips "

> and smokes, question what was really at issue, and how could the

> person handle it differently. Relapse is often part of the process.

>

> It is important to change the negative, failure concept in assessing

> what happened and how the person can use the experience to prevent

> the situation from occurring again. Encourage people to call

> immediately if necessary to get back on track. People sometimes

> request to try quitting wit fewer sessions, or without herbs. I

> remember Iris Gold's words of wisdom in her practice building

> seminar, " This is the way I work. " I tell people, " If you follow my

> program you will be successful. " Compromise is rarely effective.

>

> I built some of my practice around my smoking program. I find this

> work to be very rewarding and beneficial for future referrals.

> Smoking treatments are an effective way to increase credibility of

> our profession and to help mainstream acupuncture into modern health

> care.

>

> ----

> ----------

>

> Resource listings do not signify an endorsement of the products

> mentioned in this article. For more information, please contact:

>

> Institute for Traditional Medcine (Lily 14, Ardisia 16) at 800-544-

> 7504, Longherb Health Products, Inc., 800-766-5372, (Chinese smelling

> herbs) and Apex Energetics, 800-736-4381 (Allertox Tobacco).

>

> Institute for Traditional Medicine Aromatic herbs as an adjunct to

> acupuncture stop-smoking treatment programs: Longherb Health

> Products, Inc. 3007 E. Washington Avenue Fairfield, IA 52556 Tel:

> (800) 766-5372 Allertox Tobacco, by Futureplex

>

> Reprinted with permission form the California Journal of Oriental

> Medicine.

>

> © Acupuncture.com 2004,

>

> Chinese Medicine , " Josie Donahue

> Hermes " <medicinemom@m...> wrote:

> > attilio,

> > for my patients that want to quit smoking- I've found the best

> > results when they are willing to come in 3 x for the first 2wks

> then

> > 2x wk for 2 wks then weekly and so on, tapering the treatments.

> This

> > is difficult for most people to afford financially -but that is

> what

> > I suggest for best results.

> >

> > It is frustrating when a person wants to try acupuncture to quit

> > smoking- only to have one treatment and then declare- " Acupuncture

> > doesnt work " .

> >

> > I make this point clear. The person has their addiction 24 hrs a

> day

> > for however long- acupuncture will help - but the patient does have

> > to work at it too.To expect one treatment to cure an addiciton in

> one

> > treatment is not reasonable for most people. That is like saying " I

> > skipped lunch, why aren't I thin yet? "

> >

> > I did have one patient who stopped smoking after her first

> > treatment.I really cant take credit for her success. She was

> > extremely committed and ready. She came for 3 wks or so- with out

> > having smoked between sessions. She was still not smoking 2 yrs

> > later. This was very unusual -at least in my practice. In her case -

>

> > I really believe that she was ready and willing to quit.

> >

> > I also remind them to drink alot of water throughout the day.

> >

> > Have some healthy snacks readily available.

> >

> > Do some sort of physical exercise- even if it is only walking.

> >

> > Engage in another activity that will hold their interest for a

> while,

> > something that can be interrupted and picked up and put down again -

>

> > preferably something that shows tangible results- such as

> gardening,

> > drawing, knitting.

> >

> > I also share with them what other people told me has worked for

> them.

> > For example, one man told me that for weeks before he planned to

> quit

> > smoking - he would empty his ashtrays into clear jars. He would

> leave

> > these throughout his house. He found the sight and smell disgusting

> > and it reinforced his will to stop smoking.

> >

> > It is also helpful for the patient to say to themselves " smoking is

> a

> > dirty habit and it is very unhealthy. " It is very difficult to

> > disagree with yourself.

> >

> > Also since more and more places have a 'no smoking " rule - the

> > patient could remind themselves that smoking is also very

> > inconvenient and cumbersome.

> >

> > Remind them of how much money they are spending on sabotaging their

> > health. Ask them if they can think of other things to spend the

> money

> > on.

> >

> > I often advise people not to drink alcohol when they are first

> > quitting because many people crave a cigarette with their drink.

> This

> > can also be true of marijuana.

> >

> > It is important to remember - as with any addiction- relapses

> happen.

> > when it does, don't give up. Just start again. The first few wks

> are

> > the hardest. It does get easier. keep trying.

> >

> > Josie

> >

> > ---- Begin Original Message ----

> >

> > " Attilio D'Alberto " <attiliodalberto>

> > Tue, 7 Dec 2004 15:07:46 -0000

> > <Chinese Medicine >

> > Stop Smoking

> >

> > Hi all,

> >

> > Does anyone have any good advice on additional lifestyle changes

> for a

> > patient that wants to stop smoking.

> >

> > I'll be using the standard NADA points aswell as additional body

> > points.

> > He's on a formula for a different condition and wants to stop

> > smoking.

> >

> > Will need additional lifestyle advice to back up my course of

> > treatment.

> >

> > Any recommendations?

> >

> > Kind regards

> >

> > Attilio D'Alberto

> > Doctor of (Beijing, China)

> > BSc (Hons) TCM MATCM

> > 07786198900

> > attiliodalberto

> > <http://www.attiliodalberto.com/> www.attiliodalberto.com

December 9, 2004

> I think you are right about regular treatments and I have never sold

them in " packages " , although LOTs of people do I've noticed. I think it

may be different for stop smoking as it is a set program, low cost, and

for many people, the money " up front " is an additional insentive. I

could be wrong about that.

Also, the reason " prepay " is in general illegal is because insurance

companies are left out of the loop. Practitioners (chiros are famous for

this) will offer these reduced-cost treatment packages to patients but

never to insurance companies, so it's insurance fraud. I offer my same

stop smoking package price to the insurance company and several have paid

for it.

I know of an acupuncturist who sells 40 treatments up front (on the

patients first vist, no less!) for $2200. The problem is, by the 3rd or

4th visit, the patient has decided they don't like the practitioner. They

and their money are SOL.

>

> Pam,

> I would like to share with you a sad story about a practitioner in San

> Diego

> who was arrested for having his patients pay upfront. He also conducted

> his

> business in an unethical manner. He had his licensed suspended.

>

> When I was researching the issue of prepay for a seminar that I had put

> together I ran across an online article on a decision by the NAIC

> (national

> association of insurance commissioners). They issued an opinion based

> upon

> the way practitioners of healthcare were conducting business and the legal

> definition of insurance. Their conclusion was that prepay is the

> conducting

> of insurance and warned providers to contact their own insurance boards

> for

> further clarification and guidelines. This article seemed to target the

> chiropractors as they were mentioned. I have heard and seen many ads by

> this group advertising discounted wellness services for prepayment. They

> also encouraged the state insurance commisioners to start enforcement. If

> it was up to me I would not risk it. If you have further questions, let

> me

> know. Later

> Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

>

>> " Pam Price " <needledoc2

>>Chinese Medicine

>><Chinese Medicine >

>>Re: Stop Smoking

>>Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:33:45 -0800

>>

>>Hi, all,

>>I have stop smoking patients pay for 5 tx up front. They are more than

>>willing to use them up, as the plan is 5 consecutive days. Since I work

>> Tu,

>>We, Th now, have changed it to 3 consecutive days and two followups the

>>next

>>week. Also, even though they may want to discontinue tx, the only way for

>>non-used days is via check mailed to them or they can have their non-used

>>money credited to another patient. Keeping the money in your clinic is

>> the

>>key!

>>

>>Since I'm on a roll with finances here, we are not banks. Therefore, for

>>any

>>appointment, collect your money upfront (day of treatment), including

>>copays. If you do insurance billing, companies do not want you billing

>>their

>>clients for any reason. Living in a state capitol where money is very

>> tight

>>for my patients, most have benefits for AP. There are many money

>> management

>>tips that your local Chamber of Commerce, network group, or bank will be

>>happy to enlighten you with any questions you have.

>>

>>Happy holidays, all,

>>Pam Price

>> >

>> > Many thanks to all for your positive replies.

>> >

>> > I too have treated a number of stop-smoking patients. They often think

>> > that

>> > acupuncture is the magic-bullet and will make it so easy to stop. They

>> > usually have one treatment and then don't come back.

December 9, 2004

Anyone who parts with $2,200 upfront to a relative

stranger must be EXTREMELY desperate, or an absolute

fool!!!

John Garbarini

--- bbeale wrote:

>

> > I think you are right about regular treatments and

> I have never sold

> them in " packages " , although LOTs of people do I've

> noticed. I think it

> may be different for stop smoking as it is a set

> program, low cost, and

> for many people, the money " up front " is an

> additional insentive. I

> could be wrong about that.

>

> Also, the reason " prepay " is in general illegal is

> because insurance

> companies are left out of the loop. Practitioners

> (chiros are famous for

> this) will offer these reduced-cost treatment

> packages to patients but

> never to insurance companies, so it's insurance

> fraud. I offer my same

> stop smoking package price to the insurance company

> and several have paid

> for it.

>

> I know of an acupuncturist who sells 40 treatments

> up front (on the

> patients first vist, no less!) for $2200. The

> problem is, by the 3rd or

> 4th visit, the patient has decided they don't like

> the practitioner. They

> and their money are SOL.

> >

> > Pam,

> > I would like to share with you a sad story about a

> practitioner in San

> > Diego

> > who was arrested for having his patients pay

> upfront. He also conducted

> > his

> > business in an unethical manner. He had his

> licensed suspended.

> >

> > When I was researching the issue of prepay for a

> seminar that I had put

> > together I ran across an online article on a

> decision by the NAIC

> > (national

> > association of insurance commissioners). They

> issued an opinion based

> > upon

> > the way practitioners of healthcare were

> conducting business and the legal

> > definition of insurance. Their conclusion was

> that prepay is the

> > conducting

> > of insurance and warned providers to contact their

> own insurance boards

> > for

> > further clarification and guidelines. This

> article seemed to target the

> > chiropractors as they were mentioned. I have

> heard and seen many ads by

> > this group advertising discounted wellness

> services for prepayment. They

> > also encouraged the state insurance commisioners

> to start enforcement. If

> > it was up to me I would not risk it. If you have

> further questions, let

> > me

> > know. Later

> > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

> >

> >> " Pam Price " <needledoc2

> >>

> Chinese Medicine

> >><Chinese Medicine >

> >>Re: Stop Smoking

> >>Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:33:45 -0800

> >>

> >>Hi, all,

> >>I have stop smoking patients pay for 5 tx up

> front. They are more than

> >>willing to use them up, as the plan is 5

> consecutive days. Since I work

> >> Tu,

> >>We, Th now, have changed it to 3 consecutive days

> and two followups the

> >>next

> >>week. Also, even though they may want to

> discontinue tx, the only way for

> >>non-used days is via check mailed to them or they

> can have their non-used

> >>money credited to another patient. Keeping the

> money in your clinic is

> >> the

> >>key!

> >>

> >>Since I'm on a roll with finances here, we are not

> banks. Therefore, for

> >>any

> >>appointment, collect your money upfront (day of

> treatment), including

> >>copays. If you do insurance billing, companies do

> not want you billing

> >>their

> >>clients for any reason. Living in a state capitol

> where money is very

> >> tight

> >>for my patients, most have benefits for AP. There

> are many money

> >> management

> >>tips that your local Chamber of Commerce, network

> group, or bank will be

> >>happy to enlighten you with any questions you

> have.

> >>

> >>Happy holidays, all,

> >>Pam Price

> >> >

> >> > Many thanks to all for your positive replies.

> >> >

> >> > I too have treated a number of stop-smoking

> patients. They often think

> >> > that

> >> > acupuncture is the magic-bullet and will make

> it so easy to stop. They

> >> > usually have one treatment and then don't come

> back.

>

Send holiday email and support a worthy cause. Do good.

http://celebrity.mail.

December 9, 2004

I would like to say that when a patient pays money upfront for a future

service, this is the conducting of insurance. That is the definition of

insurance. The way medicine is conducted is that payment is received at

time of visit (co-pay paid) and insurance billed. This all happens with

regards to time of service and for that or pervious services. Timing is

important to remember. We are not allowed to collect for future services as

described below unless we have a certificate to conduct insurance. The

practitioner who charged all of these people owes them any money that did

nor cover services, period. In fact, the example of the practitioner I

listed below did just this type of scam and got caught. He required people

to pay huge sums of money up front. He was prosecuted for ethical

misconduct amongst other things. This is important to understand if you

have questions on this issue contact your state insurance board or an

attorney. Later

Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

>bbeale

>Chinese Medicine

>Re: Stop Smoking

>Thu, 9 Dec 2004 08:22:21 -0800 (PST)

>

> > I think you are right about regular treatments and I have never sold

>them in " packages " , although LOTs of people do I've noticed. I think it

>may be different for stop smoking as it is a set program, low cost, and

>for many people, the money " up front " is an additional insentive. I

>could be wrong about that.

>

>Also, the reason " prepay " is in general illegal is because insurance

>companies are left out of the loop. Practitioners (chiros are famous for

>this) will offer these reduced-cost treatment packages to patients but

>never to insurance companies, so it's insurance fraud. I offer my same

>stop smoking package price to the insurance company and several have paid

>for it.

>

>I know of an acupuncturist who sells 40 treatments up front (on the

>patients first vist, no less!) for $2200. The problem is, by the 3rd or

>4th visit, the patient has decided they don't like the practitioner. They

>and their money are SOL.

> >

> > Pam,

> > I would like to share with you a sad story about a practitioner in San

> > Diego

> > who was arrested for having his patients pay upfront. He also conducted

> > his

> > business in an unethical manner. He had his licensed suspended.

> >

> > When I was researching the issue of prepay for a seminar that I had put

> > together I ran across an online article on a decision by the NAIC

> > (national

> > association of insurance commissioners). They issued an opinion based

> > upon

> > the way practitioners of healthcare were conducting business and the

>legal

> > definition of insurance. Their conclusion was that prepay is the

> > conducting

> > of insurance and warned providers to contact their own insurance boards

> > for

> > further clarification and guidelines. This article seemed to target the

> > chiropractors as they were mentioned. I have heard and seen many ads by

> > this group advertising discounted wellness services for prepayment.

>They

> > also encouraged the state insurance commisioners to start enforcement.

>If

> > it was up to me I would not risk it. If you have further questions, let

> > me

> > know. Later

> > Mike W. Bowser, L Ac

> >

> >> " Pam Price " <needledoc2

> >>Chinese Medicine

> >><Chinese Medicine >

> >>Re: Stop Smoking

> >>Wed, 8 Dec 2004 14:33:45 -0800

> >>

> >>Hi, all,

> >>I have stop smoking patients pay for 5 tx up front. They are more than

> >>willing to use them up, as the plan is 5 consecutive days. Since I work

> >> Tu,

> >>We, Th now, have changed it to 3 consecutive days and two followups the

> >>next

> >>week. Also, even though they may want to discontinue tx, the only way

>for

> >>non-used days is via check mailed to them or they can have their

>non-used

> >>money credited to another patient. Keeping the money in your clinic is

> >> the

> >>key!

> >>

> >>Since I'm on a roll with finances here, we are not banks. Therefore, for

> >>any

> >>appointment, collect your money upfront (day of treatment), including

> >>copays. If you do insurance billing, companies do not want you billing

> >>their

> >>clients for any reason. Living in a state capitol where money is very

> >> tight

> >>for my patients, most have benefits for AP. There are many money

> >> management

> >>tips that your local Chamber of Commerce, network group, or bank will be

> >>happy to enlighten you with any questions you have.

> >>

> >>Happy holidays, all,

> >>Pam Price

> >> >

> >> > Many thanks to all for your positive replies.

> >> >

> >> > I too have treated a number of stop-smoking patients. They often

>think

> >> > that

> >> > acupuncture is the magic-bullet and will make it so easy to stop.

>They

> >> > usually have one treatment and then don't come back.

>

December 9, 2004

What about " gift-certificates " that people buy for others. Where does that fall?

mike Bowser <naturaldoc1 wrote: