Guest guest Posted March 14, 2004 Report Share Posted March 14, 2004 wrote : > New file uploaded to > > fda_petition.pdf This is really good! Is there any way to get the three national professional organizations to sign on or back this in some way? The FDA and our legislators should be made to know that the licensed practitioners in this country are in support of this petition, especially in light of pending bills H.R.435 (house) and S.R.260 (senate). Judy Saxe, L.Ac. Qing Ting Acupuncture LLC Denver, Colorado (303) 964-1996 http://www.QingTingAcupuncture.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Yes, how do we demonstrate our support for this? Judy Saxe <jsaxe wrote: wrote : > New file uploaded to > > fda_petition.pdf This is really good! Is there any way to get the three national professional organizations to sign on or back this in some way? The FDA and our legislators should be made to know that the licensed practitioners in this country are in support of this petition, especially in light of pending bills H.R.435 (house) and S.R.260 (senate). Judy Saxe, L.Ac. Qing Ting Acupuncture LLC Denver, Colorado (303) 964-1996 http://www.QingTingAcupuncture.com Chinese Herbal Medicine offers various professional services, including board approved continuing education classes, an annual conference and a free discussion forum in Chinese Herbal Medicine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 If you're talking about the AHPA petition to halt implementation of the FDA ban on all Ma Huang and Ban Xia dietary supplements, it was decided by the Chinese herbal vendor members of AHPA that this particular petition should only come from AHPA. That being said, it is crucial that our entire profession get involved in this fight -- AAOM, National Alliance, CCAOM, and ALL state orgs. What is at stake here is our ability to prescribe Chinese medicinals in ready-made form. This would affect the incomes of schools (who teach herbal medicine as a large part of their curriculum), vendors of herbal meds, and practitioners who sell ready-made meds out of their offices all under the aegis of DSHEA. While we can probably all live without Ma Huang, think of all the Rxs that contain Ban Xia. Even more ominously, the FDA just happened on the Japanese study which analyzed Ban Xia for ephedrine alkaloids a number of years ago. This was totally serendipitous on their part. Who knows how many Chinese herbs contain some ephredine alkaloids? If we let this ruling stand, then all the FDA has to do to gut our materia medica and render it inoperable is to analyze more herbs looking for any trace amounts of ephedrine alkaloids. The head honchos FDA has made it clear in public statements that they do not support DSHEA. They (and the AMA) have also made it clear that they believe any substance which shows an active biological therapeautic effect should be classified and regulated as a drug. As a total profession, it is imperative that we lobby and fight, by all means possible, for minimum accpetable levels of ephedrine alkaloids. I just can't believe that Ban Xia is the only other med in our arsenal that contains these. Personally, I agree with Ron who said two days ago that we need to stop this ruling's implementation with a law suit. I think there are unfair restriction of trade issues here. If ephedrine alkaloid bearing products can be sold OTC by drug companies, it seems an unfair restraint of trade to disallow out products, none of which have ever been associated (as far as I know) with an adverse event due to ephedrine alkaoids. Unfortunately, mounting a law suit against a branch of the Federal government requires big bucks -- the kind of big bucks only the schools and some of the vendors have (others not). However, if practitioners really understood the danger here to our practice of Chinese medicine, then we all should be willing to ante up. If Howard Dean could collect millions of dollars from lots of small donations, so could/can we. BTW, although I hate to say this, the Democrats are on the wrong side of this issue. On this one issue, the Republicans are actually our friends. Ironic, isn't it? What a strange situation. There are also other Libertarian groups out there who are against the FDA. " The enemy of my enemy... " Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 , " Bob Flaws " < pemachophel2001> wrote: > As a total profession, it is imperative that we lobby and fight, by all means possible, for minimum accpetable levels of ephedrine > alkaloids. I just can't believe that Ban Xia is the only other med in our arsenal that contains these. we need to devote all our short term efforts to getting ban xia and other herbs with ephedrine alkaloids below a certain level excluded from this rule. I think ma huang is history. spending money to reclassify it or create a new TCM remedy category will take forever and in the meantime, we lose ban xia and many small companies are destroyed in the process. The TCM remedy category should be our long term gol, though. I also do not believe the fact that sudafed is sold OTC is not the basis for legal action vis a vis restraint of trade. sudafed meets the criteria for a legal class of substances - OTC drugs. If ma huang is not a dietary supplement, there is no other existing class it can be put in that will allow legal use by us. It will not be returned to shelves under the auspices of DSHEA and if it is classed as an old rx drug, it is still out of our hands. Such a lawsuit could only result in two things, the banning of sudafed or outright dismissal. We need to be focused on a goal we can achieve that will do the most damage control for the least cost. every penny right now should go towards the issue of ban xia and legitimate use of such substances that have no reasonable possibility of being abused. Ma huang can easily be abused, but the FDA has illegally roped in ban xia without meeting the burden of proof demanded of them by DSHEA. I believe DHSEA gives them the right to ban specific substances if they prove harm. I do not believe it gives them the right to ban entire clases of naturally occurring biochemicals. It would be like banning arsenic from the food supply and then delaring all vegetable toxic substances for the trace amounts they contain. this was not the intent of DSHEA. Bob is right. the dems can go to hellon this one. Orrin Hatch from Utah, the ultra right wing mormon antiabortionist, is our main ally in this battle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 > we need to devote all our short term efforts to getting ban xia and other herbs > with ephedrine alkaloids below a certain level excluded from this rule. I agree. I think > ma huang is history. Me too. The TCM remedy category should be our long term goal, though. You mean legislation legalizing Chinese medicine as a separate category of medicines? I just can't see that happening. Do you really think that's in the realm of possibility? Obviously, that'd be wonderful. > > We need to be focused on a goal we can achieve that will do the most damage > control for the least cost. every penny right now should go towards the issue > of ban xia and legitimate use of such substances that have no reasonable > possibility of being abused. Agreed. Orrin Hatch from Utah, the ultra > right wing mormon antiabortionist, is our main ally in this battle. > Adversity makes for strange bedfellows. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 <They (and the AMA) have also made it clear that they believe any substance which shows an active biological therapeautic effect should be classified and regulated as a drug.> I heard this statement made on NPR not too long ago, and thought it was a joke then and still do now. Obviously, food can have an active biological therapeutic effect. So, what's next? Are we going to have to get a prescription and go to the pharmacy for our groceries. Sean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 Sean, Would that it were a joke. I heard the same NPR program. It is no joke. Some s (unfortunately very powerful s) really think this way. DSHEA is the only thing between us and Big Brother's abolishment of our right to prescribe ready-made Chinese medicine to our patients, and the FDA would just as well see DSHEA go away. They didn't like it when it was enacted and they don't like it now. Their motto, " In loco parentis. " Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 > Who knows how many Chinese herbs contain some > ephredine alkaloids? Undoubtedly there are many others. I use Sida rhombifolia which is known to contain ephedrine. ************************* David Bruce Leonard, L.Ac. Medicine at your Feet 'Awapuhi Health Sanctuary http://www.medicineatyourfeet.com http://www.awapuhihealth.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 Bob, You are right it is all horribly true. I should have written that I thought that statement was farcical. Hope everyone is writing their reps. See you at KaiLuum.... Sean Bob Flaws [pemachophel2001] Tuesday, March 16, 2004 5:45 PM Re: FDA petition Sean, Would that it were a joke. I heard the same NPR program. It is no joke. Some s (unfortunately very powerful s) really think this way. DSHEA is the only thing between us and Big Brother's abolishment of our right to prescribe ready-made Chinese medicine to our patients, and the FDA would just as well see DSHEA go away. They didn't like it when it was enacted and they don't like it now. Their motto, " In loco parentis. " Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 16, 2004 Report Share Posted March 16, 2004 Bob Flaws wrote : > Personally, I agree with Ron who said two days ago that we need to stop this > ruling's implementation with a law suit. I think there are > unfair restriction of trade issues here. We also need to do our best to keep H.R.435 (House) and S.R.260 (Senate) from being passed. see http://tinyurl.com/yw4qr for info on H.R.435 and http://tinyurl.com/38sb8 for info on S.R.260. Judy Saxe, L.Ac. Qing Ting Acupuncture LLC Denver, Colorado (303) 964-1996 http://www.QingTingAcupuncture.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 17, 2004 Report Share Posted March 17, 2004 Sean, Writing reps is probably not a very effective strategy at this point in time. the only way to stop this juggernaut is going to be through (expensive) litigation. Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 17, 2009 Report Share Posted August 17, 2009 Hi miss Pedrites, I am looking at your website and I tried to sign the petition against FDA globalization... It is very hard to find that petition and the website presens itself with errors in the page. Where is that petition? Thanks LMT ATFE2 Beadhussy Mon, 17 Aug 2009 14:14:17 -0700 Re: [ATFE2] OT-quick view of subjest lines Snicker. On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:43 PM, Liz <liztams wrote: > > > -- Kathleen Petrides Bead Hussy http://www.BeadHussy.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 18, 2009 Report Share Posted August 18, 2009 Durned if I know. I'll go see where it is. I believe it was just a link TO the petition. The petition was never on my website. But I'll go check things out and see what's happening. K On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Lavinia Tulcan <tulcanlawrote: > > > > Hi miss Pedrites, > > I am looking at your website and I tried to sign the petition against FDA > globalization... > > It is very hard to find that petition and the website presens itself with > errors in the page. > > Where is that petition? > > Thanks > > LMT > > ATFE2 <ATFE2%40> > Beadhussy <Beadhussy%40gmail.com> > Mon, 17 Aug 2009 14:14:17 -0700 > Re: [ATFE2] OT-quick view of subjest lines > > Snicker. > > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:43 PM, Liz <liztams<liztams%40gmail.com>> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > -- > Kathleen Petrides > Bead Hussy > http://www.BeadHussy.com <http://www.beadhussy.com/> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 18, 2009 Report Share Posted August 18, 2009 Okay, checked it out. That page with errors belongs to " Indie business blog " . The only think I can suggest is to get in touch with them. K On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 4:19 PM, Kathleen Petrides <beadhussywrote: > Durned if I know. I'll go see where it is. I believe it was just a link TO > the petition. The petition was never on my website. But I'll go check things > out and see what's happening. > > K > > On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 3:10 PM, Lavinia Tulcan <tulcanlawrote: > >> >> >> >> Hi miss Pedrites, >> >> I am looking at your website and I tried to sign the petition against FDA >> globalization... >> >> It is very hard to find that petition and the website presens itself with >> errors in the page. >> >> Where is that petition? >> >> Thanks >> >> LMT >> >> ATFE2 <ATFE2%40> >> Beadhussy <Beadhussy%40gmail.com> >> Mon, 17 Aug 2009 14:14:17 -0700 >> Re: [ATFE2] OT-quick view of subjest lines >> >> Snicker. >> >> On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:43 PM, Liz <liztams<liztams%40gmail.com>> >> wrote: >> >> > >> > >> > >> >> -- >> Kathleen Petrides >> Bead Hussy >> http://www.BeadHussy.com <http://www.beadhussy.com/> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 18, 2009 Report Share Posted August 18, 2009 Hi Lavinia, The petition has probably been taken down . . . Donna-Maria (owner of IndieBeautyNetwork) and other indie beauty member companies actually took our concerns in person to Congress while this bill was in committee and got some concessions for small businesses. It appears now that the bill has been temporarily shelved until further notice. Keep our eyes on the ball, however, in case your signature is needed again. Be Well, Marcia Elston, Samara Botane/Nature Intelligence http://www.wingedseed.com <http://www.wingedseed.com/> http://www.wingedseed.blogspot.com <http://www.wingedseed.blogspot.com/> http://www.aromaconnection.org <http://www.aromaconnection.org/> " We make a living by what we get. We make a life by what we give. " - Winston Churchill _____ ATFE2 [ATFE2 ] On Behalf Of Lavinia Tulcan Monday, August 17, 2009 3:10 PM atfe2 [ATFE2] FDA petition Hi miss Pedrites, I am looking at your website and I tried to sign the petition against FDA globalization... It is very hard to find that petition and the website presens itself with errors in the page. Where is that petition? Thanks LMT ATFE2 (AT) (DOT) <ATFE2%40> com Beadhussy (AT) gmail (DOT) <Beadhussy%40gmail.com> com Mon, 17 Aug 2009 14:14:17 -0700 Re: [ATFE2] OT-quick view of subjest lines Snicker. On Mon, Aug 17, 2009 at 1:43 PM, Liz <liztams (AT) gmail (DOT) <liztams%40gmail.com> com> wrote: > > > -- Kathleen Petrides Bead Hussy http://www.BeadHuss <http://www.BeadHussy.com> y.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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